Last Updated: 16 April 2020
Firstly, a Free-Downloadable Draft PDF Book Contains these Discussions and More in Link below:
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Can we be called Christians with Error in Doctrine?
When we speak of idealism, yes only “true Love” is compatible with “true faith” which is not mixed with “errors”. Anyway, which Christian dares to say that ‘he believes with no Doctrinal Error’?
Now, we know of Christians caught up in many errors but I believe that Christians can be Saved despite that but which Christian and where the threshold is entirely depends on God Alone (Romans 9:15).
Here are two famous First Christianity examples solidifying this Claim:
“… Attack the silence of Pythagoras,(a) and the Orphic beans, and the novel brag about “The Master said.” Attack the ideas of Plato,(b) and the transmigrations and courses of our souls, and the reminiscences, and the unlovely loves of the soul for lovely bodies. Attack the atheism of Epicurus,(g) and his atoms, and his unphilosophic pleasure; or Aristotle’s petty Providence, and his artificial system, and his discourses about the mortality of the soul, and the humanitarianism of his doctrine. Attack the superciliousness of the Stoa,(d) or the greed and vulgarity of the Cynic.(e) Attack the “Void and Full” (what nonsense), and all the details about the gods and the sacrifices and the idols and demons, whether beneficent or malignant, and all the tricks that people play with divination, evoking of gods, or of souls, and the power of the stars. And if these things seem to thee unworthy of discussion as petty and already often confuted, and thou wilt keep to thy line, and seek the satisfaction of thy ambition in it; then here too I will provide thee with broad paths. Philosophize about the world or worlds; about matter; about soul; about natures endowed with reason, good or bad; about resurrection, about judgment, about reward, or the Sufferings of Christ. For in these subjects to hit the mark is not useless, and to miss it is not dangerous. But with God we shall have converse, in this life only in a small degree; but a little later, it may be, more perfectly, in the Same, our Lord Jesus Christ, to Whom be glory for ever. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, one of the Three Holy Hirearchs, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source: [Oration XXVII. THE FIRST THEOLOGICAL ORATION. A PRELIMINARY DISCOURSE AGAINST THE EUNOMIANS, Point IX]
https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/five-theological-orations-11646
Note: the Words “World or Worlds” may actually be “Aeon or Aeons” in Koine Greek.
“… I admitted to you formerly, that I and many others are of this opinion, and [believe] that such will take place, as you assuredly are aware; but, on the other hand, I signified to you that many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians, think otherwise. …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr (c. 100AD – c. 160 AD, Dialogue with Trypho the Jew, Chapter 110)
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennialism
Blessed St. Justin Martyr affirms that this is not his opinion but is held by “right-minded Christians on all points” and that ‘All those who believe in Christ are in the First Resurrection’, to quote:
“… But I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead, and a thousand years in Jerusalem, which will then be built, adorned, and enlarged, the prophets Ezekiel and Isaiah and others declare. For Isaiah spake thus concerning this space of a thousand years: ‘For there shall be the new heaven and the new earth, and the former shall not be remembered, or come into their heart; but they shall find joy and gladness in it, which things I create’…For as Adam was told that in the day he ate of the tree he would die, we know that he did not complete a thousand years. We have perceived, moreover, that the expression, ‘The day of the Lord is as a thousand years,’ is connected with this subject [2 Peter 3:8, Psalm 90:4]. And further, there was a certain man with us, whose name was John, one of the apostles of Christ, who prophesied, by a revelation that was made to him, THAT THOSE WHO BELIEVED IN OUR CHRIST would dwell a THOUSAND YEARS in Jerusalem [Revelation 20:4 – 10]; and that thereafter the general, and, in short, the eternal resurrection and judgment of all men would likewise take place [Revelation 20:11 – 15]. Just as our Lord also said, ‘They shall neither marry nor be given in marriage, but shall be equal to the angels, the children of the God of the resurrection. [Luke 20:35 – 36] …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100AD – c. 160 AD, Dialogue with Trypho the Jew, CHAPTER LXXXI)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
Conclusion
So, as we see above, neither did Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus nor did Blessed St. Justin Martyr enforce the “right doctrine” which they ‘know for themselves is Truth’ toward Christians whom they ‘know may not be believing the actual Truth’ but please also note that they are careful enough to ‘not’ despise these Christians as ‘heretics’ on account of differences regarding these doctrines.
This may be the “Judge Nothing before its time type of Faith” in regards to “future prophecies Context” regarding “Judgment Day Context” where such leeway is allowed by Scripture as follows:
“Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord comes, who will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness and reveal the counsels of the hearts. Then each one’s praise will come from God.” (1 Corinthians 4:5, NKJV)
The Bible Verse above in regards to ‘Judge nothing before its Time’ instructs us to ‘not fix any results of Judgment on anyone’ type of Faith and hence it doesn’t matter what you believe about the “Results” of Judgment except that you ‘believe in God’s Judgment’ (as He Alone makes the Choice, Romans 9:15).
Yes, Believing in Eternal Hell, Christ Centered Universalism or Annihilation, i.e. speculating on the Topic of “Judgment” will not save anyone nor will it condemn them (but may make a difference in “rewards” as Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus’ quote has shown prior).
A related discussion may be continued here (next post):
https://web.facebook.com/jonathan.ramachandran/posts/10159362659707784
Peace to you
Fight against the Unity of the Church or Walk away?
The Way of Agape – Who is right in the Picture? Sometimes both can be right but which approach is more “Perfect”?
“But earnestly desire the best gifts. And yet I show you a more excellent way [of Agape, Love of God]. … And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love. ” – The Wise and Gifted Blessed St. Paul the Apostle (1 Corinthians 12:31, 1 Corinthians 13:13, NKJV)
Is Truth more Important than the Unity of the Majority of the Church?
“And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love [Agape].” – The Wise and Gifted St. Paul the Apostle (1 Corinthians 13:13, NKJV)
Love of God (“Agape”) > Faith. Please let that sink in.
The Love of God or ‘Agape’ Attitude (1 Corinthians 13) ranks higher than even Truth or Faith itself as per Verse above, to quote:
“… Who then among you is noble-minded? who compassionate? who full of love? Let him declare, “If on my account sedition and disagreement and schisms have arisen, I will depart, I will go away whithersoever you desire, and I will do whatever the majority commands; only let the flock of Christ live on terms of peace with the presbyters set over it.” He that acts thus shall procure to himself great glory in the Lord; and every place will welcome him. For “the earth is the Lord’s, and the fulness thereof.” These things they who live a godly life, that is never to be repented of, both have done and always will do. … ” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter (c.35 AD – c. 99 AD, 1 Clement Chapter 54)
Source [CHAPTER 54 — HE WHO IS FULL OF LOVE WILL INCUR EVERY LOSS, THAT PEACE MAY BE RESTORED TO THE CHURCH]:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/1clement-roberts.html
This is the main reason why ‘we don’t believe in forming our own church even if we are right’ but as Blessed St. Clement of Rome commands in his apostolic authority, “… I will do whatever the majority commands …” even if it includes being kicked out of the church, i.e. “… If on my account sedition and disagreement and schisms have arisen, I will depart, I will go away whithersoever you desire …” as long as the Majority of Christians is happy [i.e. “… only let the flock of Christ live on terms of peace with the presbyters set over it …”] & this is not in reference of a heretic being put off from a Church but is referring to a True Christian as “… These things they who live a godly life, that is never to be repented of, both have done and always will do …” because these belong to “… Who then among you is noble-minded? who compassionate? who full of love? …” where their reward of leaving Church is not eternal hell but amazingly, “… He that acts thus shall procure to himself great glory in the Lord; and every place will welcome him …” . Are we behaving in such a manner or forming Churches in every corner causing Schisms after Schisms?
Are the leaders who form schisms better than St. Clement of Rome?
Please notice carefully that St. Clement of Rome clearly points that the ‘separated Godly believer from the Church’ did NOT necessarily follow ‘the majority Church’s doctrine’ as the phrase “… These things they who live a godly life, that is never to be repented of …” especially the line ” … never to be repented of …” means as ‘they live a godly life’ (stated first). In other words, he/she separates themselves out of the Church if the majority is wrong but never ‘repents of his godliness’ but in other aspects keeps with the ‘demand of the majority of the church’ even if the Church may be in error for the Sake of Love of God (“Agape”).
The Reward?
“… He that acts thus shall procure to himself great glory in the Lord; …” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter
Peace to you
Which is First Christianity?
Question/Claim
Roman Catholicism is First Christianity and it Compiled the Bible.
Reply
The Roman Catholicism compiled the “later Bible” while the Protestant Movement removed further Books from the Bible & made their own Bible around 1500s onward.
Now, have you heard of the First Bibles of Christianity Sir?
The Muratorian/Roman Canon in the West or the Codex Claromontanus in the East?
Do you know that both Contained the ‘Apocalypse of Peter Writing as Scripture’ but this was never carried forward in the other Councils due to their own opinions? So, each council compiled its own Bible and you must be wise enough to know the differences in the Books Compiled as time went on even within the Roman Catholic Church.
My point is this: We are following whichever Council we approve and from that we derive what Scripture is and its Doctrine based on that. Our faith includes even the Apocalypse of Peter Writing too as it was First Christianity (no Canons earlier than that, if it existed) is recorded in Christianity.
How does it make a difference in Doctrine/Hope?
For Example, to quote:
” … the Final Prophecy of the Salvation from the Lake of Fire as described in the Apocalypse of Peter Prophecy by Lord Jesus Christ after the Righteous (Christians) Pray to Him to save the ‘damned’ from their ‘everlasting punishments’ will be answered eventually & the First Oldest Christian Canon called the Muratorian Canon lists this Book as “Scripture” too as discussed in Previous Posts … Note: We will see in Point 5 later that this is ‘not a later edition as this scholar suggests’ as even the ‘oldest Apocalypse of Peter fragment’ called the Rainer Fragment also contains this ‘Salvation from the Lake of Fire Prophecy’. … “… “though some amongst us will not have this latter read in the Church.” …” – Muratorian Cannon regarding the “Apocalypse of Peter” … Secrecy probably because its contents were not for “sinners” as a comment regarding the Salvation from the Lake of Fire (Gehenna) by God’s Great Mercy at the Prayers of Christians for them is ‘not to be easily known by all’ as Commanded to Apostle Peter during this Vision … ”
Source Post: https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/christ-centered-universalism-mystery-in-first-christianity/amp/
or Book Draft Link:
Click the button above to Download as PDF
Note: When you quote later men rejecting that Hope, you’re just proving what later Roman Catholics decided for themselves and contradicted those before them not just in this doctrine but also in the Infamous example of the “Millennial Reign of Christ Doctrine” where again the current Roman Catholic official position is against Blessed St. Papias, ‘all the direct disciples of the Apostles as Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons claims them to believe this Doctrine too’, Blessed St. Justin Martyr and many more as discussed further in link above.
Peace to you
Hope for All Men in the Gospel – Why do we dare Hope in Christ?
Question
St. Basil the Great refutes Universalism in article below:5
https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2020/02/theological-fraud
Reply
Here are some edifying comments:
Example quote:
” … the Life of Moses, Gregory writes that just as the darkness left the Egyptians after three days, perhaps redemption [ἀποκατάστασις] will be extended to those suffering in hell [γέεννα].[55] This salvation may not only extend to humans; following Origen, there are passages where he seems to suggest (albeit through the voice of Macrina*) that even the demons will have a place in Christ’s “world of goodness”.[56] Gregory’s interpretations of 1 Corinthians 15:28 (“And when all things shall be subdued unto him …”) and Philippians 2:10 (“That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth”) support this understanding of his theology. Furthermore, in the next chapter (ch. XXXVI), Gregory says that those who are purified from evil will be admitted into the “heavenly company”. …” – Wikipedia
Source:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregory_of_Nyssa
*St. Macrina the Blessed was his sister while his brother is more of the famous sibling these days who is non other than St. Basil the Great
“… Saint Basil the Great (379 CE), writes in his Third Kneeling Prayer at Pentecost: “O Christ our God…(who) on this all-perfect and saving Feast, art graciously pleased to accept propitiatory prayers for those who are imprisoned in hades, promising unto us who are held in bondage great hope of release from the vilenes that doth hinder us and did hinder them … send down Thy consolation… and establish their souls in the mansions of the Just; and graciously vouchsafe unto them peace and pardon; for not the dead shall praise thee, O Lord, neither shall they who are in Hell make bold to offer unto thee confession. But we who are living will bless thee, and will pray, and offer unto thee propitiatory prayers and sacrifices for their souls.”[16] Saint Gregory Dialogus († 604) in his famous Dialogues (written in 593) teaches that, “The Holy Sacrifice (Eucharist) of Christ, our saving Victim, brings great benefits to souls even after death, provided their sins (are such as) can be pardoned in the life to come.”[17] However, St. Gregory goes on to say, the Church’s practice of prayer for the dead must not be an excuse for not living a godly life on earth. “The safer course, naturally, is to do for ourselves during life what we hope others will do for us after death.”…”
Source:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prayer_for_the_dead
So St. Basil believes in everlasting punishment only for those condemned at the final judgment .
5. St. Basil the Great and Apocatastasis
More on Blessed St. Basil the Great’s Universalism Hope is discussed in article below. Link:
So, what he understands as “everlasting punishment” may entirely be a different meaning altogether, for example:
“The peace given by the Lord extends to all eternity, since it knows neither limitations nor boundaries. For all beings will submit to him and all will recognise his power. And when God has come to be ‘all in all,’ after those who created disorders with apostasies have been pacified, all will hymn to God in a symphony of peace.” ~ St Basil of Caesarea (also known as ‘St. Basil the Great’)
So, blessed St. Basil the Great also believed in this, which sounds like Christ Centered Universalism.
Conclusion
Thus, how St. Basil understands ‘everlasting punishment’ could mean eternal loss of the greatest good things in His Kingdom as claimed earlier.
Peace to you
Conclusion
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
The Hope Part:
“… She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
This Shepherd of Hermas Scripture regarding some non-Christians (the unbaptized & those who heard the Gospel on earth but did not believe in it) can be Saved in the Spirit World if God Wills as Described above but may be accelerated by our Propitiatory Prayers on behalf of them as the Bible Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:42 – 46 imply.
The interesting real reliable example of Emperor Trajan (a wicked non-Christian Murderer, Pagan & Unbaptized, Unbeliever) being Saved from Hell after such Propitiatory Prayers by Pope St. Gregory the Great is not a hoax but Truth, to quote:
“… On a time Saint Gregory went by the market of Rome which is called the market of Trajan, and then he remembered of the justice and other good deeds of Trajan, and how he had been piteous and debonair, and was much sorrowful that he had been a pagan, and he turned to the church of Saint Peter wailing for the horror of the miscreance of Trajan. Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …” (The Life of St. Gregory the Pope)
Source:
https://classicalchristianity.com/2012/02/06/st-gregory-the-dialogist-and-emperor-trajan/
Note: The additional comment in the link above (added by others and not Uttered by God during that Vision/Revelation to Pope St. Gregory the Great but commentators) reads next as follows [Please notice the phrase ‘as some say’ carefully in the below]:
“… By this, as some say, the pain perpetual due to Trajan as a miscreant was some deal taken away, but for all that was not he quit from the prison of hell, for the soul may well be in hell and feel there no pain by the mercy of God. …”
The Truth is as Hieromonk Ambrose mentioned earlier, God only said this part to Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great:
“… Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …”
Can you see it? This is exactly what the Final Prophecy of the Salvation from the Lake of Fire as described in the Apocalypse of Peter Prophecy by Lord Jesus Christ after the Righteous (Christians) Pray to Him to save the ‘damned’ from their ‘everlasting punishments’ will be answered eventually & the First Oldest Christian Canon called the Muratorian Canon lists this Book as “Scripture” too as discussed in Previous Posts.
Source Post:
P/S: Apocalypse of Peter – Scripture again and not the opinion of Church Fathers
Please note that the Judgment Sentence can be “eternal in Matthew 25:46 toward the wicked” but that means an eternal loss of the highest First Resurrection into the Final Abodes of the “New Jerusalem City, Paradise and Heavens” where the ‘saved formerly wicked from the Lake of Fire’ (e. g. Apocalypse of Peter Scripture) may be placed in “lower (outside) abodes” as the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture mentioned earlier too. So, Judgment is eternal in this sense but not that God’s Mercy cannot stop the “perpetual pain” by cancelling it as Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great mentioned (quoted earlier) that God did to Emperor Trajan who killed many Christians likewise too.
The “First Bible in Christianity” (i. e. The Roman Muratorian Canon in the West and the Codex Claromontanus in the East) both mention both the Shepherd of Hermas and Apocalypse of Peter as Scripture (I take the books where these two cannons overlap as Scripture too). The “KJV Bible” is not the first bible in Christianity.
Please take note that I am not quoting heretics nor opinions but Scripture Writings as endorsed in “First Christianity” and hence believing or Hoping in Christ Centered Universalism is not a Heresy but God Alone Decides to whom all things are possible and belongs All Glory to the Unending ages of Ages.
Peace to you
Shepherd of Hermas – Mystery of the Few, Many and All
As the ‘Shepherd of Hermas’ Writing is “Scripture” and thus ‘Infallible’, please consider these quotes which Proves the Context as explained above regarding the Mystery of the ‘Ransom for Many’ (Matthew 26:28) vs ‘Ransom for All’ (1 Timothy 2:6), to quote:
Bible Verses:
“ 23But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.” – The Perfect One and Only, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 13:23, NKJV)
and to quote from the Shepherd of Hermas Infallible Scripture:
“… 2[6]:4 After that thou hast made known unto them all these words, which the Master commanded me that they should be revealed unto thee, then all their sins which they sinned aforetime are forgiven to them; yea, and to all the saints that have sinned unto this day, if they repent with their whole heart, and remove double-mindedness from their heart. 2[6]:5 For the Master sware by His own glory, as concerning His elect; that if, now that this day has been set as a limit, sin shall hereafter be committed, they shall not find salvation; for repentance for the righteous hath an end; the days of repentance are accomplished for all the saints; whereas for the Gentiles there is repentance until the last day. 2[6]:6 Thou shalt therefore say unto the elders of the Church, that they direct their paths in righteousness, that they may receive in full the promises with abundant glory. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 2)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Focus Phrase Proving that to be His Elect (i.e. part of the “Tower of Repentance” or Christians), one must believe in this temporal life itself:
“… as concerning His elect; that if, now that this day has been set as a limit, sin shall hereafter be committed, they shall not find salvation; for repentance for the righteous hath an end …” – Shepherd of Hermas
Bible Verses:
“20But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles. 22Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful.” – The only KING of the Heavens (Lord Jesus Christ Matthew 13:20 – 22, NKJV)
and to quote from the Shepherd of Hermas Infallible Scripture:
To quote:
“…5[13]:5 “But those whom they rejected and threw away, who are they?” “These have sinned, and desire to repent, therefore they were not cast to a great distance from the tower, because they will be useful for the building, if they repent. They then that shall repent, if they repent, will be strong in the faith, if they repent now while the tower is building. But if the building shall be finished, they have no more any place, but shall be castaways. This privilege only they have, that they lie near the tower. 5[13]:1 But wouldst thou know about them that are broken in pieces, and cast away far from the tower? These are the sons of lawlessness. They received the faith in hypocrisy, and no wickedness was absent from them. Therefore they have not salvation, for they are not useful for building by reason of their wickednesses. Therefore they were broken up and thrown far away by reason of the wrath of the Lord, for they excited Him to wrath. 5[13]:2 But the rest whom thou hast seen lying in great numbers, not going to the building, of these they that are mildewed are they that knew the truth, but did not abide in it, nor cleave to the saints. Therefore they are useless.” 5[13]:3 “But they that have the cracks, who are they?” “These are they that have discord in their hearts against one another, and are not at peace among themselves; who have an appearance of peace, but when they depart from one another, their wickednesses abide in their hearts. These are the cracks which the stones have. 5[13]:4 But they that are broken off short, these have believed, and have their greater part in righteousness, but have some parts of lawlessness; therefore they are too short, and are not perfect.” 5[13]:5 “But the white and round stones, which did not fit into the building, who are they, lady?” She answered and said to me, “How long art thou foolish and stupid, and enquirest everything, and understandest nothing? These are they that have faith, but have also riches of this world. When tribulation cometh, they deny their Lord by reason of their riches and their business affairs.” 5[13]:6 And I answered and said unto her, “When then, lady, will they be useful for the building?” “When,” she replied, “their wealth, which leadeth their souls astray, shall be cut away, then will they be useful for God. For just as the round stone, unless it be cut away, and lose some portion of itself, cannot become square, so also they that are rich in this world, unless their riches be cut away, cannot become useful to the Lord. 5[13]:7 Learn first from thyself When thou hadst riches, thou wast useless; but now thou art useful and profitable unto life. Be ye useful unto God, for thou thyself also art taken from the same stones. 7[15]:1 “But the other stones which thou sawest cast far away from the tower and falling into the way and rolling out of the way into the regions where there is no way, these are they that have believed, but by reason of their double heart they abandon their true way. Thus thinking that they can find a better way, they go astray and are sore distressed, as they walk about in the regions where there is no way. 7[15]:2 But they that fall into the fire and are burned, these are they that finally rebelled from the living God, and it no more entered into their hearts to repent by reason of the lusts of their wantonness and of the wickednesses which they wrought. 7[15]:3 But the others, which are near the waters and yet cannot roll into the water, wouldest thou know who are they? These are they that heard the word, and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord. Then, when they call to their remembrance the purity of the truth, they change their minds, and go back again after their evil desires.” 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Is that the End for them? Surprisingly NO! The Shepherd of Hermas’ Infallible Scripture Continues as follows regarding the ‘afterlife Salvation Hope’ agreeing to the ‘Believing after Seeing Mystery’ for all these rejected stones (Context: Referring to all those rejected stones which were described above, where the ‘stones’ here refer ‘parabolically to people’; note: I’m listing all these Verses as ‘it is Written’ without skipping any as you may check it for yourself in the Source above too):
“… 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts. … ” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Please notice the following carefully:
Context = Definition of Saved
Saved = Part of the Tower of Repentance = Being His Church /Bride
Not Saved = not His Church = have not Salvation (referring to ‘not’ being part of the First Resurrection Revelation 20:4 – 6 when He Returns, Matthew 7:21 – 23)
These same rejected unsaved stones are said to be saved in another place more humble eventually, where
“…”… 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas
“…7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; …” – Shepherd of Hermas
“… and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; …” – Shepherd of Hermas
“…but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts. … ” – Shepherd of Hermas
“…5[13]:1 But wouldst thou know about them that are broken in pieces, and cast away far from the tower? These are the sons of lawlessness. They received the faith in hypocrisy, and no wickedness was absent from them. Therefore they have not salvation, for they are not useful for building by reason of their wickednesses. Therefore they were broken up and thrown far away by reason of the wrath of the Lord, for they excited Him to wrath. 5[13]:2 But the rest whom thou hast seen lying in great numbers, not going to the building, of these they that are mildewed are they that knew the truth, but did not abide in it, nor cleave to the saints. Therefore they are useless.” 5[13]:3 “But they that have the cracks, who are they?” “These are they that have discord in their hearts against one another, and are not at peace among themselves; who have an appearance of peace, but when they depart from one another, their wickednesses abide in their hearts. These are the cracks which the stones have. 5[13]:4 But they that are broken off short, these have believed, and have their greater part in righteousness, but have some parts of lawlessness; therefore they are too short, and are not perfect.” … 7[15]:1 “But the other stones which thou sawest cast far away from the tower and falling into the way and rolling out of the way into the regions where there is no way, these are they that have believed, but by reason of their double heart they abandon their true way. Thus thinking that they can find a better way, they go astray and are sore distressed, as they walk about in the regions where there is no way. 7[15]:2 But they that fall into the fire and are burned, these are they that finally rebelled from the living God, and it no more entered into their hearts to repent by reason of the lusts of their wantonness and of the wickednesses which they wrought. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
Hope of Spirit World Salvation for them?
“…”They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; …” – Shepherd of Hermas
e.2. Hope for the BackSlided Christians being Saved in the Spirit World after Judgment – Mystery of “the others”
To quote (again):
“…7[15]:3 But the others, which are near the waters and yet cannot roll into the water, wouldest thou know who are they? These are they that heard the word, and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord. Then, when they call to their remembrance the purity of the truth, they change their minds, and go back again after their evil desires.” 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Proof Phrases that these, “the others” refer Mysteriously to ‘non-Christians who heard the Gospel but did not believe in it’ from the above:
“…These are they that heard the word …” = The Non-Christians who heard the Gospel
and
“… and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord …” = They were never Baptized but ‘would be or wished to’ but they instead chose to “… they change their minds, and go back again after their evil desires …” because of the high demand of the Christian Faith in regards to “ … the purity of the truth …”.
Can you see it?
In short, the phrase “…and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord …” means that these set of rejected stones refer to ‘non-Christians’ because they only heard the Gospel but neither believed in it nor were Baptized.
Hope for them remains as they are also included as part of “all these rejected stones” to whom this Hope of being placed in “another place more humble” rings “if they repent” referring to afterlife repentance as any repentance on earth would have merited them a place in “this Tower” (referring to the Tower of Repentance/Church):
“…7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. …” – Shepherd of Hermas
e.3. Does the Hope Really Refer to UnBaptized non- Christians who Heard the Preaching of the Gospel?
Please compare the Two Translations below in full for that Section regarding this Mystery of “the others”:
“…7[15]:3 But the others, which are near the waters and yet cannot roll into the water, wouldest thou know who are they? These are they that heard the word, and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord. Then, when they call to their remembrance the purity of the truth, they change their minds, and go back again after their evil desires.” 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3, Translated by the Well Known Scholar Mr. J. B. Lightfoot)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
and this one too:
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
Can you see it?
Here is the Definition Class of the non-Christians (i.e. those unbaptized but wished to be Baptized when they heard the Gospel but changed their mind & returned to their former ways):
“… 7[15]:3 But the others, which are near the waters and yet cannot roll into the water, wouldest thou know who are they? These are they that heard the word, and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord. Then, when they call to their remembrance the purity of the truth, they change their minds, and go back again after their evil desires.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Translated by the Well Known Scholar Mr. J. B. Lightfoot)
or
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
So,
“… These are they that heard the word, and would be baptized unto the name of the Lord. …”
= “…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“ … Then, when they call to their remembrance the purity of the truth, they change their minds, and go back again after their evil desires …” = “…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
Thus, in the Context of this “others” or non-Christians, the phrase “because they participated in the Righteous Word;” (if applicable for argument’s sake) may thus refer to them Practicing any Good Works or Good Way of Life which Corresponds to the Law of God Found in the Gospels. This Context of such “good non-Christians” being Saved in the Spirit World after their Judgment as per the Visions of Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh agree Perfectly as such a chance seems to only be given to those who had a ‘relatively good moral compass’ in life of which the measure can only be determined Fairly by our Most Perfect Saviour. Please remember that the Shepherd of Hermas Writing is Scripture and thus it is Infallible giving this Hope, right?
The Bible Verses below may refer to this Spirit World Salvation of such non-Christians by His Grace after they had endured their Judgments there first accordingly for ‘spurning on His Word’ and ‘had rebelled against the words of God’ first:
“There were those who dwelt in darkness and in the shadow of death, Prisoners in misery and chains, Because they had rebelled against the words of God and spurned the counsel of the Most High. Therefore He humbled their heart with labor; They stumbled and there was none to help. Then they cried out to the LORD in their trouble; He saved them out of their distresses. He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death and broke their bands apart. Let them give thanks to the LORD for His lovingkindness, And for His wonders to the sons of men!.” (Psalm 107:10 – 15, NASB)
The Phrase ‘Shadow of Death’ in Verses above Prove that this is the ‘Afterlife or Spirit World Context’ and so the Bible Verses above clearly Describe afterlife Salvation toward those wicked (i.e. those who rebelled against God too & went to ‘Hell-Hades’ or ‘Punishment Regions called the Shadow of Death in the above’) as First Christianity taught that this is the Meaning of that Biblical Phrase, to quote:
“… For as the Lord “WENT AWAY in the midst of the SHADOW of DEATH” [Ps. 23:4, Ps 107:10 – 15], WHERE the SOULS of the DEAD were, …” (St. Irenaeous of Lyons, ‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter XXXI:2).
Source: http://www.regels.org/Irenaeus-Millennarism.htm
and
“… Let us twine, as with a wreath, the souls (or selves) [of them that love the festival and love to hearken] 3 with golden blossoms, fain to be crowned with wreaths from the unfading gardens; and offering in our hands the fair-fruited flowers of Christ, let us gather [them]. For the God-like temple of the Holy Virgin is meet to be glorified with such a crown; because the ILLUMINING PEARL cometh forth, to the END that it may RAISE UP AGAIN into the EVER-STREAMING LIGHT THEM that were GONE DOWN into DARKNESS and the SHADOW of DEATH…” – St. Gregory Thaumaturgus, the ‘Miracle-Worker’ (c. 213 AD – c. 270 AD, Point 11, Homily)
Source:
http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/gregory_thaumaturgus_homily.htm
iii) Ransom for All [Men] (1 Timothy 2:6)
Bible Verses:
“18“Therefore hear the parable of the sower: 19When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received seed by the wayside.” – The Only Wise One, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 13: 18 – 19, NKJV)
Goats – Is Hell or Afterlife Judgment Forever for the Wicked?
Shepherd of Hermas Context, please consider:
“… 18[95]:1 “How, Sir,” say I, “did they become worse, after they had fully known God?” “He that knoweth not God,” saith he, “and committeth wickedness, hath a certain punishment for his wickedness; but he that knoweth God fully ought not any longer to commit wickedness, but to do good. 18[95]:2 If then he that ought to do good committeth wickedness, does he not seem to do greater wickedness than the man that knoweth not God? Therefore they that have not known God, and commit wickedness, are condemned to death; but they that have known God and seen His mighty works, and yet commit wickedness, shall receive a double punishment, and shall die eternally. In this way therefore shall the Church of God be purified. …” Shepherd of Hermas (Parable 9)
and
“… 15[92]:2 The first is Faith, and the second, Continence, and the third, Power, and the fourth, Long-suffering. But the others stationed between them have these names–Simplicity, Guilelessness, Purity, Cheerfulness, Truth, Understanding, Concord, Love. He that beareth these names and the name of the Son of God shall be able to ENTER into the kingdom of God.
15[92]:3 Hear,” saith he, “likewise the names of the women that wear the black garments. Of these also four are more powerful than the rest; the first is Unbelief; the second, Intemperance; the third, Disobedience; the fourth, Deceit; and their followers are called, Sadness, Wickedness, Wantonness, Irascibility, Falsehood, Folly, Slander, Hatred. The servant of God that beareth these names shall SEE the kingdom of God, but shall NOT ENTER into it.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Parable 9)
Source for both Quotes above:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Luke 12:46 declares that the Punishment of the Wicked Servant is Same as the Unbelievers on Judgment Day. Please note carefully in the quote above that the ‘former servants of God’ (ex-Christians) who have backslided and turned wicked have a “… double punishment, and shall die eternally …” and at the same time this does not mean annihilation as they are represented as women in black garments who “… shall SEE the kingdom of God, but shall NOT ENTER into it. …”.
Please note carefully the difference highlighted by the Shepherd of Hermas in relation to the ‘black garment-wicked ones’ in regards to SEEing and ENTERing the KINGDOM of GOD in Verse above.
What does it mean? The Bible Verses below may explain this Mystery further:
(i) SEE His Kingdom
“Jesus answered and said to him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is BORN AGAIN he cannot SEE the kingdom of God.” (John 3:3, NASB)
15[92]:3 Hear,” saith he, “likewise the names of the women that wear the black garments. Of these also four are more powerful than the rest; the first is Unbelief; the second, Intemperance; the third, Disobedience; the fourth, Deceit; and their followers are called, Sadness, Wickedness, Wantonness, Irascibility, Falsehood, Folly, Slander, Hatred. The servant of God that beareth these names shall SEE the kingdom of God, …”
So, SEEing His Kingdom is ONLY for those being BORN AGAIN (John 3:3). The Shepherd of Hermas implies that the WICKED will SEE His Kingdom and hence MUST be BORN AGAIN too (15[92]:3) and this is Proven Irrefutably in Verse below where being BORN AGAIN (Romans 8:20 – 21) where this aspect of the Sons of God, (His Elect – Romans 8:19) is SHARED by ALL CREATION eventually (Romans 8:22):
To Quote:
All Creation (Romans 8:22) —> will be BORN AGAIN (as the Greek Word in Romans 8:22 refers to ‘Birth Pangs’ Implying this, and has the Word ALL in front of ‘Creation’) —> in the Aspect of ‘liberty from Vanity or Decay, the corruption of sin’ causing ‘sin to cease to exist eventually’ as it is mentioned first in Immediate Consecutive Verses (Romans 8:20 – 21) —> where we, the ‘believers in faith’ (of ‘church’) are ‘more special’ inheriting more than just that (as the Verse earlier in Romans 8:19 describes the ‘rest of creation’ awaiting this).
Doubts?
“The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, “Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” – apostle John quoting John the Baptist (John 1:29, NASB)
Those Verses:
“For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.” – apostle Paul (Romans 8:19 – 22, NASB)
When these Verses are taken ‘together’, being BORN AGAIN means that BEING FREE FROM SIN (decay, vanity) of “corruption” (sin & its effects) which applies to ALL CREATION eventually (as Romans 8:19 – 22 implies clearly with Verse 15[92]:3 from the Shepherd of Hermas).
‘Let Scripture interpret Scripture’ – Clement of Alexandria
(ii) NOT ENTER His Kingdom
“Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he CANNOT ENTER into the kingdom of God.” (John 3:5, NASB)
15[92]:3 Hear,” saith he, “likewise the names of the women that wear the black garments. Of these also four are more powerful than the rest; the first is Unbelief; the second, Intemperance; the third, Disobedience; the fourth, Deceit; and their followers are called, Sadness, Wickedness, Wantonness, Irascibility, Falsehood, Folly, Slander, Hatred. The servant of God that beareth these names … shall NOT ENTER into it.” (Shepherd of Hermas)
“Or do you not know that the unrighteous will NOT INHERIT the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,” – apostle Paul (1 Corinthians 6:9, NASB)
“OUTSIDE are the dogs and the sorcerers and the immoral persons and the murderers and the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices lying.” (Revelation 22:15, NASB)
The wicked being Saved from the Lake of Fire itself is Beautifully Prophesied in Verse below where both His Spirit (God) and His Bride (“believers”, Church) call out to “thirsty ones from the Lake of Fire (implied)” to partake of the “Water of Life” freely:
“The Spirit and the bride say, “Come.” And let the one who hears say, “Come.” And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.” (Revelation 22:17, NASB)
ONLY the CHRISTIAN RIGHTEOUS both ENTER (Acts 14:22) and INHERIT His Kingdom as KINGS and PRIESTS (Revelation 1:6, Revelation 5:10) toward those from the first resurrection, (sheepfold 1, Revelation 20:4 – 6) while the righteous from other nations (sheepfold2, Matthew 25:33, Acts 10:35, Revelation 22:12) inherit other lower positions or possessions as God Wills (Matthew 25:34).
So ‘combining’ these ‘Verses’, it’s clear that the wicked may thus drink of the river of life [after their part in the Lake of Fire first, Revelation 21:8 to make them to be BORN again as part of the Process of God Making ALL things NEW in SINLESS-NESS eventually – Revelation 21:5] but these will remain OUTSIDE the Kingdom of God (the Great City of Zion) and will NOT ENTER it as long as God Wills (the River of Life must thus flow OUTSIDE the Great City where the Wicked may ‘drink’ from it post-Judgment in the Lake of Fire):
“And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, … And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it. And there shall in NO wise ENTER into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb’s book of life.” – apostle John’s Vision (Revelation 21:10, 25 – 27, KJV)
Source: https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/tree-of-life-judgment-resurrection-mystery/
Please note that Lord Jesus Christ used two different phrases in John 3 as follows marking a distinction between being ‘Born again only’ vs ‘Being Born of both Water and Spirit’ as even the Shepherd of Hermas’ Writing allows us to ‘understand this Mystery’ as follows:
“BORN AGAIN” —-> “SEE the kingdom of God.” (John 3:3)
Applies to the Wicked too (as the fallen believers have the SAME Punishment as the Wicked as Luke 12:46 & Hebrews 10:26 – 27 means too):
15[92]:3 Hear,” saith he, “likewise the names of the women that wear the black garments. … shall SEE the kingdom of God, …” (Shepherd of Hermas)
Being BORN AGAIN into this SINLESS-NESS (Romans 8:20 – 21) aspect of the Sons of God, (His Elect – Romans 8:19) is SHARED by ALL CREATION eventually (Romans 8:22).
“… Born of Water and the Spirit …” —-> “ENTER into the kingdom of God.” (John 3:5)
This applies to His Bride first (obviously) with NO afterlife Judgment (John 5:24, Sheepfold1) and also to ‘some of the non-Christian righteous of the past’ who only repent in the ‘afterlife’ (possibly the ‘sheep of the other fold, John 10:16’, Sheepfold2) in ‘Verses’ below as some form of Spirit World of afterlife Baptism is represented, to quote from the Infallible Scripture of the Shepherd of Hermas again:
“… 15[92]:1 “Show me still further, Sir,” say I. “What desirest thou to know besides?” saith he. “Wherefore, Sir,” say I, “did the stones come up from the deep, and wherefore were they placed into the building, though they bore these spirits?” 15[92]:2 “It was necessary for them,” saith he, “to rise up through water, that they might be made alive; for otherwise they could not enter into the kingdom of God, except they had put aside the deadness of their [former] life.
15[92]:3 So these likewise that had fallen asleep received the seal of the Son of God and entered into the kingdom of God. For before a man,” saith he, “has borne the name of [the Son of] God, he is dead; but when he has received the seal, he layeth aside his deadness, and resumeth life. 15[92]:4 The seal then is the water: so they go down into the water dead, and they come up alive. “thus to them also this seal was preached, and they availed themselves of it that they might enter into the kingdom of God.” 15[92]:5 “Wherefore, Sir,” say I, “did the forty stones also come up with them from the deep, though they had already received the seal?” “Because,” saith he, “these, the apostles and the teachers who preached the name of the Son of God, after they had fallen asleep in the power and faith of the Son of God, preached also to them that had fallen asleep before them, and themselves gave unto them the seal of the preaching. 15[92]:6 Therefore they went down with them into the water, and came up again. But these went down alive [and again came up alive]; whereas the others that had fallen asleep before them went down dead and came up alive. 15[92]:7 So by their means they were quickened into life, and came to the full knowledge of the name of the Son of God. For this cause also they came up with them, and were fitted with them into the building of the tower and were builded with them, without being shaped; for they fell asleep in righteousness and in great purity. Only they had not this seal. Thou hast then the interpretation of these things also.” “I have, Sir,” say I. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Parable 9)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Note: I don’t think that the chance above applies to any non-Christian who die unrepentant now except (possibly) if they never head the Gospel at all and if they led a great life of purity regardless as these ones of the past got such a chance (before His First Advent) because to ‘enter the Kingdom of God’ is the Highest Inheritance which is even denied to Many Christians on that Day (Matthew 7:20 – 23, Luke 13:24) and is reserved only to those Christians who are His Disciples who have especially Renounced all for Christ in some way (Luke 14:33).
So, those being Saved in the Spirit World are placed in ‘other lower abodes only’ as per the previous point and this point refers to a different case entirely.
I repeat:
The phrase “for they fell asleep in righteousness and in great purity. Only they had not this seal” together with the phrase “came to the full knowledge of the name of the Son of God” with the phrase “others that had fallen asleep before them went down dead and came up alive” ——> with the phrase “to rise up through water, that they might be made alive; for otherwise they could not enter into the kingdom of God, except they had put aside the deadness of their [former] life” —> seem to point to any non-Christian who die unrepentant now except (possibly) if they never head the Gospel at all and if they led a great life of purity regardless as these ones of the past got such a chance (before His First Advent).
“Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able.” – God in Flesh, Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 13:24, NKJV)
“So likewise, whoever of you does not forsake all that he has cannot be My disciple.” – The Perfect Selfless One, Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 14:33, NKJV)
The Shepherd of Hermas’ Infallible Scripture also reveals this generally as follows:
“…3[7]:2 But herein is thy salvation, in that thou didst not depart from the living God, and in thy SIMPLICITY and thy GREAT CONTINENCE. These have saved thee, if thou abidest therein; and they save all who do such things, and walk in guilelessness and simplicity. These men prevail over all wickedness, and continue unto life eternal. 3[7]:3 Blessed are all they that work righteousness. They shall never be destroyed. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 2)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Here are more ‘Continence’ Related quotes without which some Christians may be “unsaved” too according to the Infallible Shepherd of Hermas of Scripture which is clearly set against the Prosperity Gospel Error, to quote:
“… 2[45]:1 “Before all is desire for the wife or husband of another, and for EXTRAVAGANCE of WEALTH, and for many needless dainties, and for drinks and OTHER LUXURIES, many and foolish. For even LUXURY is FOOLISH and vain for the servants of God. 2[45]:2 These desires then are evil, and bring death to the servants of God. For this evil desire is a daughter of the devil. Ye must, therefore, abstain from the evil desires, that so abstaining ye may live unto God. 2[45]:3 But as many as are mastered by them, and resist them not, are done to death utterly; for these desires are deadly. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Mandate 12)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Please consider also:
“… Wherefore, brethren, leaving [willingly] our sojourn in this present world, let us do the will of Him that called us, and not fear to depart out of this world. For the Lord saith, “Ye shall be as lambs in the midst of wolves.” And Peter answered and said unto Him, “What, then, if the wolves shall tear in pieces the lambs?” Jesus said unto Peter, “The lambs have no cause after they are dead to fear the wolves; and in like manner, fear not ye them that kill you, and can do nothing more unto you; but fear Him who, after you are dead, has power over both soul and body to cast them into hell-fire.” And consider, brethren, that the sojourning in the flesh in this world is but brief and transient, but the promise of Christ is great and wonderful, even the rest of the kingdom to come, and of life everlasting. By what course of conduct, then, shall we attain these things, but by leading a holy and righteous life, and by deeming these worldly things as not belonging to us, and not fixing our desires upon them? For if we desire to possess them, we fall away from the path of righteousness. …” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter (c.35 AD – c. 99 AD, 2 Clement Chapter V)
Source [ CHAP. V.–THIS WORLD SHOULD BE DESPISED ]:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/2clement-roberts.html
Can we be rich in both worlds? the quote above and below doesn’t seem to agree and neither does Luke 14:33 seems to fit such a ‘false hope’:
“… For if we desire to possess them [these worldly things], we fall away from the path of righteousness ..” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter
To the ‘Rich Sheep’, please repent before it is too late:
“… 2[62]:4 But the sheep, which thou sawest not skipping about, but feeding in one place, these are they that have delivered themselves over to acts of self-indulgence and deceit, but have not uttered any blasphemy against the Lord. These then have been corrupted from the truth. In these there is hope of repentance, wherein they can live. Corruption then hath hope of a possible renewal, but death hath eternal destruction. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Parable 6)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Logic: The Same God Who Asks you to Let Go of it All in Luke 14:33 [either by “not belonging to us” or “not fixing our desires upon them” or not owning it at all as Blessed St. Clement Writes above] cannot be Teaching you that ‘nothing is wrong with Material Prosperity, Luxury & Money in Abundance’ [Matthew 19:24]. The “Abundant Life” (John 10:10) which Christ Spoke of has nothing to do with these things (Luke 12:15) but rather in that when we receive these things being added to us (Luke 12:30 – 31) we are to ‘sell them or give it away to Charity’ (Luke 12:33) as much as possible in order to do the required transaction to attain to the Higher Glories and Rewards in His Kingdom (Matthew 6:19 – 20, Matthew 5:19).
iii. How Fortunate are we to even have the Opportunity to have the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture regarding the Tower of Repentance and Its Stones available to us?
“for assuredly, I say to you that many prophets and righteous men desired to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.” – God Himself, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 13:17, NKJV)
“… 4[12]:3 I enquired of her, saying, “Lady, I could wish to know concerning the end of the stones, and their power, of what kind it is.” She answered and said unto me, “It is not that thou of all men art especially worthy that it should be revealed to thee; for there are others before thee, and better than thou art, unto whom these visions ought to have been revealed. But that the name of God may be glorified, it hath been revealed to thee, all shall be revealed, for the sake of the doubtful-minded, who question in their hearts whether these things are so or not. Tell them that all these things are true, and that there is nothing beside the truth, but that all are steadfast, and valid, and established on a firm foundation. 5[13]:1 “Hear now concerning the stones that go to the building The stones that are squared and white, and that fit together in their joints, these are the apostles and bishops and teachers and deacons, who walked after the holiness of God, and exercised their office of bishop and teacher and deacon in purity and sanctity for the elect of God, some of them already fallen on sleep, and others still living. And because they always agreed with one another, they both had peace among themselves and listened one to another. Therefore their joinings fit together in the building of the tower.”
5[13]:2 “But they that are dragged from the deep, and placed in the building, and that fit together in their joinings with the other stones that are already builded in, who are they?” “These are they that suffered for the name of the Lord.” 5[13]:3 “But the other stones that are brought from the dry land, I would fain know who these are, lady.” She said, “Those that go to the building, and yet are not hewn, these the Lord hath approved because they walked in the uprightness of the Lord, and rightly performed His commandments.” 5[13]:4 “But they that are brought and placed in the building, who are they?” “They are young in the faith, and faithful; but they are warned by the angels to do good, because wickedness was found in them.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
“… 8[16]:1 When then I ceased asking her concerning all these things, she saith to me; “Wouldest thou see something else?” Being very desirous of beholding, I was greatly rejoiced that I should see it. 8[16]:2 She looked upon me, and smiled, and she saith to me, “Seest thou seven women round the tower?” “I see them, lady,” say I. “This tower is supported by them by commandment of the Lord. 8[16]:3 Hear now their employments. The first of them, the woman with the strong hands, is called Faith; through her are saved the elect of God. 8[16]:4 And the second, that is girded about and looketh like a man, is called Continence; she is the daughter of Faith. Whosoever then shall follow her, becometh happy in his life, for he shall refrain from all evil deeds, believing that, if he refrain from every evil desire, he shall inherit eternal life.”
8[16]:5 “And the others, lady, who be they?” “They are daughters one of the other. The name of the one is Simplicity, of the next, Knowledge, of the next, Guilelessness, of the next, Reverence, of the next, Love. When then thou shalt do all the works of their mother, thou canst live.” 8[16]:6 “I would fain know, lady,” I say, “what power each of them possesseth.” “Listen then,” saith she, “to the powers which they have. 8[16]:7 Their powers are mastered each by the other, and they follow each other, in the order in which they were born. From Faith is born Continence, from Continence Simplicity, from Simplicity Guilelessness, from Guilelessness Reverence, from Reverence Knowledge, from Knowledge Love. Their works then are pure and reverent and divine. 8[16]:8 Whosoever therefore shall serve these women, and shall have strength to master their works, shall have his dwelling in the tower with the saints of God.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
and
“… 1[26]:1 “First of all, believe that God is One, even He who created all things and set them in order, and brought all things from non-existence into being, Who comprehendeth all things, being alone incomprehensible. 1[26]:2 Believe Him therefore, and fear Him, and in this fear be continent. Keep these things, and thou shalt cast off all wickedness from thyself, and shalt clothe thyself with every excellence of righteousness, and shalt live unto God, if thou keep this commandment.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Mandate 1)
and
“20Therefore by their fruits you will know them. 21“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’” – The God of the Heavens, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:20 – 23, NKJV)
Why are the “Many” Christians above rejected from “Entering His Kingdom” and ‘what must we do as the Will of God to Enter into His Kingdom’? To quote:
“… 15[92]:2 The first is Faith, and the second, Continence, and the third, Power, and the fourth, Long-suffering. But the others stationed between them have these names–Simplicity, Guilelessness, Purity, Cheerfulness, Truth, Understanding, Concord, Love. He that beareth these names and the name of the Son of God shall be able to enter into the kingdom of God. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Parable 9)
Source for Each Quote above: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Please don’t take these Warnings from the Shepherd of Hermas Writing lightly as Christians since it was considered as “Scripture” by St. Irenaeous of Lyons, St. Clement of Alexandria, Pope Callixtus I, Tertullian and even by the First Earliest Muratorian Cannon who only don’t let it to be read publicly in Church as these earliest believers spoke likewise of the Apocalypse of Peter* since Its Contents are for Matured believers and because it’s after the times of the Old Testament Prophets and New Testament Apostles, to quote:
“… The Muratorian fragment is a list written c. 170 AD (although some scholars now question this date and prefer to assign the fragment to the 4th century.[12]) that may be the earliest known canon of New Testament writings. It identifies Hermas, the author of The Shepherd, as the brother of Pius I, bishop of Rome: But Hermas wrote The Shepherd very recently, in our times, in the city of Rome, while bishop Pius, his brother, was occupying the chair of the church of the city of Rome. And therefore it ought indeed to be read; but it cannot be read publicly to the people in church either among the Prophets, whose number is complete,[13] or among the Apostles, for it is after their time.The Liberian Catalogue of Popes, a record that was later used in the writing of the Liber Pontificalis, states in a portion under the heading of 235: “Under his [Pius’] episcopate, his brother Ermes wrote a book in which are contained the precepts which the angel delivered to him, coming to him in the guise of a Shepherd.” …”
Source:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shepherd_of_Hermas
Conclusion – Hope Remains in Christ
So, it makes sense why these earliest Church Leaders Pray and Hope for such Hidden Mysteries so that their unsaved loved ones, friends and others may attain to some ‘lower abode’ according to their works after being saved in the Spirit World if God Wills it.
We do not force God but make supplication and whether God Saves whom and doesn’t Save whomever, that’s His Choice and God Knows Best. Our duty is to believe now as Christians so that we can begin to ask even for the Salvation for our loved ones/friends (whom we know may never believe on earth) and also our loved ones/friends who have since departed from this earth unbelieving. At least we tried and there is no Bible Verse against it but rather only Bible Verses encouraging it as per 1 Timothy 2:1 and 2 Maccabees 12:46 as we have seen.
“For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.” – The Great and Blessed St. Paul the Apostle (1 Timothy 4:10, KJV)
Peace to you
Christ Centered Universalism Mystery in First Christianity
“As the heavens for height and the earth for depth, So the heart of kings is unsearchable.” (Proverbs 25:3, NKJV)
1) Blessed Patriarch Moses
“(Now the man Moses was very humble, more than all men who were on the face of the earth.)” (Numbers 12:3, NKJV)
Why? Here’s an Example:
“9And the Lord said to Moses, “I have seen this people, and indeed it is a stiff-necked people! 10Now therefore, let Me alone, that My wrath may burn hot against them and I may consume them. And I will make of you a great nation.” 11Then Moses pleaded with]the Lord his God, and said: “Lord, why does Your wrath burn hot against Your people whom You have brought out of the land of Egypt with great power and with a mighty hand? … 14So the Lord relented from the harm which He said He would do to His people.” (Exodus 32:9 – 11, 14, NKJV)
Note: God gave an option directly to Moses that He can destroy all the previous Israelite and establish a ‘new lineage’ directly from Moses alone. However, Moses did not want it at all but preferred the Lord Forgiving those ‘stiff necked sinners’. What if God was allowing His Best Servants such as Moses to decide the fate of the rest as he will do on Judgment Day too?
“Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? …” – The Great Apostle Paul (1 Corinthians 6:2, NKJV)
The Verses above clearly demonstrate how ‘Blessed Patriarch Moses’ was more humble than all others on the earth since he never even coveted the ‘I will make you a great nation’ Promise by “God Himself” through his lineage when it was offered to him especially at the expense of ‘those sinners’ either. God Must be Very Pleased with Moses and that’s why ‘Attitude Truly determines our Altitude in His Kingdom too’.
2) The Greatest Apostle – Blessed St. Paul, Apostle of Christ to the Gentiles
“1I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, 2that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart. 3For I could wish that I myself were accursed [Anathema] from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh, 4who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises; ” – The Great Apostle Paul (Romans 9:1 – 4, NKJV)
The Greek Word in the above translated as “accursed” is “anathema”, the term used for those whose names are to be blotted out of the Book of Life. Isn’t it amazing that it’s not blasphemy to hold to such thoughts are even Holy Scripture reveals the heart of apostle Paul to be willing to ‘make himself be cast out of His Kingdom’ (i.e. “anathema”) as a bargain if his ‘unsaved Israelite people’ can inherit the kingdom?
How many of us are willing to be cast out of His Kingdom as “anathema” if God allows it so that ‘your worst enemy’ can take your place instead in His Kingdom?
So, we see the Greatness of both Blessed Patriarch Moses and Blessed St. Paul the Apostle as Scripture Mysteriously Reveals this Truth as ‘their hearts were revealed’:
“34Then Simeon blessed them, and said to Mary His mother, “Behold, this Child is destined for the fall and rising of many in Israel, and for a sign which will be spoken against. (yes, a sword will pierce through your own soul also), that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.” (Luke 2:34 – 35, NKJV)
3) Blessed St. Clement of Rome
So, Christ Centered Universalism Type of Theology is NOT a Heresy but Honoured if it’s based on Love of God (‘Agape’) because there is ‘no Law against Love (‘Agape’) of God’ (Galatians 5:23) even toward Sinners in the Context of wanting them not to perish eternally, to quote [Context for Exodus 32:32 – 33]:
“… And the Lord said to him [Moses], “I have spoken to you once and again, saying, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiff-necked people: let Me destroy them, and blot out their name from under heaven; and I will make you a great and wonderful nation, and one much more numerous than this.” But Moses said, “Far be it from You, Lord: pardon the sin of this people; else blot me also out of the book of the living.” O marvellous love! O insuperable perfection! The servant speaks freely to his Lord, and asks forgiveness for the people, or begs that he himself might perish along with them. …” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter (c.35 AD – c. 99 AD, 1 Clement Chapter 53)
Source [Chapter 53: THE LOVE OF MOSES TOWARDS HIS PEOPLE]:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/1clement-roberts.html
The True Christian Attitude to keep Praying for the “… forgiveness for the people, or begs that he himself might perish along with them ..” toward whom the Lord Says First, “… stiff-necked people: let Me destroy them, and blot out their name from under heaven …” is not called Speaking up against God but is Commended above as “… O marvellous love! O insuperable perfection! ..” to the request of “… Far be it from You, Lord: pardon the sin of this people; else blot me also out of the book of the living. …”, Amazing, isn’t it?
Please note that regardless of God’s Decision to Punish these ones later or not, the request that they may be forgiven is never a heresy.
4) Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons
“… And undoubtedly the preaching of the Church is true and stedfast, in which one and the same way of salvation is shown throughout the whole world. For to her is entrusted the light of God; and therefore the “wisdom” of God, by means of which she SAVES ALL MEN, “is declared in [its] going forth; it uttereth [its voice] faithfully in the streets, is preached on the tops of the walls, and speaks continually in the gates of the city.” For the Church preaches the truth everywhere, and she is the seven-branched candlestick which bears the light of Christ…” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book V)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
The “All Men” written by St. Irenaeous includes more than just the Christians and not only the Old Testament faithful as he also wrote the following:
“… “Christ came not only for those who believed from the time of Tiberius Caesar, nor did the Father provide only for those who are now, but for absolutely all men from the beginning, who, according to their ability, feared and loved God and lived justly. . . and desired to see Christ and to hear His voice …” [ Most, William G., The Holy Spirit and the Church, Notre Dame Institute Press, 1991, p. 76] …. So, Irenaeus recognized that all who feared and loved God, practiced justice and piety towards their neighbors, and desired to see Christ, insofar as they were able to do so, will be saved. Since many were not able to have an explicit desire to see Christ, but only implicit, it is clear that for Irenaeus this is enough. …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irenaeus
This may accord to the Mystery of ‘Sheepfold2’ or ‘Good non-Christians’ based on Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26?
“… Also, by this which this servant dared to say, “Thou reapest where thou sowedst not,” we understand that the Lord accepts the good life of the Gentiles and of the Philosophers. …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Note: Whether Blessed St. Jerome agrees or not to his quote above, he may be reiterating what other Great Christians from Antiquity have passed on to him regarding such exegesis for example, to quote:
” … In the early Church, Justin Martyr, a Church Father, taught that those who lived according to the logos are Christians, though they might not know about Jesus Christ. …” – Sanders, John (14 May 1990). “The Perennial Debate”. Christianity Today. Christianity Today International.
Where some Good non-Christians may get the Chance to Repent in Hades (Hell now) as per the Visions of Sadhu Sundar Singh agrees as well, to quote:
“… Tertullian held that Christ has descended into Hades to deliver the Good News, with Clement of Alexandria, Origen and Athanasius declaring that “Jesus delivered from hell both Jews and Gentiles who accepted the gospel and that postmortem evangelism continues even today”. …” – Sanders, John (14 May 1990). “The Perennial Debate”. Christianity Today. Christianity Today International.
Source for both quotes above:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fate_of_the_unlearned
5) Blessed St. Justin Martyr
St. Justin Martyr himself seems to have believed that the ‘Wicked’s Everlasting Punishment’ may finally lead to them ‘Permanently being Converted to Obey Christ as a Child’ (hence Saved post-Judgments, right? Matthew 18:3)
“…(And what follows in order of the prophecy already quoted.) But when the passage speaks as from the lips of many, ‘We have preached before Him,’ and adds, ‘as if a child,’ it signifies that the wicked shall become subject to Him, and shall obey His command, and that all shall become as one child. Such a thing as you may witness in the body: although the members are enumerated as many, all are called one, and are a body. For, indeed, a commonwealth and a church, though many individuals in number, are in fact as one, called and addressed by one appellation. And in short, sirs,” said I, “by enumerating all the other appointments of Moses I can demonstrate that they were types, and symbols, and declarations of those things which would happen to Christ, of those who it was foreknown were to believe in Him, and of those things which would also be done by Christ Himself. But since what I have now enumerated appears to me to be sufficient, I revert again to the order of the discourse.” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER XLI & CHAPTER XLII, ‘Dialogue with Trypho’)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
Note: St. Justin Martyr draws an analogy between the ‘Wicked being made as one child’ as separate but similar as to how it is Witnessed among the Christians which become the Body of Christ not mixing these two, as different Salvations in his quote above.
This Context is strengthened by St. Justin’s own quote below where he seems to speak of God Saving (or Performing the same Basic Salvation of a Sinless Body) toward the ‘Christians’ (i.e. those Begotten of Him), the ‘Servants’ (“sinners”) and His ‘enemies’ too eventually, to quote:
“.. But, in truth, He has even called the flesh to the resurrection, and promises to it everlasting life. For where He promises to save man, there He gives the promise to the flesh. For what is man but the reasonable animal composed of body and soul? Is the soul by itself man? No; but the soul of man. Would the body be called man? No, but it is called the body of man. If, then, neither of these is by itself man, but that which is made up of the two together is called man, and God has called man to life and resurrection, He has called not a part, but the whole, which is the soul and the body. Since would it not be unquestionably absurd, if, while these two are in the same being and according to the same law, the one were saved and the other not? And if it be not impossible, as has already been proved, that the flesh be regenerated, what is the distinction on the ground of which the soul is saved and the body not? Do they make God a grudging God? But He is good, and will have all to be saved…. But no thanks are due to one who saves what is his own; for this is to save himself. For he who saves a part himself, saves himself by his own means, lest he become defective in that part; and this is not the act of a good man. For not even when a man does good to his children and offspring, does one call him a good man; for even the most savage of the wild beasts do so, and indeed willingly endure death, if need be, for the sake of their cubs. But if a man were to perform the same acts in behalf of his slaves, that man would justly be called good. Wherefore the Saviour also taught us to love our enemies, since, says He, what thank have ye? So that He has shown us that it is a good work not only to love those that are begotten of Him, but also those that are without. And what He enjoins upon us, He Himself first of all does.” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, On the Resurrection, Chapter VIII)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-resurrection.html
In fact, St. Justin Martyr himself boldly declares also that the Sibyline Oracles contain Truth pertaining to Christ:
“… but God FOREKNOWING all that shall be done by ALL MEN, and it being His Decree that the future actions of men shall all be recompensed according to their several value, He foretells by the Spirit of prophecy that He will bestow meet rewards according to the merit of the actions done, always urging the human race to effort and recollection, showing that He cares and provides for men. But by the agency of the DEVILS DEATH has been DECREED AGAINST those who READ the BOOKS of Hystaspes, or of the SIBYL, or of the PROPHETS, that through FEAR they may PREVENT MEN who READ THEM from RECEIVING the KNOWLEDGE of the GOOD, and may RETAIN THEM in SLAVERY to themselves; which, however, they could not always effect. For NOT only do we FEARLESSLY READ THEM, but, as you see, bring them for YOUR INSPECTION, knowing that THEIR CONTENTS will be PLEASING to ALL. …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, First Apology, CHAPTER XLIV — NOT NULLIFIED BY PROPHECY)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-firstapology.html
This same Sibyline Oracles has the following Christian Universalism Prophecy of Christ Saving from the Lake of Fire at the “Prayer Requests of the Righteous Christians”.
Is that why Justin Martyr (knowing this) also quotes Hystaspes in a ‘Universal Salvation’ manner —-> saying, ‘extermination of the corrupt will happen by fire’ —> with a FULLER and more DIVINE Meaning of Making all things anew context (Revelation 21:5) through the Lake of Fire too (Revelation 21:8) —> which refers to the extermination of the ‘corrupt’ (sin & evil) —> as even the SIBYL quoted together in the above obviously taught Universal Salvation (proving this Context Stronger), to quote both:
“… And the Sibyl and Hystaspes said that there should be a dissolution by God of things corruptible. And the philosophers called Stoics teach that even God Himself shall be resolved into fire, and they say that the world is to be formed anew by this revolution; but we understand that God, the Creator of all things, is superior to the things that are to be changed. If, therefore, on some points we teach the same things as the poets and philosophers whom you honour, and on other points are fuller and more divine in our teaching, and if we alone afford proof of what we assert, why are we unjustly hated more than all others? …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, First Apology, CHAPTER XX — HEATHEN ANALOGIES TO CHRISTIAN DOCTRINE)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-firstapology.html
and,
“… for a long day will God make.
And to the pious will the almighty God
405 Imperishable grant another thing,
When they shall ask the imperishable God:
That he will suffer men from raging fire
And endless gnawing anguish to be saved;
And this will he do. For hereafter he
410 Will pluck them from the restless flame, elsewhere
Remove them, and for his own people’s sake
Send them to other and eternal life
With the immortals, in Elysian field,” (Sibyline Oracles, Book II, 297-322, p. 51)
Translation Source:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib04.htm
I repeat with Emphasis:
“… for a long day will God make.
And to the pious will the Almighty God
405 Imperishable grant another thing,
When they shall ask the imperishable God:
That He [God] will suffer [SAVE] men from RAGING FIRE
And ENDLESS GNAWING ANGUISH to be SAVED;
And THIS WILL HE [God] DO. For hereafter He [God]
410 Will PLUCK THEM [Wicked] from the RESTLESS FLAME, elsewhere REMOVE THEM [Wicked, the ‘thirsty’ from the ‘Lake of Fire’], and for His own people’s sake [His Bride, Revelation 22:17] Send them to OTHER [Outside Regions of the Kingdom of the Heavens, Matthew 5:19] and eternal [AGE -DURING, Fulfilling John 17:2 toward ALL MEN or ALL FLESH or ALL HUMANITY] life With the Immortals [Revelation 20:4 – 6], in Elysian field,” (Sibyline Oracles, Book II, 297-322, p. 51)
Is Book II of the Sibyline Oracles written by Christians? Yes, if not the Jews first but not unbelievers, to quote:
“… Books 1-2 may have been written by Christians, though again there may have been a Jewish original that was adapted to Christian purposes. … The Christian apologist Athenagoras of Athens, writing A Plea for the Christians to Marcus Aurelius in ca. AD 176, quoted the same section of the extant Oracles verbatim, in the midst of a lengthy series of classical and pagan references including Homer and Hesiod, and stated several times that all these works should already be familiar to the Roman Emperor. The sibyls themselves, and the so-called Sibylline oracles, were often referred to by other early Church fathers; Theophilus, Bishop of Antioch (ca. 180), Clement of Alexandria (ca. 200), Lactantius (ca. 305), and Augustine (ca. 400), all knew various versions of the pseudo-Sibylline collections, quoted them or referred to them in paraphrase, and were unreluctant to Christianize them … ”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Oracles
6) Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria
The next Authoritative Ancient Christian Saint below states that the Order to “read the Siblyl” (quoted earlier containing the Christ Saving from the Lake of Fire Prophecy) is by “the Blessed and Holy St. Paul the Apostle of Christ himself” by a tradition ‘verbally or by word of mouth’ (2 Thessalonians 2:15), to quote:
“…He distinguished the most excellent of the Greeks from the common herd, in addition to “Peter’s Preaching,” the APOSTLE PAUL will show, saying: “Take also the Hellenic books, READ THE SIBYL, how it is shown that God is one, and how the future is indicated. And taking Hystaspes, read, and you will find much more luminously and distinctly the Son of God described, and how many kings shall draw up their forces against Christ, hating Him and those that bear His name, and His faithful ones, and His patience, and His coming.” …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria, Head of the Cathecathical School At Alexandria, Teacher of Origen (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, Stromata, or Miscellanies, Book VI, CHAPTER V — THE GREEKS HAD SOME KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUE GOD)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book6.html
So, are both St. Justin Martyr and St. Clement of Alexandria wrong or are they Speaking an Ancient Truth of Tradition established by Apostle Paul himself regarding the ‘Sibyline Oracles’? Please note that even St. Augustine, St. Athenagoras of Athens, St. Theophilus of Antioch and Blessed Lactantius all read the Sibyl & quoted it too.
St. Clement of Alexandria says clearly that Christ “Saves All” eventually some after [afterlife] punishments only:
“and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world [Kosmos].” – apostle John (1 John 2:2, NASB)
“… Ver. 2. “And not only for our sins,”–that is for those of the faithful,–is the Lord the propitiator, does he say, “but also for the whole world.” (1 John 2:2) He, indeed, saves all; but some [He saves], converting them by punishments; others, however, who follow voluntarily [He saves] with dignity of honour; so “that every knee should bow to Him, of things in heaven, and things on earth, and things under the earth;” that is, angels, men, and souls that before His advent have departed from this temporal life..” …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria, Head of the Cathecathical School At Alexandria, Teacher of Origen (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-
fragments.html
Note: ‘things under the earth’ = Hell (Hades now or Gehenna/Lake of Fire later)
“not for our sins only” = not for any Christian’s sins only
“sins of the whole world” = sin of any creation, human or otherwise
“Propitiation” = ending of wrath (also applies in that even if the Judgment Sentence is eternal Hell, the Sentence can be cancelled by His Propitiation as His Mercy is not equal but Greater than Judgment, triumphing/ending it as James 2:13 agrees with His Mercy Promised as the Last Word on Judgment toward ‘all in disobedience’ [NASB] or ‘all in unbelief’ [KJV] in the end order of His Final Judgment, Romans 11:32 – in Romans 9 – 11).
St. Clement of Alexandria Writes that Christ Saving in the Afterlife happens even now as He Wills:
“… “it is evident that those, too, who were outside of the Law, having lived rightly, in consequence of the peculiar’ nature of the voice, though they are in HADES and in ward, on hearing the voice of the Lord, whether that of His own person or that acting through His apostles, with all speed turned and believed. For we remember that the Lord is “the power of God,” and power can never be weak. So I think it is demonstrated that the God being good, and the Lord powerful, they save with a righteousness and equality which extend to ALL that TURN to Him, WHETHER HERE or ELSEWHERE. For it is not here alone that the active power of God is beforehand, but it is EVERYWHERE and is ALWAYS at WORK…” – St. Clement of Alexandria (c.150 AD – c. 215 AD, Stromata, Book 6, Chapter VI)
Translation Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book6.html
This is not St. Clement of Alexandria’s opinion but Truth as even St. Cyril of Alexandria declared likewise too, to quote:
“… The doctrine of the descent of Christ into Hades occupies an essential place in the works of Cyril of Alexandria. In his Paschal Homilies’, he repeatedly mentions that as a consequence of the descent of Christ into Hades, the devil was left all alone, while hell was devastated: ‘For having destroyed hell and opened the impassable gates for the departed spirits, He left the devil there abandoned and lonely’[19].In his ‘Festive Letters’, Cyril of Alexandria elaborates on the theme of the preaching of Christ in Hades, popular in the Alexandrian tradition since Clement. He views the preaching of Christ in hell as the accomplishment of the ‘history of salvation’, which began with the Incarnation:…He showed the way to salvation not only to us, but also to the spirits in hell; having descended, He preached to those once disobedient, as Peter says[20]…” – via ArchBishop Hilarion Alfeyev
Source for the Quote & Write Up above:
https://stjamesorthodox.org/files/articles/Bishop-Hilarion—Christ-the-Conqueror-of-Hades.pdf
7) Blessed St. Epiphanius of Salamis
Can we Repent after we die and then be re-admitted into such Great Prizes and Contests of His Kingdom?
No, to quote:
“… For in the world [AGE/AEON] to come, after a man’s departure, there is no opportunity to fast, no call to repentance, no giving of alms. There are no blameworthy deeds either — no war, adultery, licentiousness — but neither is there righteousness and repentance. (2) As the seed cannot thicken or be blasted by the wind after the reaping of the ear, so < after a man’s death there can be no increase of his store* > and nothing else of benefit to him. (3) But don’t tell me about the things that spoil the store, that is, the worms and moths. Scripture does say this of things in eternity; but the point of comparison, and what we lock away behind gates and store safely in a barn, is a symbol and type of faith, [which is kept] “where neither thieves break through nor moths corrupt,” 43 as God’s word says. Thus < there is no decrease of our store* > after death, but neither, certainly, is there opportunity for godliness, nor, as I said, < call > to repentance. (4) For Lazarus does not go to the rich man in the next world, nor does the rich man go to Lazarus. Nor does Abraham inconvenience the poor man who has since become rich, and send him [to the rich man]. And the rich man who has become poor does not obtain his request, though he begs and pleads with the merciful Abraham. (5) The storehouses had been sealed, the time was up, the contest finished, the ring emptied, the prizes awarded, and the contestants at ease. Those who have failed have left, those who did not fight have no more chance, those who were worsted in the ring have been ejected. All is plainly over after our departure. 10,6 But while all are in the world there is arising even after a fall, there is still hope, still a remedy, still confession — even if not for everyone, still < by those who are repenting for the second time* >. And surely < even > the salvation of the others is not ruled out. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘CATHARI’ , “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Consecutive Points 10.1 – 10.6, Pages 112 – 113)
Source:
How about this Bible Verse then?
“It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins.” [2 Maccabees 12:46, Douay-Rheims Bible 1899 American Edition (DRA)]
Source: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2%20Maccabees+12&version=DRA&interface=amp
Even St. Epiphanius who said that the dead cannot repent (above) says in another quote below that we can pray for ‘dead sinners’ to attain to God’s Mercy?
To quote in full:
“… 7,1 And then, as to NAMING THE DEAD, what could be MORE HELPFUL? What could be MORE OPPORTUNE or WONDERFUL than that the living believe that the departed are alive and have not ceased to be but exist, and live with the Lord — (2) and that the MOST SACRED DOCTRINE should declare that there is HOPE for those who PRAY for their brethren as though they were off on a journey? 7,3 And even though the PRAYER WE OFFER FOR THEM cannot root out all their faults — [how could it], since we often slip in this world, inadvertently and deliberately — it is still useful as an indication of something more perfect. (4) For we COMMEMORATE BOTH RIGHTEOUS and SINNERS. Though we PRAY for SINNERS , for GOD’S MERCY 19 and for the righteous, fathers, the patriarchs, prophets, apostles, evangelists, martyrs and confessors, for bishops and anchorites and the whole band [of saints], 20 (5) we worship our Lord Jesus Christ to distinguish him from the whole of humanity by our honor of him, remembering that the Lord is not on a level with any man — even though each man has < performed > a million righteous deeds and more. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘Aerians’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.6, Pages 509 – 510)
Source:
How is this possible?
Context = Definition of Saved
Saved = Part of the Tower of Repentance = Being His Church /Bride
Not Saved = not His Church = have not Salvation (referring to ‘not’ being part of the First Resurrection Revelation 20:4 – 6 when He Returns, Matthew 7:21 – 23) but may be saved post-Judgment into ‘lower afterlife abodes’ especially if they were ‘sinners’ who participated in the righteous Word before backsliding. Yes, these same rejected unsaved stones are said to be saved in another place more humble eventually, to quote:
“Hermas 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. Hermas 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. Hermas 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts.” – Shepherd of Hermas Scripture
Source for Translation: https://carm.org/shepherd-of-hermas
and
“… .10,7 In this people there dwells one infinite Godhead, one imperishable Godhead, one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; spirit, soul and flesh; faith, hope and charity; past, present and future; the AGES, the ETERNAL AGES, and the AGES of AGES; Sabbaths of Sabbaths; the circumcision of the flesh, the circumcision of the heart, and “the circumcision of Christ by the putting off of the body of the sins .’’ 202 (9) In a word, it PURIFIES ALL THINGS for itself, things visible and invisible, thrones, dominions, principalities authorities, powers. But IN ALL is the same holy voice crying, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” from glory to glory, < to glorify > the Father in the Son, and the Son in the Father with the Holy Spirit, to whom be glory and might unto the AGES of AGES. Amen. And he who so believes will say “So be it! So be it. ” …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points10.7 – 10.9, Pages 498 – 499)
Source:
Focus points from the Quote above:
Neither St. Epiphanius of Salamis, St. Ambrose of Milan and even St. Irenaeous of Lyons understood the phrase “Aeon” as eternity but as ‘age (singular) vs ages (plural)’ only into the future as their own words prove as follows (strengthening the claim that they believed at most in a to the age/ages chastisement but not an eternal one):
There are at least three types of Ages [Aeons-plural] Time Periods
“… past, present and future; the ages, the eternal ages, and the ages of ages; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
I think that the phrase “eternal ages” means that the “ages or Aeons” continue into eternity.
Note: Men’s Final Punishment in Gehenna or the Lake of Fire has never been mentioned to the Aeons-plural to come but only to the lesser maximum sentence which is to the next Aeon-singular to come (Matthew 25:46, Matthew 12:31 – 32) in the Bible giving a strong case that it’s not eternal but age-during to the next age only (though severe & a long time).
The word eternal in front of the word ages (Aeons) itself proves that the word “ages-plural” itself does not mean eternity by itself but is a limited succession of ages to come by God’s Will as St. Epiphanius says, “eternal ages” to imply an eternal sequence of ages to come, right?
It is obvious that St. Epiphanius is revealing that eternity is a ‘long series of ages (aeons)’ as his phrase “eternal ages” means which is further broken up to some special highlight of certain focus ages such as the “ages of Ages” and the general succession of one age which terminates and is followed by another is exemplified in the phrase “ages” as it was with the “past ages” (Colossians 1:26, Ephesians 3:5) & so it will be into the future too always toward all created things as this is confirmed further in agreement of definition to the First Christianity quote below too:
“… But ALL THINGS which proceed from Him, WHATSOEVER have been MADE, and are made, do indeed receive their own beginning of generation, and on this account are INFERIOR to Him who formed them, inasmuch as they are not unbegotten. Nevertheless THEY ENDURE, and EXTEND their EXISTENCE into a LONG SERIES of AGES [Aeons, Aeon1, Aeon2, Aeon3, …] in accordance with the WILL of GOD their Creator; so that He GRANTS them that they should be thus formed at the beginning, and that they should so exist afterwards.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Chapter XXXIV, Point 2)
Translation Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
and
“… yet that I may satisfy thee on Scriptural grounds, learn that He made not only what is past, but also what is future, as it is written: “Who made things to come.” Elsewhere too Scripture says: “By whom also He made the ages, who is the brightness of His glory and the express Image of His Person.” Now the ages are past and present and future. How then were those made which are future, unless it is that His active power and knowledge contains within itself the number of all the ages? For just as He calls the things that are not as though they were, s so has He made things future as though they were. It cannot come to pass that they should not be. Those things which He has directed to be, necessarily will be. Therefore He who has made the things that are to be, knows them in the way in which they will be. If we are to believe this about the ages, much more must we believe it about the day of judgment, on the ground that the Son of God has knowledge of it, as being already made by Him. For it is written: “According to Thine ordinance the day will continue.” He did not merely say “the day continues,” but even “will continue,” so that the things which are to come might be governed by His ordinance. Does He not know what He ordered? “He who planted the ear, shall He not hear? He that formed the eye shall He not see?” …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 197 – 198 Chapter 4 Pages 730 – 731)
Source:
From the First Christianity quote above:
“… In a word, it purifies all things for itself, things visible and invisible, thrones, dominions, principalities authorities, powers. But in all is the same holy voice crying, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” from glory to glory, < to glorify > the Father in the Son, and the Son in the Father with the Holy Spirit, to whom be glory and might unto the ages of ages. Amen. And he who so believes will say “So be it! So be it. ” …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
St. Epiphanius understands Colossians 1:20 as being Prophetic toward God Who “purifies all things for itself” where the “all” refers not to Christians things only but certainly includes them first as he defines this “all” in verse Colossians 1:20 to refer to exactly the same as the Holy & Blessed Apostle Paul did in Colossians 1:16 prior which is in his words, “things visible and invisible, thrones, dominions, principalities authorities, powers.” (the phrase visible & invisible itself refers to both good & evil rational beings) to the end that all these will eventually Submit to God Finally crying out as “in all is the same holy voice crying, “Holy, Holy, Holy,”.
Note: The three “Holy” is indication of the Most Holy Trinity, i. e. “Holy, Holy, Holy” refers to “Holy to God the Father”, “Holy to God the Son” and “Holy to God the Holy Spirit” as some ancient Writers have pointed out.
iii. Faith of Jesus Christ Mystery
“Even the Righteousness of God which is by Faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference” – apostle Paul (Romans 3:22, KJV)
This Context is further strengthened by St. Epiphanius’ own quote above regarding the “Faith of Jesus Christ” (Christ’s Faith to Justify all, Romans 3:22, not our ‘faith in Christ’, in contrast Romans 3:3 – 4) in quote below:
“… For its [GodHead’s] Own Glory and Faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
8) Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers
Since ‘Sodom and Gomorrah’ has been the example of the ‘Eternal [Aeonian, age-during] Fire’ punishment (Jude 1:7), this saint belives in Salvation being Possible after that (‘Purgatorial Hell Universalism’) in light of the Scripture Ezekiel 16:53 – 54 and Acts 3:21 as he says that ‘EVEN SODOM and GOMORRAH, THEIR PUNISHMENT in history having satisfied the righteousness of God [Jude 1:7], shall ULTIMATELY BE SAVED’, to quote:
“… Man has a natural proclivity to evil, an inherited weakness which has, as a matter of experience, betrayed ALL MEN into actual sin, with the exception of Christ . Elsewhere, however, Hilary recognises the possibility, under existing conditions, of a sinless life. For David could make the prayer, ‘Take from me the way of iniquity;’ of iniquity itself he was guiltless, and only needed to pray against the tendency inherent in his bodily nature . But such a case is altogether exceptional; ordinary men must confide in the thought that God is indulgent, for He knows our infirmity. He is propitiated by the wish to be righteous, and in His judgment the merits of good men outweigh their sins . Hence a prevalent tone of hopefulness about the future state of the baptized; EVEN SODOM and GOMORRAH, THEIR PUNISHMENT in history having satisfied the righteousness of God [Jude 1:7], shall ULTIMATELY BE SAVED. Yet God has a perfect, immutable goodness of which human goodness, though real, falls infinitely short, because He is steadfast and we are driven by varying impulses . This DIVINE GOODNESS is the STANDARD and the HOPE set before us. It can only be attained by GRACE, and GRACE is FREELY OFFERED. But just as the SOUL, being free, advances to meet sin, so it MUST ADVANCE to MEET GRACE…” – Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD, ‘The Theology of Hilary of Poictiers*,Page 122)
* in the Book ‘Ante-Nicene Fathers Volume 01 The Apostolic Fathers with Justin Martyr and Irenaeus To Ante Nicene Fathers Volume 10 Bibliographic Synopsis General Index’ by Schaff, Philip (1819-1893).
Source:
He also sees that All Enemies of God will eventually Submit back to Him as per His Reign based on Romans 11:26 – 32 and 1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28, to quote:
“… When authorities and powers are abolished, His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. The same Apostle tells who are these enemies, As touching the Gospel they are enemies for your sakes, but as touching the election they are beloved for the fathers’ sake . We remember that they are enemies of the cross of Christ; let us remember also that, because they are beloved for the fathers’ sake, they are reserved for the subjection, as the Apostle says, I would not, brethren, have you ignorant of this mystery, lest ye be wise in your own conceits, that a hardening in part hath befallen Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved, even as it is written, There shall come out of Sion a Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: and this is the covenant firm Me to them, when I have taken away their sins . So His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. But we must not forget what follows the subjection, namely, Last of all is death conquered by Him 1284 . This victory over death is nothing else than the resurrection from the dead: for when the corruption of death is stayed, the quickened and now heavenly nature is made eternal, as it is written, For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. But when this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in strife. O death, where is thy sting? O death, where is thy strife ? In the subjection of His enemies death is conquered; and, death conquered, life immortal follows…” Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD, Book XI ‘On the Trinity’, Points 34 – 35, Page 481**)
Source:
https://archive.org/stream/StHilaryOfPoitiersSelectWorks/StHilaryofPoitiersSelectWorks_djvu.txt
9) Blessed Ambrosiaster
How did First Christianity understand Matthew 26:28’s Ransom for Many and not for all?
“… QUESTION 54. THE APOSTLE TEACHES THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED FOR ALL MEN. “ALL ARE THEREFORE DEAD,” SAID HE, “AND HE DIED FOR ALL.” THE SAVIOR SAYS, ON THE CONTRARY: THE SON OF MAN HAS COME TO GIVE HIS LIFE FOR THE REDEMPTION OF MANY. (MATT 20:28) THERE IS HERE A CONTRADICTION. — The words are different, it is true, but the meaning is the same; at other times, on the other hand, words that seem the same have quite a different meaning, such as these: “All that is not done in good faith (ex fide) is a sin.” (Rom. 14:23) and these others: “The law does not come from faith,” (Gal. 3:12) although the law is not a sin. This great number of which the Savior speaks is all the men of whom St. Paul speaks: They are in great numbers, because the greater part of all peoples and all nations ought to believe in the Savior. It is this great number of those who must believe that the Apostle calls all men. “He is dead for all,” he says, “that is, for those who believe and must believe.” He died also for those who refused to believe, but by refusing the grace he offers them, they do not want Jesus Christ to be dead for them, and by the same he seems not to have died for those to that his death was much more harmful than useful. On the contrary, he truly died for those who won, and who understand the mystery of the redemption give thanks to God through our Lord Jesus Christ. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source:
i.1. Majority of Mankind is the “Many” who will be Saved after believing in Him
” … They are in great numbers, because the greater part of all peoples and all nations ought to believe in the Savior. It is this great number of those who must believe that the Apostle calls all men. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
i.2 How can this be when most of mankind don’t believe him on earth?
“… “He is dead for all,” he says, “that is, for those who believe and must believe.” …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
Where,
“those who believe” = Christians who believe in Him on earth (Sheepfold1) = the “few” , the Elect (Matthew 7:14)
and
“for those who … must believe” = Good non-Christians who believe in Him either in Hades now or by the Last Day on Judgment Day? (Sheepfold2) . We will explore this Mystery later using Ambrosiaster’s own words to try to understand why he made such a distinction as he might be referring to God’s Will which is inclusive of anyone who chooses to believe in Him literally ‘after seeing Him’ (John 6:40) as even the Visions of Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh has confirmed.
i.3 How about the unbelievers?
“… He died also for those who refused to believe, but by refusing the grace he offers them, they do not want Jesus Christ to be dead for them, and by the same he seems not to have died for those to that his death was much more harmful than useful. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
Comment: This ‘refused to believe’ is not necessarily those who refuse on earth among good non-Christians but those till Judgment Day who refuse to believe. As Sadhu Sundar Singh has pointed out, the ‘wicked dead’ seems not to be able to believe in the afterlife due to their lives sealing them as ‘remaining as unbelievers’ till being cast into the Lake of Fire (Revelation 21:8). Is there Hope for them? Next we will see Ambrosiaster’s other quotes.
Final Judgment – Three Types of Men – The Righteous, The Sinners and The Wicked
Each quote next is from the Roman Catholic Bible Commentary Source below unless stated otherwise (“QUESTION 110. ON THE FIRST PSALM.”):
“… The Psalmist represents here THREE KINDS OF MEN, the UNGODLY, the SINNERS, and the JUST, in the order followed by the error. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Where possibly,
the UNGODLY = The Wicked (The Evil ones among Christians and non-Christians)
or
the SINNERS = Good non-Christians and some fallen Christians (Sheepfold2)
and
the JUST = The Righteous = Saved Christians (Sheepfold1)
Because
The Fate of the Sinners – Hope after Punishment?
“… “Blessed is the man who did not stop in the way of sinners.” If he stops there, he stops being blessed to become guilty and worthy of punishment. Yet he still retains some hope of amendment, because he is not impious, but simply sinful. If a man is found who has not entered the council of the wicked and has not stopped in the way of sinners, he is doubly blessed. For he cannot be blessed, if without entering into the counsel of the wicked, he stops in the path of sinners, because if he does not then have a complete ruin, he is nevertheless worthy of punishment. The Psalmist adds: “nor sits in the seat of scoffers.” Happiness, according to him, consists of these three degrees together, and is based on a triple reason, not to enter the counsel of the ungodly, not stopping in the path of sinners, nor sits in the seat of scoffers, but, as we see in the first two degrees only two kinds of people, the ungodly and the sinners to whom this third degree applies: “Nor sits in the seat of scoffers?” Is it to the impious or the sinners? … The wretches who live under the law of God will be cited before the tribunal of Jesus Christ, and separated from the righteous to give account of the commandments of the law which they have received, and that they did not put into practice to obtain the approval of God and to avoid his reproaches. … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Hope after Punishment focus Phrases from the above:
“… If he stops there, he stops being blessed to become guilty and worthy of punishment. Yet he still retains some hope of amendment, because he is not impious, but simply sinful. … because if he does not then have a complete ruin, he is nevertheless worthy of punishment. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
and Saved from the Lake of Fire or Basic Salvation by His Name Hope?
Verses: Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13.
” … QUESTION 126. FROM THE ONE WHO RECEIVED THE FAITH OF JESUS CHRIST. … In fact, the knowledge of God must inspire the fear of the just judge, in whose court he teaches us that the faithful will receive the reward of their righteousness, and the ungodly, that is to say the unbelievers, the just punishment of their infidelity. It is of all justice, indeed, that the good ones be filled with joy in the future life in which Jesus Christ must reign with his chosen ones. They have been exposed to scorn, outrages in this world where the devil reigns, they will appear surrounded by glory in the kingdom of Jesus Christ for which they have borne the contempt of the worldly. SINNERS, on the contrary, who seemed to shine here below a false brilliance, opposing falsehood to truth, have to wait for tribulation and an imaginary glory to succeed for them a contempt, a humiliation too real. The righteous will rejoice in having believed, when they witness the chastisements of the unbelieving, and THE UNFAITHFUL WILL REPENT of THEIR UNBELIEF ONLY when THEY SEE BOTH THEIR OWN CHASTISEMENT and the glory of those WHOSE FAITH THEY HAD REGARDED as an ACT of MADNESS, which was only worthy of their contempt. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source:
Focus Phrases Proving our Claim:
“… SINNERS, on the contrary, who seemed to shine here below a false brilliance, opposing falsehood to truth, have to wait for tribulation and an imaginary glory to succeed for them a contempt, a humiliation too real. … and THE UNFAITHFUL WILL REPENT of THEIR UNBELIEF ONLY when THEY SEE BOTH THEIR OWN CHASTISEMENT and the glory of those WHOSE FAITH THEY HAD REGARDED as an ACT of MADNESS, which was only worthy of their contempt. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
Since these “sinners” or the “unfaithful” who “repent of their unbelief” on this Judgment Day (according to Blessed Ambrosiaster above) are said to have been those who regarded the Faith of True-Christians as “Madness”, thus these must refer to the ‘Sinners’ (Good non-Christians) and/or ‘Wicked only’ being ‘unbelievers’ who must first endure their Judgment/Chastisement first accordingly (Luke 12:46 – 48) making our definition earlier accurate in Blessed Ambrosiaster’s own words in this ‘Judgment Day Context’.
iii) Salvation from Hell both now and in His Second Coming Hope
“… The prophet Joel also predicted this phenomenon so that one cannot doubt the fulfillment of a fact attested by several witnesses. “And the sun,” he says, “will be changed into darkness and the moon into blood before the great and terrible DAY of the LORD’s COMING.” (Joel 2:31) . As far as the literal meaning of these words indicates, they seem to be more fitting for the SECOND ADVENT, for then the Lord will manifest himself publicly to ALL MEN, to the testimony of Scripture: “Then every eye will see him, and all the tribes of the earth and those who have crucified him will strike their breast.” (Rev. 1:7) … So the prophet foretold that the Savior would take care of their infirmities, and this prophecy is fulfilled in his time, as we see in the Gospel: “He really has borne our torpor, of our sufferings.” (Isa. 1:4) All these predictions have received their consummation and fulfillment in the Savior’s passion, and thus the SALVATION of the HUMAN RACE has been done in a true way for those who were on EARTH or in HELL*, for the prophecy of Zachariah embraces both of them at once. On earth, men have been freed from the oppression of their enemies by the intervention of the mercy of God, and in HELL THEY were DELIVERED from the SORROWS THEY ENDURED. Indeed, all those who hoped in Christ who had been Promised to them awaited the coming of Him Who was to triumph over DEATH and DELIVER THEM from HELL. This is why Zechariah says: “To fulfill His mercies toward our fathers.” (Luke 1:72) But if it is understood that THIS SALVATION must also come in the SECOND ADVENT, … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (Written c. 366 – c. 384, Reply to Question 105, Commentary on the Gospel of Luke)
Source:
Comments:
“… He [Lord Jesus Christ] said unto us: Verily I say unto you, that I have obtained the whole power of my Father, that I may bring back into light them that dwell in darkness, them that are in corruption into incorruption, them that are in death into life, and that I may loose them that are in fetters. For that which is impossible with men, is possible with the Father. I am the hope of them that despair, the helper of them that have no saviour, the wealth of the poor, the health of the sick, and the resurrection of the dead…” (Epistle of the Apostles, Point 21)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/apostolorum.html
“… Sheol saw me and was shattered, and Death ejected me and many with me. I have been vinegar and bitterness to it, and I went down with it as far as its depth. Then the feet and the head it released, because it was not able to endure my face. And I made a congregation of living among his dead; and I spoke with them by living lips; in order that my word may not be unprofitable. And those who had died ran towards me; and they cried out and said, Son of God, have pity on us. And deal with us according to Your kindness, and bring us out from the bonds of darkness. And open for us the door by which we may come out to You; for we perceive that our death does not touch You. May we also be saved with You, because You are our Savior. Then I heard their voice, and placed their faith in my heart. And I placed my name upon their head, because they are free and they are mine.Hallelujah…” (Odes of Solomon 42:11 – 20)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/odes.html
Note: Hades (Greek) = Sheol (Hebrew) = Hell now (in English)
10) Blessed St. Ambrose of Milan
What Happens to those who are Unsaved in the ‘Outer Darkness’ [Matthew 8:12], the ‘Unquenchable Fire’ [Matthew 3:12] & the ‘Worm that does not Die’ [Mark 9:48]?
“… It is not enough, however, to come if one is invited: one must have the wedding dress, that is to say have faith and charity. Whoever therefore does not bring peace and charity to the altars of Christ will be seized by the feet and the hands, and thrown into the darkness from without. “There will be tears and gnashing of teeth. What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light (Jn, xii, 35); and whoever is without Christ is in darkness, because the inner light is Christ. So it is not a question of the creaking of the material teeth, nor of some eternal fire of material flames, nor of a material worm. But this is to note that, as excess food causes fevers and worms, so too, if one does not somehow cook one’s sins by using sobriety and abstinence, but if, piling up sins on sins, one contracts as indigestion old and new faults, one will be burned by his own fire and devoured by his verses. So Isaiah says, “Walk in the light of your fire and the flame that you have lit” (Is., L, 11). The fire is the one engendered by the sadness of faults; the worm comes from the fact that the insane sins of the soul attack the mind and the senses of the guilty, and gnaw at the entrails of his conscience (Sag., XII, 5); as the worms are born of each, so to speak of the body of the sinner. So the Lord said it through Isaiah, saying, “And they shall see the members of men who have averred against me; and their worm will not die, and their fire will not be extinguished “(Is., LXVI, 24). The grinding of teeth also expresses a feeling of indignation, because too late we repent, too late we moan, too late we take it upon ourselves to have sinned with a perversity so tenacious. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD)
Source:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-14
So, the Eternal (or ‘age-during’ shame/punishment) as Blessed St. Ambrose of Milan sees it as that they lose these Great Rewards in Comparison to those who attain it and are Sad permanently due to it.
Blessed St. Ambrose doesn’t seem to see that they’re unsaved (because they are NOT in “prisons” anymore, “nor” will be placed there thereafter) but may be dwelling in the other darkness regions, to quote:
“… What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
Edifying Comments:
From the above, Blessed St. Ambrose does NOT see that the ‘Final Lake of Fire is literal (material, Revelation 21:8, Revelation 20:11 – 15)’ nor that the ‘Worm is literal’ (Mark 9:48) and Neither that the ‘Gnashing of teeth as literal either’ (Matthew 13:42, Luke 13:28):
“… So it is not a question of the creaking of the material teeth, nor of some eternal fire of material flames, nor of a material worm. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
This Concept of Understanding that the Final-Hell/Gehenna/Lake of Fire Punishment is not literal (e.g. as per the ‘gnashing of teeth’) but refers to the ‘soul’s thoughts tormenting it’ is expressed even by the Great Saint of Orthodoxy below, to quote:
“…But as to “There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth ,” 54 we must confront them with the objection that, as in this life the creator has made every member of the body for some purpose, so he has made the teeth to chew solid food Why do the damned need teeth, then? Our brethren do not claim that they eat in hell. (2) And it must be pointed out that not everything in scripture is to be taken literally. Scripture says, “Thou hast broken the teeth of sinners, ” 55 and, “The Lord hath crushed the teeth of the lions ,” 56 but who is so foolish as to suppose that, while preserving sinners’ bodies, God breaks only their teeth? (3) Just as whoever wanted the lines to read like that was obliged by his discomfort with them to resort to allegory, so one must look for the gnashing of the teeth of the damned. The soul has the faculty of “chewing [on things],” and when convicted of its sins will “gnash its teeth” by the clashing of its thoughts . 51 16.6 But “Fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell [Gehenna]” 58 perhaps teaches that the soul is incorporeal, or even, perhaps, means that
the soul will not be punished apart from the body. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘ORIGEN’ , “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 16.1 – 16., Pages 146 – 147)
Source:
So, the Eternal (or ‘age-during’ shame/punishment) as Blessed St. Ambrose of Milan sees it as that they lose these Great Rewards in Comparison to those who attain it and are Sad permanently due to it.
Blessed St. Ambrose doesn’t seem to see that they’re unsaved (because they are NOT in “prisons” anymore, “nor” will be placed there thereafter) but may be dwelling in the other darkness regions, to quote:
“… What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
“… Finally, as to a veteran who has finished his service, this bonus is offered, the contempt of riches. For whoever, absorbed by the lower worries, obtains terrestrial domains, can not obtain the kingdom of heaven, since the Lord says: “Sell all your goods, and follow me” (Matt., XIX, 21); no more he who buys oxen, since Elisha killed those he had and shared them with the people (I Kings, XIX, 21); as for the one who takes a wife, he thinks of the things of the world, not of God. This is not to condemn marriage, but because virginity is called to a greater honor; for “the unmarried woman and the widow think of the things of the Lord, so that she is holy in body and spirit; for she who is married thinks of the things of the world, and how to please her husband “(I Cor. VII, 34). But to return to grace, as we have done above for widows, with wives, we do not reject the opinion followed by many, in the thought of which three kinds of people are excluded from the society of this great feast : Gentiles, Jews, heretics. This is why the Apostle tells us to flee from greed (Rom., I, 29), lest they be hindered, in the manner of the Gentiles, by injustice, malice, impurity, avarice we can not reach the Kingdom of Christ: for “every miser, every unclean person – he is a slave to idols – can not be heir to the kingdom of Christ and to God” (Ephesians 5: 5) … (The guests) therefore apologize, because the Kingdom is not closed to anyone who has not excluded himself by the testimony of his word; the Lord in his clemency invites everyone, but it is our cowardice or our misguidance that separates us. So whoever buys a farm is a stranger to the Kingdom: for in Noah’s day you have read it, buyer and seller have been swallowed up by the flood (Matt., XXI, 21); likewise he who prefers the yoke of the Law to the benefit of grace, and the one who apologizes because he takes a wife: for it is written, “If anyone comes to me without hating his father and his mother, his wife, or can not be my disciple “(Lk, XVII, 27). So indeed that the Lord because of us gives up his Mother when He says, “Who are my mother, or who are my brothers? (Matt. Xii. 48) Why would you prefer them to your Master? But the Lord commands neither to misunderstand nature nor to be a slave to it: simply to condescend to nature while venerating its Author, and without failing God for the sake of the parents. So, after the proud disdain of the rich, He turned to the Gentiles; He made good and bad come in, to make the good grow, to change the dispositions of the wicked well, to realize what was read today: “Then wolves and lambs will have common pasture” (Is., LXV, 25 ). He invites the poor, the infirm, the blind: which shows us that bodily infirmity excludes no one from the Kingdom, and that sins are rarer when there is no invitation to sin; or that the infirmity of sins is forgiven by the mercy of the Lord, so that being redeemed from his fault not by works, but by faith, if one glorifies oneself it will be in the Lord (Rom. IX, 32, I Cor., 1,31). …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD)
Source:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-14
Please note ‘carefully’ the following phrases from above:
One Last Chance on Judgment Day to attain Basic Salvation probably into the ‘lower terrestrial domains’ (or ‘Outer Darkness’) Regions?
to quote from above too:
“… He made good and bad come in, to make the good grow, to change the dispositions of the wicked well, to realize what was read today: “Then wolves and lambs will have common pasture” (Is., LXV, 25 ). He invites the poor, the infirm, the blind: which shows us that bodily infirmity excludes no one from the Kingdom, and that sins are rarer when there is no invitation to sin; or that the infirmity of sins is forgiven by the mercy of the Lord, so that being redeemed from his fault not by works, but by faith, if one glorifies oneself it will be in the Lord (Rom. IX, 32, I Cor., 1,31). …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
Focus Phrase Proving our Claim:
” … He made good and bad come in, to make the good grow, to change the dispositions of the wicked well …” where the phrase “change the dispositions of the wicked well” may mean Repentance and Chance to attain to Faith on His Second Coming as Blessed St. Ambrose continues, “… that the infirmity of sins is forgiven by the mercy of the Lord, so that being redeemed from his fault not by works, but by faith, …”.
To Understand further the Difference being ‘Saved only’ vs ‘Saved & Entering His Kingdom’, please allow me to quote an Ancient Commentary as it is found in the Catholic Bible as follows:
“… The righteousness of the Scribes and Pharisees are the commandments of Moses; but the commandments of Christ are the fulfilment of that Law. This then is His meaning; Whosoever in addition to the commandments of the Law shall not fulfil My commandments, shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. For those indeed save from the punishment due to transgressors of the Law, but do not bring into the kingdom; but My commandments both deliver from punishment, [p. 174] and bring into the kingdom. But seeing that to break the least commandments and not to keep them are one and the same, why does He say above of him that breaks the commandments, that “he shall be the least in the kingdom of heaven,” and here of him who keeps them not, that he “shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven?” See how to be the least in the kingdom is the same with not entering into the kingdom. For a man to be in the kingdom is not to reign with Christ, but only to be numbered among Christ’s people; what He says then of him that breaks the commandments is, that he shall indeed be reckoned among Christians, yet the least of them. but he who enters into the kingdom, becomes partaker of His kingdom with Christ. Therefore he who does not enter into the kingdom of heaven, shall not indeed have a part of Christ’s glory, yet shall he be in the kingdom of heaven, that is, in the number of those over whom Christ reigns as King of heaven…” – from a Pseudo-Chrysostom Manuscript (c. 4th – 5th Century)
Source:
Comments:
So ‘no Christian’ (i.e. the Saved ones who do not undergo the Lake of Fire Judgment, John 5:24) can it refer to the Pseudo-Chrysostom’s phrases of “… [who] shall not indeed have a part of Christ’s glory…”. Indeed, ‘Every Christian’ will ‘Partake of Christ’s Glory according to his works/merit’. Even St. Clement of Alexandria’s quote agrees with this Mystery:
“… Conformably, therefore, there are various abodes, according to the worth of those who have believed… . These chosen abodes, which are three, are indicated by the numbers in the Gospel — the thirty, the sixty, the hundred. And the perfect inheritance belongs to those who attain to “a perfect man,” according to the image of the Lord. …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, CHAPTER XIV, Stromata Book 6)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book6.html
iii) The ‘Fallen Believers’ whom Christ Rejects as Stating that ‘He never knew them’ (Matthew 7:21 – 23) itself proves that these are not Considered to be His Bride (Christians) anymore and the Pseudo-Chrysostom thus refers to such ones together with the unbelievers (implied) to be in some ‘outer regions’ within the kingdom of the heavens (not heavens*) in some common meeting place areas being among Christians.
*The Kingdom of Heavens may thus be seen to include separate regions of the Heavens, Paradise, the New-Jerusalem-City and the ‘Outside the City Regions’ which it eventually Conquers in Christ.
Indeed, every Christian is a Co-Heir with Christ (Romans 8:17) and will Reign with Christ over them too (2 Timothy 2:12) as ‘kings & priests in His Imperishable Kingdom beginning with the next age’ (Revelation 5:10) and into the ‘Ages to Come’ (Ephesians 2:7) of whose Increase is Truly Eternal and has ‘no end’ (Luke 1:33).
“And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?” Jesus answered them, “To you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been granted. … Therefore I speak to them in parables; because while seeing they do not see, and while hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 13:10, 11, 13, NASB)
It is clear that the “Pseudo-Chrysostom Manuscript” reveals an understanding in First Christianity that ‘entering His Kingdom’ means ‘to Reign with Him and Share His Glory’ while ‘not entering His Kingdom refers to being Saved with a Basic Salvation and being Ruled Over being least in His Kingdom’.
iii. Unbelief will be Overcome by the Faith of God (Romans 3:3 – 4)
Context for God overcoming the Unbelief of Men as it is Written in Romans 3:3 – 4?
The Unbelief of All Men may be Solved and these may believe as it is Written above till God becomes all in all after the third shaking of the Heavens, Earth, Sea when ‘All Principalities, Powers (of Evil, Devil, Demons, Darkness) shall be Destroyed, implied’, as St. Ambrose explains:
“… This is that peace above all peace which shall be granted AFTER the THIRD SHAKING of the heaven, the sea, the earth and the dry land, when He shall DESTROY ALL PRINCIPALITIES and POWERS [Ephesians 6:12, Colossians 2:15, Isaiah 24:21]. For HEAVEN and EARTH shall PASS AWAY [Revelation 21:1],306 and ALL the FASHION of this WORLD [1 Corinthians 7:31, 1 John 2:17]; … And thus there will be peace over all, the passions of the body offering no resistance, and the UNBELIEVING mind NO OBSTACLE [Romans 3:3 – 4], that CHRIST may be ALL in ALL [1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28], offering in SUBJECTION to the Father the HEARTS of ALL MEN [1 Timothy 2:4, 1 Timothy 4:10] …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, LETTER XXX, AMBROSE TO IRENAEUS, GREETING, Point 14)
Source:
https://www.ccel.org/ccel/pearse/morefathers/files/ambrose_letters_03_letters21_30.htm
and
Please note carefully that even St. Augustine who believed in eternal hell (in a time after St. Hilary) did not condemn him but rather still praises his faith in Christ. So, believing likewise in Christ Centered Universalism is not liable to any condemnation at all as even St. Jerome of the Vulgate revealed more clearly St. Hilary’s Christ Centered Universalism in his infamous quote below from St. Hilary’s probably ‘lost content’ of his 11th Book Defending Trinity on Christ Centered Universalism Grounds as follows, to quote:
“… Your third and last question relates to the passage in the same epistle where the apostle in discussing the resurrection, comes to the words: “for he must reign, till he hath put all things under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him that God may be all in all.” [1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28] I am surprised that you have resolved to question me about this passage when that reverend man, Hilary, bishop of Poictiers, has occupied the eleventh book of his treatise against the Arians with a full examination and explanation of it. Yet I may at least say a few words. The chief stumbling-block in the passage is that the Son is said to be subject to the Father. Now which is the more shameful and humiliating, to be subject to the Father (often a mark of loving devotion as in the psalm “truly my soul is subject unto God”) or to be crucified and made the curse of the cross? For “cursed is everyone that hangeth on a tree.” If Christ then for our sakes was made a curse that He might deliver us from the curse of the law, are you surprised that lie is also for our sakes subject to the Father to make us too subject to Him as He says in the gospel: “No man cometh unto the Father but by me,” and “I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will DRAW ALL men UNTO ME.” [John 12:32] Christ then is subject to the Father in the faithful; for ALL BELIEVERS, NAY the WHOLE HUMAN RACE, are accounted MEMBERS of HIS BODY. But in UNBELIEVERS, that is in JEWS, HEATHENS, and HERETICS, He is said to be NOT SUBJECT; for these members of His body are NOT SUBJECT to the FAITH. But in the END of the world when ALL HIS MEMBERS shall SEE CHRIST, that is their own body, reigning, THEY ALSO shall be MADE SUBJECT to Christ, that is to their own body, that the whole of Christ’s body may be subject unto God and the Father, and that God may be ALL in ALL [1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28]. He does not say “that the Father may be all in all” but that “God” may be, a title which properly belongs to the Trinity and may be referred not only to the Father but also to the Son and to the Holy Ghost. His meaning therefore is “that HUMANITY may be SUBJECT to the GODHEAD.” By HUMANITY we here intend not that gentleness and kindness which the Greeks call philanthropy but the WHOLE HUMAN RACE Moreover when he says “that God may be all in all,” it is to be taken in this sense. At present our Lord and Saviour is not all in all, but only a part in each of us. For instance He is wisdom in Solomon, generosity in David, patience in Job, knowledge of things to come in Daniel faith in Peter, zeal in Phinehas and Paul, virginity in John, and other virtues in others. But when the end of all things shall come, then shall He be all in all, for then the saints shall severally possess all the virtues and all will possess Christ in His entirety….” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD, Letter LV TO AMANDUS, Point 5, Written about the year 394 A. D.)
Source:
http://www.annussacerdotalis.org/clerus/dati/2001-02/17-999999/Lett.html
Note: Though St. Jerome of the Vulgate began to lean toward Eternal-Hell theology of St. Augustine from 395 AD onward, he clearly reveals in the letter above circa 394 AD, “honestly” (a content which probably is “lost” quoting from St. Hilary of Poictiers’ 11th Book regarding the Mystery of Christ Centered Universalism). Please note also that St. Hilary has been dead for almost “30 plus years” at the time St. Jerome writes this letter proving that St. Hilary is certainly a Christ Centered Universalism believer.
“… Although what has been said sufficiently shows how inclined the Lord Jesus is to mercy, let Him further instruct us with His own words, when He would arm us against the assaults of persecution. “Fear not,” He says, “those who kill the body, but cannot kill the soul, but rather fear Him Who can cast both body and soul into hell.” … Who will not cast off for ever even those whom He casts off? For David says: “God will not cast off for ever,” and in opposition to this shall we listen to heresy asserting, “He does cast off for ever”? David says: “God will not for ever cut off His mercy from generation to generation, nor will He forget to be merciful.” This is the prophet’s declaration, and there are those who would maintain a forgetfulness of mercy on God’s part… ” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 15, Point 20, Chapter 4, Page 776 – 777)
Source:
Comment: St. Ambrose’s quote above clearly shows that even in the context of the ones being ‘Cast Off’ by the Lord (e.g. the Wicked on Judgment Day, Matthew 25:46) are NOT Cast off ‘for ever’ by Him because His MERCY can and will ‘cancel’ that Sentence after they Repent as quoted in the Context of Hell (Gehenna, the Lake of Fire) too.
The points I’m not quoting in St. Ambrose’s writing above (which you can read in link above) points to his comparison somewhat crudely put like this: ‘… Do you think that Christ is going to reject the Christians who might have denied Him whilst being tortured succumbing to pain? No because even toward the ones whom He has Cast Off the Lord has NOT intended such ones with Voluntary denial itself to remain Cast Off Forever away from him!…’ (If you don’t believe me that this is what St. Ambrose means in that entire Chapter 4, please read it for yourself to see whether I am Speaking the Truth or have misunderstood him – Checking Sermons/Scripture is a ‘Noble’ Attitude, Acts 17:11).
11) Other Major Saints
The ‘afterlife keeping in prison’ Post-Judgment awaiting Christ’s Salvation via Preaching of the Gospel has happened in the past (1 Peter 3:18 – 19) toward all as even St. Melito of Sardis clearly revealed proving this Context true toward the ‘future Gehenna Judgment’ as well as 1 Peter 4:5 – 6 implies:
Verses Describing this Parabolically: Mark 3:27 & Matthew 12:29.
First Christianity taught this:
“The Lord, having put on human nature, and having suffered for him who suffered, having been bound for him who was bound, and having been buried for him who was buried, is risen from the dead, and loudly proclaims this message: Who will contend against me? Let him stand before me. It is I who delivered the condemned. It is I who gave life to the dead. It is I who raised up the buried. Who will argue with me? It is I, says Christ, who destroyed death. It is I who triumphed over the enemy, and having trod down HADES, and bound the STRONG MAN, and have SNATCHED MANKIND up to the HEIGHTS of HEAVEN. It is I, says Christ. So then, come here ALL you FAMILIES of MEN, weighed down by your sins and recieve pardon for your misdeeds. For I am your pardon. I am the Passover which brings salvation. I am the Lamb slain for you. I am your lustral bath. I am your life. I am your resurrection. I am your light, I am your salvation, I am your King. It is I who brings you up to the heights of heaven. It is I who will give you the resurrection there. I will show you the Eternal Father. I will raise you up with my own right hand.” – Blessed St. Melito, Jewish Bishop of Sardis, of whom Polycrates of Ephesus to Pope Victor about 194 (Eusebius, Church History V.24) states that “Melito the eunuch [this is interpreted “the virgin” by Rufinus in his translation of Eusebius], whose whole walk was in the Holy Spirit”, was buried at Sardis and Jerome, speaking of the Old Testament canon established by Melito, quotes Tertullian to the effect that he was esteemed as a prophet by many of the faithful (Died c. 180 AD, ‘Homily on Pascha’)
Source: https://www.orthodox.net/pascha/pascha-melito.html
Please note ‘carefully’ also that neither of these quote refers to men of the past alone but “Man” in general (e. g. St. Irenaeous’ uses a two-fold argument to refer to Man and Adam by equivalence being set free from Condemnation* while St. Melito’s quote clearly mentions that Christ brings Salvation to all the families of Mankind in Hades itself) . Yes , even Hades/Sheol is mentioned in St. Melito’s quote. A Deep Mystery Indeed.
“… Eastern and Oriental Orthodox believe in the possibility of situation change for the souls of the dead through the prayers of the living, and reject the term “purgatory”. Prayer for the dead is encouraged in the belief that it is helpful for them, although how the prayers of the faithful help the departed is not elucidated. Eastern Orthodox simply believe that tradition teaches that prayers should be made for the dead.[14][15] Saint Basil the Great (379 CE), writes in his Third Kneeling Prayer at Pentecost: “O Christ our God…(who) on this all-perfect and saving Feast, art graciously pleased to accept propitiatory prayers for those who are imprisoned in hades, promising unto us who are held in bondage great hope of release from the vilenes that doth hinder us and did hinder them … send down Thy consolation… and establish their souls in the mansions of the Just; and graciously vouchsafe unto them peace and pardon; for not the dead shall praise thee, O Lord, neither shall they who are in Hell make bold to offer unto thee confession. But we who are living will bless thee, and will pray, and offer unto thee propitiatory prayers and sacrifices for their souls.”[16] Saint Gregory Dialogus († 604) in his famous Dialogues (written in 593) teaches that, “The Holy Sacrifice (Eucharist) of Christ, our saving Victim, brings great benefits to souls even after death, provided their sins (are such as) can be pardoned in the life to come.”[17] However, St. Gregory goes on to say, the Church’s practice of prayer for the dead must not be an excuse for not living a godly life on earth. “The safer course, naturally, is to do for ourselves during life what we hope others will do for us after death.”…”
Source:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prayer_for_the_dead
“And so we, having been called through His will in Christ Jesus, are not justified through ourselves* or through our own wisdom or understanding or piety or works which we wrought in holiness of heart, but through faith, whereby the Almighty God justified all men that have been from the beginning; to whom be the glory for ever and ever. Amen.” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome (c. 35 AD – c. 99 AD, 1 Clement 32:4)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/1clement-lightfoot.html
“Wages cannot be considered as a gift, because they are due to work, but God has given free grace to all men by the justification of faith.” – Blessed St. Hilary of Poitiers (c 315 AD – 367 AD) on Matthew 20:7)
[George Finch, A Sketch of the Romish Controversy (London: G. Norman, 1831), p. 230.]
Source:
Here’s a First Christianity Rarely known Orthodox Quote uttered by an ‘eternal Hell believing theologian’ who may actually be ‘quoting what the ancient and most orthodox Christians before him believed in regards to this context’:
“… after the witness of Gabriel, after her secret knowledge of the divine conception, after the great exhibition of miracles, she shall feel about her soul a mighty tempest. The Lord was bound to taste of death for every man — to become a propitiation for the world and to justify all men by His own blood. Even thou thyself, who hast been taught from on high the things concerning the Lord, shalt be reached by some doubt. This is the sword. “That the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.” …” – Blessed St. Basil the Great, was the bishop of Caesarea Mazaca in Cappadocia, Asia Minor (modern-day Turkey). He was an influential theologian who supported the Nicene Creed and opposed the heresies of the early Christian church, fighting against both Arianism and the followers of Apollinaris of Laodicea. In addition to his work as a theologian, Basil was known for his care of the poor and underprivileged. Basil established guidelines for monastic life which focus on community life, liturgical prayer, and manual labor. Together with Pachomius, he is remembered as a father of communal monasticism in Eastern Christianity, Titles: Great Hierarch, Doctor of the Church (c. 329 AD – c. 379 AD, Letter CCLLX, Point 671 – Point 672)
Source:
If you read the ancient Christianity quote which St. Basil the Great quotes above, it is clear that Lord Jesus Christ’s ‘Ransom for All’ (1 Timothy 2:5 – 6) applies to “All Men in its own Divine-Kairois Times’ (as it is Written in 1 Timothy 2:6) which must mean ‘all human being ever created eventually’ simply because these ancient phrases “… The Lord was bound to taste of death for every man …” and ” …. — to become a propitiation for the world …” and “… to justify all men by His own blood…” means exactly that, right?
Please take note that St. Basil the Great may be reiterating a Well known orthodox phraseology in his writing above which proves that Lord Jesus Christ’s Ransom applies to All Men and not Just believers (as it is implied in 1 Timothy 4:10 too) but though he didn’t believe it, it is well known that his sister (St. Macrina the Blessed-Wonder Worker*) and his brother St. Gregory of Nyssa who must have known this phraseology too certainly understood this same phraseology as Christ Centered Universalism as they are known to have believed that as shown a little in my previous posts.
iii. Blessed St. Gregory of Nyssa
“… When he has quitted his body and the difference between virtue and vice is known he cannot approach God till the purging fire shall have cleansed the stains with which his soul was infested. That same fire in others will cancel the corruption of matter, and the propensity to evil…” – Blessed St. Gregory of Nyssa, of whom four hundred years after his death, the Seventh Ecumenical Council gave him the one and only title which it has given to theologians in the Church, naming him “father of fathers”, Sermon on the Dead, PG 13:445,448 (ante A.D. 394).
Source:
www.scripturecatholic.com/purgatory/amp/
and
“… St. Gregory of Nyssa several times spoke of purgation by fire after death,[62] but he generally has apocatastasis* in mind.[63]…”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory
*Christ Centered Universalism in applying Purgatorial Fire to both Hades now (for some) and in the Final Gehenna (or Lake of Fire later) to Save them by Fire (1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15).
To quote a little more:
“Gregory seems to have believed in the universal salvation of all human beings. Gregory argues that when Paul says that God will be “all in all” (1 Cor. 15:28), this means that though some may need long time of purification, eventually “no being will remain outside the number of the saved”[44] and that “no being created by God will fall outside the Kingdom of God”.[45] Due to the unity of human nature in Christ “all, thanks to the union with one another, will be joined in communion with the Good, in Jesus Christ Our Lord”.[46] By his incarnation, death and resurrection Christ achieves “the common salvation of human nature”.
…
Gregory also described God’s work this way: “His [God’s] end is one, and one only; it is this: when the complete whole of our race shall have been perfected from the first man to the last—some having at once in this life been cleansed from evil, others having afterwards in the necessary periods been healed by the Fire, others having in their life here been unconscious equally of good and of evil—to offer to every one of us participation in the blessings which are in Him, which, the Scripture tells us, ‘eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,’ nor thought ever reached.”
…
In the Life of Moses, Gregory writes that just as the darkness left the Egyptians after three days, perhaps redemption [ἀποκατάστασις] will be extended to those suffering in hell [γέεννα].[55] This salvation may not only extend to humans; following Origen, there are passages where he seems to suggest (albeit through the voice of Macrina*) that even the demons will have a place in Christ’s “world of goodness”.[56] Gregory’s interpretations of 1 Corinthians 15:28 (“And when all things shall be subdued unto him …”) and Philippians 2:10 (“That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth”) support this understanding of his theology.
Furthermore, in the next chapter (ch. XXXVI), Gregory says that those who are purified from evil will be admitted into the “heavenly company”.
Source:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregory_of_Nyssa
*St. Macrina the Blessed was his sister while his brother is more of the famous sibling these days who is non other than St. Basil the Great
“… St. Marina the Younger … monastic founder, miracle worker and philosopher… Gregory heard her last philosophical discourse on a visit he made to his sister at the end of her life. (“I kept wishing that the day could be lengthened so that she might not cease to delight our hearing,” he wrote.) … He was with the many women at Macrina’s bedside when she died in 379. News of her death “spread like wildfire,” and crowds of people poured in for the funeral procession, many telling Gregory about miracles “the great Macrina” had performed while she was alive …”
Source:
http://natcath.org/NCR_Online/archives2/2007d/122107/122107y.htm
**Did St. Macrina the Younger really believe in Christ Centered Universalism including the Redemption of the Devils? Yes, according to St. Gregory of Nyssa himself (her brother), to quote:
Source:
https://www.patristics.co/patristic-universalism/
Too much to quote, for example:
“Eusebius characterizes the final apokatastasis as unity. [18] He writes that “the times of universal restoration” will be when humanity attains unity (ἡνῶσθαι) with the Logos and in the future aeon all will receive complete restoration. It is significant that Eusebius uses ἀποκατάστασις again here, and thrice at that, to claim that “the apokatastasis of all” will be when all are finally liberated from captivity and can enjoy “the freedom of the glory of the children of God” (with the aforementioned quotation of Rom 8:21): The expression “until the times of restoration” [. . .] indicates to us the world to come, in which all beings [πάντα] must receive the perfect restoration [τῆς τελείας ἀποκαταστάσεως] [. . .] on the occasion of the restoration of all beings [τῆς ἀποκαταστάσεως ἁπάντων] creation itself will be transformed [. . .] from the slavery of corruption to the freedom of the glory of the children of God. C. Marc. 2.4.11 (emphasis mine)”
Plenty of his quotes in support of Christ Centered Universalism as the Ancient First Christianity is found in link below:
Blessed St. Maximus the Confessor regarding the Post Mortem Evangelization – The Gospel being Preached to the Dead even now based on 1 Peter 4:5 – 6
To Quote:
“… An elaborate teaching of the descent of Christ into Hades is found in Maximus the Confessor. In his analysis, Maximus takes as a starting point the words of St. Peter: ‘For this cause was the Gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit’[26].
In Maximus’s view, St. Peter does not speak about the Old Testament righteous, but about those sinners who, back in their lifetime, were punished for their evil deeds:
Some say that Scriptures call ‘dead’ those who died before the coming of Christ, for instance, those who were at the time of the flood, at Babel, in Sodom, in Egypt, as well as others who in various times and in various ways received various punishments and the terrible misfortune of divine damnation. These people were punished not so much for their ignorance of God as for the offences they imposed on one another.
It was to them, according to [St Peter] that the great message of salvation was preached when they were already damned as men in the flesh, that is, when they received, through life in the flesh, punishment for crimes against one another, so that they could live according to God by the spirit, that is, being in hell, they accepted the preaching of the knowledge of God, believing in the Saviour who descended into hell to save the dead. So, in order to understand [this] passage in [Holy Scriptures] let us take it in this way: the dead, damned in the human flesh, were preached to precisely for the purpose that they may live according to God by the spirit[27].
Thus, according to Maximus’s teaching, punishments suffered by sinners ‘in the human flesh’ were necessary so that they may live ‘according to God by the spirit’. Therefore, these punishments, whether troubles and misfortunes in their lifetime or pains in hell, had pedagogical and reforming significance. Moreover, Maximus stresses that in damning them, God used not so much a religious as a moral criterion, for people were punished ‘not so much for their ignorance of God as for the offences they imposed on one another’. In other words, the religious or ideological convictions of a particular person were not decisive, but his actions with regard to his neighbours….” (Pages 3 and 4 by in the PDF as uploaded by a St. James Orthodox Church, link below):
Source for the Quote & Write Up above:
https://stjamesorthodox.org/files/articles/Bishop-Hilarion—Christ-the-Conqueror-of-Hades.pdf
“… Pamphilus refutes accusations concerning Origen’s thought on the Trinity, the incarnation, the historicity of Scripture, the resurrection, punishment, the soul and metempsychosis. In the process of defending Origen, Pamphilus affirmed his denial of eternal punishment, therefore the Apology itself was controversial. Pamphilus and Eusebius refuted the accusations made against their hero and defended his views with many passages quoted from his own works….” – History of Coptic Orthodoxy
Source:
http://www.copticchurch.net/topics/patrology/schoolofalex2/chapter04.html
and
“… Pamphilius, and Eusebius, the first Church historian, also defended Origen’s doctrines from charges brought against them by the Western Church, and in answering the complaint that he denied all future punishment they quote from his writings in contradiction thereof, not only his positive assurances of future and severe punishment, but his equally positive assertion that such correction is purifying and salutary….”
“… In A.D. 364, Titus, bishop of Bostra, wrote in advocacy of Universalism, contending that, although there are torments in the abyss of hell, they are not eternal, but that their great severity will lead the wicked to repentance and so to salvation…”
“… Gregory of Nyssa, A.D. 380, also advocated Universalism on the same grounds. Contemporary with him was the justly celebrated defender of orthodoxy, Didymus the Blind, a successor of Origen in the school at Alexandria, and a zealous Universalist. Prominent among his scholars was Jerome, eminent alike for his abilities, his inconsistencies, and instability. Universalism as taught by Origen is clearly and ably set forth by Jerome in his commentaries on the epistles, and in his letters…”
“… John, bishop of Jerusalem at this period, was also an advocate of Universalism on Origen’s theory. Another contemporary, Diodorus, a teacher of great repute in the school at Antioch, and afterwards bishop of Jerusalem, was also a Universalist, who, in opposition to the then general prevalence of allegorical interpretation, strictly adhered to the natural import of the text in his many commentaries on the Scriptures. He defended Universalism on the ground that the divine mercy far exceeds all the effects and all the deserts of sin. His pupil and successor in the school, Theodore of Mopsuestia, A.D. 420, called “the crown and climax of the school of Antioch,” and by the Nestorians, whose sect he founded, “the interpreter of the Word of God,” and whose writings were text-books in the schools of Eastern Syria, was a prominent and influential Universalist…”
Source:
https://www.biblicalcyclopedia.com/U/universalism-(2).html
Conclusion – Sinners Saved from the Lake of Fire via the Prayers of the Righteous Mystery
Blessed Ambrosiaster seems to Point that the “Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.” Mystery (1 Corinthians 2:9) includes the Saved-Christians asking for the Salvation of ALL MANKIND, to quote:
“… QUESTION 112. ON PSALM FIFTY. … so that at this sight, God, sensitive to his complaints, extends his hand to him in the midst of the difficulties which besiege him. “Because you loved the truth.” (Ps. 50:8) Since you have loved the truth, he said to God, come to my aid, I beg you, for you know that I have explained to you the true weaknesses of my soul, and you have resolved in your mercy to save the sinner by healing by a heavenly providence the wounds that sin has made to him on the earth. That’s why he adds, “You have revealed to me the secrets and mysteries of your heart.” These SECRETS and these MYSTERIES are the HELP that GOD has PREPARED for the HUMAN RACE, of which the Apostle said: “What no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man conceived, what God has prepared for those who love him,”1 Cor. 2:9) Who are those who love God? those who accept his law without trying to disguise or excuse their faults. These secrets of the heart are thus revealed to those who love God. The multitude of sins with which they deplore the sad influence could have made them question the justice of punishment, reject their faults on their origin, and make God their creator responsible for their sins. Their hearts were enlightened with a spiritual light and they discovered the providence of God in the coming of Christ who was to come to destroy the sin that had exercised the tyranny on mankind since the evasiveness of Adam. King David therefore asks God that, since He has resolved to SAVE THE HUMAN RACE ONE DAY from the SAD STATE in which he sees him reduced, he anticipates for himself, the victim of the same misfortune, the SALVATION HE [God] MUST GIVE TO ALL ONE DAY, and that he should give to his prayers and tears the free gift which he held in reserve and which he could NOT GRANT BEFORE THE MARKED TIME. How will it be done? He indicates it with the following words: “You will water me with the hyssop and I will be purified.” (Ps. 50:9) He rightly asks to be purified by sprinkling with the hyssop. The children of Israel sprinkled the poles of their house with this sprinkling to escape the exterminating angel (Exod. 20:22), and David also asks to be purified of his sins by the sprinkling of the hyssop, also to escape from death. “You will wash me and I will become whiter than the snow.” Now it is evident that God’s action is at a great distance from the action of man, which is why David says, “And I will be whiter than snow,” because the work of God has a character of perfection which the work of man cannot have. It therefore requires to be purified by sprinkling with hyssop, that is, just as the body is purified by water from its material soils, so the hyssop is the PURIFIED FIGURE of a spiritual operation of the souls by the defilements of sin. Sprinkling with the hyssop is a kind of purification whose visible action indicates the inner and invisible purification. “You will make me hear words of comfort and joy.” (Ps. 50:10) There is no doubt that the voice of one who ANNOUNCES the REMISSIONS of SINS does not SPREAD JOY in the SOULS of SINNERS. Who would NOT REJOICE, indeed, at the NEWS of the FORGIVENESS granted to him? For the FORGIVENESS of GOD gives all security for the PRESENT and for the FUTURE. … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source:
Focus Phrase from the above proving our claim:
“… These SECRETS and these MYSTERIES are the HELP that GOD has PREPARED for the HUMAN RACE, of which the Apostle said: “What no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man conceived, what God has prepared for those who love him,”1 Cor. 2:9) Who are those who love God? those who accept his law without trying to disguise or excuse their faults. These secrets of the heart are thus revealed to those who love God. … King David therefore asks God that, since He has resolved to SAVE THE HUMAN RACE ONE DAY from the SAD STATE in which he sees him reduced … the SALVATION HE [God] MUST GIVE TO ALL ONE DAY, and that he should give to his prayers and tears the free gift which he held in reserve and which he could NOT GRANT BEFORE THE MARKED TIME. … so the hyssop is the PURIFIED FIGURE of a spiritual operation of the souls by the defilements of sin. Sprinkling with the hyssop is a kind of purification whose visible action indicates the inner and invisible purification. … There is no doubt that the voice of one who ANNOUNCES the REMISSIONS of SINS does not SPREAD JOY in the SOULS of SINNERS. Who would NOT REJOICE, indeed, at the NEWS of the FORGIVENESS granted to him? For the FORGIVENESS of GOD gives all security for the PRESENT and for the FUTURE. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
“… and yet to recognize that His kingdom is ETERNAL, that is to say, the kingdom of the Son, for in the Name of Jesus EVERY KNEE shakes in HEAVEN, on the EARTH, and IN HELL. (Philip. 2) The Apostle St. Peter confirms this truth when he says:” No other name under heaven was given to MEN by which we were to BE SAVED.” (Acts 4) And did not the Lord Himself say to His disciples, “Until now you have not asked anything in my name, ask and I will answer you?” (John. 16:24) The REIGN of the Son therefore consists in the fact that it is in HIS NAME that ALL MEN are SAVED, and that ALL the PRAYERS addressed to Him until the end of the world are ANSWERED. But when ALL CREATURES have confessed Jesus Christ WILLINGLY or by FORCE, and have been subjected to the power against which they have resisted, then the MYSTERY of ONE GOD will be REVEALED to ALL MEN, and all thanksgivings will go back to God the Father, the principle of all things, that ALL PREACHING CEASE, ONE GOD be recognized in the MYSTERY of the TRINITY. … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (Written c. 366 – c. 384, Reply to Question 26, Commentary on the Gospel of Luke)
Source:
So, these Ancient First Christianity Prophesies may thus Come to Pass at the Request of God’s Closest Saints when they finally Pray MANY TIMES for the Wicked too to be Saved from the Lake of Fire (1 Timothy 2:1) that ‘All Men may be Saved’ (1 Timothy 2:4 – KJV) as He is the Most Blessed ‘Saviour of All Men, especially those who believe’ (1 Timothy 4:10), to quote:
i.1. Purgatory for Backslidden Christians
“.. 8And I also saw some blind ones crying out. And I was amazed when I saw all these works of God. 9I said, “Who are these?” He said unto me, “These are catechumens who heard the word of God, but they were not perfected in the work which they heard.” 10And I said unto him, “Then have they not repentance here?” He said, “Yes,” 11I said, “How long?” He said unto me, “Until the day when the Lord will judge.” 12And I saw others with their hair on them. 13I said, “Then there is hair and body in this place?” 14He said, “Yes, the Lord gives body and hair to them as he desires.”…” – Apocalypse of Zephaniah (aft 100 B.C. & bef A.D. 70)
i.2. Prayer of Salvation toward the non-Christian damned
The intercession of the saints for those in torment.
“… 111And I also saw multitudes. He brought them forth. 2As they looked at all of the torments they called out, praying before the Lord Almighty, saying, “We pray unto Thee on account of those who are in all these torments so that Thou might have mercy on all of them.” 3And when I saw them, I said to the angel who spoke with me, “<Who are these?>” 4He said, “These who beseech the Lord are Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. 5Then at a certain hour daily they come forth with the great angel. He soundeth a trumpet up unto heaven and another soundeth upon the earth. 6All the righteous hear the sound. They come running, praying to the Lord Almighty daily on behalf of these who are in all these torments.”…” – Apocalypse of Zephaniah (aft 100 B.C. & bef A.D. 70)
Source for both Quotes above:
From Page 535 of the ‘Lost Orthodoxy’ Book:
“There is a great deal more of the Ethiopic text, but it is very evidently of later date; the next words are: Next: ‘ The Father hath committed all judgement unto the Son.’ The destiny of sinners -their eternal [AGE-DURING] doom- is more than Peter can endure: he appeals to Christ to have pity on them. And my Lord answered me and said to me: ‘Hast thou understood that which I said unto thee before? It is permitted unto thee to know that concerning which thou askest: but thou must not tell that which thou hearest unto the sinners lest they transgress the more, and sin.’ Peter weeps many hours, and is at last consoled by an answer which, though exceedingly diffuse and vague does seem to promise ultimate pardon for all: ‘My Father will give unto them all the life, the glory, and the kingdom that passeth not away,’ . . . ‘It is because of them that have believed in Me that I am come. It is also because of them that have believed in Me, that, at their word, I shall have pity on men.’ The doctrine that sinners will be saved at last by the prayers of the righteous is, rather obscurely, enunciated in the Second Book of the Sibylline Oracles (a paraphrase, in this part, of the Apocalypse), and in the (Coptic) Apocalypse of Elias (see post). Ultimately Peter orders Clement to hide this revelation in a box, that foolish men may not see it. The passage in the Second Book of the Sibylline Oracles which seems to point to the ultimate salvation of all sinners will be found in the last lines of the translation given below.”
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/apocalypsepeter-mrjames.html
iii. Apocalypse of Elijah
“Then the sinners [ in torment ] will see the place of the righteous. And thus GRACE WILL OCCUR. In THOSE DAYS, that which the RIGHTEOUS will ASK for MANY TIMES WILL BE GIVEN to them.” – Apocalypse of Elijah (Veses 28 – 29)
Source:
http://www.3-in-1.net/Pseudepigrapha/Apocalypse%20of%20Elijah/The%20Apocalypse%20of%20Elijah.htm
The Passage below refers to the Salvation Context post-Lake of Fire or the Final Gehenna Judgment as it is quoted below in full for you to see this as well clearly:
“… 39 And we said unto him: Lord, is this thy purpose, that thou leavest us, to come upon them? (Will all this come to pass, Eth.) He answered and said unto us: After what manner shall the judgement be? whether righteous or unrighteous? (In Copt. and Eth. the general sense is the same: but the answer of Jesus in the form of a question is odd, and there is probably a corruption.) We said unto him: Lord, in that day they will say unto thee: Thou hast not distinguished between (probably: will they not say unto thee: Thou hast distinguished between) righteousness and unrighteousness, between the light and the darkness, and evil and good? Then said he: I will answer them and say: Unto Adam was power given to choose one of the two: he chose the light and laid his hand thereon, but the darkness he left behind him and cast away from him. Therefore have all men power to believe in the light which is life, and which is the Father that hath sent me. And every one that believeth and doeth the works of the light shall live in them; but if there be any that confesseth that he belongeth unto the light, and doeth the works of darkness, such an one hath no defence to utter, neither can he lift up his face to look upon the Son of God, which Son am I. For I will say unto him: As thou soughtest, so hast thou found, and as thou askedst, so hast thou received. Therefore condemnest thou me, O man? Wherefore hast thou departed from me and denied me? And wherefore hast thou confessed me and yet denied me? hath not every man power to live and to die? Whoso then hath kept my commandments shall be a son of the light, that is, of the Father that is in me. But because of them that corrupt my words am I come down from heaven. I am the word: I became flesh, and I wearied myself (or, suffered) and taught, saying: The heavy laden shall be saved, and they that are gone astray shall go astray for ever. They shall be chastised and tormented in their flesh and in their soul. 40 And we said unto him: O Lord, verily we are sorrowful for their sake. And he said unto us: Ye do rightly, for the righteous are sorry for the sinners, and pray for them, making prayer unto my Father. Again we said unto him: Lord, is there none that maketh intercession unto thee (so Eth.)? And he said unto us: Yea, and I will hearken unto the prayer of the righteous which they make for them…” (Epistle of the Apostles, Coptic, Points 39 – 40 in full)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/apostolorum.html
“And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.” – apostle John (Revelations 22:17, NKJV)
Where possibly:
The Spirit = God
The Bride = Christians
“who thirsts” = anyone who is not yet reconciled to God (e. g. Those in the Lake of Fire, as Fire makes them thirsty)
Free = Free Justification eventually toward “All” as Promised in Holy Scripture by the “Faith of Jesus Christ” (Romans 3:22) or the ‘Faith of God’ (Romans 3:3) which never Fails (seen only in accurate word to word translations, Romans 3:4)
Yes, another Bible Verse Proving Salvation from the Lake of Fire/Gehenna as these may “… be saved, yet so as through fire…”:
“For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.” – The Blessed Apostle Paul, Apostle of Lord Jesus Christ to the Gentiles (1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15, NASB)
“… I came to set the earth on fire, and what is my will, if not that finally it lights up? [Luke 12:49] I must be baptized with a baptism, and what is my torment as long as it is not accomplished! ” Higher up, He has kept us vigilant, waiting at all times for the coming of the Lord Savior, lest by slackening, by negligence, by differing from day to day his work, such, preceded by the day of the future judgment or by his own death, lose the reward of his management. It was addressed to all, in the form of a general precept; but the theme of the following comparison seems to be proposed to the bishops, that is to say, to the bishops, to let them know that they will have to undergo a severe punishment later, if, occupied with the pleasures of the century, they neglected to govern the house of the Lord and the people entrusted to them. But as the profit is thin, and the merit is low, when it is the fear of the punishment which prevents from going astray, since the charity and the love have a superior dignity, the Lord sharpens our zeal to deserve its favor and we are inflamed with the desire to acquire God, saying, “I have come to set fire to the earth,” not certainly the fire that consumes the goods, but the one that produces the good will, which makes the vases of and from the house of the Lord, consuming the hay and the straw (I Cor. iii. 12ff., 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15), devouring all the gangue of the age, amassed by worldly pleasure, the work of the flesh that is to perish;… They have thus taught with evidentness what is the action of this fire, which enlightens the intimate of the heart. For this reason perhaps the Lord will come into the fire (see Is., LXVI, 15; 16): to consume all the vices at the moment of the resurrection, to fill by his presence the desires of each one, and to project the light on merits and mysteries….” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:49 – 50)
Source:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-12
Proof Phrase that this Refers to the Final Lake of Fire Judgment toward those Christians who are treated as Unbelievers (Luke 12:46) from the above by St. Ambrose himself: “… I came to set the earth on fire … preceded by the day of the future judgment or by his own death, lose the reward of his management. It was ADDRESSED to ALL in the form of a general precept;… seems to be proposed to the bishops, that is to say, to the bishops, to let them know that they will have to undergo a severe punishment later, if, occupied with the pleasures of the century, they neglected to govern the house of the Lord and the people entrusted to them … I have come to set fire to the earth,” not certainly the fire that consumes the goods, but the one that produces the good will, which makes the vases of and from the house of the Lord, consuming the hay and the straw (I Cor. iii. 12ff., 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15), devouring all the gangue of the age, amassed by worldly pleasure, the work of the flesh that is to perish;…”.
Indeed, you can clearly see that St. Ambrose reveals that some Christian leaders or bishops are punished as unbelievers (Luke 12:46) in the Lake of Fire Context (hence the current purgatory is not enough) during the future Day of Judgment in a fire which produces ‘good will’ as he even quotes 1 Corinthians 3:12 implying that 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 may be applied to mean Salvation from the Lake of Fire, yes “even so through fire” (1 Corinthians 3:15) toward such fallen-believers who are deemed equal to unbelievers who have ‘equal sentences’ (Luke 12:46) proving our Context Claim possibly Right Again. Can you see it?
This agrees not only to the ‘Apocalypse of Peter’ visions alone but others too such as the Apocalypse of Elijah, Apocalypse of Zephaniah, the Christian-Jewish Sibyline Oracles, the Epistle of the Apostles, St. Julian of Norwich’s Visions & even the Visions of Sadhu Sundar Singh as it was Discussed in Previous essays and the Book of Enoch too, to quote as edification:
Note: Such a final chance given by God is uttered Mysteriously in the Prophecy of the Book of Enoch too where such may be ‘Saved with no honour’ (hence not referring to the Christian Salvation or ‘the Elect’ in Verse below) and by His Great Name ( Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21) on Judgment Day either toward those in the Lake of Fire (Gehenna) or prior or both, to quote:
“1 And in those days a change shall take place for the holy and elect, And the light of days shall abide upon them, And glory and honour shall turn to the holy, 2 On the day of affliction on which evil shall have been treasured up against the sinners.And the righteous shall be victorious in the name of the Lord of Spirits: And He will cause the others to witness (this) That they may repent And forgo the works of their hands. 3 They shall have no honour through the name of the Lord of Spirits, Yet through His name shall they be saved [Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21], And the Lord of Spirits will have compassion on them, For His compassion is great. 4 And He is righteous also in His judgement, And in the presence of His glory unrighteousness also shall not maintain itself: At His judgement the unrepentant shall perish before Him. 5 And from henceforth I will have no mercy on them, saith the Lord of Spirits.” (Book of Enoch, Chapter 50)
Translation Source: http://wesley.nnu.edu/index.php?id=2126
Focus Phrase: “… And He will cause the others [the sinners and/or Wicked] to witness (this) That they may repent And forgo the works of their hands. 3 They shall have NO HONOUR through the NAME of the LORD of SPIRITS, Yet THROUGH HIS NAME [John 14:6] SHALL THEY BE SAVED [Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21], And the Lord of Spirits will have compassion on them …” – Book of Enoch.
P/S: How about the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit Sin?
Not forgiven for exactly two ages (Matthew 12:31 – 32) as per Scripture but may be Forgiven if God Wills in the “ages to come” after that (Ephesians 2:7), to quote:
In his quote below, St. Epiphanius argues remarkably similar to St. Ambrose of Milan whom we discussed earlier to refer to the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit to be unforgiven in the Context that ‘pardon is available’ (probably after the two ages/Aeons) but such a one ‘may not have a share/Lot in the Christian Faith even if he repents on earth’ making him an ‘alien/slave level’ in His Kingdom with such a one being ‘denied before the Father too’ (implied), to quote:
“… [He is saying it besides] because he knows that certain persons will arise and blaspheme the Holy Spirit and place him in a slave’s status, making him alien to the essence of God. (6) And so, as a precaution, he said, “He that blasphemeth against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him here or in the world [AGE/AEON] to come” — not to commend those who blaspheme him, but to show his foreknowledge and lovingkindness by assuring in advance the salvation of those who blaspheme him and [then] repent. (7) For he himself, again, says, “He that hath denied me before men shall be denied before my Father,” 9 and, “I will deny him,” 10 and again, “He that confesseth me I will confess before my Father.” …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘THEODOTIANS ‘, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 2.5 – 2.7, Page 74)
Source:
Please compare with the other similar First Christianity Quote below:
“… But we have heard that you are accustomed to bring forward as an objection that which is written: “Every sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men, but blasphemies against the Spirit shall not be forgiven unto men. And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him, but whosoever shall speak against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world [age], nor in that which is to come.” [Matthew 12:31 – 32] By which quotation the whole of your assertion is destroyed and done away, for it is written: “Every sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men.” Why, then, do you not remit them? Why do you bind chains which you do not loose? Why do you tie knots which you do not unfasten? Forgive the others, and deal with those who you think are bound for ever by the authority of the Gospel for sinning against the Holy Spirit… Then, when Simon, depraved by long practice of magic, had thought he could gain by money the power of conferring the grace of Christ and the infusion of the Holy Spirit, Peter said: “Thou hast neither part nor lot in this faith, for thy heart is not right with God. Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray the Lord, if per-chance this thought of thy heart may be forgiven thee, for I see that thou art in the bond of iniquity and in the bitterness of gall.” [Acts 8:22 – 23] We see that Peter by his apostolic authority condemns him who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit through magic vanity, and all the more because he had not the clear consciousness of faith. And yet he did not exclude him from the hope of forgiveness, for he called him to repentance [Acts 8:22, 24]… – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 20, 23 , Chapter 4 Pages 815, Book II Concerning Repentance)
Source:
Comment (to quote from an earlier discussion):
” … Thou hast neither part nor lot in this faith ….” – the Blessed Apostle Peter quoted by ArchBishop St. Ambrose of Milan (highlighted)
That is, such ones cannot ever become His Bride in Participating in the First Resurrection & the Highest Rewards of the Heavens, Revelation 20:4 – 6, Matthew 5:20 – 23) as the phrase “… neither part nor lot in this faith…” eternally shuts them out of this hope (1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18).
Because in the same breath St. Ambrose reminds them that apostle Peter himself reveals the Mystery that such ones may be forgiven (implying a General Salvation eventually) , in his words above as follows:
“… Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray the Lord, if per-chance this thought of thy heart may be forgiven thee, for I see that thou art in the bond of iniquity and in the bitterness of gall.” [Acts 8:22 – 23]…”
and
“… We see that Peter by his apostolic authority condemns him who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit … And yet he did not exclude him from the hope of forgiveness, for he called him to repentance…” [Acts 8:22, 24]
One final point, please consider the Verse:
“Therefore repent of this wickedness of yours, and pray the Lord that, if possible, the intention of your heart may be forgiven you.” – the Blessed Apostle Peter to Simon (Acts of the Apostles 8:22, NASB)
Please notice carefully that the phrase ‘… pray the Lord that, if possible, … may be forgiven you…’ strongly points that St. Ambrose is right in pointing out that this is a Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit (example) which Simon has Committed as if it was any other sins, apostle Peter would not have said “if possible”.
Note that the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit may not be forgiven in this present singular-age (AEON1) or until the future next-singular-age (AEON2) only (as it is Written in Matthew 12:31 – 32) and Ephesians 2:7 with St. Ambrose’s quote proves that there are “Ages [Plural] to Come” (AEON2, AEON3, … at least) where Forgiveness can be Attained in AEON3 as God Wills.
If these most Orthodox Authorities of Doctrine understood the ‘next Aeon to be Eternal’ (Contradicting the literal at least two Aeons to come in Ephesians 2:7 which proposes that the ‘next Aeon is NOT eternal’), then how can St. Athanasius (the ‘Great Father of Orthodoxy’) or even St. Ambrose of Milan Preach hope for such who ‘committed those sins’? to quote:
So, how about the Unpardonable Sin to Two Ages (Matthew 12:31 – 32)?
Is there Hope for them thereafter? Yes if God Wills it:
“… They then that depreciate the Only-begotten Son of God blaspheme God, defaming His perfection and accusing Him of imperfection, and render themselves liable to the severest chastisement. For he that blasphemes any one of the Subsistences [Persons of the Trinity] shall have remission neither in this world [AGE/AEON] nor in that which is to come. But God is able to open the eyes of their heart to contemplate the Sun of Righteousness, in order that coming to know Him whom they formerly set at nought, they may with unswerving piety of mind together with us glorify Him, because to Him belongs the kingdom, even to the Father Son and Holy Spirit, now and forever. Amen…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, ‘On Luke 10:22 and Matthew 11:27’, Section 6)
Source: www.newadvent.org/fathers/2805.htm
Proof Phrases: “… But God is able to open the eyes of their heart to contemplate the Sun of Righteousness, in order that coming to know Him whom they formerly set at nought, …” toward those who did this first “… For he that blasphemes any one of the Subsistences [Persons of the Trinity] shall have remission neither in this world [AGE/AEON] nor in that which is to come …” as Blessed St. Athanasius the Great mentions (not me, please take note).
P/S 2: Blessed Origen of Alexandria and Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate
“… But our belief is that the Word shall prevail over the entire rational creation, and change every soul into his own perfection; in which will choose what he desires, and obtain what he chooses. For although, in the diseases and wounds of the body, there are some which no medical skill can cure, yet we hold that in the mind there is no evil so strong that it may not be overcome by the Supreme Word and God. For stronger than all the evils in the soul is the Word, and the healing power that dwells in him; and this healing he applies, according to the will of God, to every man. The consummation of all things is the destruction of evil…”
– Blessed Origen of Alexandria, the Great but surprisingly Modest Exegete of the Eastern Church, “Nicknamed: Admantius or Man of Steel”, Tortured and Martyred for Christ (c. 184 AD – c. 253 AD)
Source:
https://www.triumphofmercy.com/blog/the-testimony-of-the-fathers-7-of-8
The Original Word in Holy Scripture only Means a Singular Age [Aeon] only and not Eternal but the Best of the Earliest Christian Leaders allow it to be Translated as ‘Eternal’ for the ‘Benefit of the Converted Masses’ to keep them in the faith, to quote:
“… But the remarks which might be made on this topic are neither to be made at all, … [but] for the sake of those who are with difficulty restrained, even by fear of eternal [aeternum] punishment, from plunging into any degree of wickedness, and into the flood of evils which result from sin. …” – Origen (Against Celsus, 6:26)
Source: http://www.askelm.com/news/n020820.htm
“… Like Origen, Jerome too felt that belief in universal reconciliation should not be promoted. Concerning the judgment, Jerome writes, in his Commentary on Isaiah (Book 18, cap. 66),“All of which nevertheless they allow should not now be openly told to those with whom fear yet acts as a motive, and who may be kept from sinning by the terror of punishment. But this question we ought to leave to the wisdom of God alone, whose judgments as well as mercies are by weight and measure, and who, well knows whom and how long, He ought to judge.”• Jerome, Commentary on Isaiah, Book 18, cap. 66
Although this vaguely hints at an end to punishment, Jerome himself admits,
“I know that most persons understand by the story of Nineveh and its king, the ultimate forgiveness of the devil and all rational creatures.” • Jerome, Commentary on Jonah …”
Source: http://www.askelm.com/news/n020820.htm
P/S 3: Blessed St. Augustine
Perhaps St. Augustine himself did not believe in Eternal Hell 100%
St. Augustine believed in a Little Christ Centered Universalism Hope Regardless
Really?
Yes, as his arguments on Point 112 did NOT end there with those words only but as follows too toward point 113 (as usual, these truths are only seen when ‘quoted in full’), to quote ‘in his own words’:
“… Yet even in his wrath–his wrath resting on them–he does not “shut up his mercy.” This is not to put an end to their eternal afflictions, but rather to apply or interpose some little respite in their torments. For the psalm does not say, “To put an end to his wrath,” or, “After his wrath,” but, “In his wrath.” Now, if this wrath were all there is in man’s damnation, and even if it were present only in the slightest degree conceivable–still, to be lost out of the Kingdom of God, to be an exile from the City of God, to be estranged from the life of God, to suffer loss of the great abundance of God’s blessings which he has hidden for those who fear him and prepared for those who hope in him240 –this would be a punishment so great that, if it be eternal, no torments that we know could be compared to it, no matter how many ages they continued. 113. The eternal death of the damned–that is, their estrangement from the life of God–will therefore abide without end, and it will be common to them all, no matter what some people, moved by their human feelings, may wish to think about gradations of punishment, or the relief or intermission of their misery. In the same way, the eternal life of the saints will abide forever, and also be common to all of them no matter how different the grades of rank and honor in which they shine forth in their effulgent harmony. …” – Blessed St. Augustine of Hippo, Doctor of the Church, who influenced virtually all of subsequent Western philosophy and Catholic theology, as well as a significant amount of Protestant theology (c. 354 AD – c. 430 AD, Points 112 – 113, CHAPTER XXIX. “The Last Things”, Enchiridion).
Source:
http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/augustine_enchiridion_02_trans.htm
Please read ‘carefully’ an note that St. Augustine himself ‘in his own words’ puts forth the following hope even if the words in Matthew 25:46 means ‘eternal’ (allegorically, idiomatically) and ‘not age-during’ (literally):
“… For the psalm does not say, “To put an end to his wrath,” or, “After his wrath,” but, “In his wrath.” …” – St. Augustine
“… Yet even in his wrath–his wrath resting on them–he does not “shut up his mercy.” This is not to put an end to their eternal afflictions, but rather to apply or interpose some little respite in their torments. … Now, if this wrath were all there is in man’s damnation, and even if it were present only in the slightest degree conceivable–still, to be lost out of the Kingdom of God, to be an exile from the City of God, to be estranged from the life of God, to suffer loss of the great abundance of God’s blessings which he has hidden for those who fear him and prepared for those who hope in him240 –this would be a punishment so great that, if it be eternal, no torments that we know could be compared to it, no matter how many ages they continued. …” – St. Augustine
Focus Phrases: He believes or Hopes it a little, his phrase:
“… Yet even in his wrath–his wrath resting on them–he does not “shut up his mercy.” This is not to put an end to their eternal afflictions, but rather to apply or interpose some little respite in their torments. … even if it were present only in the slightest degree conceivable–still, …” – St. Augustine
“… 113. The eternal death of the damned–that is, their estrangement from the life of God–will therefore abide without end, and it will be common to them all, no matter what some people, moved by their human feelings, may wish to think about gradations of punishment, or the relief or intermission of their misery. In the same way, the eternal life of the saints will abide forever, and also be common to all of them no matter how different the grades of rank and honor in which they shine forth in their effulgent harmony. …” – St. Augustine
St. Augustine seems to see that the future “ages to come” (Ephesians 2:7) may be literal probably causing him to consider this possibility as if there are ages [Aeons] to come, the next age [maximum Punishment is only to the Singular-next Age/Aeon only, Matthew 12:31 – 32, Matthew 25:46 for men] as he Emphasizes that the Loss of the ‘Kingdom of God’s Gradation of the Highest Salvation’ is Eternal
“… to be lost out of the Kingdom of God, to be an exile from the City of God, to be estranged from the life of God, to suffer loss of the great abundance of God’s blessings which he has hidden for those who fear him and prepared for those who hope in him240 –this would be a punishment so great that, if it be eternal, no torments that we know could be compared to it, no matter how many ages they continued. …” – St. Augustine , to quote:
“… even if it were present only in the slightest degree conceivable–still, …” – St. Augustine
“It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.” (Proverbs 25:2, NKJV)
P/S 4: God’s Mercy – All Things are Possible with God Alone
To quote:
“… Mercy is the highest art and the shield of those who practice it. It is the friend of God, standing always next to him and freely blessing whatever he wishes. It must not be despised by us. For in its purity it grants great liberty to those who respond to it in kind. It must be shown to those who have quarreled with us, as well as to those who have sinned against us, so great is its power. It breaks chains, dispels darkness, extinguishes fire, kills the worm and takes away the gnashing of teeth. (Mk 9:44-48) By it the gates of heaven open with the greatest of ease. In short, mercy is a queen which makes men like God. …” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD)
Source [Commentary on James 2:13]:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/james/ancient-christian-commentary-james-2
Conclusion
Bible Verse Proving that with God’s Mercy “nothing is impossible” and that “all things are possible to Him”, to quote:
“23 But thou hast mercy upon all [Compare:Romans 11:32]; for thou canst do all things, and winkest at the sins of men, because they should amend. 24 For thou lovest all the things that are, and abhorrest nothing which thou hast made: for never wouldest thou have made any thing, if thou hadst hated it. 25 And how could any thing have endured, if it had not been thy will? or been preserved, if not called by thee? 26 But thou sparest all: for they are thine, O Lord, thou lover of souls.” (Wisdom of Solomon 11:23 – 26, King James Bible Version, KJV)
Source:
https://m.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Wisdom-of-Solomon-Chapter-11/
Example First Christianity Quotes:
“… 119. Now let the Manichaean have his word. “I hold that the devil is the creator of our flesh.” The Lord will answer him: “What, then, doest thou in the heavenly places? Depart, go thy way to thy creator. ‘My will is that they be with Me, whom my Father hath given Me.’ Thou, Manichaean, holdest thyself for a creature of the devil; hasten, then, to his abode, the place of fire and brimstone, where the fire thereof is not quenched, lest ever the punishment have an end.” … 123 . What verdict do we look for from Christ? That do I know. Do I say, what verdict will He give? Nay, He hath already pronounced sentence. We have it in our hands. “Let all,” saith He, “honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He that honoreth not the Son, honoreth not the Father, Who hath sent Him. ” 124. If the sentence please you not, appeal to the Father, CANCEL the JUDGMENT that the Father hath given. … For HE is the FOUNDATION of ALL, and is the head of the Church, in Whom our common nature according to the flesh has merited the right to the heavenly throne. For the flesh is honored as having a share in Christ Who is God, and the nature of the WHOLE HUMAN RACE is HONORED as HAVING a SHARE in the FLESH . As we then sit in Him by fellowship in our fleshly nature, so also He, Who through the assumption of our flesh was made a curse for us (seeing that a curse could not fall upon the blessed Son of God), so, I say, He through the OBEDIENCE of ALL will become subject in us; when the GENTILE has BELIEVED, and the JEW has ACKNOWLEDGED Him Whom he CRUCIFIED; when the MANICHAEN has WORSHIPED Him, Whom he has NOT BELIEVED to have come in the flesh; when the ARIAN has CONFESSED Him to be Almighty, Whom HE has DENIED; when, lastly, the wisdom of God, His justice, peace, love, RESURRECTION, is IN ALL. Through His own works and through the manifold forms of virtues Christ will be in us in subjection to the Father. And when, with VICE RENOUNCED and CRIME at an END, one spirit in the HEART of ALL PEOPLES has begun to cleave to God in all things, then will God be ALL and in ALL …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Book II Chapter 13 Point 119 Page 572, Chapter 14 Points 123 – 124 Page 575, Book V Chapter 14 Point 180 – Point 181 Page 725)
Source:
And,
“… The Divine grace variously distributed… Further also, when the word is sown, it does not yield a uniform produce of fruit in this human life, but one various and rich ; for it bringeth forth, some an hundred j^nd some Matt.] 3, 8. sixty, and some thirty 7 , as the Saviour teaches — that Sower of grace, and Bestower of the Spirit … Nor is the grace confined to the perfect alone; but it is sent down also among those who occupy the middle and the third ranks, so that He might RESCUE ALL MEN GENERALLY to SALVATION…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Festal Letter 70 – 71)
Source:
Comment: In the last quote above, St. Athanasius is revealing that the Grace of God Works in different Ways beginning with the Perfect (Hundredfold Seed) to the Second Rank (Sixty Fold Seed) to the Third Rank (Thirty Fold Seed) and lastly toward a ‘General Salvation which Rescues ALL MEN to be sinless again (implied)’. Right?
St. Athenagoras of Athens Proves that the ‘Common Lot’ of General Salvation applies even to the Wicked or failed ones after their Proportioned Final Judgment in the Lake of Fire
“… And we shall make no mistake in saying, that the final cause of an intelligent life and rational judgment, is to be occupied uninterruptedly with those objects to which the natural reason is chiefly and primaily adapted, and to delight unceasingly in the contemplation of Him who is, and of His decrees, notwithstanding that the majority of men, because they are affected too passionately and too violently by things below, pass through life without attaining this object. For the large number of those who fail of the end that belongs to them does not make void the common lot, since the examination relates to individuals, and the reward or punishment of lives ill or well spent is proportioned to the merit of each….” – Blessed St. Athenagoras of Athens, In his writings he styles himself as “Athenagoras, the Athenian, Philosopher, and Christian”, in the fragments of the Christian History of Philip of Side (c. 425). Philip of Side claims that Athenagoras headed the Catechetical School of Alexandria (which is probably incorrect and contradicted by Eusebius), Athenagoras is an Ante-Nicene Christian apologist who lived during the second half of the 2nd century (c. 133 AD – c. 190 AD, ‘On the Resurrection of the Dead’ )
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-resurrection.html
“… Christ, who was called the Son of God before the ages, was manifested in the fulness of time, in order that He might cleanse us through His blood, who were under the power of sin, presenting us as pure sons to His Father, if we yield ourselves obediently to the chastisement of the Spirit. And in the end of time He shall come to do away with all evil, and to reconcile all things, in order that there may be an end of all impurities. … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Fragment XXXIX, FRAGMENTS FROM THE LOST WRITINGS OF IRENAEUS)
Translation Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-fragments.html
It is self explanatory in the above, I repeat with Emphasis:
“… Christ, who was called the Son of God BEFORE the AGES [Aeons], was manifested in the fulness of time, in order that He might cleanse us through His blood, who were under the power of sin, presenting us as pure sons to His Father, if we yield ourselves obediently to the chastisement of the Spirit. And in the END of TIME He shall come to DO AWAY with ALL EVIL, and to RECONCILE ALL [Created] THINGS in order that there may be an END of ALL IMPURITIES. … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Fragment XXXIX, FRAGMENTS FROM THE LOST WRITINGS OF IRENAEUS)
We ‘Understand’ Colossians 1:16 – 20 the SAME way as Blessed St. Irenaeous describes above.
“It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.” (Proverbs 25:2, NKJV)
All Glory to God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit to whom be the Glory & Honour both now and to the ages of Ages unendingly. Amen. Peace to you. Maranatha!
Peace to you
P/S 1: Why is the Shepherd of Hermas not in the Bible then?
Example:
To quote:
“… The Liberian Catalogue of Popes, a record that was later used in the writing of the Liber Pontificalis, states in a portion under the heading of 235: “Under his [Pius’] episcopate, his brother Ermes wrote a book in which are contained the precepts which the angel delivered to him, coming to him in the guise of a Shepherd.” …”
To quote:
“… The Shepherd was very popular amongst Christians in the 2nd and 3rd centuries.[2] It is part of the Codex Sinaiticus,[3][4] and it is listed between the Acts of the Apostles and the Acts of Paul in the stichometrical list of the Codex Claromontanus. …”
iii) Why is it not in the Bible then?
The Shepherd of Hermas is still Scripture in the Catholic Church and Eastern Orthodoxy only removed as per the Muratorian Canon’s advice that its wisdom is not for Public reading in the church but that it ought to be read . It has never been removed or questioned in any way only interpreted differently I guess.
To quote:
“… Remarks of Tertullian and Clement of Alexandria give a sense of resistance to the Shepherd among its hearers, and of a sense of controversy about it. Tertullian implies that Pope Callixtus I had quoted it as an authority (though evidently not as one of the books of the Bible), for he replies: “I would admit your argument, if the writing of The Shepherd had deserved to be included in the Divine Instrument, and if it were not judged by every council of the Churches, even of your own Churches, among the apocryphal and false.” And again, he says that the Epistle of Barnabas – which is Tertullian’s name for NT Epistle of Hebrews is “more received among the Churches than that apocryphal Shepherd” (De pudicitia, 10 and 20). Though Clement of Alexandria constantly quotes with reverence a work that seems to him to be very useful, and inspired; yet he repeatedly apologizes, when he has occasion to quote it, on the ground that “many people despise it”. Two controversies divided the mid-century Roman Christian communities. One was Montanism, the ecstatic inspired outpourings of continuing pentecostal revelations, such as the visions recorded in the Shepherd may have appeared to encourage. The other was Docetism that taught that the Christ had existed since the beginning and the corporeal reality of Jesus the man was simply an apparition. …”
The “Docetism” claim is certainly false as no Verse in the Shepherd of Hermas says that (hence even in the Source-below, a citation is needed) but it has been misinterpreted or used by false teachers to claim that wrongly. If anyone says otherwise, please show me the which Verse from the Shepherd of Hermas teaches that?
Source for Each Quote above:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shepherd_of_Hermas
Peace to you
P/S 2: Doctrinal Changes are Huge even if One Book is Removed from the Bible – The 2 Maccabees Example
Charity – How Important is it?
“… Charity Delivers from Death … ”
“… Ten powerful things were created in the world: mountains are hard, but iron cuts through them; iron is hard, but fire melts it; fire is strong, but water extinguishes it; water is strong, but clouds bear it; clouds are strong, but wind scatters them; wind is strong, but the body contains it; the body is strong, bur fear breaks it; fear is potent, but wine dispels it; wine is powerful, but sleep assuages it; and stronger than all these is death. But charity delivers from death. … ” The Talmud
Source: https://www.chabad.org/parshah/in-depth/plainbody_cdo/aid/1262744
*Here are the 2 Maccabees Verses and a brief explanation:
“41All men therefore praising the Lord, the righteous Judge, who had opened the things that were hid, 42Betook themselves unto prayer, and besought him that the sin committed might wholly be put out of remembrance. Besides, that noble Judas [Maccabees] exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forsomuch as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for the sins of those that were slain. 43And when he had made a gathering throughout the company to the sum of two thousand drachms of silver, he sent it to Jerusalem to offer a sin offering, doing therein very well and honestly, in that he was mindful of the resurrection: 44For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should have risen again, it had been superfluous and vain to pray for the dead. 45And also in that he perceived that there was great favour laid up for those that died godly, it was an holy and good thought. Whereupon he made a reconciliation for the dead, that they might be delivered from sin.” (2 Maccabees 12:41 – 45, the Original King James Bible)
Source: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/2-Maccabees-Chapter-12/
The noble Judas Maccabees was certainly a prophet of God to the Jews and the Book above (1 & 2 Maccabees only) is Considered Canonical in First Christianity till even when the First King James Bible was translated (about a hundred years before the birth of Martin Luther himself), to quote:
“Catholics and the Eastern Orthodox regard 2 Maccabees as canonical. Jews and all Protestants other than Anglo-Catholics do not… a biblical canon identical with the list given at Trent including the two books of Maccabees. Origen of Alexandria (A.D. 253),[17] Augustine of Hippo (c. 397 AD),[18] Pope Innocent I (405 AD),[19][20] Synod of Hippo (393 AD),[21] the Council of Carthage (397 AD),[22] the Council of Carthage (419 AD),[23] the Apostolic Canons,[24] the Council of Florence (1442 AD)[25] and the Council of Trent (1546 AD)[26] listed the first two books of Maccabees as canonical…”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2_Maccabees
Martin Luther should not have ‘removed’ Books from the First King James Bible Translation or that which has been endorsed by all Christians for Centuries just because he cannot understand the Books’ Content or simply because it doesn’t line up with some of his own ‘pre-conceived theology’ as this may be very dangerous for him especially since he even denied the existence of the spirit world (denying even the literal meaning of Luke 16:19 – 31 to refer to Hades/Sheol now) & in turn proposed the ‘false soul sleep doctrine with William Tyndale’ which was later Corrected/Refuted by John Calvin in the Protestant Camp itself.
iii) First Christianity
So, the idea of Judgment can be ‘Cancelled or Reduced’ according to ‘one’s own charity works [alms] done in life’ (2 Maccabees 12:43*, see St. Polycarp’s quote below) or by the prayers of the righteous for the dead (2 Timothy 1:18, 2 Maccabees 12:42 – 46) is certainly Biblical as it is Mentioned briefly by the Apostolic Father below too, to quote:
“…When you can do good, defer it not, because “alms delivers from death.” …” – St. Polycarp, Bishop of Smryna, an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of the Blessed St. John the Apostle (c. 69 AD – c. 155 A, Chapter X, Epistle to the Philippians)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/polycarp-roberts.html
Now, the Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:43 prove that ‘alms giving helps deliver from death’ as St. Polycarp endorsed too as it was expounded by St. Ambrose later below too. It is not that one is paying for the sin with money (as some theologians err using this Verse) but rather that the person who prays for the dead’s salvation (2 Maccabees 12:42, 44 45) must first give alms (2 Maccabees 12:43) so that ‘he becomes worthy to pray’ as St. Ambrose pointed out (in an earlier post) that only a ‘very holy or worthy close friend of God’ can pray for the dead as God might hear them & not others simply because they obeyed His Commandments, to quote:
“… But you Say, It is written: “If a man sin against the Lord, who shall entreat for him?” First of all, as I already said before, I might allow you to make that objection if you refused penance to those only who denied the faith. But what difficulty does that question produce? For it is not written, “No one shall entreat for him;” but, “Who shall entreat?” that is to say, the question is, Who in such a case can entreat? The entreaty is not excluded… We must then understand in the same manner, “Who shall entreat for him?” as implying: It must be some one of excellent life who shall entreat for him who has sinned against the Lord. The greater the sin, the more worthy must be the prayers that are sought. For it was not any one of the common people who prayed for the Jewish people, but Moses, when forgetful of their covenant they worshipped the head of the calf. Was Moses wrong? Certainly he was not wrong in praying, who both merited and obtained that for which he asked. For what should such love not obtain as that of his when he offered himself for the people and said: “And now, if Thou wilt forgive their sin, forgive; but if not, blot me out of the book of life.” We see that he does not think of himself, like a man full of fancies and scruples, whether he may incur the risk of some offense, as Novatian says he dreads that he might, but rather, thinking of all and forgetful of himself, he was not afraid test he should offend, so that he might rescue and free the people from danger of offense. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 40, 42, Chapter 9 Pages 786 – 787, Book I Concerning Repentance)
Source:
Conclusion
Two Ways Sin is Diminished in the ‘Prison’ of the Lake of Fire
Bible Verses:
“For while you are going with your opponent to appear before the magistrate, on your way there make an effort to settle with him, so that he may not drag you before the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison. “I say to you, you will not get out of there until you have paid the very last cent.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:58 – 59, NASB)
“…Likewise here: either the wrong is redeemed at the price of charity, or the punishment diminished according to the appreciation of the wrong. Now it is the custom, as we remember, to give a bath to the baths: by presenting it, everyone obtains the faculty of bathing there; so, here, to be purified, because the sin of each is purified by the kind of transaction described above. On the other hand, the guilty person is tortured and tortured as long as he has not served the sentence of the error committed…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:58 – 59, highlighted)
“…Likewise here: either the wrong is redeemed at the price of charity, … so, here, to be purified, because the sin of each is purified by the kind of transaction described above. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:58 – 59, highlighted)
“…Likewise here: either … or the punishment diminished according to the appreciation of the wrong. … so, here, to be purified, because the sin of each is purified by the kind of transaction described above… the guilty person is tortured and tortured as long as he has not served the sentence of the error committed…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:58 – 59, highlighted)
Can you really see it ‘as It is Written’?
The Final Gehenna or Lake of Fire Judgment is Till the last Penny only and not Forever as our Most Merciful Savour Himself Declared
Yes, only the Sin Perishes (Meaning of ‘Eternal Destruction’, 2 Thessalonians 1:9 in Body + Soul Matthew 10:28) and not the sinner who is Saved through Fire in the End (1 Corinthians 3:15):
“… saying, “I have come to set fire to the earth,” [Luke 12:49] not certainly the fire that consumes the goods, but the one that produces the good will, which makes the vases of and from the house of the Lord, consuming the hay and the straw (I Cor. iii. 12ff., 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15), devouring all the gangue of the age, amassed by worldly pleasure, the work of the flesh that is to perish;… For this reason perhaps the Lord will come into the fire (see Is., LXVI, 15; 16): to consume all the vices at the moment of the resurrection, to fill by his presence the desires of each one, and to project the light on merits and mysteries…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:49 – 50, highlighted)
and
“… Likewise here: either the wrong is redeemed at the price of charity, or the punishment diminished according to the appreciation of the wrong. Now it is the custom, as we remember, to give a bath to the baths: by presenting it, everyone obtains the faculty of bathing there; so, here, to be purified, because the sin of each is purified by the kind of transaction described above. On the other hand, the guilty person is tortured and tortured as long as he has not served the sentence of the error committed…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:58 – 59, highlighted)
Source (for St. Ambrose’s quotes here):
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-12
Source Post:
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/lake-of-fire-hope-for-the-wicked-one-day/amp
Peace to you
Salvation from Hell in First Christianity – Which is Orthodoxy?
Claim
“… The Catholic Church holds that “all who die in God’s grace and friendship but still imperfectly purified” undergo the process of purification which the Church calls purgatory, “so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven”. It has formulated this doctrine by reference to biblical verses that speak of purifying fire (1 Corinthians 3, 1 Corinthians 3:15 and 1 Peter 1, 1 Peter 1:7) and to the mention by Jesus of forgiveness in the age to come (Matthew 12, Matthew 12:32). It bases its teaching also on the practice of praying for the dead in use within the Church ever since the Church began and which is mentioned even earlier in 2 Macc 12:46.[5][6] … At the Second Council of Lyon in 1247, strong Eastern Orthodox opposition to the idea of a third place in the afterlife containing fire was one of the differences that prevented reunification with the Catholic Church. … The Church of England, mother church of the Anglican Communion, officially denounces what it calls “the Romish Doctrine concerning Purgatory”,[13] but the Eastern Orthodox Church, Oriental Orthodox Churches, and elements of the Anglican, Lutheran and Methodist traditions hold that for some there is cleansing after death and pray for the dead.[14][15][16][17][18] The Reformed Churches teach that the departed are delivered from their sins through the process of glorification.[19] Rabbinical Judaism also believes in the possibility of after-death purification and may even use the word “purgatory” to describe the similar rabbinical concept of Gehenna, though Gehenna is also sometimes described as more similar to hell or Hades. … The Catholic Church’s teaching on purgatory, defined in the Second Council of Lyon (1274), the Council of Florence (1438–1445), and the Council of Trent (1545–63),[3][30] is without the imaginative accretions of the popular idea of purgatory. … Gregory the Great also argued for the existence, before Judgment, of a purgatorius ignis (a cleansing fire) to purge away minor faults (wood, hay, stubble) not mortal sins (iron, bronze, lead).[62] Gregory of Nyssa several times spoke of purgation by fire after death,[63] but he generally has apocatastasis in mind.[64] …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory
Reply
So, who is right?
iii. Bible Verses – 1 Peter 3:18 – 20
The Bible Verses in Luke 16:19 – 31 points to this Impossibility as no one can cross that chasm but we know that upon our Blessed Savior’s Death, He Descended and Saved even those ‘formerly/once disobedient spirits in Prison belonging to the time of Noah too’ as 1 Peter 3:18 – 20 literally implies. So, the impossibility in Luke 16:19 – 31 is no more an impossibility but only a question of whom God Wills, He can cancel that ‘eternal sentence’, right? Let’s investigate further.
“41All men therefore praising the Lord, the righteous Judge, who had opened the things that were hid, 42Betook themselves unto prayer, and besought him that the sin committed might wholly be put out of remembrance. Besides, that noble Judas [Maccabees] exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, for so much as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for the sins of those that were slain. 43And when he had made a gathering throughout the company to the sum of two thousand drachms of silver, he sent it to Jerusalem to offer a sin offering, doing therein very well and honestly, in that he was mindful of the resurrection: 44For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should have risen again, it had been superfluous and vain to pray for the dead. 45And also in that he perceived that there was great favour laid up for those that died godly, it was an holy and good thought. Whereupon he made a reconciliation for the dead, that they might be delivered from sin.” (2 Maccabees 12:41 – 45, the Original King James Bible)
Source: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/2-Maccabees-Chapter-12/
These Verses in 2 Maccabees above clearly point that the ‘prayer for the dead’ to achieve ‘… a reconciliation for the dead, that they might be delivered from sin …’ is NOT referring to the righteous dead but sinful ones as that phrase points to these ones described as ‘ … for so much as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for the sins of those that were slain …’ .
So, the idea of Judgment can be ‘Cancelled or Reduced’ according to ‘one’s own charity works [alms] done in life’ (2 Maccabees 12:43*, see St. Polycarp’s quote below) or by the propitiatory prayers of the righteous for the dead (2 Timothy 1:18, 2 Maccabees 12:42 – 46) is certainly Biblical as it is Mentioned briefly by the Apostolic Father below too, to quote:
“…When you can do good, defer it not, because “alms delivers from death.” …” – St. Polycarp, Bishop of Smryna, an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of the Blessed St. John the Apostle (c. 69 AD – c. 155 A, Chapter X, Epistle to the Philippians)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/polycarp-roberts.html
Now, the Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:43 prove that ‘alms giving helps deliver from death’ as St. Polycarp endorsed too as it was expounded by St. Ambrose prior too. It is not that one is paying for the sin with money (as some theologians err using this Verse) but rather that the person who prays for the dead’s salvation (2 Maccabees 12:42, 44 45) must first give alms (2 Maccabees 12:43) so that ‘he becomes worthy to pray’ as St. Ambrose pointed out (in an earlier post) that only a ‘very holy or worthy close friend of God’ can pray for the dead as God might hear them & not others simply because they obeyed His Commandments, to quote:
“… For it is not written, “No one shall entreat for him;” but, “Who shall entreat?” that is to say, the question is, Who in such a case can entreat? The entreaty is not excluded… We must then understand in the same manner, “Who shall entreat for him?” as implying: It must be some one of excellent life who shall entreat for him who has sinned against the Lord. The greater the sin, the more worthy must be the prayers that are sought. For it was not any one of the common people who prayed for the Jewish people, but Moses, when forgetful of their covenant they worshipped the head of the calf. Was Moses wrong? Certainly he was not wrong in praying, who both merited and obtained that for which he asked. For what should such love not obtain as that of his when he offered himself for the people and said: “And now, if Thou wilt forgive their sin, forgive; but if not, blot me out of the book of life.” . …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 40, 42, Chapter 9 Pages 786 – 787, Book I Concerning Repentance)
Source:
vii. Not Convinced? – Empirical Evidences
Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh clearly revealed that he saw some non-Christians (idolaters & atheists) being Saved in the Spirit World (as discussed in previous posts). As usual, many of the Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox adherents and even Protestants dismiss this simply because they might not agree with it. Well, the famous Indian protestant theologian, Blessed Dr. DGS Dhinakaran mentioned that he saw Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh in a high heavenly abode during his visits to heaven too as God granted him (as recorded in his book).
“… But Saint Perpetua, who was martyred in 202, believed herself to have been encouraged in a vision to pray for her brother, who had died in his eighth year, almost certainly unbaptized; and a later vision assured her that her prayer was answered and he had been translated from punishment. St. Augustine thought it needful to point out that the narrative was not canonical Scripture, and contended that the child had perhaps been baptized. …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prayer_for_the_dead
To quote:
“… I was reading an article recently by Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev called “Orthodox Worship as a School of Theology”, and I came across the following:- Bishop Hilarion: “Several years ago I came across a short article in a journal of the Coptic Church where it stated that this Church had decided to remove prayers for those held in hell from its service books, since these prayers “contradict Orthodox teaching”. Puzzled by this article, I decided to ask a representative of the Coptic Church about the reasons for this move. Recently I had the possibility to do so, and a Coptic Metropolitan replied that the decision was made by his Synod because, according their official doctrine, no prayers can help those in hell. “I told the metropolitan that in the liturgical practice of the Russian Orthodox Church and other local Orthodox Churches there are prayers for those held in hell, and that we believe in their saving power. This surprised the Metropolitan, and he promised to study this question in more detail.” Here is the original article … http://orthodoxeurope.org/page/12/1.aspx …” – via Hieromonk Ambrose
Source:
http://www.byzcath.org/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/339693/Praying%20people%20out%20of%20hell
“… Remember that Pope Saint Gregory the Great prayed for the Emperor Trajan and his prayer was heard…Trajan was saved: the Roman emperor, he who was a pagan, he who killed Christians in the Colosseum! Why did this great Pope of Rome pray for Trajan? Because there was a time when the holy Church of Rome was joined with her sister Churches and there was a time when the Romans believed that God would deliver souls from hell. But in later centuries this teaching has been lost.
We see the belief in the great prayer which still remains in the Roman liturgy for the dead: “Libera animas omnium fidelium defunctorum de poenis inferni et de profundo lacu.” Roman scholars will say that this prayer means exactly what it says. Roman theologians will say that this was an error in the belief of the ancient Church and they have corrected it. They have retained the prayer but they no longer understand it as their ancestors in the faith understood it. There is no doubt that our ancestors in the faith, from the Emerald Isle, during the first millennium believed that souls could be released from hell. …” – via Hieromonk Ambrose
Source:
http://www.byzcath.org/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/339693/Praying%20people%20out%20of%20hell
Conclusion – Shepherd of Hermas Scripture
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
The Hope Part:
“… She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
This Shepherd of Hermas Scripture regarding some non-Christians (the unbaptized & those who heard the Gospel on earth but did not believe in it) can be Saved in the Spirit World if God Wills as Described above but may be accelerated by our Propitiatory Prayers on behalf of them as the Bible Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:43 – 46 prior imply.
The interesting real reliable example of Emperor Trajan (a wicked non-Christian Murderer, Pagan & Unbaptized, Unbeliever) being Saved from Hell after such Propitiatory Prayers by Pope St. Gregory the Great is not a hoax but Truth, to quote:
“… On a time Saint Gregory went by the market of Rome which is called the market of Trajan, and then he remembered of the justice and other good deeds of Trajan, and how he had been piteous and debonair, and was much sorrowful that he had been a pagan, and he turned to the church of Saint Peter wailing for the horror of the miscreance of Trajan. Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …” (The Life of St. Gregory the Pope)
Source:
https://classicalchristianity.com/2012/02/06/st-gregory-the-dialogist-and-emperor-trajan/
Note: The additional comment in the link above (added by others and not Uttered by God during that Vision/Revelation to Pope St. Gregory the Great but commentators) reads next as follows [Please notice the phrase ‘as some say’ carefully in the below]:
“… By this, as some say, the pain perpetual due to Trajan as a miscreant was some deal taken away, but for all that was not he quit from the prison of hell, for the soul may well be in hell and feel there no pain by the mercy of God. …”
The Truth is as Hieromonk Ambrose mentioned earlier, God only said this part to Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great:
“… Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …”
Can you see it? This is exactly what the Final Prophecy of the Salvation from the Lake of Fire as described in the Apocalypse of Peter Prophecy by Lord Jesus Christ after the Righteous (Christians) Pray to Him to save the ‘damned’ from their ‘everlasting punishments’ will be answered eventually & the First Oldest Christian Canon called the Muratorian Canon lists this Book as “Scripture” too as discussed in Previous Posts.
So, is Pope St. Gregory the Great Speaking the Truth during his supernatural vision or encounter or did he also need to be ‘corrected by later Roman Catholics’?
It is to be noted that Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great was an eternal Hell believer (which makes this Vision even more reliable as probably God was making a Point to him) and also notice that if Emperor Trajan (who died an unrepentant pagan with little good deeds and who did plenty of murders toward innocent Christians too in his reign) has a chance to be Saved from Hell so quickly after the Prayer of the Holy Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great (making Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan’s Theological claim even more True), then shouldn’t it be easier to God Who is Equally Fair to all grant such a quick Salvation from Hell toward our much much better non-Christian Loved ones and Friends likewise if only we (Christians) Prayed for their Salvation likewise?
Do you remember who are we referring to?
He is the same – Blessed Roman Catholic Pope St. Gregory the Great, Saint Gregory the Dialogist in Eastern Christianity, the Father of Christian Worship, and John Calvin declared in his Institutes that Gregory was the last good Pope.
Here is how Reliable Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great himself really is, to quote (link below):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Gregory_I
and how wicked a life Emperor Trajan really lived before he died unrepentant too, to quote:
“… One of Trajan’s notable acts during this period was the hosting of a three-month gladiatorial festival in the great Colosseum in Rome (the precise date is unknown). Combining chariot racing, beast fights and close-quarters gladiatorial bloodshed, this gory spectacle reputedly left 11,000 dead (mostly slaves and criminals, not to mention the thousands of ferocious beasts killed alongside them) and attracted a total of five million spectators over the course of the festival. …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trajan
So, Emperor Trajan must have been taken to the ‘lower abodes accordingly after being Saved’ as the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture implies.
“For with God nothing will be impossible.” – Blessed Archangel Gabriel regarding Christ the Lord of the Heavens during the Incarnation Prophecy (Luke 1:37, NKJV)
Peace to you
P/S 4: Tree of Life – Overcomers Mystery in First Christianity
1) Who is an Overcomer or the Victorious ones?
Any Believer in Christ who keeps His Commandments, to quote:
“1Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world— our faith. 5Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?” – the Blessed and Holy St. John the Apostle (1 John 5:1 – 5, NKJV)
2) What is the Meaning of the Tree of Life?
“… (By) tree of life is meant Christ, (whom) we apprehend in the Holy Spirit and in relation to the Spirit. For the Spirit is in him and he is worshipped in the Spirit and is the Bestower of the Spirit …” – Blessed St. Andreas/Andrew, Bishop of Caesarea, Earliest* Greek Patristic commentary on the Apocalypse (c. 563 AD – c. 637 AD)
Source [ Page 230/518, Chapter 68 ] :
https://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/2008_constantinou_andrew-translation.pdf
*Note :
“… The very first Greek commentary on Revelation barely predates Andrew’s work and is attributed to “Oikoumenios.” Oikoumenios is not a recognized Father of the Church. Therefore, Andrew of Caesarea’s work is correctly identified as the earliest Greek Patristic commentary on the Apocalypse. …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andreas_of_Caesarea
and
“… Truly, the river of life shows grace to flow in spiritual birth. The tree of life of either bank shows the coming of Christ according to the flesh, Who the Law predicted was to come and to suffer, and was shown clearly by the Gospel. Truly, by twelve fruits through each of the months are shown the diverse graces of the Twelve Apostles, which they receive from the single tree of the cross, satiating peoples consumed by hunger with the preaching of the Word of God. …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Source [ St.Jerome adding additional Commentary to St. Victorinus’ Original Treatise on Chapters 20, 21 on the Apocalypse of John ]:
http://www.bombaxo.com/patristic-stuff/victorinus-in-apocalypsin/
and
“… He indicates that he writes for all the churches the things which he addresses to them individually; for it was not the Church of the Ephesians alone, which, if it did not repent, was to be removed from its place; nor was Satan’s seat at Pergamos alone, and not rather in every place. In like manner also, the other things of the several churches are common to every church. overcometh. The “tree of life” is Christ, by the vision of Whom in the celestial paradise, and in the present body of the Church, holy souls are refreshed. …” – St. Bede the Venerable, English Monk & Doctor of the Church (c. 673 AD – c. 735 AD)
Source:
3) The Saints will Partake from the Tree of Life First
“… 10 And he shall open the gates of paradise, And shall remove the threatening sword against Adam. 11 And he shall give to the saints to eat from the tree of life, And the spirit of holiness shall be on them. 12 And Beliar shall be bound by him, And he shall give power to His children to tread upon the evil spirits. 13 And the Lord shall rejoice in His children, And be well pleased in His beloved ones for ever. 14 Then shall Abraham and Isaac and Jacob exult, And I will be glad, And all the saints shall clothe themselves with joy. …” – Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs (Reached their Final Form in c. 2nd Century)
Source [ Points 10 – 14, Chapter 18, THE TESTAMENT OF LEVI, THE THIRD SON OF JACOB AND LEAH, Translation by Mr. Charles]:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/patriarchs-charles.html
4) Will Every Christian Partake of the Tree of Life in the Paradise of God?
Yes if they Practice these traits :
“… [Chapter 2] Indeed, in his first letter he says, I know your suffering and works and your patience, I know you are suffering and see your works and patience: do not think I remain far (or ‘for long’) away from you. And that you cannot bear evil people, and that those who say they are apostles, you discovered them liars, and you have patience according to My name. All these belong to praise, and not mediocre praise. But also such men and of such a kind, and the selection of such men, indicates that every one of them must be admonished so that they are not deprived of good things. He says he has a few things against them, saying: You have abandoned your earlier love: remember from where you have fallen. He who falls, falls from a height, and therefore he says from where, for at all times until the end works of love are to be practiced, with is the greatest commandment. Finally, unless this is done, was threatened to move the lampstand from its place, that is, to scatter the people. For you hate the works of the Nicolaitans which I also hate; you have this, this belongs to praise. For the works of the Nicolaitans: before this time, false and disease-bearing men, ministers in the name of Nicolaus, made for themselves a heresy, (saying) that something devoted (to an idol) may be exorcized and eaten, and that whoever had fornicated could receive the peace on the eighth day. Therefore he praises those to whom he has written, to whom, such and so great men, he has promised that tree of life which is in the garden of God. …” – Blessed St. Victorinus, Bishop of Pettau, the First and Oldest Christian Commentary on the Apocalypse of John or Book of Revelation, Martyr for Christ (c. 303 AD)
[‘Commentary on the Apocalypse’, circa 2nd half of the third century]:
http://www.bombaxo.com/patristic-stuff/victorinus-in-apocalypsin/
Who was he?
“… Victorinus was a firm believer in the millennium.[5] He was also much influenced by Origen.[6] His works were ranked with the apocrypha in the decree, later attributed to Pope Gelasius I, which excluded and anathematized them with that of many other early fathers. That is to say they were not considered free of error.[7] By contrast, St. Jerome gives him an honourable place in his catalogue of ecclesiastical writers. Jerome occasionally cites the opinion of Victorinus (in Eccles. iv. 13; in Ezech. xxvi. and elsewhere), but considered him to have been affected by the opinions of the Chiliasts or Millenarians.[8] According to Jerome, Victorinus died a martyr in 304.[9] He is commemorated in both the Eastern and Western Churches on 2 November. …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victorinus_of_Pettau
Conclusion – Christians Partake the Tree of Life in the order of the Thirty-fold, Sixty-fold and Hundred-Fold Mystery
How? To quote:
“… Thèse leaves will be for healing, that is, for the purging of ignorance of those pagans inferior in the activity of virtues, because the glory of the sun is one thing, the glory of the moon is another and the glory of the stars is something else, and there are many mansions alongside the Father’s (house), which they will be worthy, the one of a lesser brightness and the other of greater, according to the correspondence of the deeds of each. And one must also understand this differently. The Tree of Life producing twelve fruits is the apostolic assembly according to their participation in the true Tree of Life by communion with the
flesh, having bestowed upon us participation in his divinity. Their fruits are those which hâve produced a harvest one hundredfold. The leaves, (are) those (who bore a harvest of) sixty fold, and thirtyfold1129 (are) those who will bring forth healing from the nations, those lesser, transmitting the radiance of the divine lights which they received through those who bore a fruit harvest one hundred fold. For whatever différence there is between the leaves and fruit, then such is the différence between those who were saved then, some being glorified less and some glorified more, as has been written. If it is written singularly the tree instead of the trees, it signifies the unitary [253] life residing together and the concord of the saints …” – Blessed St. Andreas/Andrew, Bishop of Caesarea, Earliest* Greek Patristic commentary on the Apocalypse (c. 563 AD – c. 637 AD)
Source [ Page 231/519, Chapter 68 ] :
https://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/2008_constantinou_andrew-translation.pdf
Comment 1: Christians will probably be able to move throughout the Kingdom of God (e.g. the Heavens, Paradise and the New Jerusalem City) but as Blessed St. Papias a direct disciple of Blessed St. John the Apostle who wrote this Book of Revelation himself adds that the ‘thirty fold, sixty fold or hundred fold Christians’ will get an abode/mansion in the ‘New Jerusalem City, Paradise or Heavens’ respectively. This View is confirmed to be true as the Testimony of ‘other Presbyters as well’ including Blessed St. Polycarp (who was a Disciple of St. John the Apostle too) of whom Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons quotes to say this same Truth as well as discussed in earlier posts, example (in the free downloadable pdf book below):
https://play.google.com/store/books/details?id=9lnIDwAAQBAJ
Comment 2: The order described above gives deeper meaning regarding Christ’s Promise of “Paradise” to the Repentant-Thief on the Cross (St. Dismas) as follows:
“And Jesus said to him, “Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.” (Luke 23:43, NKJV)
Christians must view that Verse with the ‘Overcomers/Victorious’ ones below:
“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God.” (Revelation 2:7, NKJV)
So, this is not to say that it is easy to obtain Paradise as having an abode/mansion there because that is different from Partaking of the Tree of Life (Christ) there as we have seen the detailed description of Blessed St. Andrew prior regarding this which agrees with the interpretation below too:
“… The words of The Lord (This day … in paradise) must therefore be understood not of an earthly or corporeal paradise, but of that spiritual paradise in which all may be, said to be, who are in the enjoyment of the divine glory. Hence to place, the thief went up with Christ to heaven, that he might be with Christ, as it was said to him: “Thou shalt be with Me in Paradise”; but as to reward, he was in Paradise, for he there tasted and enjoyed the divinity of Christ, together with the other saints …” – Blessed St. Thomas Aquinas, an Italian Dominican friar, philosopher, Catholic priest, Doctor of the Church (c. 1225 AD – c. 1274 AD)
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penitent_thief
Note: This thief is probably even unbaptized and surely led a wicked life earlier (and that’s why he was serving such a Capital Death on a Cross Punishment Sentence), to quote from Tradition (from the same Source above):
“… According to John Chrysostom, the thief dwelt in the desert and robbed or murdered anyone unlucky enough to cross his path. According to Pope Gregory I, he “was guilty of blood, even his brother’s blood” …”
P/S: Morning Star Mystery
What is the “Morning Star” 🌟 mentioned in Revelation 2:28?
“The First Resurrection of the Dead” (Revelation 20:4 – 6).
Says who?
“… The fourth kind indicates the nobility of the faithful, working daily, and doing great works. But even here are indicated some men to be at ease, given over to unlawful leisures, and paying attention to new prophecies, which he shows and prophesies to others, to whom this is not pleasing, who know the wickedness of the Adversary, by which evils and sorrows he seeks to bring dangers on the head of the faithful. And thus he says: I will not place upon you another weight, that is, I have not given you laws, observances and burdens, which is another weight, that what you have, you hold onto, until I come. And to him who conquers, I will give to him power over the nations, that is, I will make him a judge among the other saints. And the star of the morning will I give to him: namely, the first resurrection he promised; for the morning star chases away the night and announces light, which is the beginning of day…” – Blessed St. Victorinus, Bishop of Pettau, the First and Oldest Christian Commentary on the Apocalypse of John or Book of Revelation, Martyr for Christ (c. 303 AD)
Source [‘Commentary on the Apocalypse’, circa 2nd half of the third century]:
http://www.bombaxo.com/patristic-stuff/victorinus-in-apocalypsin/
P/S 2: Virginity Mystery
Bible Verses:
“3They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth. 4These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. 5And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God.” (Revelation 14:3 – 5, NKJV)
Comment:
“… We believe that thèse, after the aforementioned twenty-four elders, are superior to the rest on account of both virginity and blamelessness in tongue and hand,735 after the appearance of Christ possessing splendor in virtues through which they are taught the new song,736 the song which is unknown to the many, not only in the présent life but also in the future âge. For if perfect knowledge will corne at that time abolishing the partial, according to the divine Apostle, suitably however there will be a manifestation of the divine mysteries in the way of life of the saints hère. For (there are) many mansions in the Father ‘s (house) and (one) star differs from another in glory, just as (there are) many différent punishments, from which the Lord of all redeems us, he will reckon us among those who are saved on account of his goodness, not looking at the multitude of our sins, but in his compassion, because of which he had corne to earth and poured out his precious blood for us, in order to wash clean our défilements and stains, to bring us to the Father, with whom to him (there) must be, [149] as the Leader of our Salvation,140 together with the All-holy Spirit, glory, dominion and honor, now and ever and unto the âges of âges. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Andreas/Andrew’s, Bishop of Caesarea, Earliest* Greek Patristic commentary on the Apocalypse (c. 563 AD – c. 637 AD)
Source [ Page 149 – 150/437 – 438, Chapter 39 ] :
https://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/2008_constantinou_andrew-translation.pdf
Additional Comments from the Same Source above:
“… Jérôme remarks: “If virgins are fïrst-fruits, it follows that widows and the continent in marriage, come after the firstfruits, that is, they are in the second and third rank: nor can a lost people be saved unless it offer such sacrifices of chastity to God, and with pure victims reconcile the spotless Lamb. It would be endless work to explain the Gospel mystery of the ten virgins, five of whom were wise and five foolish. Ail I say now is, that as mère virginity without other works does not save, so ail works without virginity, purity, continence, chastity, are imperfect.” (Against Jovinianus, 1.40, NPNF 2nd 6:379.) Caesarius of Arles reminds his hearers that thèse are not only virgins in body but in mind, since they are not liars (v. 5) “Listen carefully that if anyone boasts about bodily virginity alone, as long as he loves deceit he will not be able to follow Christ along with those holy virgins. For this reason let no virgin présume only upon her physical virginity, because if she is disobedient or gossiping she knows that she will hâve to be excluded from the bed-chamber of her Heavenly Spouse. Although a virgin possesses a hundredfold and a married woman the thirtyfold, still a chaste and humble married woman is better than a proud virgin.” {Serm. 155.3, FC 47:346) 736 Many Fathers had opinions about this new or spécial song and concluded that it was related to virginity. “To sing a spécial song to the Lamb means to rejoice with him forever, and before ail the faithful, also in the incorruption ofthe flesh. The rest ofthe elect can hear this song, but they may not utter it. Though by their love they rejoice in the exaltation of those others, they do not rise to the height of their reward….”
P/S 5: All Israel and All the Gentiles eventually Saved by Christ Hope for All Mankind in First Jewish Christianity?
Bible Verses:
“25For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob; 27For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins.” 28Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.” – the Great, Holy and Noble St. Paul the Apostle of Christ (Romans 11:25 – 29, NKJV)
where possibly,
“all Israel will be saved” = All those of the Israel Race will eventually be Saved
and
“until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in” = All Gentiles (i.e. non-Israel race may be Saved first because some Israelites have committed the ‘Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit Sin’ & thus cannot be Saved for this age nor the next one, Matthew 12:31 – 32 but possibly on an age after that as they are ‘ages to come’, Ephesians 2:7).
We have discussed in detail such a Hope in Previous Posts with plenty of First Christianity quotes too.
However, please allow me to quote from a possible early Jewish-Christianity Source or Jewish-Christianity-Influenced Writing from the 2nd Century which may echo such a Hope for all mankind eventually in Lord Jesus Christ Alone, to quote:
1) What is the “Testament of the Twelve Patriarchs” Writing?
“… The Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs is a constituent of the apocryphal scriptures connected with the Bible. It is a pseudepigraphical work comprising the dying commands of the twelve sons of Jacob. It is part of the Oskan Armenian Orthodox Bible of 1666. Fragments of similar writings were found at Qumran, but opinions are divided as to whether these are the same texts. It is considered apocalyptic literature. The Testaments were written in Hebrew or Greek, and reached their final form in the 2nd century CE. In the 13th century they were introduced into the Western world through the agency of Robert Grosseteste, Bishop of Lincoln, whose Latin translation of the work immediately became popular. He believed that it was a genuine work of the twelve sons of Jacob, and that the Christian interpolations were a genuine product of Jewish prophecy; he accused Jews of concealing the Testaments “on account of the prophecies of the Saviour contained in them.” … Scholarship tends to focus on this book as a Christian work, whether or not it has a Jewish predecessor (Vorlage) …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testaments_of_the_Twelve_Patriarchs
Note: Please note the “All Israel” or “All the Gentiles” shall be “Saved” or equivalent words/phrases in each quote below (not highlighted) ‘carefully’.
Each quote (next) is Labelled according to its Source as follows:
[ From The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament by R. H. Charles, vol. II, Oxford Press ]
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/patriarchs-charles.html
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/patriarchs.html
iii. Was it ever cited by any early Church leader?
“… References in Origen (Hom. in Joshua. 15.6) and Jerome (Tractatus de Psalmo 15) show that the Testament of the Twelve Patriarchs existed in some form in the second century CE. …”
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/patriarchs.html
2) Possible Christ Centered Universalism Prophecy Quotes
“… Points 6,7 … And all the people shall perish. Then shall all the earth rest from trouble, And all the world under heaven from war. 5 Then the Mighty One of Israel shall glorify Shem, For the Lord God shall appear on earth, And Himself save men. 6 Then shall all the spirits of deceit be given to be trodden under foot, And men shall rule over wicked spirits. 7 Then shall I arise in joy, And will bless the Most High because of his marvellous works, [Because God hath taken a body and eaten with men and saved men]. 7 1 And now, my children, obey Levi and Judah, and be not lifted up against these two tribes, for 2 from them shall arise unto you the salvation of God. For the Lord shall raise up from Levi as it were a High-priest, and from Judah as it were a King [God and man], He shall save all [the Gentiles 3 and] the race of Israel. …” – Translation by Mr. Charles
or
“… Points 6,7 … and every people shall perish. Then shall all the earth rest from trouble, and all the world under heaven from war. Then shall Shem be glorified, because the Lord God, the Mighty One of Israel, shall appear upon earth as man, and saved by Him Adam. Then shall all the spirits of deceit be given to be trampled under foot, and men shall rule over the wicked spirits. Then will I arise in joy, and will bless the Most High because of His marvellous works, because God hath taken a body and eaten with men and saved men. 7. And now, my children, obey Levi, and in Judah shall ye be redeemed: and be not lifted up against these two tribes, for from them shall arise to you the salvation of God. For the Lord shall raise up from Levi as it were a Priest, and from Judah as it were a King, God and man. So shall He save all the Gentiles and the race of Israel. …” – Translation by Mr. Roberts-Donaldson
“… Point 7 … 1 Become not, my children, as Sodom, which sinned against the angels of the Lord, and perished for 2 ever. For I know that ye shall sin, and be delivered into the hands of your enemies; and your land shall be made desolate, and your holy places destroyed, and ye shall be scattered unto the four 3 corners of the earth. And ye shall be set at nought in the dispersion vanishing away as water. Until the Most High shall visit the earth, coming Himself [as man, with men eating and drinking, and breaking the head of the dragon in the water. He shall save Israel and all the Gentiles [God speaking in 4 the person of man]. [Therefore do ye also, my children, tell these things to your children, that they 5 disobey Him not. For I have known that ye shall assuredly be disobedient, and assuredly act ungodly, not giving heed to the law of God, but to the commandments of men, being corrupted 6 through wickedness. And therefore shall ye be scattered as Gad and Dan my brethren, and ye shall 7 know not your lands, tribe, and tongue. But the Lord will gather you together in faith through His tender mercy, and for the sake of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.] …” – Translation by Mr. Charles
or
“… Point 7 … 7. Become not, my children, as Sodom, which knew not the angels of the Lord, and perished for ever, For I know that ye will sin, and ye shall be delivered into the hands of your enemies, and your land shall be made desolate, and ye shall be scattered unto the four corners of the earth. And ye shall be set at nought in the Dispersion as useless water, until the Most High shall visit the earth; and He shall come as man, with men eating and drinking, and in peace breaking the head of the dragon through water. He shall save Israel and all nations, God speaking in the person of man. Therefore tell ye these things to your children, that they disobey Him not. For I have read in the Heavenly Tablets that in very deed ye will disobey Him, and act ungodly against Him, not giving heed to the law of God, but to the commandments of men. Therefore shall ye be scattered as Gad and as Dan my brethren, who shall know not their own lands, tribe, and tongue. But the Lord will gather you together in faith through the hope of His tender mercy, for the sake of Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob….” – Translation by Mr. Roberts-Donaldson
iii) The Testament of Joseph
“… Point 19 … And the bulls rejoiced because of him, and the cow [and the 10 harts] exulted together with them. And these 11 things must come to pass in their season. Do ye therefore, my children, observe the commandments of the Lord, and honour Levi and Judah; for from them shall arise unto you [the Lamb of God, who taketh away the sin of the world] one who saveth [all the Gentiles and] Israel. 12 For His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, which shall not pass away; but my kingdom among you shall come to an end as a watcher’s hammock, which after the summer disappeareth. …” – Translation by Mr. Charles
or
“… Point 19 … And because of Him the angels rejoiced, and men, and all the earth. And these things shall take place in their season, in the last days. Do ye therefore, my children, observe the commandments of the Lord, and honour Judah and Levi; for from them shall arise unto you the Lamb of God, by grace saving all the Gentiles and Israel. For His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, which shall not be shaken; but my kingdom among yogi shall come to an end as a watcher’s hammock, which after the summer will not appear. …” – Translation by Mr. Roberts-Donaldson
P/S: Context for Romans 11:25 – 29 with 1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28 in First Christianity by an Authoritative Saint in First Christianity agreeing to our Exegesis above
To quote:
“… When authorities and powers are abolished, His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. The same Apostle tells who are these enemies, As touching the Gospel they are enemies for your sakes, but as touching the election they are beloved for the fathers’ sake . We remember that they are enemies of the cross of Christ; let us remember also that, because they are beloved for the fathers’ sake, they are reserved for the subjection, as the Apostle says, I would not, brethren, have you ignorant of this mystery, lest ye be wise in your own conceits, that a hardening in part hath befallen Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved, even as it is written, There shall come out of Sion a Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: and this is the covenant firm Me to them, when I have taken away their sins . So His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. But we must not forget what follows the subjection, namely, Last of all is death conquered by Him 1284 . This victory over death is nothing else than the resurrection from the dead: for when the corruption of death is stayed, the quickened and now heavenly nature is made eternal, as it is written, For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. But when this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in strife. O death, where is thy sting? O death, where is thy strife ? In the subjection of His enemies death is conquered; and, death conquered, life immortal follows…” Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD, Book XI ‘On the Trinity’, Points 34 – 35, Page 481**)
Source:
https://archive.org/stream/StHilaryOfPoitiersSelectWorks/StHilaryofPoitiersSelectWorks_djvu.txt
and
“… and yet to recognize that His kingdom is ETERNAL, that is to say, the kingdom of the Son, for in the Name of Jesus EVERY KNEE shakes in HEAVEN, on the EARTH, and IN HELL. (Philippians. 2) The Apostle St. Peter confirms this truth when he says:” No other name under heaven was given to MEN by which we were to BE SAVED.” (Acts 4) And did not the Lord Himself say to His disciples, “Until now you have not asked anything in my name, ask and I will answer you?” (John. 16:23 – 24) The REIGN of the Son therefore consists in the fact that it is in HIS NAME that ALL MEN are SAVED [Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13], and that ALL the PRAYERS addressed to Him until the end of the world are ANSWERED [1 Timothy 2:1, 4, 6, 1 Timothy 4:10]. But when ALL CREATURES have confessed Jesus Christ WILLINGLY or by FORCE, and have been subjected to the power against which they have resisted, then the MYSTERY of ONE GOD will be REVEALED to ALL MEN, and all thanksgivings will go back to God the Father, the principle of all things, that ALL PREACHING CEASE, ONE GOD be recognized in the MYSTERY of the TRINITY. … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source (Written c. 366 AD – c. 384 AD, Reply to Question 26, Commentary on the Gospel of Luke):
P/S: A Common Objection Noted – Is All Israel all Israel?
Objection
“All Israel” includes Gentiles who are believers and excludes Jews who refuse Christ.
Romans 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Romans 11:26 And >>>>so all Israel<<<<< (Jews who believe and Gentiles who believe and are grafted in) shall be saved:
Explanation
Bible Verses:
“But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are of Israel,” – the Great St. Paul the Apostle (Romans 9:6, NKJV)
“25For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob; 27For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins.” 28Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.” – the Great, Holy and Noble St. Paul the Apostle of Christ (Romans 11:25 – 29, NKJV)
Do these Verses Contradict Each Other?
Please consider:
Romans 9’s context Speak of the “Elect “. Indeed, not all Israel are the Elect (Christians) but are enemies of the Gospel who are Prophesied to be Saved later (but not part of the Elect, in Romans 11:25 – 32).
The “enemies of the gospel” = those Gentiles + Israelites who don’t believe in the Gospel = who are prophesied to be Saved eventually by His Great Mercy to All in “unbelief” (KJV) or “Disobedience” (NASB) in Romans 11:25 – 32.
Is there a non-Elect Salvation?
Yes, according to the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture agreeing to these Verses literally, to quote (example from an earlier post):
Mystery of “the others”:
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
Can you see it?
Here is the Definition Class of the non-Christians (i.e. those unbaptized but wished to be Baptized when they heard the Gospel but changed their mind & returned to their former ways):
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
a Non-Elect Salvation Hope?
“… Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. …” – Shepherd of Hermas above if they Repent during “Hell Judgment in the afterlife” but cannot be part of the ‘Elect’ (or Tower of Repentance type of Salvation) but only “… in another and much inferior place they will be laid …”.
Thus, in the Context of this “others” or non-Christians, the phrase “because they participated in the Righteous Word;” (if applicable for argument’s sake) may thus refer to them Practicing any Good Works or Good Way of Life which Corresponds to the Law of God Found in the Gospels. This Context of such “good non-Christians” being Saved in the Spirit World after their Judgment as per the Visions of Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh agree Perfectly as such a chance seems to only be given to those who had a ‘relatively good moral compass’ in life of which the measure can only be determined Fairly by our Most Perfect Saviour. Please remember that the Shepherd of Hermas Writing is Scripture and thus it is Infallible giving this Hope, right?
P/S2: Other Interesting Prophecies
“… Point 4 … 1 Now, therefore, know that the Lord shall execute judgment upon the sons of men. Because when the rocks are being rent, And the sun quenched, And the waters dried up, And the fire cowering, And all creation troubled, And the invisible spirits melting away; And Hades taketh spoils through the visitations of the Most High, Men will be unbelieving and persist in their iniquity. On this account with punishment shall they be judged. …” – Translation by Mr. Charles
or
“… 4. Now, therefore, know that the Lord will execute judgment upon the sons of men; because when the rocks are rent, and the sun quenched, and the waters dried up, and the fire trembling, and all creation troubled, and the invisible spirits melting away, and the grave spoiled in the suffering of the Most High, men unbelieving will abide in their iniquity, therefore with punishment shall they be judged. …” – Translation by Mr. Roberts-Donaldson
Focus Phrases from the above:
“… And Hades taketh spoils through the visitations of the Most High …” = ” … and the grave spoiled in the suffering of the Most High …” = Christ Saving from Hell now in His Visitations by His Suffering Prior?
*Hades (Greek) = Sheol (Hebrew) = Grave (Hell now, English)
“… Point 26 … And ye shall be the people of the Lord, and have one tongue; And there shall be there no spirit of deceit of Beliar, For he shall be cast into the fire for ever. 4 And they who have died in grief shall arise in joy , And they who were poor for the Lord’s sake shall be made rich, And they who are put to death for the Lord’s sake shall awake to life. 5 And the harts of Jacob shall run in joyfulness, And the eagles of Israel shall fly in gladness; And all the people shall glorify the Lord for ever. …” – Translation by Mr. Charles
or
“… Point 25 … and there shall no more be a spirit of deceit of Beliar, for he shall be cast into the fire for ever. And they who have died in grief shall arise in joy, and they who have lived in poverty for the Lord’s sake shall be made rich, and they who have been in want shall be filled, and they who have been weak shall be made strong, and they who have been put to death for the Lord’s sake shall awake in life. And the harts of Jacob shall run in joyfulness, and the eagles of Israel shall fly in gladness; but the ungodly shall lament, and sinners all weep, and all the people shall glorify the Lord for ever. …” – Translation by Mr. Roberts-Donaldson
Note: Beliar = Antichrist.
Peace to you
Unforgiven Christians and Others?
Bible Verses:
“26For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” [g]says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.” – Anonymous (Hebrews 10:26 – 31, NKJV)
Or
“4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6[c]if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame. 7For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.” – Anonymous (Hebrews 6:4 – 8, NKJV)
and
“31“Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. 32Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.” – The KING, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 12:31 – 32, NKJV)
Explanation
Please note that such “willful sinning” seems to be referring to only ‘Christians’ as ‘only they have tasted the power of the age to come’. These Verses together with the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit form the Greatest sins Unforgiven in two ages, this age and the next age (Matthew 12:31 – 32).
Will God Forgive them in His Great Mercy in the ages to come after that (Ephesians 2:7)?
We can Hope and Pray but only God has the Final Word. My reason to continue hoping comes primarily from this Shepherd of Hermas Scripture’s Verses below which seem to imply that such Christians cannot repent anymore to become the ‘Elect’ but may have ‘remission’ (or forgiveness eventually to be placed in some ‘non-Elect Salvation if God Wills’ but these must live with difficulty here too after committing such sins; so, these are probably some of the ones placed in the ‘lower abodes if they repent during afterlife Judgments’ as we have seen in other Verses from the Shepherd of Hermas as discussed in earlier posts), to quote:
“… 3[31]:1 “I will still proceed, Sir,” say I, “to ask a further question.” “Speak on,” saith he. “I have heard, Sir,” say I, “from certain teachers, that there is no other repentance, save that which took place when we rent down into the water and obtained remission of our former sins.” 3[31]:2 He saith to me; “Thou hast well heard; for so it is. For he that hath received remission of sins ought no longer to sin, but to dwell in purity. 3[31]:3 But, since thou enquirest all things accurately, I will declare unto thee this also, so as to give no excuse to those who shall hereafter believe or those who have already believed, on the Lord. For they that have already believed, or shall hereafter believe, have not repentance for sins, but have only remission of their former sins. 3[31]:4 To those then that were called before these days the Lord has appointed repentance. For the Lord, being a discerner of hearts and foreknowing all things, perceived the weakness of men and the manifold wiles of the devil, how that he will be doing some mischief to the servants of God, and will deal wickedly with them. 3[31]:5 The Lord then, being very compassionate, had pity on His handiwork, and appointed this (opportunity of) repentance, and to me was given the authority over this repentance. 3[31]:6 But I say unto you,” saith he, “if after this great and holy calling any one, being tempted of the devil, shall commit sin, he hath only one (opportunity of) repentance. But if he sin off-hand and repent, repentance is unprofitable for such a man; for he shall live with difficulty.” 3[31]:7 I say unto him, “I was quickened unto life again, when I heard these things from thee so precisely. For I know that, if I shall add no more to my sins, I shall be saved.” “Thou shalt be saved,” he saith, “thou and all, as many as shall do these things.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Mandate 4)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Focus Quotes:
“… For they that have already believed, or shall hereafter believe, have not repentance for sins, but have only remission of their former sins. … “if after this great and holy calling any one, being tempted of the devil, shall commit sin, he hath only one (opportunity of) repentance. But if he sin off-hand and repent, repentance is unprofitable for such a man; for he shall live with difficulty.” …” – Angel of Repentance (Shepherd of Hermas)
Conclusion – Why did these Great Saints write likewise?
So it makes sense to me now why these most orthodox First Christianity saints taught likewise too (as I often wondered which Scripture could have let them understand the meaning of these Verses that way, but now I see that it could have been the Shepherd of Hermas Verses above):
“… [He is saying it besides] because he knows that certain persons will arise and blaspheme the Holy Spirit and place him in a slave’s status, making him alien to the essence of God. (6) And so, as a precaution, he said, “He that blasphemeth against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him here or in the world [AGE/AEON] to come” — not to commend those who blaspheme him, but to show his foreknowledge and lovingkindness by assuring in advance the salvation of those who blaspheme him and [then] repent. (7) For he himself, again, says, “He that hath denied me before men shall be denied before my Father,” 9 and, “I will deny him,” 10 and again, “He that confesseth me I will confess before my Father.” …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘THEODOTIANS ‘, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 2.5 – 2.7, Page 74)
Focus Quote:
“… not to commend those who blaspheme him, but to show his foreknowledge and lovingkindness by assuring in advance the salvation of those who blaspheme him and [then] repent. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
“… But we have heard that you are accustomed to bring forward as an objection that which is written: “Every sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men, but blasphemies against the Spirit shall not be forgiven unto men. And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him, but whosoever shall speak against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world [age], nor in that which is to come.” [Matthew 12:31 – 32] By which quotation the whole of your assertion is destroyed and done away, for it is written: “Every sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men.” Why, then, do you not remit them? Why do you bind chains which you do not loose? Why do you tie knots which you do not unfasten? Forgive the others, and deal with those who you think are bound for ever by the authority of the Gospel for sinning against the Holy Spirit… Then, when Simon, depraved by long practice of magic, had thought he could gain by money the power of conferring the grace of Christ and the infusion of the Holy Spirit, Peter said: “Thou hast neither part nor lot in this faith, for thy heart is not right with God. Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray the Lord, if per-chance this thought of thy heart may be forgiven thee, for I see that thou art in the bond of iniquity and in the bitterness of gall.” [Acts 8:22 – 23] We see that Peter by his apostolic authority condemns him who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit through magic vanity, and all the more because he had not the clear consciousness of faith. And yet he did not exclude him from the hope of forgiveness, for he called him to repentance [Acts 8:22, 24]… – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 20, 23 , Chapter 4 Pages 815, Book II Concerning Repentance)
Focus Quote:
“… We see that Peter by his apostolic authority condemns him who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit through magic vanity, and all the more because he had not the clear consciousness of faith. And yet he did not exclude him from the hope of forgiveness, for he called him to repentance [Acts 8:22, 24]…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of St. Augustine
iii) Blessed St. Athanasius the Great
“… They then that depreciate the Only-begotten Son of God blaspheme God, defaming His perfection and accusing Him of imperfection, and render themselves liable to the severest chastisement. For he that blasphemes any one of the Subsistences [Persons of the Trinity] shall have remission neither in this world [AGE/AEON] nor in that which is to come. But God is able to open the eyes of their heart to contemplate the Sun of Righteousness, in order that coming to know Him whom they formerly set at nought, they may with unswerving piety of mind together with us glorify Him, because to Him belongs the kingdom, even to the Father Son and Holy Spirit, now and forever. Amen…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, ‘On Luke 10:22 and Matthew 11:27’, Section 6)
Source: www.newadvent.org/fathers/2805.htm
Focus Phrases:
“… But God is able to open the eyes of their heart to contemplate the Sun of Righteousness, in order that coming to know Him whom they formerly set at nought, …” toward those who did this first “… For he that blasphemes any one of the Subsistences [Persons of the Trinity] shall have remission neither in this world [AGE/AEON] nor in that which is to come …” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope
We know for sure that Shepherd of Hermas is Scripture and even Blessed St. Athanasius approved it and hence that’s probably a reason why he is so confident in such a hope as explained in his own quote above agreeing to the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture’s Verses quoted prior. Example quote regarding the approval of the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture:
“… The Muratorian Fragment*(c.200) says: “And very recently in our own times, in the city of Rome, Hermas wrote the Pastor, when his brother Pius, the bishop, sat upon the chair of the city of Rome.” … The Shepherd was well-regarded by several of the Fathers, though there was little interest in it by St. Jerome’s time. St. Irenaeus, Clement of Alexandria and Origen considered the Shepherd inspired, while Eusebius and St. Athanasius approved of its use for catechumens. …”
Source:
https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/church-fathers-shepherd-hermas/
*The Muratorian Canon = The First and Oldest Canon of Scripture in Christianity = The First Bible Scriptures in Christianity
Peace to you
Fire of Hell
An Interesting Quote in image regarding the “Fire that is not Quenched”.
Here are some further Interesting quotes by well known Mystical Respected Christian Saints:
This Concept of Understanding that the Final-Hell/Gehenna/Lake of Fire Punishment is not literal (e.g. as per the ‘gnashing of teeth’) but refers to the ‘soul’s thoughts tormenting it’ is expressed even by the Great Saint of Orthodoxy below, to quote:
“…But as to “There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth ,” 54 we must confront them with the objection that, as in this life the creator has made every member of the body for some purpose, so he has made the teeth to chew solid food Why do the damned need teeth, then? Our brethren do not claim that they eat in hell. (2) And it must be pointed out that not everything in scripture is to be taken literally. Scripture says, “Thou hast broken the teeth of sinners, ” 55 and, “The Lord hath crushed the teeth of the lions ,” 56 but who is so foolish as to suppose that, while preserving sinners’ bodies, God breaks only their teeth? (3) Just as whoever wanted the lines to read like that was obliged by his discomfort with them to resort to allegory, so one must look for the gnashing of the teeth of the damned. The soul has the faculty of “chewing [on things],” and when convicted of its sins will “gnash its teeth” by the clashing of its thoughts . 51 16.6 But “Fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell [Gehenna]” 58 perhaps teaches that the soul is incorporeal, or even, perhaps, means that the soul will not be punished apart from the body. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘ORIGEN’ , “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 16.1 – 16., Pages 146 – 147)
Source:
Example quote:
” …… When he has quitted his body and the difference between virtue and vice is known he cannot approach God till the purging fire shall have cleansed the stains with which his soul was infested. That same fire in others will cancel the corruption of matter, and the propensity to evil…” – Blessed St. Gregory of Nyssa, of whom four hundred years after his death, the Seventh Ecumenical Council gave him the one and only title which it has given to theologians in the Church, naming him “father of fathers”, Sermon on the Dead, PG 13:445,448 (ante A.D. 394).
Source: www.scripturecatholic.com/purgatory/amp/
and
“… St. Gregory of Nyssa several times spoke of purgation by fire after death,[62] but he generally has apocatastasis* in mind.[63]…”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory
*Christ Centered Universalism in applying Purgatorial Fire to both Hades now (for some) and in the Final Gehenna (or Lake of Fire later) to Save them by Fire (1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15).
To quote a little more:
“… Gregory seems to have believed in the universal salvation of all human beings. Gregory argues that when Paul says that God will be “all in all” (1 Cor. 15:28), this means that though some may need long time of purification, eventually “no being will remain outside the number of the saved”[44] and that “no being created by God will fall outside the Kingdom of God”.[45] Due to the unity of human nature in Christ “all, thanks to the union with one another, will be joined in communion with the Good, in Jesus Christ Our Lord”.[46] By his incarnation, death and resurrection Christ achieves “the common salvation of human nature”.
…
Gregory also described God’s work this way: “His [God’s] end is one, and one only; it is this: when the complete whole of our race shall have been perfected from the first man to the last—some having at once in this life been cleansed from evil, others having afterwards in the necessary periods been healed by the Fire, others having in their life here been unconscious equally of good and of evil—to offer to every one of us participation in the blessings which are in Him, which, the Scripture tells us, ‘eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,’ nor thought ever reached.”
…
In the Life of Moses, Gregory writes that just as the darkness left the Egyptians after three days, perhaps redemption [ἀποκατάστασις] will be extended to those suffering in hell [γέεννα].[55] This salvation may not only extend to humans; following Origen, there are passages where he seems to suggest (albeit through the voice of Macrina*) that even the demons will have a place in Christ’s “world of goodness”.[56] Gregory’s interpretations of 1 Corinthians 15:28 (“And when all things shall be subdued unto him …”) and Philippians 2:10 (“That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth”) support this understanding of his theology.
Furthermore, in the next chapter (ch. XXXVI), Gregory says that those who are purified from evil will be admitted into the “heavenly company”. …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregory_of_Nyssa
*St. Macrina the Blessed was his sister while his brother is more of the famous sibling these days who is non other than St. Basil the Great.
iii. Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh regarding the Cleansing Purgatorial Purifying Fire after the Retributive Fire of Judgment in Hell
the Wicked be in Hell forever* or to the “ages” (Aeons)?
To quote:
“… THE SOUL OF A ROBBER A robber died and entered the world of spirits… On this one of the angels said, “If spirits of this kind were not kept down in the darkness or the bottomless pit, then they would cause immense harm wherever they might go. This man’s conscience is so dead, that even after he has reached the world of spirits, he fails to recognize that, by murdering and robbing in the world, he has wasted his own spiritual discernment and life. He killed and destroyed others, but in reality, he has destroyed himself. God alone knows if this man, and those who are like him, will remain in torment for ages or forever.” … A kind of lightless fire burns forever and torments these souls, but neither are they altogether consumed, nor does the fire die out. A spirit who was watching what had just happened said, “Who knows but that in the end this may not be a cleansing flame?” …” – Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh, he had seen Jesus Christ in a vision and heard his voice, a Christian universalist; he believed that all people would, eventually, attain salvation (1889 AD – 1929 AD)
Source [Translated by Rev. T. E. Riddle of the New Zealand Presbyterian Mission, Kharar, Punjab, from Urdu into English, c. 1926]:
https://reluctant-messenger.com/sadhu-sundar-singh.htm
More regarding Sundar Singh in link below [with plenty of links & proof quotes from various Christian Pastors & Believers who knew him personally]:
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/sadhu-sundar-singh-a-christian-universalist/
Conclusion – Hope for those Condemned on Judgment Day?
What Happens to those who are Unsaved in the ‘Outer Darkness’ [Matthew 8:12], the ‘Unquenchable Fire’ [Matthew 3:12] & the ‘Worm that does not Die’ [Mark 9:48]?
“… It is not enough, however, to come if one is invited: one must have the wedding dress, that is to say have faith and charity. Whoever therefore does not bring peace and charity to the altars of Christ will be seized by the feet and the hands, and thrown into the darkness from without. “There will be tears and gnashing of teeth. What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light (Jn, xii, 35); and whoever is without Christ is in darkness, because the inner light is Christ. So it is not a question of the creaking of the material teeth, nor of some eternal fire of material flames, nor of a material worm. But this is to note that, as excess food causes fevers and worms, so too, if one does not somehow cook one’s sins by using sobriety and abstinence, but if, piling up sins on sins, one contracts as indigestion old and new faults, one will be burned by his own fire and devoured by his verses. So Isaiah says, “Walk in the light of your fire and the flame that you have lit” (Is., L, 11). The fire is the one engendered by the sadness of faults; the worm comes from the fact that the insane sins of the soul attack the mind and the senses of the guilty, and gnaw at the entrails of his conscience (Sag., XII, 5); as the worms are born of each, so to speak of the body of the sinner. So the Lord said it through Isaiah, saying, “And they shall see the members of men who have averred against me; and their worm will not die, and their fire will not be extinguished “(Is., LXVI, 24). The grinding of teeth also expresses a feeling of indignation, because too late we repent, too late we moan, too late we take it upon ourselves to have sinned with a perversity so tenacious. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Converter, Baptizer &Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD)
Source:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-14
So, the Eternal (or ‘age-during’ shame/punishment) as Blessed St. Ambrose of Milan sees it as that they lose these Great Rewards in Comparison to those who attain it and are Sad permanently due to it.
Blessed St. Ambrose doesn’t seem to see that they’re unsaved (because they are NOT in “prisons” anymore, “nor” will be placed there thereafter) but may be dwelling in the other darkness regions, to quote:
“… What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
Edifying Comments:
From the above, Blessed St. Ambrose does NOT see that the ‘Final Lake of Fire is literal (material, Revelation 21:8, Revelation 20:11 – 15)’ nor that the ‘Worm is literal’ (Mark 9:48) and Neither that the ‘Gnashing of teeth as literal either’ (Matthew 13:42, Luke 13:28):
“… So it is not a question of the creaking of the material teeth, nor of some eternal fire of material flames, nor of a material worm. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
So, the Eternal (or ‘age-during’ shame/punishment) as Blessed St. Ambrose of Milan sees it as that they lose these Great Rewards in Comparison to those who attain it and are Sad permanently due to it.
Blessed St. Ambrose doesn’t seem to see that they’re unsaved (because they are NOT in “prisons” anymore, “nor” will be placed there thereafter) but may be dwelling in the other darkness regions, to quote:
“… What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
P/S: Book of the Bee Mystery
Christ Centered Universalism in the Book of the Bee as the Final Destiny of All Men including the Wicked too
To quote:
“… Mâr Isaac says thus: ‘Those who are to be scourged in Gehenna will be tortured with stripes of p. 140 love; they who feel that they have sinned against love will suffer harder and more severe pangs from love than the pain that springs from fear.’ Again he says: ‘The recompense of sinners will be this: the resurrection itself will be their recompense instead of the recompense of justice; and at the last He will clothe those bodies which have trodden down His laws with the glory of perfection. This act of grace to us after we have sinned is greater than that which, when we were not, brought our nature into being.’ Again he says: ‘In the world which is to come grace will be the judge and not justice.’…” (Chapter LX, Book of the Bee)
Source: https://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/bb/bb60.htm
“… Mâr Theodore the Expositor says: ‘Those who have here chosen fair things will receive in the world to come the pleasure of good things with praises; but the wicked who have turned aside to evil things all their life, when they are become ordered in their minds by penalties and the fear that springs from them, and choose good things, and learn how much they have sinned by having persevered in evil things and not in good things, and by means of these things receive the knowledge of the highest doctrine of the fear of God, and become instructed to lay hold of it with a good will, will be deemed worthy of the happiness of the Divine liberality. For He would never have said, “Until thou payest the uttermost farthing,” unless it had been possible for us to be freed from our sins through having atoned for them by paying the penalty; neither would He have said, “he shall be beaten with many stripes,” or “he shall be beaten with few stripes,” unless it were that the penalties, being meted out according to the sins, should finally come to an end.’ These things the Expositor has handed down in his books clearly and distinctly…” (Chapter LX, Book of the Bee)
Source: https://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/bb/bb60.htm
iii. Bishop Diodore of Tarsus
“… So also the blessed Diodorus, who says in the ‘Book of the Dispensation1:’ ‘A lasting reward, which is worthy of the justice of the Giver, is laid up for the good, in return for their labours; and torment for sinners, but not everlasting, that the immortality which is prepared for them may not be worthless. They must however be tormented for a short time, as they deserve, in proportion to the measure of their iniquity and wickedness, according to the amount of the wickedness of their deeds. This they will have to bear, that they suffer for a short time; but immortal and unending happiness is prepared for them. If it be then p. 141 that the rewards of good deeds are as great (in proportion to them) as the times of the immortality which are prepared for them are longer than the times of the limited contests which take place in this world, the torments for many and great sins must be very much less than the greatness of mercy. So then it is not for the good only that the grace of the resurrection from the dead is intended, but also for the wicked; for the grace of God greatly honours the good, but chastises the wicked sparingly.’
Again he says: ‘God pours out the wages of reward beyond the measure of the labours (wrought), and in the abundance of His goodness He lessens and diminishes the penalty of those who are to be tormented, and in His mercy He shortens and reduces the length of the time. But even thus He does not punish the whole time according to (the length of) the time of folly, seeing that He requites them far less than they deserve, just as He does the good beyond the measure and period (of their deserts); for the reward is everlasting. It has not been revealed whether the goodness of God wishes to punish without ceasing the blameworthy who have been found guilty of evil deeds (or not), as we have already said before…” (Chapter LX, Book of the Bee)
Source: https://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/bb/bb60.htm
Conclusion
These great Christian theologians may have believed say the Nestorianism heresy wrongly but in regards to the Lake of Fire and the Future Judgment, they may have gotten it right because in this aspect, the Book of the Bee may actually just be quoting ancient Christian beliefs regarding this without much (or any) alterations in principle which is evidenced likewise hundreds of years earlier say in the Sibyline Oracles or even the early church father’s quotes (e. g. St. Justin Martyr, St. Irenaeous of Lyons, St. Clement of Alexandria) as I have demonstrated prior in full detail in Post below for edification regarding this, please consider:
Source Post:
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/lake-of-fire-hope-for-the-wicked-one-day/amp/
Peace to you
Lake of Fire – Retributive or Restorative or Both?
Question
Christian mystics saying hell isn’t literal? 2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies. Where does it say there’s a purification fire? That’s why I say, FALSE TEACHERS.
Reply
Firstly, Blessed Apostle St. Peter whom you quoted is said to have been given the Vision that Christ Saves from the Lake of Fire after the prayers of the righteous petition it (though it may be after a long time) in the infamous Apocalypse of Peter Writing which was considered as Scripture by the First Bible in Christianity called the ‘Muratorian Canon’ (in the West) and the Codex Claromontanus (in the East) before ‘later Christians’ were not comfortable with it and so they removed it as the reason for this is explained in detail in the first topic in link below, please consider:
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/lake-of-fire-hope-for-the-wicked-one-day/amp/
So, what we are calling as ‘Scripture’ is not the same as I’m quoting the First Bible in Christianity. Suppose that we don’t consider the Apocalypse of Peter as Scripture. Let’s use your Bible in 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 to try understand why did the early Church leaders and Christian Mystics hold on to such a hope.
On another point, please take note that such Christians are not necessarily saying that Hell is not literal but that Retributive Judgment and Fire will eventually be followed by Purification Fire. They believe in a transition of both in that order sir. 1 Corinthians 3:15 clearly Teaches that the Fire of the Final Hell/Gehenna in the Lake of Fire eternally consumes the ‘evil works’ as the meaning of ‘eternal destruction’ or ‘everlasting punishment’ in that ‘sin ceases to exist eventually’ (i.e. those ‘works’ which are not built upon our Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ cease to exist eventually) but the person himself may be saved but through/by fire. Here are those Verses:
“For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work. If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.” – The Blessed Apostle St. Paul, Apostle of Lord Jesus Christ to the Gentiles (1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15, NASB)
Let’s Begin to Consider Common Objections & Consider in Depth Explanations as follows:
2.i. Purgatory
The Verses above Speak of “… the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire…” referring to the ‘Lake of Fire/Gehenna at the end of this Age/Aeon which has not happened yet’ (Luke 12:49). Yes, ‘the Day’ in this Verse refers to “the Day of the Lord” and hence not the Timeline now for which Purgatory exists and it is clearly Written by Apostle Paul himself that ‘this Fire’ only tests the Work on ‘that Day of the Lord’ & hence can’t refer to any fire in ‘purgatory now’. Can you see it?
2.ii. Believers only
Nowhere in Scripture above it is referenced to ‘believers only’ but to ‘each man’ or ‘every man’ in some translations meaning all of mankind. Also, the Lord only Judges on ‘that Day’ (Acts 17:31) for deeds done in the ‘Body’ as ‘the soul cannot be judged without the resurrection of Judgment with its body first’ (John 5:28 – 29). Also, believers do not come under any afterlife Judgment (John 5:24) and the ‘fallen believers’ are not considered part of the ‘Tower of Repentance or Church’ who die unrepentant & repent in the afterlife to be placed in some ‘other place more humble’ as stated in the Shepherd of Hermas (discussed in posts prior). Also, the ‘fallen believers’ are not distinguished to have a different punishment from the rest of the unbelievers as our Most Blessed Saviour Himself states in Luke 12:46 where the Lake of Fire Punishment is Described next to be ‘Proportionate the Sins/hence not eternal (implied) being countable as few vs many and not infinite’ as mentioned in Luke 12:47 – 48 where in this Context of Gehenna/Lake of Fire which the Master wishes to Kindle in the Future on Earth (Luke 12:49), these Lake of Fire Punishments are further Repeated to mean ‘not forever’ but ‘only till the last penny’ in Luke 12:59 as Christ Parabolically Describes all this in Regards to this Same Topic in Luke 12 even Remarking to His Listeners that ‘this is what is right’ (in regards to Justice or Judgment) in Luke 12:57.
Please allow me to quote from the one who Converted, Baptized and Taught St. Augustine himself namely, Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan regarding the Proper/True Context of 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 in First Christianity as it was in Roman Catholicism itself through his writing as follows:
“… What else can this mean — namely, that fire became water and water called forth fire — but that spiritual grace burns out our sins through fire, and through water cleanses them [Revelation 21:8, Revelation 22:17]? For sin is washed away and it is burnt away. Wherefore the Apostle says: “The fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is.” And further on: “If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.” [1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15] . This, then, we have stated, so as to prove that sins are burnt out by means of fire. We know now that this is in truth the sacred fire which then, as a type of the future remission of sins, came down upon the sacrifice. This fire is hidden in the time of captivity, during which sin reigns, but in the time of liberty it is brought forth [Romans 8:21 – 22, Revelation 20:11 – 15]]. And though it is changed into the appearance of water, yet it preserves its nature as fire so as to consume the sacrifice. Do not wonder when thou readest that God the Father said: “I am a consuming fire.” And again: “They have forsaken Me, the fountain of living water.” The Lord Jesus, too, like a fire inflamed the hearts of those who heard Him, and like a fount of waters cooled them. For He Himself said in His Gospel that He came to send fire on the earth [Luke 12:49] and to supply a draught of living waters to those who thirst [Revelation 22:17]…”– Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Chapter 18, Points 103 – 105, Page 244 – 245, Book III, Duties of the Clergy)
Source:
[Emphasis Mine]
Please notice carefully that St. Ambrose clearly ties up the Gehenna/Lake of Fire (Luke 12:49) when he quotes 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 disproving St. Augustine. He also implies that this is not referring to Purgatory for Christians only but for “every man” and quotes apostle Paul exactly as this same person will be Saved after his time in the [Lake of] Fire, i.e. “… he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire…”… to prove that sins are burnt out by means of fire … a type of the future remission of sins, came down upon the sacrifice …”.
St. Ambrose clearly refers to 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 to the ‘future’ to Burn Away Sins in the Lake of Fire toward Sinners as a Type of Baptism Promised to ‘all human beings eventually’ (Joel 2:28, Acts 2:17) where believers clearly receive it on earth as he writes about the Pentecost in relation to this (you may read in source above), as he states in the above:
“… but that spiritual grace burns out our sins through fire, and through water cleanses them [Revelation 21:8, Revelation 22:17] … For sin is washed away and it is burnt away … The fire shall try every man’s work … If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire… to prove that sins are burnt out by means of fire. .. as a type of the future remission of sins, came down upon the sacrifice… ” – St. Ambrose of Milan
Yes, this Lake of Fire Will Consume the Sin in those cast into it (Revelation 21:8) and Set them to Liberty from it:
“… This fire is hidden in the time of captivity, during which sin reigns, but in the time of liberty it is brought forth [Romans 8:21 – 22, Revelation 20:11 – 15]]. And though it is changed into the appearance of water, yet it preserves its nature as fire so as to consume the sacrifice. Do not wonder when thou readest that God the Father said: “I am a consuming fire.” And again: “They have forsaken Me, the fountain of living water.” The Lord Jesus, too, like a fire inflamed the hearts of those who heard Him, and like a fount of waters cooled them. For He Himself said in His Gospel that He came to send fire on the earth [Luke 12:49] and to supply a draught of living waters to those who thirst [Revelation 22:17]…” – St. Ambrose of Milan
Yes, this is an accurate Context as a point or two earlier St. Ambrose reveals in his quote below that this Lake of Fire is Signified to ‘consume all sin’ for the ‘Forgiveness of all’ (who are cast into it):
“… We form the congregation of the Lord. We recognize the propitiation of our Lord God, which our Propitiator wrought in His passion [1 John 2:2]. I think, too, we cannot leave out of sight that fire when we read that the Lord Jesus baptizes with the Holy Spirit and with fire, as John said in his Gospel [John 1:33]. Rightly was the sacrifice consumed, for it was for sin . But that fire was a type of the Holy Spirit Who was to come down after the Lord’s ascension, and forgive the sins of all, [Mark 9:49]…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Chapter 18, Points 102, Page 244, Book III, Duties of the Clergy)
Source:
St. Ambrose points out that the ‘Baptism of Fire’ causes Death to some but renewal of inner man (‘spirit saved’ after the outer body + soul or flesh is destroyed) as with the Case of Noah too as follows:
“… In the flood, too, in Noah’s time all flesh died, though just Noah was preserved together with his family. Is not a man consumed when all that is mortal is cut off from life? The outer man is destroyed, but the inner is renewed. Not in baptism alone but also in repentance does this destruction of the flesh tend to the growth of the spirit, as we are taught on the Apostle’s authority, when holy Paul says: “I have judged as though I were present him that hath so done this deed, to deliver him unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Chapter 18, Points 108, Page 245, Book III, Duties of the Clergy)
Source:
The Phrase “… Not in baptism alone but also in repentance does this destruction of the flesh tend to the growth of the spirit, …” clearly points to St. Ambrose stating that apart from this Final “… being Saved by [the Lake of] Fire…” for some men during Judgment Day when they are Baptized by this Fire, for those ‘in repentance’ (i.e. ‘some Christians’) experience it now within our current mortal bodies itself hence being saved in the spirit on that day already [without needing to go through the resurrection of Judgment, implied] whilst the best Christians are preserved through Baptism of Water wholly without Judgment as the example of Noah proves.
This is exactly how this ancient authority of doctrine understood it too:
“… “Let them , if they will, walk in our way and in Christ’s. If not, let them walk in their own way. Perchance there they will be baptized with fire, with that last, that more laborious and longer baptism, which devours the substance like hay, and consumes the lightness of all evil.”…” – ArchBishop St. Gregory of Nazianzen as he regarded punishment after death as limited, is sufficiently evident from this reference to the heretical Novatians: (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD, Assemani Bibl. Orient. Tom. III, p. 323.)
Source:
https://www.tentmaker.org/books/Prevailing.html
3.i. The Works of Sin: “wood, hay, straw”
Please notice carefully that ArchBishop St. Gregory of Nazianzen’s last quote above identifies the ‘hay’ as referring to ‘sinful things/false teaching in the Novatians Heretics’.
St. Ambrose of Milan clearly uses the phrases “wood, hay, straw” to refer to ‘sins only (lust)’ which ‘fuel the fire of sin’ strengthening our claim as some Christians misunderstand it to mean ‘lighter good works’, to quote:
“… An external fire is extinguished by pouring on water, it is then no wonder if the inward heat of the body is cooled by draughts from the stream, for the flame is fed or fails according to the fuel. As hay, straw, wood, oil, and such like things are the nourishment which feeds fire, if you take them away, or do not supply them, the fire is extinguished. In like manner then the heat of the body is supported or lessened by food, it is excited by food and lessened by food. Luxury then is the mother of lust.. ” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Points 26, Page 1048, Epistle LXHI, To Christians at Vercellae, 396 AD)
Source:
In the quote below, St. Ambrose clearly distinguishes that only these three works (gold, silver, precious stones) are ‘works on the foundation of faith’ (i.e. of Christians):
“… Let each one then strive that be may be able to receive a reward according to his labor. “For we are laborers together with God,” as the Apostle said; “we are God’s husbandry, God’s building.” Blessed therefore is he who sees such usury on his principal; blessed too is he who beholds the fruit of his work; blessed again is he “who builds upon the foundation of faith, gold, silver, precious stones.” …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Point 8, Page 674, Chapter 1, Book V Exposition of the Christian Faith)
Source:
This Agrees to the Verse below too where both the Good and Bad are Judged in One Judgment Seat of Christ only as it is Written in the Book of Revelation too (Revelation 20:11 – 15):
“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.” – the Blessed Apostle Paul (2 Corinthians 5:10, NASB)
Comment: These three works “gold, silver, precious stones” may even refer to the ‘hundredfold, sixty fold, thirty fold’ mystery too respectively (Conjecture).
Note: The phrase: “… no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ….” (in 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15) easily debunks the idea that these Verses refer to the believers Judgment only under the claim that the Foundation Spoken of is Jesus Christ because ‘it is Written clearly here that no other foundation is possible either’. This means that every man’s work is tested upon the Lake of Fire’s Baptism on Judgment Day by Lord Jesus Christ’s Perfect Foundation where though the evil man’s works may be burnt (same punishment in the Lake of Fire toward fallen Christians & Unbelievers in Luke 12:46 – 47) these may be “saved by fire” (1 Corinthians 3:15), i.e. by the Lake of Fire’s Baptism which Destroys all sin in the Body + Soul during this Destruction (Matthew 10:28).
3.iii. Destruction of the Body and Soul in Gehenna/Lake of Fire (Matthew 10:28)
St. Ambrose’s quote below agrees to Salvation post-afterlife Judgment toward a non-repentant died in sin fallen Christian case whose punishment sentence is the same as an unbeliever as Luke 12:46 implies clearly ‘as the place/portion’ with the ‘unbelievers’ (Revelation 21:8 too) whose spirit is Promised to be Saved on the ‘Lord’s Day’ (1 Corinthians 5:5):
“… I write unto you not to keep company if any man that is named a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater.” Those whom he has joined together under one penalty, he willed to attain together to forgiveness. “If any be such,” he says, “with him not to eat.” How severe he is with the obstinate, how indulgent to those who seek. Against those rises up in arms the injury done to Christ, whilst the calling upon Christ aids these. But lest any one be perplexed because it is written: “I have delivered such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, and should say: How can he attain forgiveness whose whole flesh has perished, seeing that it is evident that man was redeemed both in body and soul, and is saved in both and that neither the soul without the body, nor yet the body without the soul, since both are united by their fellowship in the deeds that have been done, can be without fellowship either in punishment or in reward? Let this suffice for an answer to him. That “destruction” does not mean the complete annihilation of the flesh, but its chastening. For as he who is dead to sin lives to God, so the allurements of the flesh perish, and the flesh dies to its lusts, in order that it may live again to purity and to other good works. And what more suitable example can we take than one from our common mother? For the earth itself, from which we are all taken, when it is not worked and cultivated, seems to be desert; and the field dies to the vines or olive-trees with which it was planted, and yet it does not lose its own nutritive power, which is, as it were, its life. And then later, when cultivation begins once more, and the seed is sown for which the land seems suitable, it breaks forth again more fruitful than before with its products. It is not, then, anything so strange if our flesh is said to die, and yet is understood to be subdued rather than annihilated…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Selected Works and Letters, Points 94 – 96, Page 807, Chapter 17, Book I Concerning Repentance)
Source:
Comment: In the fallen believer’s Judgment Sentence above, it happens either in this life or during the ‘Resurrection of Judgment’ (John 5:28 – 29) because St. Ambrose clearly sets the Context for ‘resurrection before judgment’ first for the body + soul to be together in his quote from the above as follows:
“… nor yet the body without the soul, since both are united by their fellowship in the deeds that have been done, can be without fellowship either in punishment or in reward? [Context: John 5:28 – 29 is included] Let this suffice for an answer to him. That “destruction” does not mean the complete annihilation of the flesh, but its chastening [Context for Matthew 10:28 in Gehenna/Lake of Fire is included in Principle]. … For as he who is dead to sin lives to God, so the allurements of the flesh perish, and the flesh dies to its lusts, in order that it may live again to purity and to other good works. … it is not, then, anything so strange if our flesh is said to die, and yet is understood to be subdued rather than annihilated …[for 1 Corinthians 5:5]…” St. Ambrose of Milan
Christians do not receive any recompense for the bad on Judgment Day (John 5:24) as they are already judged in their life prior on earth itself (Hebrews 12:8) and so the ones receiving any bad must thus refer to the non-Christians in 2 Corinthians 5:10 where these are said to be “Saved by Fire” (i.e. after the lake of Fire) in 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 according to the Punishment Level (Many or Few, Luke 12:47- 48) where fallen believers are considered to receive the same equal punishment in the Lake of Fire (Luke 12:49) together with the unbelievers (Luke 12:46, Revelation 21:8) till the last penny only or ‘to the end’ and not forever (Luke 12:59) as Lord Jesus Christ Declared this Justice as Right (Luke 12:57 – 59).
“… At this juncture, one is to be reminded that Ambrose was actually a Christian universalist, as was seen in the preceding section. How can his antisemitism be reconciled with his universalism? His conceivable answer to this question is his interesting universalist view that even if people such as the Jews (and also the Arians) may miss the first resurrection, they will be purified by the fire of punishment by the time of the second resurrection, and that if they miss even that chance, they will simply stay longer in the fire of punishment that will eventually purify them:
‘…Our Saviour has appointed two kinds of resurrection, in accordance with which John says, in the Apocalypse, “Blessed is he that hath part in the first resurrection”; for such come to grace without the judgment. As for those who do not come to the first, but are reserved until the second resurrection, these shall be burnt, until they fulfill their appointed times, between the first and the second resurrection; or, if they should not have fulfilled them then, they shall remain still longer in punishment … ‘ – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD) …”
Source: https://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Ambrose
So the Case of ‘All Israel will be Saved’ (Romans 11:26) agrees to our exegesis where the ‘two-thirds that perish in the Lake of Fire to the end’ (Zechariah 13:9) may be raised during the Second Resurrection to life after the thousand years are over by God’s Mercy (Revelation 20:5) and the ‘one-third refers to the ones partaking of the First Resurrection to life’ which is His Church = Christians = His Bride (Revelation 20:4 – 6) who call out with God the Spirit for the thirsty ones from the Lake of Fire (implied as ‘fire causes thirst’) to drink of the Water of Life Freely (Revelation 22:17) attaining to the ‘Common Lot’ of Salvation (shared toward all creation eventually toward sinlessness, Romans 8:21 – 22) as St. Ambrose Describes above and the quotes by the Apostolic Fathers below agree too toward this END for ALL MEN (all human beings):
Perfection of God Means God Saves ‘All Men’ eventually as Basic or General Salvation is likened to the ‘Rain falling both on the Just & Unjust’ and so ‘enmity on account of faith is with Love’
“… ” You ought therefore to “hate those that hate God, and to waste away [with grief] on account of His enemies.” I do not mean that you should beat them or persecute them, as do the Gentiles “that know not the Lord and God; ” but that you should regard them as your enemies, and separate yourselves from them, while yet you admonish them, and exhort them to repentance, if it may be they will hear, if it may be they will submit themselves. For our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth.” [1 Timothy 2:4] Wherefore “He makes His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; ” of whose kindness the Lord, wishing us also to be imitators, says, “Be ye perfect, even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect.” [Matthew 5:44 – 48]…” – St. Ignatius of Antioch, Disciple of the Blessed Apostle John (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Philadelphians, Chapter III)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-philadelphians-longer.html
Context: The phrase “… our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved … His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; …even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect…” clearly Proves that St. Ignatius Believes that ‘All Men’ (in the Context of ‘God being a Lover of Mankind’, hence it means all human beings ever created) will be Saved eventually.
Christ Draws (Drags as in Catching Fish in a Net as it means in Koine Greek) ‘All Men’ as St. Ignatius applies the General Word ‘Draw All’ or ‘Draw All things’ in John 12:32 to the Subset of ‘All Men’ as follows:
“… and once more, “If I be lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men unto Me [John 12:32].” The Word therefore did dwell in flesh, for “Wisdom built herself an house.” The Word raised up again His own temple on the third day, when it had been destroyed by the Jews fighting against Christ. The Word, when His flesh was lifted up, after the manner of the brazen serpent in the wilderness [John 3:14], drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation [John 12:32]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Smyrnaeans, Chapter II)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-smyrnaeans-longer.html
Please notice carefully that St. Ignatius mentions that this ‘Drawing of All [Men]’ by Christ in John 12:32 results in the Final Salvation of ‘All Men’, in his words, “… drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation…” as Stated in a past tense Prophetically as a Done Reality to Him.
The Perfection of God Means that God Saves ‘All Men’ eventually as Basic or General Salvation is likened to the ‘Rain falling both on the Just & Unjust’ and so ‘enmity on account of faith is with Love’
“… ” You ought therefore to “hate those that hate God, and to waste away [with grief] on account of His enemies.” I do not mean that you should beat them or persecute them, as do the Gentiles “that know not the Lord and God; ” but that you should regard them as your enemies, and separate yourselves from them, while yet you admonish them, and exhort them to repentance, if it may be they will hear, if it may be they will submit themselves. For our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth.” [1 Timothy 2:4] Wherefore “He makes His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; ” of whose kindness the Lord, wishing us also to be imitators, says, “Be ye perfect, even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect.” [Matthew 5:44 – 48]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Philadelphians, Chapter III)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-philadelphians-longer.html
Context: The phrase “… our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved … His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; …even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect…” clearly Proves that St. Ignatius Believes that ‘All Men’ (in the Context of ‘God being a Lover of Mankind’, hence it means all human beings ever created) will be Saved eventually.
Last but not least, Please also notice ‘carefully’ how St. Justin Martyr distinguishes the Church as One Body vs the Wicked converted as ‘One Child’ as two different entities as follows:
“…We have preached before Him as if [He were] a child, as if a root in a dry ground.’ (And what follows in order of the prophecy already quoted.) But when the passage speaks as from the lips of many, ‘We have preached before Him,’ and adds, ‘as if a child,’ it signifies that the wicked shall become subject to Him, and shall obey His command, and that all shall become as one child … and of those things which would also be done by Christ Himself …” – St. Justin Martyr (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER XLI & CHAPTER XLII, ‘Dialogue with Trypho’)
“… Such a thing as you may witness in the body: although the members are enumerated as many, all are called one, and are a body. For, indeed, a commonwealth and a church, though many individuals in number, are in fact as one, called and addressed by one appellation … of those who it was foreknown were to believe in Him,…” – St. Justin Martyr (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER XLI & CHAPTER XLII, ‘Dialogue with Trypho’)
Source for both quotes above:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
“… The Divine grace variously distributed… Further also, when the word is sown, it does not yield a uniform produce of fruit in this human life, but one various and rich ; for it bringeth forth, some an hundred j^nd some Matt.] 3, 8. sixty, and some thirty 7 , as the Saviour teaches — that Sower of grace, and Bestower of the Spirit … Nor is the grace confined to the perfect alone; but it is sent down also among those who occupy the middle and the third ranks, so that He might RESCUE ALL MEN GENERALLY to SALVATION…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Festal Letter 70 – 71)
Source:
Comment: In the last quote above, St. Athanasius is revealing that the Grace of God Works in different Ways beginning with the Perfect (Hundredfold Seed) to the Second Rank (Sixty Fold Seed) to the Third Rank (Thirty Fold Seed) and lastly toward a ‘General Salvation which Rescues ALL MEN to be sinless again (implied)’. Right?
St. Athenagoras of Athens Proves that the ‘Common Lot’ of General Salvation applies even to the Wicked or failed ones after their Proportioned Final Judgment in the Lake of Fire
“… And we shall make no mistake in saying, that the final cause of an intelligent life and rational judgment, is to be occupied uninterruptedly with those objects to which the natural reason is chiefly and primaily adapted, and to delight unceasingly in the contemplation of Him who is, and of His decrees, notwithstanding that the majority of men, because they are affected too passionately and too violently by things below, pass through life without attaining this object. For the large number of those who fail of the end that belongs to them does not make void the common lot, since the examination relates to individuals, and the reward or punishment of lives ill or well spent is proportioned to the merit of each….” – Blessed St. Athenagoras of Athens, In his writings he styles himself as “Athenagoras, the Athenian, Philosopher, and Christian”, in the fragments of the Christian History of Philip of Side (c. 425). Philip of Side claims that Athenagoras headed the Catechetical School of Alexandria (which is probably incorrect and contradicted by Eusebius), Athenagoras is an Ante-Nicene Christian apologist who lived during the second half of the 2nd century (c. 133 AD – c. 190 AD, ‘On the Resurrection of the Dead’ )
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-resurrection.html
“… Christ, who was called the Son of God before the ages, was manifested in the fulness of time, in order that He might cleanse us through His blood, who were under the power of sin, presenting us as pure sons to His Father, if we yield ourselves obediently to the chastisement of the Spirit. And in the end of time He shall come to do away with all evil, and to reconcile all things, in order that there may be an end of all impurities. … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Fragment XXXIX, FRAGMENTS FROM THE LOST WRITINGS OF IRENAEUS)
Translation Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-fragments.html
It is self explanatory in the above, I repeat with Emphasis:
“… Christ, who was called the Son of God BEFORE the AGES [Aeons], was manifested in the fulness of time, in order that He might cleanse us through His blood, who were under the power of sin, presenting us as pure sons to His Father, if we yield ourselves obediently to the chastisement of the Spirit. And in the END of TIME He shall come to DO AWAY with ALL EVIL, and to RECONCILE ALL [Created] THINGS in order that there may be an END of ALL IMPURITIES. … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Fragment XXXIX, FRAGMENTS FROM THE LOST WRITINGS OF IRENAEUS)
We ‘Understand’ Colossians 1:16 – 20 the SAME way as Blessed St. Irenaeous describes above. So it’s highly possible that the everlasting punishment or everlasting destruction Spoken off in the Bible refers to ‘an everlasting separation of rewards between the righteous & the wicked’ and also that the wicked’s sins are all destroyed till it ceases to exist but that they are also saved with a Basic Salvation if God Wills by His Mercy be it through the Lake of Fire first for sure as these quotes from First Christianity’s Finest & the Bible Verse in 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15 seem to Imply this Hope Biblically especially since the burning described in this Verse means ‘katakaio’ or ‘burn fully’ (i.e. Maximum Burning in the Lake of Fire, right?) where such a one is said to be saved by/through fire.
Peace to you
Concept of Ages (Aeons) part within the Bounds of Orthodoxy?
*Everlasting – or is it to the “age” or “aeon” only as per the literal meaning?
To quote:
“… Which joy may it be ours to reach, by the grace and kindness of our Lord Jesus Christ, to whom pertain glory, honour, and adoration, with His Father, who is without beginning, and His holy, and good, and quickening Spirit, now and ever, and to the ages of the ages. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (c. 170 AD –235 AD, Chapter XLVIII, Page 130 from the same source above)
Please note that Blessed St. Hippolytus wrote the ending above within the same explanation where the word translated as “ever” is possibly more accurate as “age” (“aeon”) which is the same root word in Koine Greek as the word translated as “everlasting” in “everlasting punishment” prior.
So, the fact that Blessed St. Hippolytus points to three time period phrases in “… now and ever, and to the ages of the ages …” may mean as follows (as the literal Koine Greek Words imply):
Now = Present time
Ever (age-during, age/aeon) = usually an unknown long time but limited in time
ages of Ages = a set of successive ages to come out of a larger possibly unending series of Ages indicating that each age ends giving way to the next age (aeon, please see Ephesians 2:7 too)
Hence the ‘everlasting punishment’ could mean ‘age-during punishments’ more accurately or if not, representing a permanent loss of inheriting His Kingdom which is only for His Church as discussed in earlier posts.
“… But third it gives the ordinances of the spirit, as though, in the Gospels, arranging the mercy seat and Holy of Holies for its dwelling, but as its holy tabernacle a holy people < who * > have none but the righteous as their companions.10,7 In this people there dwells one infinite Godhead, one imperishable Godhead, one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; spirit, soul and flesh; faith, hope and charity; past, present and future; the AGES, the ETERNAL AGES, and the AGES of AGES; Sabbaths of Sabbaths; the circumcision of the flesh, the circumcision of the heart, and “the circumcision of Christ by the putting off of the body of the sins .’’ 202 (9) In a word, it PURIFIES ALL THINGS for itself, things visible and invisible, thrones, dominions, principalities authorities, powers. But IN ALL is the same holy voice crying, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” from glory to glory, < to glorify > the Father in the Son, and the Son in the Father with the Holy Spirit, to whom be glory and might unto the AGES of AGES. Amen. And he who so believes will say “So be it! So be it. ” …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.3, Pages 498 – 499)
Source:
Focus points from the Quote above – Ages or Aeons Mystery
There are at least three types of Ages [Aeons-plural] Time Periods
“… past, present and future; the ages, the eternal ages, and the ages of ages; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
I think that the phrase “eternal ages” means that the “ages or Aeons” continue into eternity.
Note: Men’s Final Punishment in Gehenna or the Lake of Fire has never been mentioned to the Aeons-plural to come but only to the lesser maximum sentence which is to the next Aeon-singular to come (Matthew 25:46, Matthew 12:31 – 32) in the Bible giving a strong case that it’s not eternal but age-during to the next age only (though severe & a long time). It cannot be that each of the phrases “the ages” (Ephesians 2:7), “the eternal ages” (no such phrase exists in the Bible but may be inferred to the overall creation of all ages as per the context of Hebrews 11:3) and “ages of Ages” (Revelation 20:10) all describe eternity.
The word eternal in front of the word ages (Aeons) itself proves that the word “ages-plural” itself does not mean eternity by itself but is a limited succession of ages to come by God’s Will as St. Epiphanius says, “eternal ages” to imply an eternal sequence of ages to come, right?
iii. Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons
It is obvious that St. Epiphanius is revealing that eternity is a ‘long series of ages (aeons)’ as his phrase “eternal ages” means which is further broken up to some special highlight of certain focus ages such as the “ages of Ages” and the general succession of one age which terminates and is followed by another is exemplified in the phrase “ages” as it was with the “past ages” (Colossians 1:26, Ephesians 3:5) & so it will be into the future too always toward all created things as this is confirmed further in agreement of definition to the First Christianity quote below too:
“… But ALL THINGS which proceed from Him, WHATSOEVER have been MADE, and are made, do indeed receive their own beginning of generation, and on this account are INFERIOR to Him who formed them, inasmuch as they are not unbegotten. Nevertheless THEY ENDURE, and EXTEND their EXISTENCE into a LONG SERIES of AGES [Aeons, Aeon1, Aeon2, Aeon3, …] in accordance with the WILL of GOD their Creator; so that He GRANTS them that they should be thus formed at the beginning, and that they should so exist afterwards.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Chapter XXXIV, Point 2)
Translation Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
“… Elsewhere too Scripture says: “By whom also He made the ages, who is the brightness of His glory and the express Image of His Person.” Now the ages are past and present and future. How then were those made which are future, unless it is that His active power and knowledge contains within itself the number of all the ages? For just as He calls the things that are not as though they were, s so has He made things future as though they were. It cannot come to pass that they should not be. Those things which He has directed to be, necessarily will be. Therefore He who has made the things that are to be, knows them in the way in which they will be. If we are to believe this about the ages, much more must we believe it about the day of judgment, on the ground that the Son of God has knowledge of it, as being already made by Him. For it is written: “According to Thine ordinance the day will continue.” He did not merely say “the day continues,” but even “will continue,” so that the things which are to come might be governed by His ordinance. Does He not know what He ordered? “He who planted the ear, shall He not hear? He that formed the eye shall He not see?” …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 197 – 198 Chapter 4 Pages 730 – 731)
Four phrases from the above proving this Doctrine of the Ages (Aeons/Olams) to be True: “… By whom also He made the ages … Now the ages are past and present [Aeon1] and future [Aeon2, Aeon3, ….] … unless it is that His active power and knowledge contains within itself the number of all the ages … If we are to believe this about the ages…”
Note that the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit may not be forgiven in this present singular-age (AEON1) or until the future next-singular-age (AEON2) only and Ephesians 2:7 with St. Ambrose’s quote proves that there are “Ages [Plural] to Come” (AEON2, AEON3, … at least) where Forgiveness can be Attained in AEON3 as God Wills as per the Mystery of the Eighth Day (AEON3) which is after His Millennial Reign of the Coming Sabbath-Rest-of-the-Righteous-Seventh-Day (AEON2) as discussed in previous posts.
Hell’s Secrets in the Shadow of Death
Question
Hell is Illogical.
Reply
Hell is Logical when Understood rightly as each is only punished according to their deserts and ability to discern or make a choice, to quote:
The Shepherd of Hermas says “Other Place” where One can be Saved to obtain the non-Elect Salvation even.
This is called the “another place” which is ‘not the Tower of Repentance’ (where the ‘Tower of Repentance’ is parabolically referring to the Church’s Inheritance Part) in ‘Verse’ below:
“… 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for ALL THESE STONES that were REJECTED and would not fit into the building of the TOWER that was REPENTANCE, and they had a place in this tower. “THEY CAN REPENT” she said, “but they CANNOT be fitted into THIS TOWER. 7[15]:6 Yet THEY shall be fitted into ANOTHER PLACE much more humble, but not until they have UNDERGONE TORMENTS and have FULFILLED THE DAYS OF THEIR SINS. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts…” – Shepherd of Hermas
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Regarding the Shepherd of Hermas which was considered Scripture-Level in First Christianity by even St. Irenaeous of Lyons, Tertullian, Pope Callixtus I, St. Clement of Alexandria and even the First Bibles of Christianity (the Muratorian or Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus Canon in the East) while Eusebius (father of Church History) and St. Athanasius the Great (father of orthodoxy & Champion of Trinity) approved of its use for catechumens is discussed further with proof quotes in link below:
Here’s a Secret:
“… But with all be frank, and things from the soul Speak thou forth. Whosoever willfully Commits a wrong, an evil man is he; But he that does it under force, the end 155 I tell not; but let each man’s will be right. …” – Christian Sibyline Oracles
Source [Book II, Page 42, Points 150 – 155, Section 80 – 104?]:
https://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib04.htm
Is Book II of the Sibyline Oracles reliable? To quote:
“… Books 1-2 may have been written by Christians, though again there may have been a Jewish original that was adapted to Christian purposes. … The Christian apologist Athenagoras of Athens, writing A Plea for the Christians to Marcus Aurelius in ca. AD 176, quoted the same section of the extant Oracles verbatim, in the midst of a lengthy series of classical and pagan references including Homer and Hesiod, and stated several times that all these works should already be familiar to the Roman Emperor. The sibyls themselves, and the so-called Sibylline oracles, were often referred to by other early Church fathers; Theophilus, Bishop of Antioch (ca. 180), Clement of Alexandria (ca. 200), Lactantius (ca. 305), and Augustine (ca. 400), all knew various versions of the pseudo-Sibylline collections, quoted them or referred to them in paraphrase, and were unreluctant to Christianize them … ” Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Oracles
Are we supposed to even read the Sibyline Oracles as ‘True Christians’?
“… but God FOREKNOWING all that shall be done by ALL MEN, and it being His Decree that the future actions of men shall all be recompensed according to their several value, He foretells by the Spirit of prophecy that He will bestow meet rewards according to the merit of the actions done, always urging the human race to effort and recollection, showing that He cares and provides for men. But by the agency of the DEVILS DEATH has been DECREED AGAINST those who READ the BOOKS of Hystaspes, or of the SIBYL, or of the PROPHETS, that through FEAR they may PREVENT MEN who READ THEM from RECEIVING the KNOWLEDGE of the GOOD, and may RETAIN THEM in SLAVERY to themselves; which, however, they could not always effect. For NOT only do we FEARLESSLY READ THEM, but, as you see, bring them for YOUR INSPECTION, knowing that THEIR CONTENTS will be PLEASING to ALL. …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, First Apology, CHAPTER XLIV — NOT NULLIFIED BY PROPHECY)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-firstapology.html
The next Authoritative Ancient Christian Saint below states that the Order to “read the Siblyl” is by “the Blessed and Holy St. Paul the Apostle of Christ himself” by a tradition ‘verbally or by word of mouth’ (2 Thessalonians 2:15), to quote:
“…He distinguished the most excellent of the Greeks from the common herd, in addition to “Peter’s Preaching,” the APOSTLE PAUL will show, saying: “Take also the Hellenic books, READ THE SIBYL, how it is shown that God is one, and how the future is indicated. And taking Hystaspes, read, and you will find much more luminously and distinctly the Son of God described, and how many kings shall draw up their forces against Christ, hating Him and those that bear His name, and His faithful ones, and His patience, and His coming.” …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria, Head of the Cathecathical School At Alexandria, Teacher of Origen (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, Stromata, or Miscellanies, Book VI, CHAPTER V — THE GREEKS HAD SOME KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUE GOD)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book6.html
So, are both St. Justin Martyr and St. Clement of Alexandria wrong or are they Speaking an Ancient Truth of Tradition established by Apostle Paul himself regarding the ‘Sibyline Oracles’? Please note that even St. Augustine, St. Athenagoras of Athens, St. Theophilus of Antioch and Blessed Lactantius all read the Sibyl & quoted it too.
iii) Empirical Spirit World Evidence by a Reputable Christian saint that this is True (Verse in Image too)
“… DEATH OF A PHILOSOPHER … The soul of a German philosopher entered into the world of spirits and saw from afar the incomparable glory of the spiritual world, and the boundless happiness of its people. He was delighted with what he saw, but his stubborn intellectualism stood in the way of his entering into it, and enjoying its happiness. Instead of admitting that it was real, he argued thus with himself, “There is no doubt at all that I see all this, but what proof is there that it has objective existence, and is not some illusion conjured up by my mind? From end to end of all this scene I will apply the tests of logic, philosophy and science, and then only will I be convinced that it has a reality of its own, and is no illusion.” … . I asked one of the angels what the end of this man would be, and he replied “If this man’s life had been altogether bad, then he would at once have joined the spirits of darkness, but he is not without a moral sense, so for a very long time he will wander blindly round in the dim light of the lower parts of the intermediate state, and keep on bumping his philosophical head, until tired of his foolishness, he repents. Then he will be ready to receive the necessary instruction from the angels appointed for that purpose, and, when instructed, will he be fit to enter into the fuller light of God in the higher sphere…” – Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh
Source [Translated by Rev. T. E. Riddle of the New Zealand Presbyterian Mission, Kharar, Punjab, from Urdu into English, c. 1926]: https://reluctant-messenger.com/sadhu-sundar-singh.htm
A sincerely wrong non-Christian Idolater who has a reasonably sound moral compass may have a chance in the Spirit World too if he doesn’t hold too strongly to his false beliefs, to quote:
“… THE MANIFESTATION OF CHRIST … I saw in a vision the spirit of an idolater on reaching the world of spirits begin at once to search for his god. Then the saints said to him, “There is no god here save the One True God, and Christ, who is His manifestation.” At this, the man was a good deal astonished, but being a sincere seeker after truth, he frankly admitted that he had been in error. He eagerly sought to know the correct view of truth, and asked if he might see the Christ. Shortly after this Christ manifested Himself in a dim light to him, and to others who had newly arrived in the world of spirits, because at this stage they could not have endured a full exhibition of His glory, for His glory is so surpassing that even the angels look on Him with difficulty, and cover their faces with their wings (Isaiah 6:9). When He does reveal Himself to any one He takes into account the particular stage of progress to which that soul has attained, so He appears dimly, or in the fuller light of His glory, that the sight of Him may be endured. So, when these spirits saw Christ in this dim but attractive light, they were filled with a joy and peace, which is beyond our power to describe. Bathed in the rays of His life-giving light, and with the waves of His love, which constantly flow out from Him, flowing over them, all their error was washed away. Then with all their hearts, they acknowledged Him as the Truth, and found healing, and, bowing in lowly adoration before Him, thanked and praised Him. And the saints, who had been appointed for their instruction; also rejoiced over them. …” – Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh
Source [Translated by Rev. T. E. Riddle of the New Zealand Presbyterian Mission, Kharar, Punjab, from Urdu into English, c. 1926]:
https://reluctant-messenger.com/sadhu-sundar-singh.htm
Conclusion – First Christianity taught this regarding “Hades” (‘Hell now’):
“… The Lord, having put on human nature, and having suffered for him who suffered, having been bound for him who was bound, and having been buried for him who was buried, is risen from the dead, and loudly proclaims this message: Who will contend against me? Let him stand before me. It is I who delivered the condemned. It is I who gave life to the dead. It is I who raised up the buried. Who will argue with me? It is I, says Christ, who destroyed death. It is I who triumphed over the enemy, and having trod down HADES, and bound the STRONG MAN, and have SNATCHED MANKIND up to the HEIGHTS of HEAVEN. It is I, says Christ. So then, come here ALL you FAMILIES of MEN, weighed down by your sins and recieve pardon for your misdeeds. For I am your pardon. I am the Passover which brings salvation. I am the Lamb slain for you. I am your lustral bath. I am your life. I am your resurrection. I am your light, I am your salvation, I am your King. It is I who brings you up to the heights of heaven. It is I who will give you the resurrection there. I will show you the Eternal Father. I will raise you up with my own right hand …” – Blessed St. Melito, Jewish Bishop of Sardis, of whom Polycrates of Ephesus to Pope Victor about 194 (Eusebius, Church History V.24) states that “Melito the eunuch [this is interpreted “the virgin” by Rufinus in his translation of Eusebius], whose whole walk was in the Holy Spirit”, was buried at Sardis and Jerome, speaking of the Old Testament canon established by Melito, quotes Tertullian to the effect that he was esteemed as a prophet by many of the faithful (Died c. 180 AD, ‘Homily on Pascha’)
Source: https://www.orthodox.net/pascha/pascha-melito.html
P/S: An Example of a relatively good non-Christian
There are “relatively good non-Christians” way better than us in works but not faith too who may be Saved as the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture in First Christianity and Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh’s Visions have shown.
Even more amazing is that someone commented further regarding this person in image as follows:
‘… True representation of Pakistan. Edhi sb also runs the largest private fleet of ambulance in the world. His employees worked during the worse terror hit areas. He also runs cancer hospitals, maternity homes, mental hospitals animal shelters and morgues. The best part is that its all free. …’
Peace to you
Hell Fire – Retributive and Purification?
It’s both, yes. There’s a Retributive Fire (Luke 16:19 – 31) and a Purifying Fire in Hell (1 Corinthians 3:15) but even then, ranking in His Kingdom and differences in inheritance are not the same (Matthew 5:19) and only His Bride or Church (Christians) get the First Resurrection Gift of Deification (Revelation 20:4 – 6, Matthew 7:21 – 23) and not everyone else (Revelation 20:5, 1 Corinthians 6:9 – 10).
Also, the “Rich Man” went to Hell in Luke 16:19 – 31 because of ‘not doing enough Acts of Mercy’ in his life. Indeed, The pain is Retributive because he is in pain and also that the “Rich Man” is suffering for the luxury experienced without practicing enough such mercy (Verse in image).
Conclusion
“24“Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:24, NKJV)
“19“There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and [h]fared sumptuously every day. ” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:19, NKJV)
iii) The Fire of Hell is especially for the Rich who never practiced enough Acts of Mercy to match the Level of blessings which they received in life
“But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:25, NKJV)
“20But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:20 – 22, NKJV)
“26And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:26, NKJV)
Only the literally poor and the poor in spirit have this Gift, Verses:
Definition:
Poor = Christian Poor and possibly non-Christian poor too who didn’t get much good in life or didn’t get much spiritual richness either
Poor in Spirit = Christian Rich who share a lot of their money away and/or Christian Rich who share a lot of their Spiritual Knowledge of the Gospel for free too
Where the First Christianity Definition above is Given by this Great Saint below as follows:
“… 401 8r,3 But he does not know that the Old Testament also says, “The poor and the rich have met together: but the Lord is the maker of them both.” 402 And the New Testament agrees, and pronounces a blessing on the poor who are literally poor, and in another passage a blessing on the poor in spirit, so that both pronouncements have force. Thus Peter can point with pride to his literal poverty and say, “Silver and gold have I none, but what I have, I give thee; in the name of Jesus Christ, rise up and walk,” 403 (4) so that the blessing of the actually poor means nothing contradictory to the blessing of the poor in spirit. The “poor in spirit” are persons in righteous possession of property, while the “poor” are the humble, of whom Christ said, “I was an hungered, and ye gave me meat, thirsty, and ye gave me drink,” and so on 81,5 Next he explains, ‘These (i.e., the poor in spirit) acted of their abundance”; 405 and you see one and the same Spirit speaking of the poor and the rich in the Old Testament and the same in the New, just as the Savior praises them both. (6) For as he was watching the treasury he saw people putting money into the treasury, and did not refuse the gifts of the rich; but he praised the widow who had put in the two mites for her [actual] poverty, as we have said, in fulfillment of the scripture, “The poor and the rich have met together: but the Lord is the maker of them both.” 406 (81,7) And to show that this is so, and the Spirit of the Old and the New Testaments is the same, see the apostle say of the ancient prophets, “The time would fail me to tell of Gideon, Barak, Samson, Jephtha, David and the other prophets who wandered about in sheepskins, in goatskins, being tormented, straitened, afflicted, of whom the world was not worthy.” 407 For I have found that Isaiah wore sackcloth, and Elijah too. And do you see how, in the Old and the New Testaments, the poor are called blessed for piety, and the rich are called blessed for righteousness? …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘MANICHAEANS’ , “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Point 62.10, Pages 308 – 309)
Source:
vii) Which Rich Man may enter into the Kingdom of God?
“23And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 19:23, NASB)
Comment: The Shepherd of Hermas Scripture Explains ‘Why’ and ‘How’ a Christian Rich Man may be Saved
“… 5[13]:6 And I answered and said unto her, “When then, lady, will they be useful for the building?” “When,” she replied, “their wealth, which leadeth their souls astray, shall be cut away, then will they be useful for God. For just as the round stone, unless it be cut away, and lose some portion of itself, cannot become square, so also they that are rich in this world, unless their riches be cut away, cannot become useful to the Lord. 5[13]:7 Learn first from thyself When thou hadst riches, thou wast useless; but now thou art useful and profitable unto life. Be ye useful unto God, for thou thyself also art taken from the same stones. …” – Shepherd of Hermas
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
viii) Christ did Cross that Chasm and bring Hope after His Death Itself
“18For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, 19by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, 20who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.” – Apostle St. Peter (1 Peter 3:18 – 20, NKJV)
“10Those who sat in darkness and in the shadow of death, Bound in affliction and irons—11Because they rebelled against the words of God, And despised the counsel of the Most High,12Therefore He brought down their heart with labor; They fell down, and there was none to help. 13Then they cried out to the Lord in their trouble, and He saved them out of their distresses.14He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death, and broke their chains in pieces. 15Oh, that men would give thanks to the Lord for His goodness,
And for His wonderful works to the children of men!16For He has broken the gates of bronze, And cut the bars of iron in two.” (Psalm 107:10 – 16, NKJV)
And regarding the Context of the Phrase ‘Shadow of Death’, please consider:
“… For as the Lord “WENT AWAY in the midst of the SHADOW of DEATH” [Ps. 23:4, Ps 107:10 – 15], WHERE the SOULS of the DEAD were, …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter XXXI:2).
Source: http://www.regels.org/Irenaeus-Millennarism.htm
Note: The “Shadow of Death” refers to the “Spirit World” where “the souls of the dead were” making Psalm 107:10 – 16 to also possibly refer to Salvation in the Spirit World being Prophesied to be Done by Lord Jesus Christ toward those “who have rebelled against His Word” who are the “unsaved + unbelievers who cry out to Him from Hell” as the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture agrees too, to quote:
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
The Hope Part:
“… She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
This Shepherd of Hermas Scripture regarding some non-Christians (the unbaptized & those who heard the Gospel on earth but did not believe in it) can be Saved in the Spirit World if God Wills as Described above but may be accelerated by our Propitiatory Prayers on behalf of them as the Bible Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:42 – 46 imply.
Shepherd of Hermas which was considered Scripture-Level in First Christianity by even St. Irenaeous of Lyons, Tertullian, Pope Callixtus I, St. Clement of Alexandria and even the First Bibles of Christianity (the Muratorian or Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus Canon in the East) while Eusebius (father of Church History) and St. Athanasius the Great (father of orthodoxy & Champion of Trinity) approved of its use for catechumens is discussed further with proof quotes in link below:
The interesting real reliable example of Emperor Trajan (a wicked non-Christian Murderer, Pagan & Unbaptized, Unbeliever) being Saved from Hell after such Propitiatory Prayers by Pope St. Gregory the Great is not a hoax but Truth, to quote:
“… On a time Saint Gregory went by the market of Rome which is called the market of Trajan, and then he remembered of the justice and other good deeds of Trajan, and how he had been piteous and debonair, and was much sorrowful that he had been a pagan, and he turned to the church of Saint Peter wailing for the horror of the miscreance of Trajan. Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …” (The Life of St. Gregory the Pope)
Source https://classicalchristianity.com/2012/02/06/st-gregory-the-dialogist-and-emperor-trajan/
Note: The additional comment in the link above (added by others and not Uttered by God during that Vision/Revelation to Pope St. Gregory the Great but commentators) reads next as follows [Please notice the phrase ‘as some say’ carefully in the below]: “… By this, as some say, the pain perpetual due to Trajan as a miscreant was some deal taken away, but for all that was not he quit from the prison of hell, for the soul may well be in hell and feel there no pain by the mercy of God. …”
The Truth is as Hieromonk Ambrose mentioned earlier, God only said this part to Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great:
“… Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …”
Can you see it? This is exactly what the Final Prophecy of the Salvation from the Lake of Fire as described in the Apocalypse of Peter Prophecy by Lord Jesus Christ after the Righteous (Christians) Pray to Him to save the ‘damned’ from their ‘everlasting punishments’ will be answered eventually & the First Oldest Christian Canon called the Muratorian Canon lists this Book as “Scripture” too as discussed in Previous Posts.
Peace to you
Baptism Mystery
“35Then Philip opened his mouth, and beginning at this Scripture, preached Jesus to him. 36Now as they went down the road, they came to some water. And the eunuch said, “See, here is water. What hinders me from being baptized?” 37Then Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may.” And he answered and said, “I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”38So he commanded the chariot to stand still. And both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water, and he baptized him.” (Acts 8:35 – 38, NKJV)
“… 3[11]:5 I asked her, “Wherefore is the tower builded upon waters, lady?” “I told thee so before,” said she, “and indeed thou dost enquire diligently. So by thy enquiry thou discoverest the truth. Hear then why the tower is builded upon waters; it is because your life is saved and shall be saved by water. But the tower has been founded by the word of the Almighty and Glorious Name, and is strengthened by the unseen power of the Master.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
“… 3[31]:1 “I will still proceed, Sir,” say I, “to ask a further question.” “Speak on,” saith he. “I have heard, Sir,” say I, “from certain teachers, that there is no other repentance, save that which took place when we rent down into the water and obtained remission of our former sins.” 3[31]:2 He saith to me; “Thou hast well heard; for so it is. For he that hath received remission of sins ought no longer to sin, but to dwell in purity. 3[31]:3 But, since thou enquirest all things accurately, I will declare unto thee this also, so as to give no excuse to those who shall hereafter believe or those who have already believed, on the Lord. For they that have already believed, or shall hereafter believe, have not repentance for sins, but have only remission of their former sins. …” (Mandate 4)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Conclusion
A new believer may be baptized by other believers as God leads though I am also aware that Baptism is not my main ministry as sharing the Blessed Scripture in the Bible, to quote (as even Apostle St. Paul himself baptized very few people):
“12Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” 13Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? 14I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15lest anyone should say that I had baptized in my own name. 16Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas. Besides, I do not know whether I baptized any other. 17For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of no effect.” – The Blessed and Great St. Paul the Apostle of Christ (1 Corinthians 1:12 – 17, NKJV)
Please feel free to contact us if you wish to be baptized by us in Malaysia (confidentiality assured) or please contact a nearest Church to you to do so.
P/S: Hope for the Unbaptized?
“He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.” – God in Flesh, Most Blessed and Greatest One, Lord Jesus Christ (Mark 14:14, NKJV)
The Unbaptized cannot have Salvation as the Shepherd of Hermas quotes and bible verses mean that they cannot repent to inherit the Kingdom of God but may be saved to another place after being judged/condemned for their sins first as the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture explains as follows further:
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
The Hope Part:
“… She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
This Shepherd of Hermas Scripture regarding some non-Christians (the unbaptized & those who heard the Gospel on earth but did not believe in it) can be Saved in the Spirit World if God Wills as Described above but may be accelerated by our Propitiatory Prayers on behalf of them as the Bible Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:42 – 46 imply.
An Important Note: Shepherd of Hermas which was considered Scripture-Level in First Christianity by even St. Irenaeous of Lyons (Hearer/Disciple of St. Polycarp an apostolic father being the direct disciple of Apostle St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation) , Tertullian (father of Latin Christianity), Pope Callixtus I (Head of the entire Roman Catholic Church in his time in First Christianity), St. Clement of Alexandria (head of the Cathecatical School of Alexandria) and even the First Bibles of Christianity (the Muratorian or Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus Canon in the East) while Eusebius (father of Church History) and St. Athanasius the Great (father of orthodoxy & Champion of Trinity) approved of its use for catechumens is discussed further with proof quotes in link below:
Visions – Shepherd of Hermas Mystery
Question 1
How do you know which Christian vision is true as God has Promised in Acts 2:17?
Reply 1
This is a hard question and usually I don’t comment either way to not accidentally approve a wrong vision or disapprove a right vision (this attitude is correct as we declare ‘not sure’ to things we are ‘not fully sure’ – as speaking the truth means).
However, I do have a strong conviction that the Shepherd (meaning “Pastor” literally) Writing of Hermas may actually be a True Vision of God. In fact, it was the single most approved Orthodox Christian Vision at the Scripture Level (or “Inspired Writing Accuracy/Equivalent”) in all of First Christianity, to quote why it’s claimed so:
Shepherd of Hermas which was considered Scripture-Level in First Christianity by even St. Irenaeous of Lyons (Hearer/Disciple of St. Polycarp an apostolic father being the direct disciple of Apostle St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation) , Tertullian (father of Latin Christianity), Pope Callixtus I (Head of the entire Roman Catholic Church in his time in First Christianity), St. Clement of Alexandria (head of the Cathecatical School of Alexandria) and even the First Bibles of Christianity (the Muratorian or Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus Canon in the East) while Eusebius (father of Church History) and St. Athanasius the Great (father of orthodoxy & Champion of Trinity) approved of its use for catechumens is discussed further with proof quotes in link below:
Note: The ‘Shepherd of Hermas’ Writing is accepted till today in either Roman Catholicism and in Eastern Orthodoxy just that one interprets the meaning of its contents differently (that’s debatable).
Question 2
Who is the “He” and “She” Hermas speaks to in the Shepherd of Hermas Writing?
Reply 2
An aged woman in the Vision. To quote:
“… 1[9]:1 The third vision, which I saw, brethren, was as follows. 1[9]:2 After fasting often, and entreating the Lord to declare unto me the revelation which He promised to show me by the mouth of the aged woman, that very night the aged woman was seen of me, and she said to me, “Seeing that thou art so importunate and eager to know all things, come into the country where thou abidest, and about the fifth hour I will appear, and will show thee what thou oughtest to see.” …” (Vision 3)
Who is she?
“… 4[8]:1 Now, brethren, a revelation was made unto me in my sleep by a youth of exceeding fair form, who said to me, “Whom thinkest thou the aged woman, from whom thou receivedst the book, to be?” I say, “The Sibyl” “Thou art wrong,” saith he, “she is not.” “Who then is she?” I say. “The Church,” saith he. I said unto him, “Wherefore then is she aged?” “Because,” saith he, “she was created before all things; therefore is she aged; and for her sake the world was framed.” 4[8]:2 And afterwards I saw a vision in my house. The aged woman came, and asked me, if I had already given the book to the elders. I said that I had not given it. “Thou hast done well,” she said, “for I have words to add. When then I shall have finished all the words, it shall be made known by thy means to all the elect. …” (Vision 2)
Or
“… 10[18]:3 Now she was seen of me, brethren, in my first vision of last year, as a very aged woman and seated on a chair. 10[18]:4 In the second vision her face was youthful, but her flesh and her hair were aged, and she spake to me standing; and she was more gladsome than before. 10[18]:5 But in the third vision she was altogether youthful and of exceeding great beauty, and her hair alone was aged; and she was gladsome exceedingly and seated on a couch. Touching these things I was very greatly anxious to learn this revelation.10[18]:6 And I see the aged woman in a vision of the night, saying to me, “Every enquiry needs humility. Fast therefore, and thou shalt receive what thou askest from the Lord.” … ” (Vision 3)
Why? Explanation:
“… 11[19]:1 Listen,” saith he, “concerning the three forms, of which thou enquirest. 11[19]:2 In the first vision wherefore did she appear to thee an aged woman and seated on a chair? Because your spirit was aged, and already decayed, and had no power by reason of your infirmities and acts of double-mindedness. 11[19]:3 For as aged people, having no longer hope of renewing their youth, expect nothing else but to fall asleep, so ye also, being weakened with the affairs of this world gave yourselves over to repining, and cast not your cares on the Lord; but your spirit was broken, and ye were aged by your sorrows.” 11[19]:4 “Wherefore then she was seated on a chair, I would fain know, Sir.” “Because every weak person sits on a chair by reason of his weakness, that the weakness of his body may be supported. So thou hast the symbolism of the first vision.” 12[20]:1 “But in the second vision thou sawest her standing, and with her countenance more youthful and more gladsome than before; but her flesh and her hair aged. Listen to this parable also,” saith he. 12[20]:2 “Imagine an old man, who has now lost all hope of himself by reason of his weakness and his poverty, and expecteth nothing else save the last day of his life. Suddenly an inheritance is left him. He heareth the news, riseth up and full of joy clothes himself with strength, and no longer lieth down, but standeth up, and his spirit, which was now broken by reason of his former circumstances, is renewed again, and he no longer sitteth, but taketh courage; so also was it with you, when you heard the revelation which the Lord revealed unto you. 12[20]:3 For He had compassion on you, and renewed your spirits, and ye laid aside your maladies, and strength came to you, and ye were made powerful in the faith, and the Lord rejoiced to see you put on your strength. And therefore He showed you the building of the tower; yea, and other things also shall He show you, if with your whole heart ye be at peace among yourselves. 13[21]:1 But in the third vision ye saw her younger and fair and gladsome, and her form fair. 13[21]:2 For just as when to some mourner cometh some piece of good tidings, immediately he forgetteth his former sorrows, and admitteth nothing but the tidings which he hath heard, and is strengthened thenceforth unto that which is good, and his spirit is renewed by reason of the joy which he hath received; so also ye have received a renewal of your spirits by seeing these good things. 13[21]:3 And whereas thou sawest her seated on a couch, the position is a firm on; for the couch has four feet and standeth firmly; for the world too Is upheld by means of four elements. 13[21]:4 They then that have fully repented shall be young again, and founded firmly, seeing that they have repented with their whole heart. There thou hast the revelation entire and complete. Thou shalt ask nothing more as touching revelation– but if anything be lacking still, it shall be revealed unto thee.” …” (Vision 3)
“… 5[25]:7 If then, when ye hear them, ye keep them and walk in them, and do them with a pure heart, ye shall receive from the Lord all things that He promised you; but if, when ye hear them, ye do not repent, but still add to your sins, ye shall receive from the Lord the opposite. All these the shepherd, the angel of repentance. commanded me to write. …” (Mandate 1)
And
“… 1[78]:1 After I had written down the commandments and parables of the shepherd, the angel of repentance, he came to me and saith to me; “I wish to show thee all things that the Holy Spirit, which spake with thee in the form of the Church, showed unto thee. For that Spirit is the Son of God. 1[78]:2 For when thou wast weaker in the flesh, it was not declared unto thee through an angel; but when thou wast enabled through the Spirit, and didst grow mighty in thy strength so that thou couldest even see an angel, then at length was manifested unto thee, through the Church, the building of the tower. In fair and seemly manner hast thou seen all things, (instructed) as it were by a virgin; but now thou seest (being instructed) by an angel, though by the same Spirit; 1[78]:3 yet must thou learn everything more accurately from me. For to this end also was I appointed by the glorious angel to dwell in thy house, that thou mightest see all things mightily, in nothing terrified, even as before.” …” (Parable 9)
Examples:
“… 6[49]:1 “But I, the angel of repentance, say unto you; Fear not the devil; for I was sent,” saith he, “to be with you who repent with your whole heart, and to strengthen you in the faith. …” (Mandate 12)
Or
“… 13[90]:2 “They shall enter,” saith he, “if they shall put away the works of these women, and take again the power of the virgins, and walk in their works. For this is the reason why there was also a cessation in the building, that, if these repent, they may go into the building of the tower; but if they repent not, then others will go, and these shall be cast away finally.” 13[90]:3 For all these things I gave thanks unto the Lord, because He had compassion on all that called upon His name, and sent forth the angel of repentance to us that had sinned against Him, and refreshed our spirit, and, when we were already ruined and had no hope of life, restored our life. …” (Parable 9)
Or
“… 23[100]:4 If God and our Lord, Who ruleth over all things and hath the authority over all His creation, beareth no grudge against them that confess their sins, but is propitiated, doth man, who is mortal and full of sins, bear a grudge against man, as though he were able to destroy or save him? 23[100]:5 I say unto you–I, the angel of repentance–unto as many as hold this heresy, put it away from you and repent, and the Lord shall heal your former sins, if ye shall purify yourselves from this demon; but if not, ye shall be delivered unto him to be put to death. … 24[101]:3 The Lord then seeing their simplicity and entire childliness made them to abound in the labors of their hands, and bestowed favor on them in all their doings. 24[101]:4 But I say unto you that are such–I, the angel of repentance–remain to the end such as ye are, and your seed shall never be blotted out. For the Lord hath put you to the proof, and enrolled you among our number, and your whole seed shall dwell with the Son of God; for of His Spirit did ye receive. …” (Parable 9)
Or
“… 27[104]:2 For this world and the vanities of their possessions must be cut off from them, and then they will fit into the kingdom of God. For it is necessary that they should enter into the kingdom of God; because the Lord hath blessed this innocent kind. Of this kind then not one shall perish. Yea, even though any one of them being tempted by the most wicked devil have committed any fault, he shall return speedily unto his Lord. 27[104]:3 Blessed I pronounced you all to be–I the angel of repentance–whoever of you are guileless as infants, because your part is good and honorable in the sight of God. …” (Parable 9)
Source for each quote above:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Summary: Shepherd of Hermas Approval Quotes in First Christianity
To quote (examples)
“… Tertullian implies that Pope Callixtus I had quoted it as an authority (though evidently not as one of the books of the Bible), for he replies: “I would admit your argument, if the writing of The Shepherd had deserved to be included in the Divine Instrument, and if it were not judged by every council of the Churches, even of your own Churches, among the apocryphal.” …”
“… Cyprian makes no reference to this work, so it would seem to have been out of use in Africa during the early decades of the 3rd century. Somewhat later it is quoted by the author of the pseudo-Cyprianic tract Adversus aleatores as “Scriptura divina”, …”
iii. St. Clement of Alexandria – Head of the Oldest Bible School in First Christianity, the Alexandrian School
“… Though Clement of Alexandria constantly quotes with reverence a work that seems to him to be very useful, and inspired; yet he repeatedly apologizes, when he has occasion to quote it, on the ground that “some people despise it”. …”
Note: the ‘some people who despise it’ doesn’t mean that they’re right as Christians even despise some Bible Verses. No ‘big name’ or saints in First Christianity ever despised the Shepherd of Hermas Writing.
“… A poem written against Marcion from the 3rd or 4th century, by a writer adopting the name and persona of Tertullian — and sometimes therefore referred to as “Pseudo-Tertullian” — states “Then, after him, Pius, whose brother according to the flesh was Hermas, the angelic shepherd, because he spoke the words given to him.” Note that Pseudo-Tertullian quotes some details from this list which are absent from the Liberian Catalogue, which may mean that he is independent of it. …”
“… The Liberian Catalogue of Popes, a record that was later used in the writing of the Liber Pontificalis, states in a portion under the heading of 235: “Under his [Pius’] episcopate, his brother Ermes wrote a book in which are contained the precepts which the angel delivered to him, coming to him in the guise of a Shepherd.” …”
“… The Shepherd of Hermas (Greek: Ποιμὴν τοῦ Ἑρμᾶ, Poimēn tou Herma; sometimes just called The Shepherd) is a Christian literary work of the late first half of the second century, considered a valuable book by many Christians, and considered canonical scripture by some of the early Church fathers such as Irenaeus.[1] …”
vii. First Bible in Eastern Christianity (e. g.The “Codex Claromontanus”)
“… The Shepherd was very popular amongst Christians in the 2nd and 3rd centuries.[2] It is part of the Codex Sinaiticus,[3][4] and it is listed between the Acts of the Apostles and the Acts of Paul in the stichometrical list of the Codex Claromontanus. …”
viii. First (Oldest) Bible (Canon) in all of Christianity – The Muratorian Canon or Roman Canon
“… The Muratorian fragment is a list written c. 170 AD (although some scholars now question this date and prefer to assign the fragment to the 4th century.[12]) that may be the earliest known canon of New Testament writings. It identifies Hermas, the author of The Shepherd, as the brother of Pius I, bishop of Rome:
But Hermas wrote The Shepherd very recently, in our times, in the city of Rome, while bishop Pius, his brother, was occupying the chair of the church of the city of Rome. And therefore it ought indeed to be read; but it cannot be read publicly to the people in church either among the Prophets, whose number is complete,[13] or among the Apostles, for it is after their time. …”
Note: the First Christians unanimously approved the Shepherd as Inspired Scripture as the last quote above clearly proves but they didn’t want it to be easily read in church as its knowledge is great and may not be suitable for immature or young believers.
“… but in Jerome’s day it was “almost unknown to the Latins”. Curiously, it went out of fashion in the East, so that the Greek manuscripts of it are but two in number; whereas in the West it became better known and was frequently copied in the Middle Ages. …”
Source for each quote above from (i) to (ix):
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shepherd_of_Hermas
To quote from a ‘purely Roman Catholic source’ too:
“… The Muratorian Fragment*(c.200) says: “And very recently in our own times, in the city of Rome, Hermas wrote the Pastor, when his brother Pius, the bishop, sat upon the chair of the city of Rome.” … The Shepherd was well-regarded by several of the Fathers, though there was little interest in it by St. Jerome’s time. St. Irenaeus, Clement of Alexandria and Origen considered the Shepherd inspired, while Eusebius and St. Athanasius approved of its use for catechumens. …”
Source:
https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/church-fathers-shepherd-hermas/
Peace to you
P/S 17: Lake of Fire Mystery – Wisdom regarding Converting Wealth to Charity
0) Accurate Translations
Firstly, the same Hebrews word “righteousness” is found in this same chapter in both Proverbs 11:18 and Proverbs 11:4. Please consider it as follows:
“Riches do not profit in the day of wrath, But righteousness delivers from death.” (Proverbs 11:4, NKJV)
“The wicked man does deceptive work, But he who sows righteousness will have a sure reward.” (Proverbs 11:18, NKJV)
The translation for the phrase ‘righteousness delivers from death’ in Proverbs 11:4 (NKJV) to mean/refer to ‘charity will save from death’ is the most accurate rendition/meaning of that Verse as not just the Jewish Talmud contains that phrase (please see point 2 next) or that the ancient First Christianity’s Apostolic Father of the Church St. Polycarp also refers to it as “Alms” (Charity Focus, point 3 later) but also that this ancient well learned Jewish Scholar Rashi translates it the same likewise in his commentary, to quote:
“… Riches will not avail on the Day of wrath, but charity will save from death. …” – Rashi
Yes, Rashi calls the ‘righteousness’ referred to in both Proverbs 11:4 and Proverbs 11:18 as more accurately pointing to ‘charity’, to quote:
“… 18. A wicked man earns illusory wages, but he who sows charity [receives] a true reward. יח. A wicked man earns illusory wages: The wage of a wicked man lies to him. He thinks that his prosperity will remain, but all is lost. :but he who sows charity [receives] a true reward: But he who sows charity, it is a wage of truth, for he is surely confident that he will receive his wage at the end. שכר cornial in Old French. [This appears to mean a weir in several dialects; i.e., a fence placed in the water to catch fish.] Manuscripts of Rashi yield: eclusse or esklusa, which is e’cluse [in modern French]; in German wasserschleuse, a lock or a sluice gate). Like a man who locks a canal in order to gather fish, and he is confident that he will find many fish there. A similar instance is (Isa. 19:10): “all who make dams (שכר) for still ponds.” : 19. The truth of charity is for life, but one who pursues evil [leads] to his death. יט.The truth of charity: Heb. כן, the truth of charity is that its end is for life, as in (Num. 27:7): “The daughters of Zelofchad speak right (כן).” …” – Rashi
Source for both of Rashi’s quotes above:
[Emphasis in this brackets by me or others]
Who is Rashi?
To quote:
“… Shlomo Yitzchaki (Hebrew: רבי שלמה יצחקי; Latin: Salomon Isaacides; French: Salomon de Troyes, 22 February 1040 – 13 July 1105), today generally known by the acronym Rashi (Hebrew: רש״י, RAbbi SHlomo Itzhaki), was a medieval French rabbi and author of a comprehensive commentary on the Talmud and commentary on the Tanakh. Acclaimed for his ability to present the basic meaning of the text in a concise and lucid fashion, Rashi appeals to both learned scholars and beginner students, and his works remain a centerpiece of contemporary Jewish study. His commentary on the Talmud, which covers nearly all of the Babylonian Talmud (a total of 30 out of 39 tractates, due to his death), has been included in every edition of the Talmud since its first printing by Daniel Bomberg in the 1520s. His commentary on Tanakh—especially on the Chumash (“Five Books of Moses”)—serves as the basis for more than 300 “supercommentaries” which analyze Rashi’s choice of language and citations, penned by some of the greatest names in rabbinic literature. …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashi
1) Old Testament
“Riches do not profit in the day of wrath, But righteousness [including charity/alms] delivers from death.” (Proverbs 11:4, NKJV)
Context Note: Charity is said to deliver in comparison to the Death possibly referring to the “Second Death” on the “Day of Wrath” (please read carefully to see this). Perhaps that’s a reason why St. Ambrose of Milan wrote this:
“… Our Saviour has appointed two kinds of resurrection, in accordance with which John says, in the Apocalypse, “Blessed is he that hath part in the first resurrection”; for such come to grace without the judgment. As for those who do not come to the first, but are reserved until the second resurrection, these shall be burnt, until they fulfill their appointed times, between the first and the second resurrection; or, if they should not have fulfilled them then, they shall remain still longer in punishment … ‘ – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD) …”
Source: https://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Ambrose
2) Judaism
“… Ten powerful things were created in the world: mountains are hard, but iron cuts through them; iron is hard, but fire melts it; fire is strong, but water extinguishes it; water is strong, but clouds bear it; clouds are strong, but wind scatters them; wind is strong, but the body contains it; the body is strong, bur fear breaks it; fear is potent, but wine dispels it; wine is powerful, but sleep assuages it; and stronger than all these is death. But charity delivers from death. … ” – The Talmud
Source: https://www.chabad.org/parshah/in-depth/plainbody_cdo/aid/1262744
3) St. Polycarp
“… When you can do good, defer it not, because “alms delivers from death.” …” – Blessed St. Polycarp, Bishop of Smryna, an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of the Blessed St. John the Apostle who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 69 AD – c. 155 A, Chapter X, Epistle to the Philippians)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/polycarp-roberts.html
4) The Didache or the Teaching of the Twelve Apostles to the Nations
The Didache affirms this doctrine of charity/alms giving being a ‘ransom for your sins’, to quote:
“… If you have anything, through your hands you shall give ransom for your sins. …” – The Didache
Here is that quote in full:
“… Be not a stretcher forth of the hands to receive and a drawer of them back to give. If you have anything, through your hands you shall give ransom for your sins. Do not hesitate to give, nor complain when you give; for you shall know who is the good repayer of the hire. Do not turn away from him who is in want; rather, share all things with your brother, and do not say that they are your own. …” – The Didache or the Teaching of the Twelve Apostles to the Nations (Chapter 4)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/didache-roberts.html
How Reliable is the Didache and why is it not in the Bible then?
To quote:
“… The Didache is considered part of the group of second-generation Christian writings known as the Apostolic Fathers. The work was considered by some Church Fathers to be a part of the New Testament,[6][7][8] while being rejected by others as spurious or non-canonical,[9][10][11] In the end, it was not accepted into the New Testament canon. However, the Ethiopian Orthodox Church “broader canon” includes the Didascalia, a work which draws on the Didache. Lost for centuries, a Greek manuscript of the Didache was rediscovered in 1873 by Philotheos Bryennios, Metropolitan of Nicomedia, in the Codex Hierosolymitanus. A Latin version of the first five chapters was discovered in 1900 by J. Schlecht. …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Didache
And
“… One of the most important sources from the age of the Apostolic Fathers is “The Lord’s Teaching through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations,” commonly referred to by its short name, the Didache (Greek for “teaching”). While the Didache was lost until the mid-19th century, it was known to and quoted by the Fathers Clement of Alexandria, Origen, and St. Athanasius, the latter of whom recommended it for the instruction of catechumens. Indeed, the importance of the Didache is such that some of the Fathers considered it part of the New Testament, though ultimately it was not included in the canon. The author of the Didache does not give his name; the title should not be seen as a claim to authorship by the Twelve themselves, but as an indication that it passes down what they taught. …”
Source:
https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/church-fathers-didache-and-epistle-barnabas/
An Important Comment: Lord Jesus Christ Himself Affirms this Conversion of Riches to Charity
“19“Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; 20but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.” – God in Flesh, Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 6:19 – 21, NKJV)
“But SEEK HIS KINGDOM, and THESE THINGS will be ADDED to you. “Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has chosen gladly to give you the kingdom. “SELL YOUR POSSESSIONS and GIVE TO CHARITY; make yourselves money belts which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near nor moth destroys. “For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.” – The Perfect Selfless One Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:31 – 34, NASB)
“So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.” – King of the Heavens, Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:21, NASB)
5) Scripture of Tobit
The Bible Book of Tobit affirms this Doctrine of Almsgiving which delivers from Death as a compensation of your sins in some way as this Secret was Revealed by Blessed Archangel Raphael himself (Raphael means ‘God Who Heals’), to quote:
i) It Saves/Keeps a person away from ‘Hell’ or the ‘Dark World of the Dead’
“7 Give generously to anyone who faithfully obeys God.[a] If you are stingy in giving to the poor, God will be stingy in giving to you. 8 Give according to what you have. The more you have, the more you should give. Even if you have only a little, be sure to give something. 9 This is as good as money saved. You will have your reward in a time of trouble. 10-11 Taking care of the poor is the kind of offering that pleases God in heaven. Do this, and you will be kept safe from the dark world of the dead.” (Good News Translation, Tobit 4:7 – 11)
Source: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Tobit+4&version=GNT
or from another translation below:
“7 Give alms out of thy substance, and turn not away thy face from any poor person:
for so it shall come to pass that the face of the Lord shall not be turned from thee.
8 According to thy ability be merciful.
9 If thou have much give abundantly: if thou have a little, take care even so to bestow willingly a little.
10 For thus thou storest up to thyself a good reward for the day of necessity.
11 For alms deliver from all sin, and from death, and will not suffer the soul to go into darkness.
12 Alms shall be a great confidence before the most high God, to all them that give it.”
(Bible Scripture.Net Translation, Tobit 4:7 – 12)
Source: https://biblescripture.net/Tobias.html
or in another translation:
“6 Then he said to them secretly: Bless ye the God of heaven, give glory to him in the sight of all that live, because he hath shewn his mercy to you. 7 For it is good to hide the secret of a king: but honourable to reveal and confess the works of God. 8 Prayer is good with fasting and alms more than to lay up treasures of gold: 9 For alms delivereth from death, and the same is that which purgeth away sins, and maketh to find mercy and life everlasting. … 15 For I am the angel Raphael, one of the seven who stand before the Lord.” (Bible Scripture.Net Translation, Tobit 12:6 – 9, 15)
Source: https://biblescripture.net/Tobias.html
Is the Book of Tobit Canonical Scripture? It was in entire First Christianity till Martin Luther removed it for the Protestants following after Judaism, to quote:
“… The Book of Tobit (/ˈtoʊbɪt/)[a] is a book of scripture that is part of the Catholic and Orthodox biblical canons. It was recognized as canonical by the Council of Hippo (in 393), the Councils of Carthage of 397 and 417, and the Council of Florence (in 1442), and confirmed in the Counter-Reformation by the Council of Trent (1546). It is not found in Protestant or Jewish biblical canons. Augustine[9] (c. 397 AD) and Pope Innocent I[10] (405 AD) affirmed Tobit as part of the Old Testament Canon. Athanasius (367 AD) mentioned that certain other books, including the book of Tobit, while not being part of the Canon, “were appointed by the Fathers to be read”.[11] According to Rufinus of Aquileia (c. 400 AD) the book of Tobit and other deuterocanonical books were not called Canonical but Ecclesiastical books.[12]
Article VI of the Thirty-Nine Articles of the Church of England lists it as a book of the “Apocrypha“.[13] Protestants regard Tobit as apocryphal because it was not included in the Tanakh nor considered canonical by Judaism. …” – Wikipedia (Book of Tobit)
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Tobit
Note: Its contents are true regardless if it is canonical or not and since most of First Christianity has accepted it a Scripture, it must be so, right? Judaism quotes this almsgiving truth without considering the Book of Tobit as Canonical proving this Doctrine true regardless as seen next.
6) Second Death Mystery
“For the wages of sin is [Second] death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.” (Romans 6:23, NKJV)
Now if Romans 6:23’s “Death” is assumed to refer to the ‘Second Death’ by most Christians, then Proverbs 11:4 must also refer likewise too because the ‘first death’ (or earthly death happens not just to the wicked but also to the righteous while the ‘Second Death’ applies to anyone who is not of the First Resurrection as Blessed Archbishop Ambrose has commented prior, see Revelation 20:4 – 6 & John 5:24 too). So, if this “Death” refers to the “Second Death”, please consider again these Verses and Authoritative Quotes from our discussion prior:
“Riches do not profit in the day of wrath, But righteousness [including charity/alms] delivers from [Second] death.” (Proverbs 11:4, NKJV)
“… Riches will not avail on the Day of wrath, but charity will save from [Second] death. …” – Rashi
“… and stronger than all these is death. But charity delivers from [Second] death. … ” – The Talmud
“… When you can do good, defer it not, because “alms delivers from [Second] death.” …” – Blessed St. Polycarp
“Taking care of the poor is the kind of offering that pleases God in heaven. Do this, and you will be kept safe from the dark world of the dead.” (Good News Translation, Tobit 4:10 – 11)
“9 Such generosity will save you from [Second] death and will wash away all your sins. …” (Good News Translation, Tobit 12:9)
Analysis: Gehenna is Revealed as a Metaphor (or analogy) of the Final Lake of Fire or “Second Death” region in Old Testament times itself. To quote:
Example – the Targums
The ancient Aramaic paraphrase-translations of the Hebrew Bible known as Targums supply the term “Gehinnom” frequently to verses touching upon resurrection, judgment, and the fate of the wicked. This may also include addition of the phrase “second death”, as in the final chapter of the Book of Isaiah, where the Hebrew version does not mention either Gehinnom or the Second Death, whereas the Targums add both. In this the Targums are parallel to the Gospel of Mark addition of “Gehenna” to the quotation of the Isaiah verses describing the corpses “where their worm does not die”.
Example – Rabbinical Judaism
The picture of Gehenna as the place of punishment or destruction of the wicked occurs frequently in the Mishnah in Kiddushin 4.14, Avot 1.5; 5.19, 20, Tosefta t. Bereshith 6.15, and Babylonian Talmud b.Rosh Hashanah 16b:7a; b. Bereshith 28b. Gehenna is considered a Purgatory-like place where the wicked go to suffer until they have atoned for their sins. It is stated that the maximum amount of time a sinner can spend in Gehenna is one year. There are also four people who do not get a share in Olam Ha-Ba.[21] Those people are Doeg the Edomite, Ahitophel, Balaam, and Gehazi.
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gehenna
Comment: If their concept of Gehenna is wrong, Christ wouldn’t have mentioned it. But does it mean that Rabbinical Judaism got the facts regarding Gehenna right? The Rabbinical writings contain some truth but they missed some part of it. That’s why when Lord Jesus Christ spoke of Gehenna, He is referring to what they know but corrected their understanding of it and revealed more details as it is Written in New Testament verses.
Here’s an interesting point: Christ never corrected their belief in a Purgatorial Hell (Gehenna) Universalism till the last penny only as He Himself Taught that (as we shall see next) while also regarding Gehenna, Christ never corrected their belief in that the Messiah (Lord Jesus Christ Himself though they did not recognize Him then) will not only be able to Save souls from Hell now (Hades/Sheol) but also from the Final Lake of Fire (Gehenna/Second Death) later, to quote this well known Fact regarding ‘Judaism too’:
(i) What’s the Difference between Gehenna and Sheol (Hades)?
To quote (Page 34):
“Hanhart (1966:32) states that according to Jeremias, however, it is fundamental
for our understanding of the New Testament to make a sharp distinction between Hades
and Gehenna.
Hades is used exclusively for the interim period, Gehenna on the other side
for a state of punishment after the last judgment. In Hades, the punishment is provisional, in Gehenna eternal.”
(ii) Can the Messiah [Lord Jesus Christ] Save from Gehenna (the Final Judgment, Lake of Fire) itself?
To quote (Page 38):
“Bernard (1915:290) quotes two passages from the Bereshith Rabba to show that this idea was prominent in Jewish literature. He is, however, unsure of the dating of the literature.
Nevertheless, it still demonstrates the basic purpose of the descent:
‘When they are bound, they that are in Gehinnom, saw the light of the Messiah, they
rejoiced to receive him’; and ‘This is that which stands written, We shall rejoice and exult thee.
When?
When the captives climb out of hell, and the Shechinah at their head.’
The only difference here is that the captives are in Gehinnom and not Sheol.”
Source for both Quotes are from this phD Dissertation (link below, please read it). Indeed, the phD thesis I referred to may be found in link below:
https://repository.up.ac.za/bitstream/handle/2263/27130/dissertation.pdf?sequence=1
7) Mysterious Great Church Fathers’ Quotes agreeing to this Doctrine
To quote (some quoting the Book of Tobit as Scripture too):
John Chrysostom Homily 7 on John’s gospel (347-407 ad)
But there is another more prevailing way than this; to bear malice against none of those who have offended against us, to forgive their trespasses to all those who have trespassed against us. Will you learn a third? Hear Daniel, saying, “Redeem thy sins by almsdeeds, and thine iniquities by showing mercy to the poor.” (Dan. iv. 27, LXX.) And there is another besides this; constancy in prayer, and persevering attendance on the intercessions made with God. In like manner fasting brings to us some, and that not small comfort and release from sins committed, provided it be attended with kindness to others, and quenches the vehemence of the wrath of God. (1 Tim. ii. 1.) For “water will quench a blazing fire, and by almsdeeds sins are purged away.” (Ecclus. iii. 30, LXX.)
John Chrysostom Homily 4 on Philippians (347-407 ad)
And again, “And let our people also learn to maintain good works.” (Tit. iii. 14.) And again, “These things are good and profitable unto men.” (Tit. iii. 8.) Listen to a certain other one who saith, “Alms do deliver from death” (Tob. xii. 9)
John Chrysostom Homily 21 on Acts ch 9 (347-407 ad)
more sins he has to answer for, the greater need has he of alms, not only for this reason, but because the alms has not the. same virtue now, but far less: for it is not all one to have done it himself, and to have another do it for him; therefore, the virtue being less, let us by quantity make it the greatest. Let us not busy ourselves about monuments, not about memorials. This is the greatest memorial: set widows to stand around him. Tell them his name: bid them all make for him their prayers, their supplications: this will overcome God: though it have not been done by the man himself, yet because of him another is the author of the almsgiving. Even this pertains to the mercy of God: “widows standing around and weeping” know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come. Many have profited even by the alms done by others on their behalf: for even if they have not got perfect be not so.
Note: The quote “…know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come …” by Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD) seems to point to the [Second] Death in light of this Almsgiving Context in his writings especially the phrase “… rescue, not … the present death, but from that which is to come [Second Death] …”.
Jerome Letter 108 par 16 (347-420 ad)
She constantly had on her lips such phrases as these: “Blessed are the merciful for they shall obtain mercy:” and “water will quench a flaming fire; and alms maketh an atonement for sins;” and “make to yourselves friends of the mammon of unrighteousness that … they may receive you into everlasting habitations;” and “give alms … and behold all things are clean unto you;” and Daniel’s words to King Nebuchadnezzar in which he admonished him to redeem his sins by almsgiving.
Augustine Catechising the uninstructed par 22 (354-430 ad)
“… If, however, grief has taken possession of us on account of something in which we ourselves have erred or sinned, we should bear in mind not only that a “broken spirit is a sacrifice to God,” but also the saying, “Like as water quencheth fire, so alms sin;” …” – Blessed St. Augustine of Hippo, Doctor of the Church, who influenced virtually all of subsequent Western philosophy and Catholic theology, as well as a significant amount of Protestant theology (c. 354 AD – c. 430 AD)
Leo the Great Sermon 9 (395-461 ad)
“… Let no one therefore, dearly beloved, flatter himself on any merits of a good life, if works of charity be wanting in him, and let him not trust in the purity of his body, if he be not cleansed by the purification of almsgiving. For “almsgiving wipes out sin,” kills death, and extinguishes the punishment of perpetual fire. (Tobit) …” – Pope Leo I (c. 400 – 10 November 461), also known as Saint Leo the Great, was Bishop of Rome from 29 September 440 and died in 461. Pope Benedict XVI said that Leo’s papacy “…was undoubtedly one of the most important in the Church’s history.”
Source for each well known quote above:
https://practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/2013/07/early-church-fathers-on-almsgiving.html
Conclusion – Did Lord Jesus Christ Speak of Deliverance from the Lake of Fire?
Verses:
“ 22 … But whoever says, ‘You fool!’ shall be in danger of hell [Gehenna] fire. … 25Agree with your adversary quickly, while you are on the way with him, lest your adversary deliver you to the judge, the judge hand you over to the officer, and you be thrown into prison. 26Assuredly, I say to you, you will by no means get out of there till you have paid the last penny.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 5:22, 25 – 26, NKJV)
“49“I came to send fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled! … 57“Yes, and why, even of yourselves, do you not judge what is right? 58When you go with your adversary to the magistrate, make every effort along the way to settle with him, lest he drag you to the judge, the judge deliver you to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison. 59I tell you, you shall not depart from there till you have paid the very last mite.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:49, 57 – 59, NKJV)
In the ancient quote next from First Christianity, The Way of Life vs The Way of Death is Contrasted briefly. It is interesting to note that the context of ‘every man’ who ‘receives’ a giving by a giver but if he lied about it (so, it must refer to a case of a liar/thief who certainly are classified among the ‘wicked’) thus it’s an example of someone in the ‘Way of Death’ who shall indeed be Judged in the “Confinement” (“Prison, Matthew 5:26 or Luke 12:59) but ’till the last penny, not forever’, right? Where as we discussed in previous posts, the “prison” can refer to ‘Hell now’ (or “Hades”, 1 Peter 3:18 – 19) after death for some or it may also refer to the ‘Final Hell’ or the ‘Lake of Fire, Gehenna’ (Revelation 20:11 – 15, Matthew 10:28) for some together with the ‘fallen angels and demons’ (Isaiah 24:21 – 22), right?
To quote:
“… There are two ways, one of life and one of death, but a great difference between the two ways. The way of life, then, is this: First, you shall love God who made you; second, love your neighbor as yourself, and do not do to another what you would not want done to you. And of these sayings the teaching is this: Bless those who curse you, and pray for your enemies, and fast for those who persecute you. For what reward is there for loving those who love you? Do not the Gentiles do the same? But love those who hate you, and you shall not have an enemy. Abstain from fleshly and worldly lusts. If someone strikes your right cheek, turn to him the other also, and you shall be perfect. If someone impresses you for one mile, go with him two. If someone takes your cloak, give him also your coat. If someone takes from you what is yours, ask it not back, for indeed you are not able. Give to every one who asks you, and ask it not back; for the Father wills that to all should be given of our own blessings (free gifts). Happy is he who gives according to the commandment, for he is guiltless. WOE to HIM WHO RECEIVES; for if one receives who has need, he is guiltless; but he who RECEIVES NOT having NEED shall PAY the PENALTY, why he received and for what. And coming into CONFINEMENT, he shall be EXAMINED concerning the THINGS which he HAS DONE, and he shall NOT ESCAPE from THERE until he PAYS back the LAST PENNY. And also concerning this, it has been said, Let your alms sweat in your hands, until you know to whom you should give…” – The Didache, The Lord’s Teaching Through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations. (1st Century, Chapter 1. The Two Ways and the First Commandment)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/didache-roberts.html
Summary – the Context for “Confinement till the last penny” (not forever but a long time into the age/ages, or aeon/aeons) seems to be Stronger for the Final Lake of Fire Context as these Verses mention both an equivalent word meaning “Confined” and “Prison” referring to this Final Judgment
” 21So it will happen in that day, That the LORD will punish the host of heaven on high,
And the kings of the earth on earth. 22They will be gathered together Like prisoners in the dungeon, And will be CONFINED in PRISON; And after many days they will be punished*.” (Isaiah 24:21 – 22, NASB)
*The Word in Hebrew is actually “Visited/Inspected” and not punished but the translator in NASB introduces a bias where he translates thus assuming that the ‘reason for visiting is to punish more’. It has been noted that the ‘reason for inspection after many days (or ages/aeons allegorically referred to here)’ is to check and see whether or not the required change toward Subjection to God by all is achieved or not (as per the Prophecies in Hebrews 2:8, 1 Corinthians 15:24 – 29) making sense of the more accurate translation of the KJV (King James Version for this original word) as follows:
“And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the PRISON, and AFTER MANY DAYS shall they be VISITED.” (Isaiah 24:22, KJV)
FAQ – If one can pay for their own sins, then why need Christ?
Firstly, Christ Himself is the Fire (Hebrews 12:29) and so such one are Saved by Christ. Yes, possibly only the Sin Perishes (Meaning of ‘Eternal Destruction’, 2 Thessalonians 1:9 in Body + Soul Matthew 10:28) and not the sinner who is Saved through Fire in the End (1 Corinthians 3:15):
“… saying, “I have come to set fire to the earth,” [Luke 12:49] not certainly the fire that consumes the goods, but the one that produces the good will, which makes the vases of and from the house of the Lord, consuming the hay and the straw (I Cor. iii. 12ff., 1 Corinthians 3:11 – 15), devouring all the gangue of the age, amassed by worldly pleasure, the work of the flesh that is to perish;… For this reason perhaps the Lord will come into the fire (see Is., LXVI, 15; 16): to consume all the vices at the moment of the resurrection, to fill by his presence the desires of each one, and to project the light on merits and mysteries…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:49 – 50, highlighted)
and
“… Likewise here: either the wrong is redeemed at the price of charity, or the punishment diminished according to the appreciation of the wrong. Now it is the custom, as we remember, to give a bath to the baths: by presenting it, everyone obtains the faculty of bathing there; so, here, to be purified, because the sin of each is purified by the kind of transaction described above. On the other hand, the guilty person is tortured and tortured as long as he has not served the sentence of the error committed…” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Commentary on Luke XII, Verses Luke 12:58 – 59, highlighted)
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-12
An Additional Comment: Many Protestants may not feel comfortable with the phrase “… whatever the mode of payment, of it is by the compensation of charity and other works, or by some satisfaction, that the penalty of sin is extinguished…” as they claim that it Makes Void the Work of Christ.
Please notice that the Work of Christ is toward the ‘Making Alive’ which applies to All Men eventually (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 23) but the afterlife Judgment part is excluded for Christians (John 5:24) because they are already Baptized with His Holy Spirit on Earth itself Who Consumes all sin and Vanity (Hebrews 12;8) and hence the Rest of Mankind are Baptized in His Fire (Mark 9:49, Hebrews 12:29) either in Hades or Lake of Fire which is more painful but may be Saved thereafter in the End (1 Corinthians 3:15).
“… and once more, “If I be lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men unto Me [John 12:32].” The Word therefore did dwell in flesh, for “Wisdom built herself an house.” The Word raised up again His own temple on the third day, when it had been destroyed by the Jews fighting against Christ. The Word, when His flesh was lifted up, after the manner of the brazen serpent in the wilderness [John 3:14], drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation [John 12:32]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Smyrnaeans, Chapter II)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-smyrnaeans-longer.html
Please notice carefully that St. Ignatius mentions that this ‘Drawing of All [Men]’ by Christ in John 12:32 results in the Final Salvation of ‘All Men’, in his words, “… drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation…” as Stated in a past tense Prophetically as a Done Reality to Him.
Last but not least, Please also notice ‘carefully’ how St. Justin Martyr distinguishes the Church as One Body vs the Wicked converted as ‘One Child’ as two different entities as follows:
“…We have preached before Him as if [He were] a child, as if a root in a dry ground.’ (And what follows in order of the prophecy already quoted.) But when the passage speaks as from the lips of many, ‘We have preached before Him,’ and adds, ‘as if a child,’ it signifies that the wicked shall become subject to Him, and shall obey His command, and that all shall become as one child … and of those things which would also be done by Christ Himself …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER XLI & CHAPTER XLII, ‘Dialogue with Trypho’)
“… Such a thing as you may witness in the body: although the members are enumerated as many, all are called one, and are a body. For, indeed, a commonwealth and a church, though many individuals in number, are in fact as one, called and addressed by one appellation … of those who it was foreknown were to believe in Him,…” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER XLI & CHAPTER XLII, ‘Dialogue with Trypho’)
Source for both quotes above:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
Peace to you
Sadhu Sundar Singh – a Christian Universalist Confirmed in Heaven by Dr DGS Dhinakaran
Where?
Please read the quoted page in image authored by Dr. DGS Dhinakaran himself in his famous book claiming multiple visits to heaven via the Power of the Holy Spirit (Page 101 in this printout) calling Sadhu Sundar Singh as the ‘Great and Acclaimed Saint of India’.
1) Who was Sadhu Sundar Singh?
Link: http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Sadhu_Sundar_Singh
2) Who was Dr. DGS Dhinakaran?
Link: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/D._G._S._Dhinakaran
3) Was Sadhu Sundar Singh a Christian Universalist?
Sadhu Sundar Singh was clearly a Christian Universalist who believed these aspects which agree especially with both the ‘Shepherd of Hermas Scripture’ and ‘Apocalypse of Peter Scripture’ as these were both found in the First Bibles of Christianity (i. e. The ‘Muratorian Canon or Roman Canon’ in the West and the ‘Codex Claromontanus’ in the East) as discussed in previous posts, example in the ones below:
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/sadhu-sundar-singh-a-christian-universalist/amp/
Conclusion – Examples of Christ Centered Universalism Quotes by Sadhu Sundar singh
“… DEATH OF A PHILOSOPHER … The soul of a German philosopher entered into the world of spirits and saw from afar the incomparable glory of the spiritual world, and the boundless happiness of its people. He was delighted with what he saw, but his stubborn intellectualism stood in the way of his entering into it, and enjoying its happiness. Instead of admitting that it was real, he argued thus with himself, “There is no doubt at all that I see all this, but what proof is there that it has objective existence, and is not some illusion conjured up by my mind? From end to end of all this scene I will apply the tests of logic, philosophy and science, and then only will I be convinced that it has a reality of its own, and is no illusion.” … . I asked one of the angels what the end of this man would be, and he replied “If this man’s life had been altogether bad, then he would at once have joined the spirits of darkness, but he is not without a moral sense, so for a very long time he will wander blindly round in the dim light of the lower parts of the intermediate state, and keep on bumping his philosophical head, until tired of his foolishness, he repents. Then he will be ready to receive the necessary instruction from the angels appointed for that purpose, and, when instructed, will he be fit to enter into the fuller light of God in the higher sphere…” – Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh
Source [Translated by Rev. T. E. Riddle of the New Zealand Presbyterian Mission, Kharar, Punjab, from Urdu into English, c. 1926]:
https://reluctant-messenger.com/sadhu-sundar-singh.htm
A sincerely wrong non-Christian Idolater who has a reasonably sound moral compass may have a chance in the Spirit World even now too if he doesn’t hold too strongly to his false beliefs, to quote:
“… THE MANIFESTATION OF CHRIST … I saw in a vision the spirit of an idolater on reaching the world of spirits begin at once to search for his god. Then the saints said to him, “There is no god here save the One True God, and Christ, who is His manifestation.” At this, the man was a good deal astonished, but being a sincere seeker after truth, he frankly admitted that he had been in error. He eagerly sought to know the correct view of truth, and asked if he might see the Christ. Shortly after this Christ manifested Himself in a dim light to him, and to others who had newly arrived in the world of spirits, because at this stage they could not have endured a full exhibition of His glory, for His glory is so surpassing that even the angels look on Him with difficulty, and cover their faces with their wings (Isaiah 6:9). When He does reveal Himself to any one He takes into account the particular stage of progress to which that soul has attained, so He appears dimly, or in the fuller light of His glory, that the sight of Him may be endured. So, when these spirits saw Christ in this dim but attractive light, they were filled with a joy and peace, which is beyond our power to describe. Bathed in the rays of His life-giving light, and with the waves of His love, which constantly flow out from Him, flowing over them, all their error was washed away. Then with all their hearts, they acknowledged Him as the Truth, and found healing, and, bowing in lowly adoration before Him, thanked and praised Him. And the saints, who had been appointed for their instruction; also rejoiced over them. …” – Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh
Source [Translated by Rev. T. E. Riddle of the New Zealand Presbyterian Mission, Kharar, Punjab, from Urdu into English, c. 1926]:
https://reluctant-messenger.com/sadhu-sundar-singh.htm
(Question #3) Did the Sadhu think there was eternal punishment? — “There was punishment, but it was not eternal…Everyone after this life would be given a fair chance of making good, and attaining to the measure of fullness the soul was capable of. This might sometimes take ages.” – Sadhu Sundar Singh
Few Christians know that Sundar was not afraid to raise his voice in favor of “universalism.” He could never deny to all non-Christians the possibility of entering heaven.
In 1925 Sundar wrote, “If the Divine spark in the soul cannot be destroyed, then we need despair of no sinner… Since God created men to have fellowship with Himself, they cannot for ever be separated from Him… After long wandering, and by devious paths, sinful man will at last return to Him in whose Image he was created; for this is his final destiny.”
Source: https://www.tentmaker.org/biographies/singh.htm
2 Samuel 14:14 in a few translations
New American Standard Bible
“For we will surely die and are like water spilled on the ground which cannot be gathered up again. Yet God does not take away life, but plans ways so that the banished one will not be cast out from him.
New King James Version
For we will surely die and become like water spilled on the ground, which cannot be gathered up again. Yet God does not take away a life; but He devises means, so that His banished ones are not expelled from Him.
Christian Standard Bible
We will certainly die and be like water poured out on the ground, which can’t be recovered. But God would not take away a life; he would devise plans so that the one banished from him does not remain banished.
Peace to you
Almsgiving Mystery – First Christianity
The Didache or the Teaching of the Twelve Apostles to the Nations
The Didache affirms this doctrine of charity/alms giving being a ‘ransom for your sins’, to quote:
“… If you have anything, through your hands you shall give ransom for your sins. …” – The Didache
Here is that quote in full:
“… Be not a stretcher forth of the hands to receive and a drawer of them back to give. If you have anything, through your hands you shall give ransom for your sins. Do not hesitate to give, nor complain when you give; for you shall know who is the good repayer of the hire. Do not turn away from him who is in want; rather, share all things with your brother, and do not say that they are your own. …” – The Didache or the Teaching of the Twelve Apostles to the Nations (Chapter 4)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/didache-roberts.html
How Reliable is the Didache and why is it not in the Bible then?
To quote:
“… The Didache is considered part of the group of second-generation Christian writings known as the Apostolic Fathers. The work was considered by some Church Fathers to be a part of the New Testament,[6][7][8] while being rejected by others as spurious or non-canonical,[9][10][11] In the end, it was not accepted into the New Testament canon. However, the Ethiopian Orthodox Church “broader canon” includes the Didascalia, a work which draws on the Didache. Lost for centuries, a Greek manuscript of the Didache was rediscovered in 1873 by Philotheos Bryennios, Metropolitan of Nicomedia, in the Codex Hierosolymitanus. A Latin version of the first five chapters was discovered in 1900 by J. Schlecht. …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Didache
And
“… One of the most important sources from the age of the Apostolic Fathers is “The Lord’s Teaching through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations,” commonly referred to by its short name, the Didache (Greek for “teaching”). While the Didache was lost until the mid-19th century, it was known to and quoted by the Fathers Clement of Alexandria, Origen, and St. Athanasius, the latter of whom recommended it for the instruction of catechumens. Indeed, the importance of the Didache is such that some of the Fathers considered it part of the New Testament, though ultimately it was not included in the canon. The author of the Didache does not give his name; the title should not be seen as a claim to authorship by the Twelve themselves, but as an indication that it passes down what they taught. …”
Source:
https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/church-fathers-didache-and-epistle-barnabas/
1) Scripture of Tobit
The Bible Book of Tobit affirms this Doctrine of Almsgiving which delivers from Death as a compensation of your sins in some way as this Secret was Revealed by Blessed Archangel Raphael himself (Raphael means ‘God Who Heals’), to quote:
“7 Give generously to anyone who faithfully obeys God.[a] If you are stingy in giving to the poor, God will be stingy in giving to you. 8 Give according to what you have. The more you have, the more you should give. Even if you have only a little, be sure to give something. 9 This is as good as money saved. You will have your reward in a time of trouble. 10-11 Taking care of the poor is the kind of offering that pleases God in heaven. Do this, and you will be kept safe from the dark world of the dead.” (Good News Translation, Tobit 4:7 – 11)
Source: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Tobit+4&version=GNT
or from another translation below:
“7 Give alms out of thy substance, and turn not away thy face from any poor person:
for so it shall come to pass that the face of the Lord shall not be turned from thee.
8 According to thy ability be merciful.
9 If thou have much give abundantly: if thou have a little, take care even so to bestow willingly a little.
10 For thus thou storest up to thyself a good reward for the day of necessity.
11 For alms deliver from all sin, and from death, and will not suffer the soul to go into darkness.
12 Alms shall be a great confidence before the most high God, to all them that give it.”
(Bible Scripture.Net Translation, Tobit 4:7 – 12)
Source: https://biblescripture.net/Tobias.html
“7 It’s a good idea to keep a king’s secret, but what God does should be told everywhere, so that he may be praised and honored. If you do good, no harm will come to you.8 It is better to pray sincerely and to please God by helping the poor than to be rich and dishonest. It is better to give to the poor than to store up gold. 9 Such generosity will save you from death and will wash away all your sins. … 15 I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand in the glorious presence of the Lord, ready to serve him.” (Good News Translation, Tobit 12:7 – 9, 15)
Source: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Tobit+12&version=GNT
or in another translation:
“6 Then he said to them secretly: Bless ye the God of heaven, give glory to him in the sight of all that live, because he hath shewn his mercy to you. 7 For it is good to hide the secret of a king: but honourable to reveal and confess the works of God. 8 Prayer is good with fasting and alms more than to lay up treasures of gold: 9 For alms delivereth from death, and the same is that which purgeth away sins, and maketh to find mercy and life everlasting. … 15 For I am the angel Raphael, one of the seven who stand before the Lord.” (Bible Scripture.Net Translation, Tobit 12:6 – 9, 15)
Source: https://biblescripture.net/Tobias.html
Is the Book of Tobit Canonical Scripture? It was in entire First Christianity till Martin Luther removed it for the Protestants following after Judaism, to quote:
“… The Book of Tobit (/ˈtoʊbɪt/)[a] is a book of scripture that is part of the Catholic and Orthodox biblical canons. It was recognized as canonical by the Council of Hippo (in 393), the Councils of Carthage of 397 and 417, and the Council of Florence (in 1442), and confirmed in the Counter-Reformation by the Council of Trent (1546). It is not found in Protestant or Jewish biblical canons. Augustine[9] (c. 397 AD) and Pope Innocent I[10] (405 AD) affirmed Tobit as part of the Old Testament Canon. Athanasius (367 AD) mentioned that certain other books, including the book of Tobit, while not being part of the Canon, “were appointed by the Fathers to be read”.[11] According to Rufinus of Aquileia (c. 400 AD) the book of Tobit and other deuterocanonical books were not called Canonical but Ecclesiastical books.[12] Article VI of the Thirty-Nine Articles of the Church of England lists it as a book of the “Apocrypha”.[13] Protestants regard Tobit as apocryphal because it was not included in the Tanakh nor considered canonical by Judaism. …” – Wikipedia (Book of Tobit)
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Tobit
Note: Its contents are true regardless if it is canonical or not and since most of First Christianity has accepted it a Scripture, it must be so, right? Judaism quotes this almsgiving truth without considering the Book of Tobit as Canonical proving this Doctrine true regardless as seen next.
2) Second Death Mystery
“For the wages of sin is [Second] death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.” (Romans 6:23, NKJV)
Now if Romans 6:23’s “Death” is assumed to refer to the ‘Second Death’ by most Christians, then Proverbs 11:4 must also refer likewise too because the ‘first death’ (or earthly death happens not just to the wicked but also to the righteous while the ‘Second Death’ applies to anyone who is not of the First Resurrection as Blessed Archbishop Ambrose has commented prior, see Revelation 20:4 – 6 & John 5:24 too). So, if this “Death” refers to the “Second Death”, please consider again these Verses and Authoritative Quotes from our discussion prior (link below):
“Riches do not profit in the day of wrath, But righteousness [including charity/alms] delivers from [Second] death.” (Proverbs 11:4, NKJV)
“… Riches will not avail on the Day of wrath, but charity will save from [Second] death. …” – Rashi
“… and stronger than all these is death. But charity delivers from [Second] death. … ” – The Talmud
“… When you can do good, defer it not, because “alms delivers from [Second] death.” …” – Blessed St. Polycarp
“… If you have anything, through your hands you shall give ransom for your sins. …” – The Didache
“Taking care of the poor is the kind of offering that pleases God in heaven. Do this, and you will be kept safe from the dark world of the dead.” (Good News Translation, Tobit 4:10 – 11)
“9 Such generosity will save you from [Second] death and will wash away all your sins. …” (Good News Translation, Tobit 12:9)
3) Mysterious Great Church Fathers’ Quotes agreeing to this Doctrine
To quote (some quoting the Book of Tobit as Scripture too):
John Chrysostom Homily 7 on John’s gospel (347-407 ad)
But there is another more prevailing way than this; to bear malice against none of those who have offended against us, to forgive their trespasses to all those who have trespassed against us. Will you learn a third? Hear Daniel, saying, “Redeem thy sins by almsdeeds, and thine iniquities by showing mercy to the poor.” (Dan. iv. 27, LXX.) And there is another besides this; constancy in prayer, and persevering attendance on the intercessions made with God. In like manner fasting brings to us some, and that not small comfort and release from sins committed, provided it be attended with kindness to others, and quenches the vehemence of the wrath of God. (1 Tim. ii. 1.) For “water will quench a blazing fire, and by almsdeeds sins are purged away.” (Ecclus. iii. 30, LXX.)
John Chrysostom Homily 4 on Philippians (347-407 ad)
And again, “And let our people also learn to maintain good works.” (Tit. iii. 14.) And again, “These things are good and profitable unto men.” (Tit. iii. 8.) Listen to a certain other one who saith, “Alms do deliver from death” (Tob. xii. 9)
John Chrysostom Homily 21 on Acts ch 9 (347-407 ad)
more sins he has to answer for, the greater need has he of alms, not only for this reason, but because the alms has not the. same virtue now, but far less: for it is not all one to have done it himself, and to have another do it for him; therefore, the virtue being less, let us by quantity make it the greatest. Let us not busy ourselves about monuments, not about memorials. This is the greatest memorial: set widows to stand around him. Tell them his name: bid them all make for him their prayers, their supplications: this will overcome God: though it have not been done by the man himself, yet because of him another is the author of the almsgiving. Even this pertains to the mercy of God: “widows standing around and weeping” know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come. Many have profited even by the alms done by others on their behalf: for even if they have not got perfect be not so.
Note: The quote “…know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come …” by Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD) seems to point to the [Second] Death in light of this Almsgiving Context in his writings especially the phrase “… rescue, not … the present death, but from that which is to come [Second Death] …”.
Jerome Letter 108 par 16 (347-420 ad)
She constantly had on her lips such phrases as these: “Blessed are the merciful for they shall obtain mercy:” and “water will quench a flaming fire; and alms maketh an atonement for sins;” and “make to yourselves friends of the mammon of unrighteousness that … they may receive you into everlasting habitations;” and “give alms … and behold all things are clean unto you;” and Daniel’s words to King Nebuchadnezzar in which he admonished him to redeem his sins by almsgiving.
Augustine Catechising the uninstructed par 22 (354-430 ad)
“… If, however, grief has taken possession of us on account of something in which we ourselves have erred or sinned, we should bear in mind not only that a “broken spirit is a sacrifice to God,” but also the saying, “Like as water quencheth fire, so alms sin;” …” – Blessed St. Augustine of Hippo, Doctor of the Church, who influenced virtually all of subsequent Western philosophy and Catholic theology, as well as a significant amount of Protestant theology (c. 354 AD – c. 430 AD)
Leo the Great Sermon 9 (395-461 ad)
“… Let no one therefore, dearly beloved, flatter himself on any merits of a good life, if works of charity be wanting in him, and let him not trust in the purity of his body, if he be not cleansed by the purification of almsgiving. For “almsgiving wipes out sin,” kills death, and extinguishes the punishment of perpetual fire. (Tobit) …” – Pope Leo I (c. 400 – 10 November 461), also known as Saint Leo the Great, was Bishop of Rome from 29 September 440 and died in 461. Pope Benedict XVI said that Leo’s papacy “…was undoubtedly one of the most important in the Church’s history.”
Source for each well known quote above:
https://practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/2013/07/early-church-fathers-on-almsgiving.html
Peace to you
Spirit World Hope – Prayer for the Dead Mystery
“57“And why do you not even on your own initiative judge what is right? 58“For while you are going with your opponent to appear before the magistrate, on your way there make an effort to settle with him, so that he may not drag you before the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison. 59“I say to you, you will not get out of there until you have paid the very last cent.” – Most Blessed God in Flesh, Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:57 – 59, NASB)
Here are some interesting First Christianity Facts
1) The person who prays for the Dead must be noble enough through Almsgiving Practice First
Verses*:
“41All men therefore praising the Lord, the righteous Judge, who had opened the things that were hid, 42Betook themselves unto prayer, and besought him that the sin committed might wholly be put out of remembrance. Besides, that noble Judas [Maccabees] exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forsomuch as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for the sins of those that were slain. 43And when he had made a gathering throughout the company to the sum of two thousand drachms of silver, he sent it to Jerusalem to offer a sin offering, doing therein very well and honestly, in that he was mindful of the resurrection: 44For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should have risen again, it had been superfluous and vain to pray for the dead. 45And also in that he perceived that there was great favour laid up for those that died godly, it was an holy and good thought. Whereupon he made a reconciliation for the dead, that they might be delivered from sin.” (2 Maccabees 12:41 – 45, the Original King James Bible)
Source: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/2-Maccabees-Chapter-12/
2) Why does a person who prays for the dead to be Saved in the Spirit World needs to be especially Noble in Almsgiving Acts?
” …. Why, here is a man who has lost all the labor of a whole life: not one day has he lived for himself, but to luxury, to debauchery, to covetousness, to sin, to the devil. Then, say, shall we not bewail this man? shall we not try to snatch him from his perils? For it is, yes, it is possible, if we will, to mitigate his punishment, if we make continual prayers for him, if for him we give alms. However unworthy he may be, God will yield to our importunity. For if Paul showed mercy on one (who had no claims on his mercy), and for the sake of others spared one (whom he would not have spared), much more is it right for us to do this. …” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD, Homily 21 on Acts ch 9)
Source:
https://practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/2013/07/early-church-fathers-on-almsgiving.html?m=1
3) Does this Hope of Prayer for the Dead is only for fallen-Christians or non-Christians too?
Both and to Practice it is called a ‘Sacred Doctrine’ in the Ancient First Christian Churches, to quote:
“… 7,1 And then, as to NAMING THE DEAD, what could be MORE HELPFUL? What could be MORE OPPORTUNE or WONDERFUL than that the living believe that the departed are alive and have not ceased to be but exist, and live with the Lord — (2) and that the MOST SACRED DOCTRINE should declare that there is HOPE for those who PRAY for their brethren as though they were off on a journey? 7,3 And even though the PRAYER WE OFFER FOR THEM cannot root out all their faults — [how could it], since we often slip in this world, inadvertently and deliberately — it is still useful as an indication of something more perfect. (4) For we COMMEMORATE BOTH RIGHTEOUS and SINNERS. Though we PRAY for SINNERS , for GOD’S MERCY 19 and for the righteous, fathers, the patriarchs, prophets, apostles, evangelists, martyrs and confessors, for bishops and anchorites and the whole band [of saints], 20 (5) we worship our Lord Jesus Christ to distinguish him from the whole of humanity by our honor of him, remembering that the Lord is not on a level with any man — even though each man has < performed > a million righteous deeds and more. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘Aerians’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.6, Pages 509 – 510)
Source:
Conclusion – Is there Scripture* Level Revelation that afterlife Salvation is Possible into Lower Abodes?
Yes, How is this possible?
Context = Definition of Saved
Saved = Part of the Tower of Repentance = Being His Church /Bride
Not Saved = not His Church = have not Salvation (referring to ‘not’ being part of the First Resurrection Revelation 20:4 – 6 when He Returns, Matthew 7:21 – 23) but may be saved post-Judgment into ‘lower afterlife abodes’ especially if they were ‘sinners’ who participated in the righteous Word before backsliding. Yes, these same rejected unsaved stones are said to be saved in another place more humble eventually, to quote:
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
Can you see it?
Here is the Definition Class of the non-Christians (i.e. those unbaptized but wished to be Baptized when they heard the Gospel but changed their mind & returned to their former ways):
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
a Non-Elect Salvation Hope?
“… Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. …” – Shepherd of Hermas above if they Repent during “Hell Judgment in the afterlife” but cannot be part of the ‘Elect’ (or Tower of Repentance type of Salvation) but only “… in another and much inferior place they will be laid …”.
Thus, in the Context of this “others” or non-Christians, the phrase “because they participated in the Righteous Word;” (if applicable for argument’s sake) may thus refer to them Practicing any Good Works or Good Way of Life which Corresponds to the Law of God Found in the Gospels. This Context of such “good non-Christians” being Saved in the Spirit World after their Judgment as per the Visions of Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh agree Perfectly as such a chance seems to only be given to those who had a ‘relatively good moral compass’ in life of which the measure can only be determined Fairly by our Most Perfect Saviour. Please remember that the Shepherd of Hermas Writing is Scripture and thus it is Infallible giving this Hope, right?
*The fact that 2 Maccabees or even the Shepherd of Hermas quoted later being “Scripture” in First Christianity is discussed further with proof quotes in link below:
P/S i: Empirical Spirit World Evidence in First Christianity
The interesting real reliable example of Emperor Trajan (a wicked non-Christian Murderer, Pagan & Unbaptized, Unbeliever) being Saved from Hell after such Propitiatory Prayers by Pope St. Gregory the Great is not a hoax but Truth, to quote:
“… On a time Saint Gregory went by the market of Rome which is called the market of Trajan, and then he remembered of the justice and other good deeds of Trajan, and how he had been piteous and debonair, and was much sorrowful that he had been a pagan, and he turned to the church of Saint Peter wailing for the horror of the miscreance of Trajan. Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …” (The Life of St. Gregory the Pope)
Source https://classicalchristianity.com/2012/02/06/st-gregory-the-dialogist-and-emperor-trajan/
Note: The additional comment in the link above (added by others and not Uttered by God during that Vision/Revelation to Pope St. Gregory the Great but commentators) reads next as follows [Please notice the phrase ‘as some say’ carefully in the below]: “… By this, as some say, the pain perpetual due to Trajan as a miscreant was some deal taken away, but for all that was not he quit from the prison of hell, for the soul may well be in hell and feel there no pain by the mercy of God. …”
The Truth is as Hieromonk Ambrose mentioned earlier, God only said this part to Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great:
“… Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …”
Can you see it? This is exactly what the Final Prophecy of the Salvation from the Lake of Fire as described in the Apocalypse of Peter Prophecy by Lord Jesus Christ after the Righteous (Christians) Pray to Him to save the ‘damned’ from their ‘everlasting punishments’ will be answered eventually & the First Oldest Christian Canon called the Muratorian Canon lists this Book as “Scripture” too as discussed in Previous Posts.
P/S ii: Will majority of mankind (not all) be Saved via Purgatorial Hell now itself in this manner?
How did First Christianity understand Matthew 26:28’s Ransom for Many and not for all?
“… QUESTION 54. THE APOSTLE TEACHES THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED FOR ALL MEN. “ALL ARE THEREFORE DEAD,” SAID HE, “AND HE DIED FOR ALL.” THE SAVIOR SAYS, ON THE CONTRARY: THE SON OF MAN HAS COME TO GIVE HIS LIFE FOR THE REDEMPTION OF MANY. (MATT 20:28) THERE IS HERE A CONTRADICTION. — The words are different, it is true, but the meaning is the same; at other times, on the other hand, words that seem the same have quite a different meaning, such as these: “All that is not done in good faith (ex fide) is a sin.” (Rom. 14:23) and these others: “The law does not come from faith,” (Gal. 3:12) although the law is not a sin. This great number of which the Savior speaks is all the men of whom St. Paul speaks: They are in great numbers, because the greater part of all peoples and all nations ought to believe in the Savior. It is this great number of those who must believe that the Apostle calls all men. “He is dead for all,” he says, “that is, for those who believe and must believe.” He died also for those who refused to believe, but by refusing the grace he offers them, they do not want Jesus Christ to be dead for them, and by the same he seems not to have died for those to that his death was much more harmful than useful. On the contrary, he truly died for those who won, and who understand the mystery of the redemption give thanks to God through our Lord Jesus Christ. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source:
i.1. Majority of Mankind is the “Many” who will be Saved after believing in Him
” … They are in great numbers, because the greater part of all peoples and all nations ought to believe in the Savior. It is this great number of those who must believe that the Apostle calls all men. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
i.2 How can this be when most of mankind don’t believe him on earth?
“… “He is dead for all,” he says, “that is, for those who believe and must believe.” …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
Where,
“those who believe” = Christians who believe in Him on earth (Sheepfold1) = the “few” , the Elect (Matthew 7:14)
and
“for those who … must believe” = Good non-Christians who believe in Him either in Hades now or by the Last Day on Judgment Day? (Sheepfold2) . We will explore this Mystery later using Ambrosiaster’s own words to try to understand why he made such a distinction as he might be referring to God’s Will which is inclusive of anyone who chooses to believe in Him literally ‘after seeing Him’ (John 6:40) as even the Visions of Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh has confirmed (example next).
i.3 How about the unbelievers?
“… He died also for those who refused to believe, but by refusing the grace he offers them, they do not want Jesus Christ to be dead for them, and by the same he seems not to have died for those to that his death was much more harmful than useful. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
Comment: This ‘refused to believe’ is not necessarily those who refuse on earth among good non-Christians but those till Judgment Day who refuse to believe. As Sadhu Sundar Singh has pointed out, the ‘wicked dead’ seems not to be able to believe in the afterlife due to their lives sealing them as ‘remaining as unbelievers’ till being cast into the Lake of Fire (Revelation 21:8). Is there Hope for them? Next we will see Ambrosiaster’s other quotes at the end.
To quote:
“… At least, that is the case with the majority, but there are some few personalities, Satan for instance, in regard to whom I was told, ‘Don’t ask about them.’ And so I didn’t like to ask, but I hoped that for them also there was some hope. ‘ ‘ They also told me that the Saints help in the work of saving souls in Hell, because there can be no idleness in Heaven. Those in Hell will ultimately be brought to Heaven like the prodigal son, but with regard to the ultimate fate of a certain number you must not ask.” The Sadhu is inclined to think that perhaps these few will be annihilated. “Once I said, ‘So many people will be lost because they have not heard of Christ.’ They said, ‘The contrary will be the ease ; very few will be lost. ‘ There is a kind of heavenly joke, no, joke is not a good word for it. ‘Very few will be lost but many will be saved. It is so, but don’t tell,’ they said, as it were, in jest, ‘because it will make men careless, and we want them to enjoy the First Heaven — that is the Heaven on earth — as well.’ ” “If there were no hope for all the non-Christians in the world and all the Christians who die in sin, God would stop creating men. We must do our part here on earth to save sinners, but if they refuse we need not be without hope for them. ‘ ‘ The Sadhu’s “universalism” recalls the famous “Shewing” to Mother Juliana of Norwich*, “All manner of things shall be well,” and her comments thereon — except that her respect for the authority of the Church precludes her making any suggestion how this may be possible. 1 The Sadhu faithfully obeys the injunction, “Don’t tell.” In his popular teachings, as we shall see in the next chapter, he stresses the need of repentance, and the certainty of immediate judgment in the next life, but he never speaks of his hope of ultimate salvation even for the unrepentant. …” (Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh’s Hope in Christ Centered Universalism and Afterlife Salvation Mystery)
Source [Page 101 – 102, ECSTASY AND VISION, via Reverend Streeter and Bishop Dr. AJ Appasamy]:
https://archive.org/stream/cu31924029356684/cu31924029356684_djvu.txt
The surprising thing is that the quote above is found mysteriously similar to what the mysterious Blessed Ambrosiaster himself wrote in First Christianity (quoted earlier, right?).
P/S iii: Judgment Day Salvation Hope
Verses: Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Isaiah 45:22.
“Look to Me, and be saved, All you ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other.” (Isaiah 45:22, NKJV)
” … QUESTION 126. FROM THE ONE WHO RECEIVED THE FAITH OF JESUS CHRIST. … In fact, the knowledge of God must inspire the fear of the just judge, in whose court he teaches us that the faithful will receive the reward of their righteousness, and the ungodly, that is to say the unbelievers, the just punishment of their infidelity. It is of all justice, indeed, that the good ones be filled with joy in the future life in which Jesus Christ must reign with his chosen ones. They have been exposed to scorn, outrages in this world where the devil reigns, they will appear surrounded by glory in the kingdom of Jesus Christ for which they have borne the contempt of the worldly. SINNERS, on the contrary, who seemed to shine here below a false brilliance, opposing falsehood to truth, have to wait for tribulation and an imaginary glory to succeed for them a contempt, a humiliation too real. The righteous will rejoice in having believed, when they witness the chastisements of the unbelieving, and THE UNFAITHFUL WILL REPENT of THEIR UNBELIEF ONLY when THEY SEE BOTH THEIR OWN CHASTISEMENT and the glory of those WHOSE FAITH THEY HAD REGARDED as an ACT of MADNESS, which was only worthy of their contempt. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source:
Focus Phrases Proving our Claim:
“… SINNERS, on the contrary, who seemed to shine here below a false brilliance, opposing falsehood to truth, have to wait for tribulation and an imaginary glory to succeed for them a contempt, a humiliation too real. … and THE UNFAITHFUL WILL REPENT of THEIR UNBELIEF ONLY when THEY SEE BOTH THEIR OWN CHASTISEMENT and the glory of those WHOSE FAITH THEY HAD REGARDED as an ACT of MADNESS, which was only worthy of their contempt. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster
Since these “sinners” or the “unfaithful” who “repent of their unbelief” on this Judgment Day (according to Blessed Ambrosiaster above) are said to have been those who regarded the Faith of True-Christians as “Madness”, thus these must refer to the ‘Sinners’ (Good non-Christians) and/or ‘Wicked only’ being ‘unbelievers’ who must first endure their Judgment/Chastisement first accordingly (Luke 12:46 – 48) making our definition earlier accurate in Blessed Ambrosiaster’s own words in this ‘Judgment Day Context’.
Note: Such a final chance given by God is uttered Mysteriously in the Prophecy of the Book of Enoch too where such may be ‘Saved with no honour’ (hence not referring to the Christian Salvation or ‘the Elect’ in Verse below) and by His Great Name ( Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21) on Judgment Day either toward those in the Lake of Fire (Gehenna) or prior or both, to quote:
“1 And in those days a change shall take place for the holy and elect, And the light of days shall abide upon them, And glory and honour shall turn to the holy, 2 On the day of affliction on which evil shall have been treasured up against the sinners.And the righteous shall be victorious in the name of the Lord of Spirits: And He will cause the others to witness (this) That they may repent And forgo the works of their hands. 3 They shall have no honour through the name of the Lord of Spirits, Yet through His name shall they be saved [Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21], And the Lord of Spirits will have compassion on them, For His compassion is great. 4 And He is righteous also in His judgement, And in the presence of His glory unrighteousness also shall not maintain itself: At His judgement the unrepentant shall perish before Him. 5 And from henceforth I will have no mercy on them, saith the Lord of Spirits.” (Book of Enoch, Chapter 50)
Translation Source: http://wesley.nnu.edu/index.php?id=2126
Focus Phrase: “… And He will cause the others [the sinners and/or Wicked] to witness (this) That they may repent And forgo the works of their hands. 3 They shall have NO HONOUR through the NAME of the LORD of SPIRITS, Yet THROUGH HIS NAME [John 14:6] SHALL THEY BE SAVED [Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21], And the Lord of Spirits will have compassion on them …” – Book of Enoch.
Peace to you
First Christianity – Non – Elect Salvation Hope?
Blessed saints John Chrysostom, Cyril of Alexandria, Pope Gregory the Great and Basil the Great have often been quoted as believers in an eternal hell and as those who oppose any universalism.
However, they may be speaking of ‘eternal hell’ (if they meant eternal instead of ‘age-during’ as the original Bible Koine Greek Words mean that literally) in their other quotes provided that it refers to the most wicked of mankind (be it believers or unbelievers only). Why do I claim that?
Please allow me to quote each of them from their well known writings which illustrate that each of these three pillar saints in both Roman Catholicism or Eastern Orthodoxy who are known to be ‘Defenders of the True Faith’ in their respective time in First Christianity to also allow for ‘Spirit World Salvation’ (i.e. post mortem salvation toward some of the most wicked men who died unbelieving/unrepentant or ‘backslided’ too). Please consider:
1) Blessed St. John Chrysostom
Blessed St. John Chrysostom speaks of Spirit World [or Afterlife] Salvation NOT for ‘some righteous souls in purgatory’ but rather for some of the Sinners who deserve “an evil death, the death of sinners”, among whom he refers to have done “no alms-deeds of his own to exhibit”, those who are “good for them had they never been born”, who “not one day has he lived for himself, but to luxury, to debauchery, to covetousness, to sin, to the devil.” etc. to have a Hope of Salvation on Judgment Day (i.e. before the ‘judgment seat of Christ’) due to ‘Alms & Prayers by their righteous Christian relatives on behalf of them to be Saved’.
Really?
Yes, please his quote below carefully from a ‘Catholic Source’ itself to ‘realize this Truth’ [and this Prayer of Salvation of the Damned is exactly what is Prophesied by the Apocalypse of Peter Scripture which was found in the First Bibles of Christianity, i.e. the Muratorian Canon/Roman Canon in the West and/or the Codex Claromontanus in the East as discussed in previous posts]:
” … But not thou alone must lament him that is such; the whole city must do the same, and all that meet you on the way, as men bewail them that are led to be put to death. For this is a death indeed, an evil death, the death of sinners. … Worthy indeed of lamentations are they (when we consider), what time as they shall stand before the judgment seat of Christ, what words they shall then hear, what they shall suffer! To no purpose have these men lived: nay, not to no purpose, but to evil purpose! Of them too it may be fitly said, “It were good for them had they never been born.” (Mark xiv. 21.) For what profit is it, I ask, to have spent so much time to the hurt of his own person? Had it been spent only to no purpose, were not that, I ask you, punishment enough! If one who has been an hired servant twenty years were to find that he has had all his labor in vain, would he not weep and lament, and think himself the most miserable of men? Why, here is a man who has lost all the labor of a whole life: not one day has he lived for himself, but to luxury, to debauchery, to covetousness, to sin, to the devil. Then, say, shall we not bewail this man? shall we not try to snatch him from his perils? For it is, yes, it is possible, if we will, to mitigate his punishment, if we make continual prayers for him, if for him we give alms. However unworthy he may be, God will yield to our importunity. For if Paul showed mercy on one (who had no claims on his mercy), and for the sake of others spared one (whom he would not have spared), much more is it right for us to do this. By means of his substance, by means of thine own, by what means thou wilt, aid him: pour in oil, nay rather, water. Has he no alms-deeds of his own to exhibit? Let him have at least those of his kindred. Has he none done by himself? At least let him have those which are done for him, that his wife may with confidence beg him off in that day, having paid down the ransom for him. The more sins he has to answer for, the greater need has he of alms, not only for this reason, but because the alms has not the same virtue now, but far less: for it is not all one to have done it himself, and to have another do it for him; therefore, the virtue being less, let us by quantity make it the greatest. Let us not busy ourselves about monuments, not about memorials. This is the greatest memorial: set widows to stand around him. Tell them his name: bid them all make for him their prayers, their supplications: this will overcome God: though it have not been done by the man himself, yet because of him another is the author of the almsgiving. Even this pertains to the mercy of God: “widows standing around and weeping” know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come. Many have profited even by the alms done by others on their behalf: for even if they have not got perfect (deliverance), at least they have found some comfort thence. If it be not so, how are children saved? And yet there, the children themselves contribute nothing, but their parents do all: and often have women had their children given them, though the children themselves contributed nothing. Many are the ways God gives us to be saved, only let us not be negligent. …” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Archbishop of Constantinople, Doctor of the Church (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD)
Source [Chrysostom: Homilies on the Acts of the Apostles and the Epistle to the Romans A Commentary on the Acts of the Apostles Homily XXI on Acts ix. 26, 27]:
http://www.catholiccrossreference.com/fathers/index.php/2Cor%201:11
And how reliable is he?
“… John Chrysostom (/ˈkrɪsəstəm, krɪˈsɒstəm/; Greek: Ἰωάννης ὁ Χρυσόστομος; c. 349 – 14 September 407),[6] Archbishop of Constantinople, was an important Early Church Father. He is known for his preaching and public speaking, his denunciation of abuse of authority[7] by both ecclesiastical and political leaders, the Divine Liturgy of Saint John Chrysostom, and his ascetic sensibilities. The epithet Χρυσόστομος (Chrysostomos, anglicized as Chrysostom) means “golden-mouthed” in Greek and denotes his celebrated eloquence.[2][8] Chrysostom was among the most prolific authors in the early Christian Church, exceeded only by Augustine of Hippo in the quantity of his surviving writings.[9] He is honoured as a saint in the Oriental Orthodox, Eastern Orthodox, Catholic, Anglican, and Lutheran churches, as well as in some others. The Eastern Orthodox, together with the Byzantine Catholics, hold him in special regard as one of the Three Holy Hierarchs (alongside Basil the Great and Gregory of Nazianzus) …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Chrysostom
2) Blessed St. Cyril of Alexandria
Blessed St. Cyril of Alexandria clearly speaks that the ones who do not believe in Christ and those who died in their sins are the ones referred to in Luke 12:54 – 59 (and not ‘fallen Christians only’) where ‘those who believe in Him’ will NOT come under such a Judgment at all if they kept the faith (John 5:24), to quote:
“… But against those, who, in the greatness of their wickedness, have scorned His goodness, and rejected the Saviour, there is decreed wrath and misery; and, as it were, a winter of torment and punishment, from the blast of which hard will it be to escape. For, as the Psalmist says; “Fire, and brimstone, and the whirlwind, is the portion of their cup.” And why so? Because they have rejected, as I said, the grace that is by faith; and therefore the guilt of their sins cannot be wiped away, and they must bear, as they deserve, the punishment due to those who love sin. For so, when speaking of the Jews, He said; “Verily I say unto you, that if you believe not that I am He, you shall die in your sins.” … That it is our duty, therefore, to be watchful, in seeking quickly to attain to deliverance from our sins, and the means of escaping from blame, before we arrive at the termination of our natural lives, He has shown, by saying; “And why even of yourselves judge you not what is just? For while you are going with him who has a suit against you, in the way to the magistrate, give diligence that you may be delivered from him; lest he drag you to the judge, and the judge deliver you to the exactor, and the exactor cast you into prison. I tell you, you shall not come out thence, until you have made compensation unto the last mite.” [Luke 12:57 – 59]. Now perhaps it may be imagined that the sense of this passage is difficult to comprehend: but it will become very easy if we examine the metaphor by what takes place among ourselves. For let there be supposed, He says, some one who has brought a charge against you before one of those in authority, and has pointed you out to those whose office it is to carry the accused into court, and is causing you to be taken thither. “While therefore, He says, you are still with him on the way,” that is, before you have come to the judge, “give diligence,” that is, weary not, in using all your earnestness that you may be delivered from him. For otherwise he will give you up to the judge; and then, when you have been proved to be indebted to him, you will be delivered to the exactors, to those, that is, whose office it is to exact the money; and they will cast you into prison, and make you pay the last mite. Now all of us, without exception, upon earth are guilty of offences: he who has a suit against us and accuses us is the wicked Satan: for he is “the enemy and the exactor.” While therefore we are in the way: that is, ere yet we have arrived at the termination of our life here, let us deliver ourselves from him: let us do away with the offences of which we have been guilty: let us close his mouth: let us seize upon the grace that is by Christ, which frees us from all debt and penalty, and delivers us from fear and torment: lest if our impurity be not cleansed away, we be carried before the judge, and given over to the exactors, that is, the tormentors, from whose cruelty no man can escape: yea, rather, who will exact vengeance for every fault, whether it be great or small. Far removed from this danger are those who search for the time of Christ’s corning, and are not ignorant of His mystery, but well know that the Word, though He be God, has shone forth upon the inhabitants of earth in likeness as one of us, that freeing them from all blame, He may bless with exceeding happiness those who believe in Him, and acknowledge Him as God and the Son of God: by Whom and with Whom to God the Father be praise and dominion, with the Holy Spirit, for ever and ever, Amen. …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD)
Source [SERMON XCV, Commentary on Luke]:
http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/cyril_on_luke_09_sermons_89_98.htm
And how reliable is he?
“… Little is known for certain of Cyril’s early life. He was born c. 376, in the small town of Didouseya, Egypt, modern-day El-Mahalla El-Kubra.[3] A few years after his birth, his maternal uncle Theophilus rose to the powerful position of Patriarch of Alexandria.[4] His mother remained close to her brother and under his guidance, Cyril was well educated. His writings show his knowledge of Christian writers of his day, including Eusebius, Origen, Didymus the Blind, and writers of the Church of Alexandria. He received the formal Christian education standard for his day: he studied grammar from age twelve to fourteen (390–392),[5] rhetoric and humanities from fifteen to twenty (393–397) and finally theology and biblical studies (398–402). … St. Cyril received an important recognition of his preachings by the Second Council of Constantinople (553 d.C.) which declared: St. Cyril who announced the right faith of Christians” (Anathematism XIV, Denzinger et Schoenmetzer 437). …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyril_of_Alexandria
3) Pope St. Gregory the Great
The interesting real reliable example of Emperor Trajan (a wicked non-Christian Murderer, Pagan & Unbaptized, Unbeliever) being Saved from Hell after such Propitiatory Prayers by Pope St. Gregory the Great is not a hoax but Truth, to quote:
“… On a time Saint Gregory went by the market of Rome which is called the market of Trajan, and then he remembered of the justice and other good deeds of Trajan, and how he had been piteous and debonair, and was much sorrowful that he had been a pagan, and he turned to the church of Saint Peter wailing for the horror of the miscreance of Trajan. Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …” (The Life of St. Gregory the Pope)
Source:
https://classicalchristianity.com/2012/02/06/st-gregory-the-dialogist-and-emperor-trajan/
Note: Emperor Trajan was not Saved immediately after his death but only after Pope St. Gregory the Great prayed for him which is a few hundred years in Hell first for Emperor Trajan first (i.e. ’till the last penny’ first).
Comment: The additional comment in the link above (added by others and not Uttered by God during that Vision/Revelation to Pope St. Gregory the Great but commentators) reads next as follows [Please notice the phrase ‘as some say’ carefully in the below]:
“… By this, as some say, the pain perpetual due to Trajan as a miscreant was some deal taken away, but for all that was not he quit from the prison of hell, for the soul may well be in hell and feel there no pain by the mercy of God. …”
The Truth is as Hieromonk Ambrose mentioned earlier, God only said this part to Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great:
“… Then answered a voice from God saying: I have now heard thy prayer, and have spared Trajan from the pain perpetual. …”
Can you see it? This is exactly what the Final Prophecy of the Salvation from the Lake of Fire as described in the Apocalypse of Peter Prophecy by Lord Jesus Christ after the Righteous (Christians) Pray to Him to save the ‘damned’ from their ‘everlasting punishments’ will be answered eventually & the First Oldest Christian Canon called the Muratorian Canon lists this Book as “Scripture” too as discussed in Previous Posts.
Source Post: https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/christ-centered-universalism-mystery-in-first-christianity/amp
Do you remember who are we referring to?
He is the same – Blessed Roman Catholic Pope St. Gregory the Great, Saint Gregory the Dialogist in Eastern Christianity, the Father of Christian Worship, and John Calvin declared in his Institutes that Gregory was the last good Pope.
Here is how Reliable Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great himself really is, to quote (link below):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Gregory_I
4) St. Basil the Great
More on Blessed St. Basil the Great’s Universalism Hope is discussed in article below. Link:
So, what he understands as “everlasting punishment” may entirely be a different meaning altogether, for example:
“The peace given by the Lord extends to all eternity, since it knows neither limitations nor boundaries. For all beings will submit to him and all will recognise his power. And when God has come to be ‘all in all,’ after those who created disorders with apostasies have been pacified, all will hymn to God in a symphony of peace.” ~ St Basil of Caesarea (also known as ‘St. Basil the Great’)
So, blessed St. Basil the Great also believed in this, which sounds like Christ Centered Universalism.
Thus, how St. Basil understands ‘everlasting punishment’ could mean eternal loss of the greatest good things in His Kingdom as claimed earlier.
Conclusion – Scripture of the Shepherd of Hermas and Apocalypse of Peter
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
The Hope Part:
“… She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
This Shepherd of Hermas Scripture regarding some non-Christians (the unbaptized & those who heard the Gospel on earth but did not believe in it) can be Saved in the Spirit World if God Wills as Described above but may be accelerated by our Propitiatory Prayers on behalf of them as the Bible Verses in 2 Maccabees 12:42 – 46 imply.
“… There is a great deal more of the Ethiopic text, but it is very evidently of later date [the opinion of this scholar is refuted by the Rainer Fragment Discovery as Described in Point 5 earlier]; the next words are: … Next: ‘ The Father hath committed all judgement unto the Son.’ The destiny of sinners -their eternal doom- is more than Peter can endure: he appeals to Christ to have pity on them. And my Lord answered me and said to me: ‘Hast thou understood that which I said unto thee before? It is permitted unto thee to know that concerning which thou askest: but thou must not tell that which thou hearest unto the sinners lest they transgress the more, and sin.’ Peter weeps many hours, and is at last consoled by an answer which, though exceedingly diffuse and vague does seem to promise ultimate pardon for all: ‘My Father will give unto them all the life, the glory, and the kingdom that passeth not away,’ . . . ‘It is because of them that have believed in me that I am come. It is also because of them that have believed in me, that, at their word, I shall have pity on men.’ The doctrine that sinners will be saved at last by the prayers of the righteous is, rather obscurely, enunciated in the Second Book of the Sibylline Oracles (a paraphrase, in this part, of the Apocalypse), and in the (Coptic) Apocalypse of Elias (see post). Ultimately Peter orders Clement to hide this revelation in a box, that foolish men may not see it. The passage in the Second Book of the Sibylline Oracles which seems to point to the ultimate salvation of all sinners will be found in the last lines of the translation given below. The passage in the Coptic Apocalypse of Elias is guarded and obscure in expression, but significant. It begins with a sentence which has a parallel in Peter. The righteous will behold the sinners in their punishment, and those who have persecuted them and delivered them up. Then will the sinners on their part behold the place of the righteous and be partakers of grace. In that day will that for which the (righteous) shall often pray, be granted to them. That is, as I take it, the salvation of sinners will be granted at the prayer of the righteous.Compare also the Epistle of the Apostles, 40: ‘the righteous are sorry for the sinners, and pray for them…. And I will hearken unto the prayer of the righteous which they make for them.’…”
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/apocalypsepeter-mrjames.html
[Emphasis Mine throughout]
iii. Blessed Ambrosiaster
The Earliest Authoritative Commentary of the New Testament in Latin before St. Augustine also reflects this Prophecy that the Righteous may ask for Anything including the Salvation of the Damned “on that Day” toward Christ Centred Universalism as shown below, to quote
“… and yet to recognize that His kingdom is ETERNAL, that is to say, the kingdom of the Son, for in the Name of Jesus EVERY KNEE shakes in HEAVEN, on the EARTH, and IN HELL. (Philip. 2) The Apostle St. Peter confirms this truth when he says:” No other name under heaven was given to MEN by which we were to BE SAVED.” (Acts 4) And did not the Lord Himself say to His disciples, “Until now you have not asked anything in my name, ask and I will answer you?” (Jn. 16:24) The REIGN of the Son therefore consists in the fact that it is in HIS NAME that ALL MEN are SAVED, and that ALL the PRAYERS addressed to Him until the end of the world are ANSWERED. But when ALL CREATURES have confessed Jesus Christ WILLINGLY or by FORCE, and have been subjected to the power against which they have resisted, then the MYSTERY of ONE GOD will be REVEALED to ALL MEN, and all thanksgivings will go back to God the Father, the principle of all things, that ALL PREACHING CEASE, ONE GOD be recognized in the MYSTERY of the TRINITY. … ” – Ambrosiaster (Written c. 366 – c. 384, Reply to Question 26, Commentary on the Gospel of Luke)
Source:
“In THAT DAY you will not question Me about anything. Truly, truly, I say to you, if you ask the Father for anything in My name, He will give it to you. “Until now you have asked for nothing in My name; ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be made full.” – Lord Jesus Christ (John 16:23 – 24, NASB)
Comment: Please notice carefully that Ambrosiaster quotes John 16:24 where in John 16:23 (see these Verses above), it is clear that the Context is “in THAT DAY” (probably the Seventh or Eighth Day onward in the Messianic Prophecies Timeline), all prayer requests especially for the Salvation of the Damned [that the ‘Eternal Hell Sentence’ may be Cancelled by His Mercy which can Triumph Over & End any Judgment Sentence, James 2:13] will be Answered causing this Universal Salvation of ‘All Men in heaven, Earth or Hell’ (Context: Please read the above ‘carefully’) agreeing to the Prophecies of the Apocalypse of Peter, Apocalypse of Elijah, Apocalypse of Zephaniah, the Christian-Jewish Sibyline Oracles, the Epistle of the Apostles, St. Julian of Norwich’s Visions & even the Visions of Sadhu Sundar Singh as it was Discussed in Previous posts.
Since ‘Sodom and Gomorrah’ has been the example of the ‘Eternal [Aeonian, age-during] Fire’ punishment (Jude 1:7), this saint belives in Salvation being Possible after that (‘Purgatorial Hell Universalism’) in light of the Scripture Ezekiel 16:53 – 54 and Acts 3:21 as he says that ‘EVEN SODOM and GOMORRAH, THEIR PUNISHMENT in history having satisfied the righteousness of God [Jude 1:7], shall ULTIMATELY BE SAVED’, to quote:
“… Man has a natural proclivity to evil, an inherited weakness which has, as a matter of experience, betrayed ALL MEN into actual sin, with the exception of Christ . Elsewhere, however, Hilary recognises the possibility, under existing conditions, of a sinless life. For David could make the prayer, ‘Take from me the way of iniquity;’ of iniquity itself he was guiltless, and only needed to pray against the tendency inherent in his bodily nature . But such a case is altogether exceptional; ordinary men must confide in the thought that God is indulgent, for He knows our infirmity. He is propitiated by the wish to be righteous, and in His judgment the merits of good men outweigh their sins . Hence a prevalent tone of hopefulness about the future state of the baptized; EVEN SODOM and GOMORRAH, THEIR PUNISHMENT in history having satisfied the righteousness of God [Jude 1:7], shall ULTIMATELY BE SAVED. Yet God has a perfect, immutable goodness of which human goodness, though real, falls infinitely short, because He is steadfast and we are driven by varying impulses . This DIVINE GOODNESS is the STANDARD and the HOPE set before us. It can only be attained by GRACE, and GRACE is FREELY OFFERED. But just as the SOUL, being free, advances to meet sin, so it MUST ADVANCE to MEET GRACE…” – Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD, ‘The Theology of Hilary of Poictiers*,Page 122)
* in the Book ‘Ante-Nicene Fathers Volume 01 The Apostolic Fathers with Justin Martyr and Irenaeus To Ante Nicene Fathers Volume 10 Bibliographic Synopsis General Index’ by Schaff, Philip (1819-1893).
Source:
He also sees that All Enemies of God will eventually Submit back to Him as per His Reign based on Romans 11:26 – 32 and 1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28, to quote:
“… When authorities and powers are abolished, His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. The same Apostle tells who are these enemies, As touching the Gospel they are enemies for your sakes, but as touching the election they are beloved for the fathers’ sake . We remember that they are enemies of the cross of Christ; let us remember also that, because they are beloved for the fathers’ sake, they are reserved for the subjection, as the Apostle says, I would not, brethren, have you ignorant of this mystery, lest ye be wise in your own conceits, that a hardening in part hath befallen Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved, even as it is written, There shall come out of Sion a Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: and this is the covenant firm Me to them, when I have taken away their sins . So His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. But we must not forget what follows the subjection, namely, Last of all is death conquered by Him 1284 . This victory over death is nothing else than the resurrection from the dead: for when the corruption of death is stayed, the quickened and now heavenly nature is made eternal, as it is written, For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. But when this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in strife. O death, where is thy sting? O death, where is thy strife ? In the subjection of His enemies death is conquered; and, death conquered, life immortal follows…” Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD, Book XI ‘On the Trinity’, Points 34 – 35, Page 481**)
Source:
https://archive.org/stream/StHilaryOfPoitiersSelectWorks/StHilaryofPoitiersSelectWorks_djvu.txt
Shocked?
Their quotes above are more shocking than my description of it which proves that they only believed in ‘Eternal Hell’ (if still they believed it for some) where it must be for those more worse than these, right?
Thus, we can Imitate their faith in this, right (Hebrews 13:7)?
Hence, at least up to this point as these quotes illustrate, it has been legitimate (within Christian Orthodoxy) to hope for the ‘unsaved’ to be ‘saved’ into ‘other lower abodes’ in the ‘spirit world’ as per these authoritative quotes Prove.
Peace to you
FAQ – If we pay for our sins why need Christ?
Question 1
Here are two scenarios to test the thinking of this Luke reference.
1. I never repaid a legitimate debt of $500 to someone.
2. Someone murdered my child.
Assuming you’re putting “payment” in the afterlife:
1. To whom is the payment owed? The “accuser”?
2. What is the form of that “payment” for each scenario?
3. Who decides when the “last penny” has been paid?
Reply 1
So, the non-Elect owe the debt of sin to their master the Devil.
Question 2
1.Interesting! If one can suffer for their own sins, and are thereby saved after they’ve “paid the last penny,” then Christ didn’t need to die since all could be saved by suffering for their own sin, including the elect. If, in response to Jesus prayer in the garden, there really was “another way,” then his sacrifice was completely unnecessary.
2. Requiring the word “accuser” to refer exclusively to the “devil” in Luke’s reference, rather than simply someone to whom a debt is owed in this life, opens up a whole other can of worms. The only thing that would satisfy the devil is if everyone rebelled against God as he did. Doing the devil’s will hardly incurs a debt to him, much less provides a reason for him to seek justice before the magistrate. Payment is due to the one who is offended by evil, God, which makes no sense that it would be Satan.
Reply 2
Believers are still judged but in this life (Hebrews 12:8) while the rest with afterlife Judgment (John 5:24).
When one pays for their sins till the last penny (Luke 12:57 – 59, Matthew 18:31 – 35), one only comes out of there, not getting any other restoration, renewal or place in the better abodes as the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture clearly reveals this Mystery as well.
Indeed, Christ’s Ransom for our sins is for the “Making Alive” or Resurrection of the Dead part which applies when He takes away our sins (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 28).
for believers = His Propitiation includes the Absent of the Afterlife Judgment (John 5:24)
for the rest = His Propitiation means ‘turning away or ending of Wrath of the afterlife Judgments eventually’ as “His Mercy will Triumph over and End Afterlife Judgment (James 2:13) as it is Promised to All including the Disobedient/enemies of the Gospel in this order eventually (Romans 11:28 -32).
Verses quoted in the above (list):
“57“And why do you not even on your own initiative judge what is right? 58“For while you are going with your opponent to appear before the magistrate, on your way there make an effort to settle with him, so that he may not drag you before the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison. 59“I say to you, you will not get out of there until you have paid the very last cent.” – Most Blessed God in Flesh, Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:57 – 59, NASB)
“But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons.” (Hebrews 12:8, NKJV)
“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (John 5:24, NKJV)
“19“There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and [h]fared sumptuously every day. 20But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21desiring to be fed with [i]the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24“Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ 25But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 26And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’ 27“Then he said, ‘I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father’s house, 28for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.’ 29Abraham said to him, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ 30And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ 31But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’ ” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:19 – 31, NKJV)
“Therefore, to him who knows to do good and does not do it, to him it is sin.” (James 4:17, NKJV)
“ 46the master of that servant will come on a day when he is not looking for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in two and appoint him his portion with the unbelievers. 47And that servant who knew his master’s will, and did not prepare himself or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few. For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:46 – 48, NKJV)
“31So when his fellow servants saw what had been done, they were very grieved, and came and told their master all that had been done. 32Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. 33Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ 34And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him. 35“So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 18:31 – 35, NKJV)
“20But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have [d]fallen asleep. 21For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead. 22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive. 23But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming. 24Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26The last enemy that will be destroyed is death. 27For “He has put all things under His feet.” But when He says “all things are put under Him,” it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted. 28Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.” (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 28, NKJV)
“1My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.” (1 John 2:1 – 2, NKJV)
“For judgment is without mercy to the one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.” (James 2:13, NKJV)
“28Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.” (Romans 11:28 – 32, NKJV)
Peace to you
Mystery of Christ’s Forgiveness – Will God Forgive All Sins of Men Eventually?
Christ Himself Says that all sins will be Forgiven eventually in this age (“Today”) or the in the age to come except the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit which is Unforgiven for Two Ages (Matthew 12:31 – 32). The till the last penny is afterlife Judgment as even in Matthew 18:34 Christ Spoke it in the Context of this is what the Father will do (in afterlife Judgment) if one does not Forgive others.
Here are the Facts with Verses:
1) “Today” is the Day of Salvation Verses Meaning
Example:
“For He says: “In an acceptable time I have heard you, And in the day of salvation I have helped you.” Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.” (2 Corinthians 6:2, NKJV)
“Today” = this age before He Returns to the end of this age to obtains the ‘Repentance to become His Church’
Yes, this “Today” only lasts before the end of this age:
“So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come forth, separate the wicked from among the just,” – Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 13:49, NKJV)
2) All Sins of Men will be Forgiven if not in this age, in the age to come except the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit
“31“Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. 32Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 12:31 – 32, NKJV)
Focus Phrases from the Verses above:
“… but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age [AEON] or in the age to come …”
Note: The next Aeon may not be eternal as the are “AEONS” (or ages to come) proving that the next Aeon must end making way for another as Ephesians 2:7 implies. Even if the next age is eternal, it only proves ‘eternal Hell’ for very few individuals who have committed such a sin.
“… Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, …”
3) First Christianity
Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great himself implied that God’s Forgiveness extends from “Today” (current age to become His Bride/Church) and into the “age to come” (next age) based on Matthew 12:31 – 32, to quote:
“… “From this sentence we understand that certain offenses can be forgiven in this age, but certain others in the age to come” (Dial. 4, 39) …”
Sources:
https://catholicexchange.com/did-jesus-believe-in-purgatory
or
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/online-edition/on-the-remission-of-sins-after-death
*He is the same – Blessed Roman Catholic Pope St. Gregory the Great, Saint Gregory the Dialogist in Eastern Christianity, the Father of Christian Worship, and John Calvin declared in his Institutes that Gregory was the last good Pope.
The only difference is that the Roman Catholics limit it toward ‘fallen Christians only in Purgatory’ while Christ’s Statement Clearly Puts this Hope forward toward all of Mankind who did not commit the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit as He Himself Says,
“… Therefore I say to you, EVERY sin and blasphemy WILL be FORGIVEN MEN, …” – Most Blessed Judge & KING of kings, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 12:31 – 32, NKJV)
Christ does not put any condition but Says that ‘they will be Forgiven’ (be it with or without Judgment till the last penny as w have seen earlier) as Forgiveness is His Choice Alone and He has Declared it as a Valid Hope ‘as it is Written’.
4) Context for Luke 12:57 – 59 and Matthew 18:32 – 35 is afterlife Judgment till the ‘last penny’ (nothing more)
Please note carefully that Christ Himself Says that Matthew 18:34’s Context of ‘being Judged in the Afterlife Judgment’ (Described Parabolically) is till the ‘last Penny only’ as it refers to the Context of ‘what the Father will do (Judgment) toward such ones who do not Forgive others first in their lives prior’ (Matthew 18:35:
“32Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. 33Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ 34And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him. 35“So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother [g]his trespasses.” – Most Blessed Judge & KING of kings, Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 18:32 – 35, NKJV)
Comment: The Shepherd of Hermas’ quote regarding ‘the Today type of Repentance referring to the Tower of Repentance to be part of the Church’ is NOT available to those repenting in the Spirit World or when they are Forgiven in the afterlife Judgments be it even in the age to come agrees to all these Verses Perfectly when taken together, to quote:
Yes, Please notice the following carefully:
Context = Definition of Saved
Saved = Part of the Tower of Repentance = Being His Church /Bride
Not Saved = not His Church = have not Salvation (referring to ‘not’ being part of the First Resurrection Revelation 20:4 – 6 when He Returns, Matthew 7:21 – 23)
These same rejected unsaved stones are said to be saved in another place more humble eventually (Matthew 12:31), to quote:
“Hermas 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. Hermas 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. Hermas 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts.”
Source for Translation: https://carm.org/shepherd-of-hermas
Peace to you
First Christianity non-Elect Salvation Hope for non-Christians
Please consider these authoritative quotes regarding the non-Elect Salvation for unbaptized non-Christians being Saved in the Spirit World by God’s Mercy via the Prayers of Christian Saints:
1) Blessed St. Maximus the Confessor
“… The “gloom” is their complete and total blindness to divine grace, a gloom that wholly pervaded the disposition of their will and separated them from the blessed and all-radiant outpouring of divine light. This is how they squandered all the natural intellective power given to them when they were brought into being out of nothing. What will happen to them on the terrible Day of Judgment is something known only to the Just Judge. He will determine the just and deserved recompence for everyone, assigning a form of punishment equal to the degree of wickedness, and, consistent with His good decrees, will render with justice the eternal sentence. …” – Blessed St. Maximus the Confessor, Christian monk, theologian, and scholar, who was a civil servant, and an aide to the Byzantine Emperor Heraclius before he gave up this life in the political sphere to enter into the monastic life, who is venerated in both the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches. He was eventually persecuted for his Christological positions; following a trial, his tongue and right hand were mutilated. (c. 580 AD – c. 662 AD)
Source:
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/henrykarlson/2020/01/st-maximos-and-universal-salvation/
“… And the who did not completely acquire perfection but have acquired both sins and good works, come into the court of judgment; there, they are scorched as by a fire by the comparison of their good and evil deeds, and if, in fact, the scale of the good deeds weighs downwards, they are cleansed of punishment …” – Blessed St. Maximus the Confessor, Christian monk, theologian, and scholar, who was a civil servant, and an aide to the Byzantine Emperor Heraclius before he gave up this life in the political sphere to enter into the monastic life, who is venerated in both the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches. He was eventually persecuted for his Christological positions; following a trial, his tongue and right hand were mutilated. (c. 580 AD – c. 662 AD)
Source:
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/henrykarlson/2020/01/st-maximos-and-universal-salvation/
Comment: Perhaps the First Resurrection is based on both “Faith and Works” (Christians only get to Participate in it, Revelation 20:4 – 6, James 2:24) while the rest are rejected (Matthew 7:20 – 23) for hope in the Second Resurrection for some which comes after the 1000 years (Revelation 20:5). Some only seem to repent of their “unbelief” on this Judgment Day as the Book of Enoch has Mysteriously Prophesied agreeing to this Hope as St. Maximus presented above, to quote:
“… 1 And in those days a change shall take place for the holy and elect, And the light of days shall abide upon them, And glory and honour shall turn to the holy, 2 On the day of affliction on which evil shall have been treasured up against the sinners.And the righteous shall be victorious in the name of the Lord of Spirits: And He will cause the others to witness (this) That they may repent And forgo the works of their hands. 3 They shall have no honour through the name of the Lord of Spirits, Yet through His name shall they be saved [Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Matthew 12:21], And the Lord of Spirits will have compassion on them, For His compassion is great. 4 And He is righteous also in His judgement, And in the presence of His glory unrighteousness also shall not maintain itself: At His judgement the unrepentant shall perish before Him. 5 And from henceforth I will have no mercy on them, saith the Lord of Spirits. …” (Book of Enoch, Chapter 50)
Translation Source: http://wesley.nnu.edu/index.php?id=2126
iii. St. Maximus seems to Point to some type of “Universalism” where God may be ‘… Completely United to All, at the end of the Ages (Aeons) …’ toward each person according to varying capabilities but he seemed to have been “silent” to ‘explain it further’, example quote:
“… For nature does not contain the characteristics of the super-natural, just as it does not contain the laws of what is against nature. By ‘supernatural’ I mean the divine and inconceivable joy, which God naturally creates when he is united by grace to those who are worthy. By ‘against nature’, I mean the unspeakable anguish which is involved in the deprivation of this (joy), which God naturally creates when He is united with the unworthy against grace. For God is united with all, according to the quality of the fundamental state of each person; in a way that He understands, he supplies sensation to each one, corresponding to the way each is made by Him to receive the One Who is completely united to all, at the end of the ages …” – Blessed St. Maximus the Confessor, Christian monk, theologian, and scholar, who was a civil servant, and an aide to the Byzantine Emperor Heraclius before he gave up this life in the political sphere to enter into the monastic life, who is venerated in both the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches. He was eventually persecuted for his Christological positions; following a trial, his tongue and right hand were mutilated. (c. 580 AD – c. 662 AD, Quest. Thal. 59 PG 90, 609B14-C12, Quaestiones ad Thalassium)
Source:
https://classicalchristianity.com/2016/03/08/on-universalism-and-st-maximus-the-confessor/
Someone remarked:
‘… Maximus the Confessor hopes that universal salvation may be true, yet he states the horrors of existing outside God’s presence in sad and fearful terms. …’
2) Blessed St. Cyril of Alexandria
“And so we, having been called through His will in Christ Jesus, are not justified through ourselves or through our own wisdom or understanding or piety or works which we wrought in holiness of heart, but through faith, whereby the Almighty God justified all men that have been from the beginning; to whom be the glory for ever and ever. Amen.” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter (c. 35 AD – c. 99 AD, 1 Clement 32:4)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/1clement-lightfoot.html
St. Cyril of Alexandria fully affirms that the Context of 1 Peter 3:19 – 20 refers to Christ Saving in Hell toward the Wicked too, to quote:
“… What occasion will we still have for weeping? On the contrary, will not what has happened to us, thanks to the Savior, cause us boundless rejoicing? He it was Who showed the way of salvation not only to us, but also went as herald to the once disobedient spirits of the underworld, as Peter says (1 Pet. 3:19-20). For it would not have done for His loving-kindness to be shown only to some; the manifestation of the gift had to extended to all of nature. For He spoke opportunely through the Prophets, “One part shall be rained upon, and the part on which I shall not rain shall be dried up.” (Amos 4:7) But the word which befits the Savior is: “Come to me, all you who labor and are weary, and I will give you rest.” (Mt. 11:28) Having proclaimed His message, then, to the spirits in the underworld and having said to those in fetters, “Come forth!” and to those in darkness, “Show yourselves!” (cf. Isa. 49:9) He raised up the temple of Himself in three days, (cf. Jn. 2:19) and renewed for nature even the ascent into heaven, presenting Himelf to the Father as a kind of first-fruits of humanity, having endowed those on earth with a share of the Spirit as a pledge of grace. (cf. 2 Cor. 5:5) (Festal Letter 2.8) …” …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD)
Source:
https://classicalchristianity.com/category/holyfathers/post-mortem/
And how reliable is he?
“… St. Cyril received an important recognition of his preachings by the Second Council of Constantinople (553 d.C.) which declared: St. Cyril who announced the right faith of Christians” (Anathematism XIV, Denzinger et Schoenmetzer 437). …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyril_of_Alexandria
Comment: Blessed St. Clement of Rome says that “all men” are Justified by Faith from the beginning. So, by whose Faith are those “formerly wicked/disobedient” ones in 1 Peter 3:19 – 20 justified by as Blessed St. Cyril attests?
In the Bible (e.g. KJV translation), it seems more accurate to refer it to the “Faith of Jesus Christ” (and not our faith in Christ as Romans 3:22, Galatians 2:16 and Blessed St. Clement of Rome’s quote prior seems to agree making this Possible). In fact, this rarely known accuracy seemed to have been uttered by this great early Church father too, to quote:
“… , one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.3, Pages 498 – 499)
Source:
Where
The phrase “For its own glory and faith” implies that “its own Faith” = GodHead’s Own Faith = “Christ’s Faith” = the “Faith of Jesus Christ” in Romans 3:22-KJV (not by our faith we are justified but by His Faith where we become the first recipients of It when we believe first reaping Imperishable Rewards, Romans 3:26).
So, St. Epiphanius writes that by “His Faith” Christ makes even the “things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth (Hell)” as one, yes as He “makes these three one” and “For its [His] own glory and faith”. So, each of the “Justification of faith for all men (all mankind)” eventually must thus refer to “His Faith” which is the Free Gift of God to all (Romans 3:22 – 24) and ‘not our faith as popularly assumed’, i. e. not of anything of ourselves including not our faith too for Salvation by His Mercy (Ephesians 2:8).
3) Blessed St. John of Damascus
“And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.” – The KING, Lord Jesus Christ (John 6:40, NKJV)
“… Some say that [Christ delivered from Hades] only those who believed, such as fathers and prophets, judges and together with them kings, local rulers and some others from the Hebrew people, not numerous and known to all. But we shall reply to those who think so that there is nothing undeserved, nothing miraculous and nothing strange in that Christ should save those who believed, for He remains only the fair Judge, and every one who believes in Him will not perish. So they all ought to have been saved and delivered from the bonds of Hades by the descent of God and Master — that same happened by His Disposition. Whereas those who were saved only through [God’s] love of men were, as I think, all those who had the purest life and did all kinds of good works, living in modesty, temperance and virtue, but the pure and divine faith they did not conceive because they were not instructed in it and remained altogether unlearnt. They were those whom the Steward and Master of all drew, captured in the divine nets and persuaded to believe in Him, illuminating them with the divine rays and showing them the true light. (Concerning Those Who Died in Faith PG 95, 257 AC). …” – Blessed St. John of Damascus, the Last Father of the Church who is a revered Father of the Church, and is recognized as a saint. He is sometimes called the last of the Church Fathers by the Roman Catholic Church. In 1890 he was declared a Doctor of the Church by Pope Leo XIII (c. 675 AD – c. 749 AD)
Comment: Again, these non-Christian righteous must be justified by the “Faith of Jesus Christ” (Christ’s Faith) as neither did these non-Christian righteous (the ‘unlearnt’) though rich in good works did have any ‘faith in Christ/God’ as the Shepherd of Hermas mentioned them too. Why can’t such a redemption continue now by God’s Mercy?
“… “And so, with our souls again united to our bodies. which will have become incorrupt and put off corruption, we shall rise again and stand before the terrible judgment seat of Christ. And the devil and his demons, and his man, which is to say, the Antichrist, and the impious and sinners will be given over to everlasting fire, which will not be a material fire such as we are accustomed to, but a fire such as God might know. And those who have done good will shine like the sun together with the angels unto eternal life with our Lord Jesus Christ, ever seeing Him and being seen, enjoying the unending bliss which is from Him, and praising Him together with the Father and the Holy Spirit unto the endless ages of ages. Amen.” …” – Blessed St. John of Damascus, the Last Father of the Church who is a revered Father of the Church, and is recognized as a saint. He is sometimes called the last of the Church Fathers by the Roman Catholic Church. In 1890 he was declared a Doctor of the Church by Pope Leo XIII (c. 675 AD – c. 749 AD, in the final chapter of his Exact Exposition of the Orthodox Faith)
Source:
http://orthodoxinfo.com/death/excerpts_death.aspx
This agrees with Blessed St. Ambrose of Milan’s quote below too:
“… It is not enough, however, to come if one is invited: one must have the wedding dress, that is to say have faith and charity. Whoever therefore does not bring peace and charity to the altars of Christ will be seized by the feet and the hands, and thrown into the darkness from without. “There will be tears and gnashing of teeth. What are the darkness of the outside? Will there also be prisons and latomias? In no way; but whoever is excluded from the promises of the heavenly commandments is in outer darkness, because the commandments of God are light (Jn, xii, 35); and whoever is without Christ is in darkness, because the inner light is Christ. So it is not a question of the creaking of the material teeth, nor of some eternal fire of material flames, nor of a material worm. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Converter, Baptizer &Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD)
Source:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/ambrose-on-luke-14
From the above, Blessed St. Ambrose does NOT see that the ‘Final Lake of Fire is literal (material, Revelation 21:8, Revelation 20:11 – 15)’ nor that the ‘Worm is literal’ (Mark 9:48) and Neither that the ‘Gnashing of teeth as literal either’ (Matthew 13:42, Luke 13:28):
“… So it is not a question of the creaking of the material teeth, nor of some eternal fire of material flames, nor of a material worm. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan
This Concept of Understanding that the Final-Hell/Gehenna/Lake of Fire Punishment is not literal (e.g. as per the ‘gnashing of teeth’) but refers to the ‘soul’s thoughts tormenting it’ is expressed even by the Great Saint of Orthodoxy below, to quote:
“…But as to “There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth ,” 54 we must confront them with the objection that, as in this life the creator has made every member of the body for some purpose, so he has made the teeth to chew solid food Why do the damned need teeth, then? Our brethren do not claim that they eat in hell. (2) And it must be pointed out that not everything in scripture is to be taken literally. Scripture says, “Thou hast broken the teeth of sinners, ” 55 and, “The Lord hath crushed the teeth of the lions ,” 56 but who is so foolish as to suppose that, while preserving sinners’ bodies, God breaks only their teeth? (3) Just as whoever wanted the lines to read like that was obliged by his discomfort with them to resort to allegory, so one must look for the gnashing of the teeth of the damned. The soul has the faculty of “chewing [on things],” and when convicted of its sins will “gnash its teeth” by the clashing of its thoughts . 51 16.6 But “Fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell [Gehenna]” 58 perhaps teaches that the soul is incorporeal, or even, perhaps, means that the soul will not be punished apart from the body. …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘ORIGEN’ , “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 16.1 – 16., Pages 146 – 147)
Source:
iii. St. John of Damascus clearly believed in the non-Elect Salvation of Some who are non-Christians or Unbaptized Saved by the Prayer of the Christians
To quote:
“… In the life of St. Thecla, the first century martyr and follower of the Apostle Paul, we read of her arrest in Antioch during which time she was kept in the custody of Tryphina, a rich noblewoman who although now a Christian, her daughter Falconilla reposed while they were pagans. One night Tryphina beheld her daughter in a dream, who said:
“My mother, love the stranger, Thecla. Take her as your daughter in my place, for she is the handmaid of God. She can entreat the Lord to place me with the righteous.”
When she awoke she related the matter to Thecla and asked her to pray for her daughter. Straightway, Thecla raised her hands in prayer, and uttered with tears:
“My Lord Jesus Christ, Son of the true and living God, hearken unto Your handmaiden and grant rest to the soul of Falconilla in life eternal, according to Your holy will.”
St. John of Damascus, in his “Homily for Meat-Fare Saturday”, testifies concerning this act of Thecla, saying:
“Did not the Protomartyr save Falconilla after the latter had reposed? Perhaps you may say that her prayer was heard because she was a martyr. To this I reply that it was indeed fitting that her prayer was heard since she was a martyr. But consider also on whose behalf the supplication was made. Was it not for a pagan, an idolater, altogether profane and estranged from the Lord?”
In this same homily, St. John of Damascus goes on to bring up the example of St. Gregory the Dialogist, Pope of Rome, of whom he writes:
“One day, as Gregory the Dialogist, Bishop of Old Rome (a man known to all for his holiness and wisdom, of whom it is said that an angel from heaven served with him when he celebrated the Divine Liturgy), was traveling along a paved stone road, he halted and prayed to God, who loves the souls of men, to forgive the Emperor Trajan his sins. The Saint straightway heard the voice of the most heavenly God, which said to him, ‘I have heard your supplication and shall grant Trajan forgiveness, but I command you to cease your entreaties to Me on behalf of the impure.’ To the veracity of this account East and West alike bear witness.”
Following this, the Damascene mentions Falconilla once more, saying:
“The same is true of Falconilla, of whom we spoke before. She was guilty only of worshipping idols, but Trajan sent numerous martyrs to cruel death. You are wonderful, O Master, and marvelous are Your works, and Your inexpressible compassions do we glorify!”
Thus we know from the trustworthy testimony of the Damascene that Falconilla was granted salvation after her repose by the prayers of the holy Protomartyr Thecla, and Trajan was granted salvation after his repose by the prayers of the holy Gregory, Pope of Rome.
Other examples from the lives of the saints where private prayer made on behalf of those reposed outside the Church are St. Perpetua who prayed for her unbaptized brother Dinocrates, and St. Theodora the Empress who prayed for her iconoclast husband Theophilos the Emperor.
In each of the above instances, through the fervent entreaty of the saint, Christ granted them a vision where their request for the relief of the reposed was granted. It is not possible to make a formal Church doctrine out of these saint’s expressions of love and affection for those that reposed in such precarious spiritual states, but love transcends every barrier.
The following is a model of a private prayer which might be said for a reposed non-Orthodox person as suggested by the Elder Leonid of Optina, one who was experienced in the spiritual life:
Have mercy, O Lord, if it is possible, on the soul of Your servant (name), departed to eternal life in separation from Your Holy Orthodox Church! Unsearchable are Your judgments. Account not this my prayer as sin, but may Your holy will be done! …”
Source:
https://arizonaorthodox.com/pray-reposed-non-christians-non-orthodox/
In Short, Blessed St. John of Damascus’ own words are as follows:
“… “Did not the Protomartyr save Falconilla after the latter had reposed? Perhaps you may say that her prayer was heard because she was a martyr. To this I reply that it was indeed fitting that her prayer was heard since she was a martyr. But consider also on whose behalf the supplication was made. Was it not for a pagan, an idolater, altogether profane and estranged from the Lord?” … “One day, as Gregory the Dialogist*, Bishop of Old Rome (a man known to all for his holiness and wisdom, of whom it is said that an angel from heaven served with him when he celebrated the Divine Liturgy), was traveling along a paved stone road, he halted and prayed to God, who loves the souls of men, to forgive the Emperor Trajan his sins. The Saint straightway heard the voice of the most heavenly God, which said to him, ‘I have heard your supplication and shall grant Trajan forgiveness, but I command you to cease your entreaties to Me on behalf of the impure.’ To the veracity of this account East and West alike bear witness.” … “The same is true of Falconilla, of whom we spoke before. She was guilty only of worshipping idols, but Trajan sent numerous martyrs to cruel death. You are wonderful, O Master, and marvelous are Your works, and Your inexpressible compassions do we glorify!” …” – Blessed St. John of Damascus, the Last Father of the Church who is a revered Father of the Church, and is recognized as a saint. He is sometimes called the last of the Church Fathers by the Roman Catholic Church. In 1890 he was declared a Doctor of the Church by Pope Leo XIII (c. 675 AD – c. 749 AD, in the final chapter of his Exact Exposition of the Orthodox Faith)
Another Source quoting this same fact:
https://www.johnsanidopoulos.com/2015/09/praying-for-reposed-non-christians-and.html
*St. Gregory the Great mentioned by St. John of Damasus above is the same – Blessed Roman Catholic Pope St. Gregory the Great, Saint Gregory the Dialogist in Eastern Christianity, the Father of Christian Worship, and Protestant Reformer Blessed John Calvin declared in his Institutes that Gregory was the last good Pope.
to quote:
“… How important commemoration at the Liturgy is may be seen in the following occurrence: Before the uncovering of the relics of St. Theodosius of Chernigov (1896), the priest-monk (the renowned Starets Alexis of Goloseyevsky Hermitage, of the Kiev-Caves Lavra, who died in 1916) who was conducting the re-vesting of the relics, becoming weary while sitting by the relics, dozed off and saw before him the Saint, who told him: “I thank you for laboring me. I beg you also, when you will serve the Liturgy, to commemorate my parents”—and be gave their names (Priest Nikita and Maria).* “How can you, O Saint, ask my prayers, when you yourself stand at the heavenly Throne and grant to people God’s mercy?” the priest-monk asked. “Yes, that is true,” replied St. Theodosius, “but the offering at the Liturgy is more powerful than my prayer.”
Therefore, panikhidas and prayer a home for the dead are beneficial for them, as are good deeds done in their memory, such as alms or contributions to the church. But especially beneficial for them is commemoration at the Divine Liturgy. There have been many appearances of the dead and other occurrences which confirm how beneficial is the commemoration of the dead. Many who died in repentance, but who were unable to manifest this while they were alive, have been freed from tortures and have obtained repose. In the Church prayers are ever offered for the repose of the dead, and on the day of the Descent of the Holy Spirit, in the kneeling prayers at vespers, there is even a special petition “for those in hell.”
St. Gregory the Great, in answering in his Dialogues the question, “Is there anything at all that can possibly benefit souls after death?” teaches: “The Holy Sacrifice of Christ, our saving Victim, brings great benefits to souls even after death, provided their sins (are such as) can be pardoned in the life to come. For this reason the souls of the dead sometimes beg to have Liturgies offered for them … The safer course, naturally, is to do for ourselves during life what we hope others will do for us after death. It is better to make one’s exit a free man than to seek liberty after one is in chains. We should, therefore, despise this world with all our hearts as though its glory were already spent, and offer our sacrifice of tears to God each day as we immolate His sacred Flesh and Blood. This Sacrifice alone has the power of saving the soul from eternal death, for it presents to us mystically the death of the Only-begotten Son” (Dialogues IV: 57, 60, pp. 266, 272-3).
St. Gregory gives several examples of the dead appearing to the living and asking for or thanking them for the celebration of the Liturgy for their repose; once, also, a captive whom his wife believed dead and for whom she had the Liturgy celebrated on certain days, returned from captivity and told her how he had been released from his chains on some days—the very days when the Liturgy had been offered for him. (Dialogues IV: 57, 59, pp. 267, 270).
Protestants generally find the Church’s prayer for the dead to be somehow incompatible with the necessity of finding salvation first of all in this life: “If you can be saved by the Church after death, then why bother to struggle or find faith in this Life? Let us eat, drink, and be merry…” Of course, no one holding such a philosophy has ever attained salvation by the Church’s prayer, and it is evident that such an argument is quite artificial and even hypocritical. The Church’s prayer cannot save anyone who does not wish salvation, or who never offered any struggle for it himself during his lifetime. In a sense, one might say that the prayer of the Church or of individual Christians for a dead person is but another result of that person’s life: he would not be prayed for unless he had done something during his lifetime to inspire such prayer after his death.
St. Mark of Ephesus also discusses this question of the Church’s prayer for the dead and the improvement it brings in their state, citing the example of the prayer of St. Gregory the Dialogist for the Roman Emperor Trajan—a prayer inspired by a good deed of this pagan Emperor. …”
Source:
http://orthodoxinfo.com/death/excerpts_death.aspx
Conclusion
The Shepherd of Hermas Scripture clearly Points to the non-Elect Salvation Hope in ‘another place more humble (inferior)’ toward even ‘some’ of the ‘Unbaptized/Unrepentant on earth’, to quote regarding the Mystery of “the others”:
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
Can you see it?
Here is the Definition Class of the non-Christians (i.e. those unbaptized but wished to be Baptized when they heard the Gospel but changed their mind & returned to their former ways):
So,
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
a Non-Elect Salvation Hope?
“… Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. …” – Shepherd of Hermas above if they Repent during “Hell Judgment in the afterlife” but cannot be part of the ‘Elect’ (or Tower of Repentance type of Salvation) but only “… in another and much inferior place they will be laid …”.
Thus, in the Context of this “others” or non-Christians, the phrase “because they participated in the Righteous Word;” (if applicable for argument’s sake) may thus refer to them Practicing any Good Works or Good Way of Life which Corresponds to the Law of God Found in the Gospels. This Context of such “good non-Christians” being Saved in the Spirit World after their Judgment as per the Visions of Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh agree Perfectly as such a chance seems to only be given to those who had a ‘relatively good moral compass’ in life of which the measure can only be determined Fairly by our Most Perfect Saviour. Please remember that the Shepherd of Hermas Writing is Scripture and thus it is Infallible giving this Hope, right?:
We Preach this Same Hope as these Great Saints and may God have Mercy on whom He Wills (as these Saints did and Preached it as well, this Belief thus cannot be Heresy but allowed within Orthodoxy too).
Let’s end with a Mysterious but well known Orthodox Story of Blessed St. Varus which Proves this non-Christian or non-Elect Salvation Hope in the afterlife/Spirit World due to the Prayers of Christians, to quote:
“… St Varus was an officer in the Roman army in Egypt, a secret Christian, who frequently visited a group of imprisoned Christians, supplying their every need. He greatly admired their courage, feeling he would himself never have the strength to bear torture. However, through the prayers of these Christians, he finally gained courage and offered himself as a sacrifice along with them. He was cut to pieces with knives and thrown onto a dung heap, from where a Christian woman, Cleopatra, took his body secretly. Her husband was also an officer in the Roman army and had recently been killed. She was granted permission to take his body back to her home in Palestine. Instead, wishing to honour the martyr, she took the body of the holy martyr Varus, buried his relics in her family vault, and built a church there dedicated to him. Gradually he became known throughout the region as a great healer and wonderworker. Cleopatra herself prayed there frequently with great devotion, especially for her only son, John, who had just gone into the army. To her great grief, the young man died shortly afterwards and she went to the tomb, bitterly complaining that the saint had not answered her prayers. That night the saint appeared to her in a dream, together with her son, both of them radiant in glory. “You asked me to beg God to grant John whatever was most pleasing to Him and beneficial for you both. He has taken him into His heavenly army, where he serves with great joy. How can you complain? Would you rather keep him for the army of an earthly king? Your prayers to me are always remembered. Moreover I have prayed for all your relatives, buried with me in the vault, that although they died outside the Church, all their sins would be forgiven, and God has heard my prayers.” Cleopatra’s joy was unbounded, and she passed on the good news to everyone. From that revelation in her vision, the custom grew up of begging St Varus’ prayers for deceased relatives and friends, whatever their faith. Isn’t that good news for all of us converts! …”
Source:
https://www.stjohnthebaptist.org.au/en/saints/day.php?month=2&day=19&mode=xhtml
or this same story can be read in this source or forum too:
http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php?topic=14478.0
Peace to you
First Christianity Orthodox Faith includes Believing Salvation from the Lake of Fire
Says who?
This indisputable Church Father believes this Hope even for the Novatus Heretics to be Saved ‘in another place’ after the Lake of Fire punishment till the Last Penny (Luke 12:57 – 59, Matthew 18:32 – 35) followed by Purification based on 1 Corinthians 3:15 as follows, to quote:
“… And what law to me is the inhumanity of Novatus, who did not punish avarice, the second idolatry, but condemned unchastity so bitterly, as if he were fleshless and bodiless? What do you say? Are we persuading you by these words? Come, stand with us who are human beings. “Let us magnify the Lord together.” Let none of you dare to say, even if he is very confident about himself, “Do not touch me, for I am pure,” and, “Who is as pure as I?” Give us also a share in your splendor. But are we not persuading you? Then we will weep for you. So let them go, if they wish, our way and the way of Christ, but if not, let them go their own way. Perhaps hereafter they will be baptized by fire, the final baptism that is more laborious and longer, that devours matter like hay and consumes all evils like the lightest things. (39.18-19) …” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source:
https://afkimel.wordpress.com/2012/11/12/st-gregory-the-theologian-oration-40-part-3/amp/
Or in the Roman Catholic Source below too (image):
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310239.htm
Here are some of his other wise quotes, example:
“… Give something, however small, to the one in need. For it is not small to one who has nothing. Neither is it small to God, if we have given what we could. … May God preserve me from being rich while they are indigent, from enjoying robust health if I do not try to cure their diseases, from eating good food, clothing myself well and resting in my home if I do not share with them a piece of my bread and give them, in the measure of my abilities, part of my clothes and if I do not welcome them into my home … Let us treasure up in our soul some of those things which are permanent…, not of those which will forsake us and be destroyed, and which only tickle our senses for a little while. … These three things God requires of all the Baptized: right faith in the heart, truth on the tongue, temperance in the body. …” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source: https://www.azquotes.com/author/38417-Gregory_of_Nazianzus
Conclusion
Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus is Speaking of this Hope of Forgiveness remaining toward those ‘Christians who have sinned after Baptism willingly’ (whom the Novatians deny any hope of forgiveness claiming based on possibly say Hebrews 10:26 – 27) where he condemns the Novatians to the ‘Lake of Fire’ (i.e. the ‘Last Baptism’ by Fire for such an equivalent unforgiveness type heresy, an authority based on John 20:23) which is not forever but till the last penny & purifies thereafter as his words ” … which is more painful and longer [NOT forever] …” in “… but if they will not, let them go their own. Perhaps in it they [Novatian Heretics] will be baptized with Fire, in that last Baptism which is more painful and longer, which devours wood like grass, 1 Corinthians 3:12-19 and consumes the stubble of every evil….” below mean when quoted in full, please consider carefully:
“… XIX. But these sins were not after Baptism, you will say. Where is your proof? Either prove it — or refrain from condemning; and if there be any doubt, let charity prevail. But Novatus, you say, would not receive those who lapsed in the persecution. What do you mean by this? If they were unrepentant he was right; I too would refuse to receive those who either would not stoop at all or not sufficiently, and who would refuse to make their amendment counterbalance their sin; and when I do receive them, I will assign them their proper place; but if he refused those who wore themselves away with weeping, I will not imitate him. And why should Novatus’s want of charity be a rule for me? He never punished covetousness, which is a second idolatry; but he condemned fornication as though he himself were not flesh and body. What say you? Are we convincing you by these words? Come and stand here on our side, that is, on the side of humanity. Let us magnify the Lord together. Let none of you, even though he has much confidence in himself, dare to say, Touch me not for I am pure, and who is so pure as I? Give us too a share in your brightness. But perhaps we are not convincing you? Then we will weep for you. Let these men then if they will, follow our way, which is Christ’s way; but if they will not, let them go their own. Perhaps in it they will be baptized with Fire, in that last Baptism which is more painful and longer, which devours wood like grass, 1 Corinthians 3:12-19 and consumes the stubble of every evil….” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source [ Oration 39, Chapter XIX, Oration on the Holy Lights. The Oration on the Holy Lights was preached on the Festival of the Epiphany 381, and was followed the next day by that on Baptism.]:
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310239.htm
How about Holy Scripture?
The First Christianity Scriptural Hope of Salvation from the Lake of Fire is not just based on Luke 12:57 – 59 or Matthew 18:32 – 35’s ’till the last penny limit set by our Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ’ but also based on 1 Corinthians 3:15 which says that such an “unsaved” (judged/condemned person in the Lake of Fire) may be “saved by fire” [Context Note: Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus clearly sets 1 Corinthians 3:15’s Context to refer to the Lake of Fire for ‘Novatian Heretics’ in his quote prior too].
Apart from that, if you look at the First Bibles of Christianity [i.e. (the Muratorian or Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus Canon in the East], the ‘Apocalypse of Peter Book was also considered Canonical Scripture at the Same Level as the Book of Revelation or Apocalypse of John where it too has the ‘Christ Saving from the Lake of Fire (Gehenna) Prophecy’ as discussed in detail in previous posts, for example:
“There is a great deal more of the Ethiopic text, but it is very evidently of later date; the next words are: Next: ‘ The Father hath committed all judgement unto the Son.’ The destiny of sinners -their eternal [AGE-DURING] doom- is more than Peter can endure: he appeals to Christ to have pity on them. And my Lord answered me and said to me: ‘Hast thou understood that which I said unto thee before? It is permitted unto thee to know that concerning which thou askest: but thou must not tell that which thou hearest unto the sinners lest they transgress the more, and sin.’ Peter weeps many hours, and is at last consoled by an answer which, though exceedingly diffuse and vague does seem to promise ultimate pardon for all: ‘My Father will give unto them all the life, the glory, and the kingdom that passeth not away,’ . . . ‘It is because of them that have believed in Me that I am come. It is also because of them that have believed in Me, that, at their word, I shall have pity on men.’ The doctrine that sinners will be saved at last by the prayers of the righteous is, rather obscurely, enunciated in the Second Book of the Sibylline Oracles (a paraphrase, in this part, of the Apocalypse), and in the (Coptic) Apocalypse of Elias (see post). Ultimately Peter orders Clement to hide this revelation in a box, that foolish men may not see it. The passage in the Second Book of the Sibylline Oracles which seems to point to the ultimate salvation of all sinners will be found in the last lines of the translation given below.”
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/apocalypsepeter-mrjames.html
Comment: Example from Blessed St. John Chrysostom Homily 21 on Acts ch 9 (347-407 ad) regarding ‘Salvation from the Second Death which is to come Hope’, to quote:
“… more sins he has to answer for, the greater need has he of alms, not only for this reason, but because the alms has not the. same virtue now, but far less: for it is not all one to have done it himself, and to have another do it for him; therefore, the virtue being less, let us by quantity make it the greatest. Let us not busy ourselves about monuments, not about memorials. This is the greatest memorial: set widows to stand around him. Tell them his name: bid them all make for him their prayers, their supplications: this will overcome God: though it have not been done by the man himself, yet because of him another is the author of the almsgiving. Even this pertains to the mercy of God: “widows standing around and weeping” know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come. Many have profited even by the alms done by others on their behalf: for even if they have not got perfect (deliverance), at least they have found some comfort thence. If it be not so, how are children saved? And yet there, the children themselves contribute nothing, but their parents do all: and often have women had their children given them, though the children themselves contributed nothing. Many are the ways God gives us to be saved, only let us not be negligent.. … How then if one be poor? say you. Again I say, the greatness of the alms is not estimated by the quantity given, but by the purpose. Only give not less than thine ability, and thou hast paid all. How then, say you, if he be desolate and a stranger, and have none to care for him? And why is it that he has none, I ask you? In this very thing thou sufferest thy desert, that thou hast none to be thus thy friend, thus virtuous. This is so ordered on purpose that, though we be not ourselves virtuous, we may study to have virtuous companions and friends-both wife, and son, and friend-as reaping some good even through them, a slight gain indeed, but yet a gain. If thou make it thy chief object not to marry a rich wife,(27) but to have a devout wife, and a religious daughter, thou shall gain this consolation; if thou study to have thy son not rich but devout, thou shall also gain this consolation. If thou make these thine objects then wilt thyself be such as they. This also is part of virtue, to choose such friends, and such a wife and children. Not in vain are the oblations made for the departed, not in vain the prayers, not in vain the almsdeeds: all those things hath the Spirit ordered,(28) wishing us to be benefited one by the other. See: he is benefited, thou art benefited: because of him, thou hast despised wealth, being set on to do some generous act: both thou art the means of salvation to him, and he to thee the occasion of thine almsgiving. Doubt not that he shall get some good thereby. It is not for nothing that the Deacon cries, “For them that are fallen asleep in Christ, and for them that make the memorials for them.” It is not the Deacon that utters this voice, but the Holy Ghost: I speak of the Gift. What sayest thou? There is the Sacrifice in hand, and all things laid out duly ordered: Angels are there present, Archangels, the Son of God is there: all stand with such awe, and in the general silence those stand by, crying aloud: and thinkest thou that what is done, is done in vain? … ” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Archbishop of Constantinople, Doctor of the Church (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD)
Source [ Homily XXI, on ACTS IX. 26, 27 ]:
Note: The quote “…know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come …” by Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD) seems to point to the [Second] Death in light of this Almsgiving Context in his writings especially the phrase “… rescue, not … the present death, but from that which is to come [Second Death] …”.
Peace to you
Bible Verses only – Possible Sola Scriptura Hope Beyond Hell?
Hell is Real, we don’t deny that.
1) We also read that Christ also has Saved formerly disobedient spirits from the prisons of Hell after they did their time (those who ignored the ‘Preaching of Noah’ in the past) as 1 Peter 3:17 – 20 reveals.
“17For it is better to suffer for doing good, if the will of God wills it, than doing evil, 18because Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, so that He might bring you to God, having been put to death indeed in the flesh, but having been made alive in the spirit, 19in which also having gone, He preached to the spirits in prison 20at one time having disobeyed, when the longsuffering of God was waiting in the days of Noah, of the ark being prepared, in which a few—that is, eight souls—were saved through water,” (1 Peter 3:17 – 20, Berean Literal Bible)
2) The Gospel is also Preached to the dead (1 Peter 4:6) where the dead in Verse 6 is exactly the ‘same dead’ in 1 Peter 4:5 (Context).
“5who will give account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead. 6For to this end the gospel was proclaimed even to the dead, so that they might be judged indeed according to men in the flesh, but they might live in the spirit according to God.” (1 Peter 4:5 – 6, Berean Literal Bible)
3) The Bible Verses below may refer to this Spirit World Salvation of such non-Christians by His Grace after they had endured their Judgments there first accordingly for ‘spurning on His Word’ and ‘had rebelled against the words of God’ first:
“There were those who dwelt in darkness and in the shadow of death, Prisoners in misery and chains, Because they had rebelled against the words of God and spurned the counsel of the Most High. Therefore He humbled their heart with labor; They stumbled and there was none to help. Then they cried out to the LORD in their trouble; He saved them out of their distresses. He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death and broke their bands apart. Let them give thanks to the LORD for His lovingkindness, And for His wonders to the sons of men!.” (Psalm 107:10 – 15, NASB)
The Phrase ‘Shadow of Death’ in Verses above Prove that this is the ‘Afterlife or Spirit World Context’ and so the Bible Verses above clearly Describe afterlife Salvation toward those wicked (i.e. those who rebelled against God too & went to ‘Hell-Hades’ or ‘Punishment Regions called the Shadow of Death in the above’), Verses (please note the Phrase ‘Shadow of Death’ Carefully in each of these Holy Scripture):
“19I would have been as though I had not been.
I would have been carried from the womb to the grave.
20Are not my days few?
Cease! Leave me alone, that I may take a little comfort,
21Before I go to the place from which I shall not return,
To the land of darkness and the shadow of death,
22A land as dark as darkness itself,
As the shadow of death, without any order,
Where even the light is like darkness.’ ” (Job 10:19 – 22, NKJV)
“Have the gates of death been revealed to you? Or have you seen the doors of the shadow of death?” – God Himself Defines this Context that the ‘Shadow of Death’ refers to the ‘Spirit World’ (in Job 38:17, NKJV)
Peace to you
God’s Mercy can Triumph over Judgment (James 2:13) but being Saved there does not make one to share any inheritance in His Kingdom but may be placed in some outside regions as the Books such as the Shepherd of Hermas & Apocalypse of Peter which “Scripture” in the First Bibles of Christianity have Testified as discussed in previous essays with proof quotes and sources for each claim made.
The smoke of their torment is said to rise to the “ages of Ages” (and not forever as translated often, Revelation 14:11). Even then, God’s Mercy to All including the enemies of the Gospel and the disobedient (Romans 11:26 – 32) can cancel the ‘Eternal’ Judgment Sentence as He also Says that All sins will be Forgiven of men eventually (Matthew 12:31) except the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit which is not forgiven to two ages (Matthew 12:32) but there are “ages to come” after that where His Mercy can be shown if He Wills (Ephesians 2:7) as discussed in link above in many aspects.
Unbelief Overcome by the Faith of God
Here are some edifying comments regarding these Verses discussed earlier:
In Psalm 105, Verses 1 – 3 is about the living yes. Examples:
“Some wandered in desert wastelands…” v.4
“Some sat in darkness, in utter darkness…”v.10
“Some became fools through their rebellious ways…” v.17
“Some went out on the sea in ships…” v.23
The entire chapter of psalm 105 speaks of various cases of God’s Redemption where in verses 10 – 15 the Redemption of those dwelling in the “Shadow of Death” in “chains” referring to the ‘Spirit World’ as the Verses in Job have shown is Presented in Holy Scripture (Job 10:19 – 22, Job 38:17). It’s amazing how we miss it.
John 6:40 Speaks of believing after Seeing Hope till the Last Day where such may believe after seeing in the afterlife as 1 Peter 3:18 – 20 and 1 Peter 4:5 – 6 imply.
Note that 1 Peter 4:1 – 4 speaks of the ‘spiritually dead’ but 1 Peter 4:5 Speaks of the spiritually dead to be judged after they have died literally (physically being called ‘the dead’ in 1 Peter 4/:5 now) in Christ’s Tribunal where in 1 Peter 4:6 this is the ‘same dead’ in 1 Peter 4:5 (referring to the physically dead unrepentant ones) who may hear the Gospel there & live to the spirit but must be Judged there first in the afterlife (in 1 Peter 4:6, Hebrews 9:27).
iii. Faith of God = Faith of Jesus Christ Mystery – Romans 3:3 – 4, Romans 3:22, Romans 11:32
Yes, God’s Will will Come to Pass Overcoming any Unbelief as His Faith (literally “Faith of God” in Verse below) will Cause it to be Done:
” 3For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the Faith of God without effect? 4God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That Thou [God] mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when Thou [God] art judged.” (Romans 3:3 – 4, KJV)
[Emphasis Mine]
Now, God’s Mercy is Promised toward “all in unbelief” too in Romans 11:30 -32 (in KJV translation manuscripts) debunking the ‘myth of no hope for those in unbelief’ as also ‘unbelief cannot Stop the Will of God to be Done by the Faith of God’ (by His Action Alone, His Sovereignty in Romans 3:3 – 4, KJV).
“Even the Righteousness of God which is by Faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference” – apostle Paul (Romans 3:22, KJV)
In fact, this rarely known accuracy seemed to have been uttered by this great early Church father too, to quote:
“… , one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.3, Pages 498 – 499)
Source:
This Context is further strengthened by St. Epiphanius’ own quote above regarding the “Faith of Jesus Christ” (Christ’s Faith to Justify all, Romans 3:22, not our ‘faith in Christ’, in contrast Romans 3:3 – 4) in quote below:
“… For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
The phrase “For its own glory and faith” implies that “its own Faith” = “Christ’s Faith” = the “Faith of Jesus Christ” in Romans 3:22-KJV toward “All” & “those who believe”, two different types of Salvation (the non-Elect Salvation* vs the Elect Salvation may be inferred here) and not by our faith we are justified but by His Faith where we become the first recipients of It when we believe first reaping Imperishable Rewards, Romans 3:26.
So, St. Epiphanius writes that by “His Faith” Christ makes even the “things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth (Hell)” as one, yes as He “makes these three one” and “For its [His] own glory and faith”. So, each of the “Justification of faith for all men (all mankind)” eventually must thus refer to “His Faith” which is the Free Gift of God to all (Romans 3:22 – 24) and ‘not our faith as popularly assumed’, i. e. not of anything of ourselves including not our faith too for Salvation by His Mercy (Ephesians 2:8).
*The non-Elect Salvation has been Seen in both the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture and Apocalypse of Peter Scripture in the First Bibles of Christianity (i.e. the Muratorian/Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus in the East) where these do “not” inherit the Kingdom of God regions but may be placed in some “outside” regions upon being Saved.
Conclusion – Mercy Triumphs Over Judgment
And that’s Exactly the Conclusion of the Judgment of God as Blessed Apostle St. Paul himself declared in Romans 9 – 11 (describing Judgment First but Mercy having been shown in the End – Please note that Forgiveness can be Granted Before Judgment as it’s the case of Christians in John 5:24 while for the rest it can be Granted by His Mercy anytime while Judgment is carried on till the last penny or after that, James 2:13, Luke 12:57 – 59). Here’s the Verse that Mercy can be Granted by God toward “All in Unbelief” meaning that they can be Forgiven as ‘Mercy implies Forgiveness’ at the point when it is Granted:
“32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.” (Romans 11:32)
Context: The “all in unbelief” mentioned in Romans 11:32 is the ‘same all who will never believe in the Gospel on earth (Romans 11:30 – 31) referring primarily to the Jewish enemies of the Gospel (Romans 11:28) who are thus implied to be Saved as part of ‘All Israel’ (Romans 11:26) in some future time as the Gift & Calling of God especially for the sake of the ‘fathers’ toward them cannot revoked (Romans 11:29, Romans 11:11 – 12) despite Judgment first for their unbelief/disobedience (e.g. Romans 11:7 – 10 first) as this is a ‘Secret/Mystery’ (Romans 11:25). These Verses in Full, please read ‘carefully’:
“25For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. 26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 27For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. 28As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. 29For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. 30For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.” (Romans 11:25 – 32, KJV)
I am not doing any private interpretation (2 Peter 1:20) of say Romans 11:25 – 32 as this is what this Great Champion/Defender of Trinity in First Christianity Preached as the meaning of these Verses too, to quote:
“… When authorities and powers are abolished, His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. The same Apostle tells who are these enemies, As touching the Gospel they are enemies for your sakes, but as touching the election they are beloved for the fathers’ sake . We remember that they are enemies of the cross of Christ; let us remember also that, because they are beloved for the fathers’ sake, they are reserved for the subjection, as the Apostle says, I would not, brethren, have you ignorant of this mystery, lest ye be wise in your own conceits, that a hardening in part hath befallen Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved, even as it is written, There shall come out of Sion a Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: and this is the covenant firm Me to them, when I have taken away their sins . So His enemies shall be subjected under His feet. But we must not forget what follows the subjection, namely, Last of all is death conquered by Him 1284 . This victory over death is nothing else than the resurrection from the dead: for when the corruption of death is stayed, the quickened and now heavenly nature is made eternal, as it is written, For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. But when this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in strife. O death, where is thy sting? O death, where is thy strife ? In the subjection of His enemies death is conquered; and, death conquered, life immortal follows…” Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD, Book XI ‘On the Trinity’, Points 34 – 35, Page 481**)
Source:
Peace to you
Romans 3:22 – Faith of Jesus Christ Mystery
The image shows a page from the NKJV Interlinnear of the Original Greek Bible (Romans 3:21 – 24).
Please note that in these Manuscripts (e. g. used by the King James Version or KJV translations), the word “and” (or ‘Kai’) in Koine Greek exists.
“Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:” (Romans 3:22, KJV)
1) The word “and” implies that two Justifications are Spoken of by the Faith of Jesus Christ here namely,
“toward all” (General Salvation, non-Elect Salvation included)
And
“toward those who believe” (Elect Salvation)
2) A similar phrase may be seen in 1 Timothy 4:10.
“For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.” (1 Timothy 4:10, KJV)
The phrase “those who believe” is the one which refers to Christians only while “all men” includes all of mankind. Please note that if Blessed St. Paul the Apostle wanted to refer to justification by Faith of Jesus Christ Applying only to Christians, he must have just Written the following for the two quoted Verses:
“Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto … all them that believe: for there is no difference:” (NOT Written in the Original Koine Greek Bible for Romans 3:22, KJV’s Majority Manuscript)
“For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of … specially of those that believe.” (NOT Written in the Original Koine Greek Bible for 1 Timothy 4:10, KJV’s Majority Manuscript)
Since he didn’t write that, the meanings for the word “all” and “all men” in Romans 3:22 and 1 Timothy 4:10 may be lost if we read it as above only.
Conclusion
Perhaps Patristic Universalism quotes by early Church Leaders/Fathers makes sense as they may have understood it to such accuracy being the Real Experts in Koine Greek (not necessarily in secular education view but in that they were Chosen of God), to quote an example:
Christ Draws (Drags as in Catching Fish in a Net as it means in Koine Greek) ‘All Men’ as St. Ignatius applies the General Word ‘Draw All’ or ‘Draw All things’ in John 12:32 to the Subset of ‘All Men’ as follows:
“… and once more, “If I be lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men unto Me [John 12:32].” The Word therefore did dwell in flesh, for “Wisdom built herself an house.” The Word raised up again His own temple on the third day, when it had been destroyed by the Jews fighting against Christ. The Word, when His flesh was lifted up, after the manner of the brazen serpent in the wilderness [John 3:14], drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation [John 12:32]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Smyrnaeans, Chapter II)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-smyrnaeans-longer.html
Please notice carefully that St. Ignatius mentions that this ‘Drawing of All [Men]’ by Christ in John 12:32 results in the Final Salvation of ‘All Men’, in his words, “… drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation…” as Stated in a past tense Prophetically as a Done Reality to Him.
Perfection of God Means God Saves ‘All Men’ eventually as Basic or General Salvation is likened to the ‘Rain falling both on the Just & Unjust’ and so ‘enmity on account of faith is with Love’
“… ” You ought therefore to “hate those that hate God, and to waste away [with grief] on account of His enemies.” I do not mean that you should beat them or persecute them, as do the Gentiles “that know not the Lord and God; ” but that you should regard them as your enemies, and separate yourselves from them, while yet you admonish them, and exhort them to repentance, if it may be they will hear, if it may be they will submit themselves. For our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth.” [1 Timothy 2:4] Wherefore “He makes His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; ” of whose kindness the Lord, wishing us also to be imitators, says, “Be ye perfect, even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect.” [Matthew 5:44 – 48]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Philadelphians, Chapter III)
Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-philadelphians-longer.html
Context: The phrase “… our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved … His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; …even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect…” clearly Proves that St. Ignatius Believes that ‘All Men’ (in the Context of ‘God being a Lover of Mankind’, hence it means all human beings ever created) will be Saved eventually.
Peace to you
Shadow of Death – does it refer to the Spirit World or here?
Brief Explanation
Psalm 107:10 – 15 is afterlife Salvation as it describes in “chains” (hell description) .
Psalm 23’s Shadow of Death is ‘afterlife’ as Blessed Patriarch David says he is not afraid of that if God is with him as he often Speaks Prophetically on behalf of those in Hell or in comparison too, e.g. Psalm 139:8.
Psalm 44:19 refers to the “Place of Dragons” literally (KJV) where it refers to afterlife Judgment to those being broken there.
Interestingly Job, Irenaeous of Lyons and God Himself defined the ‘Shadow of Death’ to refer to the ‘Spirit World’ in quotes next.
Details:
“19I would have been as though I had not been.
I would have been carried from the womb to the grave.
20Are not my days few?
Cease! Leave me alone, that I may take a little comfort,
21Before I go to the place from which I shall not return,
To the land of darkness and the shadow of death,
22A land as dark as darkness itself,
As the shadow of death, without any order,
Where even the light is like darkness.’ ” (Job 10:19 – 22, NKJV)
“… For as the Lord “WENT AWAY in the midst of the SHADOW of DEATH” [Ps. 23:4, Ps 107:10 – 15], WHERE the SOULS of the DEAD were, …” – St. Irenaeous of Lyons, Hearer of St. Polycarp who was a Disciple of St. John the Apostle who wrote the Book of Revelation (‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter XXXI:2).
Source: http://www.regels.org/Irenaeus-Millennarism.htm
iii. God
“Have the gates of death been revealed to you? Or have you seen the doors of the shadow of death?” – God Himself Defines this Context that the ‘Shadow of Death’ refers to the ‘Spirit World’ (in Job 38:17, NKJV)
“There were those who dwelt in darkness and in the shadow of death, Prisoners in misery and chains, Because they had rebelled against the words of God and spurned the counsel of the Most High. Therefore He humbled their heart with labor; They stumbled and there was none to help. Then they cried out to the LORD in their trouble; He saved them out of their distresses. He brought them out of darkness and the shadow of death and broke their bands apart. Let them give thanks to the LORD for His lovingkindness, And for His wonders to the sons of men!.” (Psalm 107:10 – 15, NASB)
“… 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts. … ” – Shepherd of Hermas (Vision 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd-lightfoot.html
Note: This is a “non-Elect Salvation” because these repenting later ones amongst the rejected stones (or parabolically people) are not part of the ‘Tower of Repentance’ (i. e. the church) and after being Saved after Judgment till the last penny (in the afterlife, Luke 12:57 – 59) such ones are placed in “another place more humble” (hence clearly not an Elect Salvation – as you may read in the Shepherd of Hermas Translations in link provided above).
If you can’t believe it’s okay.
I will believe Job, Irenaeous of Lyons, and God Himself Who clearly referred to the phrase “Shadow of Death” as pointing to the ‘Spirit World’ as quoted above.
Let’s not forget Post-Mortem Salvation in the Spirit World as Described in 1 Peter 3:18 – 20 and 1 Peter 4:5 – 6 too.
Also, Even the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture proves that post mortem non-elect Salvation is true as shown above too (the ‘Shepherd of Hermas’ is a Vision/ Book endorsed by all in First Christianity from Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, Tertullian, Pope Callixtus I, St. Clement of Alexandria to the Muratorian/Roman Canon to Codex Claromontanus; it is also approved by Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, Eusebius and Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy till today as discussed in many of my previous posts at www.AnonymousChristian.org).
In fact, I went through every single Occurrence of that same Hebrew phrase meaning ‘Shadow of Death’ (occurring in Psalm 107:10 – 15 equivalent in all sense/linguistic particulars) in the Bible and saw that the ‘Spirit World’ Context fits perfectly with no contradictions as discussed in these two previous posts for edification:
2) https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/hells-missed-messianic-prophecy-shadow-of-death/
Indeed, God’s Saving Power has No Limits:
“… When He commands, His every purpose is fulfilled, and none can limit His saving power. …” (Sirach 39:18, NRSVCE)
Yes, the New Testament Reveals that Christ’s Redemptive Work applies into the “Shadow of Death” Spirit World Regions too as these Verses Reveal:
“The people who sat in darkness have seen a great light, And upon those who sat in the region and shadow of death Light has dawned.” (Matthew 4:16, NKJV)
“To give light to those who sit in darkness and the shadow of death, To guide our feet into the way of peace.”” (Luke 1:79, NKJV)
“The people who walked in darkness Have seen a great light; Those who dwelt in the land of the shadow of death, Upon them a light has shined.” (Isaiah 9:2, NKJV)
First Christianity Example – St. Cyril of Alexandria fully affirms that the Context of 1 Peter 3:19 – 20 refers to Christ Saving in Hell toward the Wicked too, to quote:
“… What occasion will we still have for weeping? On the contrary, will not what has happened to us, thanks to the Savior, cause us boundless rejoicing? He it was Who showed the way of salvation not only to us, but also went as herald to the once disobedient spirits of the underworld, as Peter says (1 Pet. 3:19-20). For it would not have done for His loving-kindness to be shown only to some; the manifestation of the gift had to extended to all of nature. For He spoke opportunely through the Prophets, “One part shall be rained upon, and the part on which I shall not rain shall be dried up.” (Amos 4:7) But the word which befits the Savior is: “Come to me, all you who labor and are weary, and I will give you rest.” (Mt. 11:28) Having proclaimed His message, then, to the spirits in the underworld and having said to those in fetters, “Come forth!” and to those in darkness, “Show yourselves!” (cf. Isa. 49:9) He raised up the temple of Himself in three days, (cf. Jn. 2:19) and renewed for nature even the ascent into heaven, presenting Himelf to the Father as a kind of first-fruits of humanity, having endowed those on earth with a share of the Spirit as a pledge of grace. (cf. 2 Cor. 5:5) (Festal Letter 2.8) …” …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD)
Source: https://classicalchristianity.com/category/holyfathers/post-mortem/
Peace to you
How did Blessed St. Irenaeous himself understand the phrase ages of Ages?
Bible Occurrences of the Koine Greek phrase “aeons of Aeons” (or “ages of Ages” translated often as an idiom to mean “forever and ever” – are we over translating it?), to quote:
“And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.” (Revelation 14:11, NKJV)
or in another translation:
“and the smoke of their torment doth go up to ages of ages; and they have no rest day and night, who are bowing before the beast and his image, also if any doth receive the mark of his name.” (Revelation 14:11, YLT)
The Biblical Concept that there are AGES to COME literally (Ephesians 2:7) is supported by St. Irenaeous himself (who was a direct Disciple of St. Polycarp who in turn was a Disciple of the Blessed St. John the apostle himself) apart from the Blessed ArchBishop St. Ambrose of Milan too Affirming it from Western Christianity, to quote:
“… we [True Christians] ourselves, when at the giving of thanks we pronounce the words, “To Aeons of Aeons” [Revelation 20:10] do set forth these Aeons. And, in fine, wherever the words Aeon or Aeons occur, they at once refer them to these beings.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Chapter III, Book I)
Translation Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book1.html
Comment: St. Irenaeous clearly refers to time as the “Aeon” (singular) and “Aeons” (Plural) in his last quote above & dispels the Gnostic Myth that these refer to some creatures (beings).
It is obvious that St. Epiphanius is revealing that eternity is a ‘long series of ages (aeons)’ as his phrase “eternal ages” means which is further broken up to some special highlight of certain focus ages such as the “ages of Ages” and the general succession of one age which terminates and is followed by another is exemplified in the phrase “ages” as it was with the “past ages” (Colossians 1:26, Ephesians 3:5) & so it will be into the future too always toward all created things as this is confirmed further in agreement of definition to the First Christianity quote below too:
“… But ALL THINGS which proceed from Him, WHATSOEVER have been MADE, and are made, do indeed receive their own beginning of generation, and on this account are INFERIOR to Him who formed them, inasmuch as they are not unbegotten. Nevertheless THEY ENDURE, and EXTEND their EXISTENCE into a LONG SERIES of AGES [Aeons, Aeon1, Aeon2, Aeon3, …] in accordance with the WILL of GOD their Creator; so that He GRANTS them that they should be thus formed at the beginning, and that they should so exist afterwards.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Chapter XXXIV, Point 2)
Translation Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
[Emphasis Mine throughout]
I think that Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons has been misrepresented to teach ‘annihilation’ based on his quotes below:
“…2. … Nevertheless they endure, and extend their existence into a long series of ages in accordance with the will of God their Creator; so that He grants them that they should be thus formed at the beginning, and that they should so exist afterwards. 3. For as the heaven which is above us, the firmament, the sun, the moon, the rest of the stars, and all their grandeur, although they had no previous existence, were called into being, and continue throughout a long course of time according to the will of God, so also any one who thinks thus respecting souls and spirits, and, in fact, respecting all created things, will not by any means go far astray, inasmuch as all things that have been made had a beginning when they were formed, but endure as long as God wills that they should have an existence and continuance. The prophetic Spirit bears testimony to these opinions, when He declares, “For He spake, and they were made; He commanded, and they were created: He hath established them for ever, yea, forever and ever.” And again, He thus speaks respecting the salvation of man: “He asked life of Thee, and Thou gavest him length of days for ever and ever; ” indicating that it is the Father of all who imparts continuance for ever and ever on those who are saved. For life does not arise from us, nor from our own nature; but it is bestowed according to the grace of God. And therefore he who shall preserve the life bestowed upon him, and give thanks to Him who imparted it, shall receive also length of days for ever and ever. But he who shall reject it, and prove himself ungrateful to his Maker, inasmuch as he has been created, and has not recognised Him who bestowed [the gift upon him], deprives himself of [the privilege of] continuance for ever and ever. And, for this reason, the Lord declared to those who showed themselves ungrateful towards Him: “If ye have not been faithful in that which is little, who will give you that which is great? ” indicating that those who, in this brief temporal life, have shown themselves ungrateful to Him who bestowed it, shall justly not receive from Him length of days for ever and ever. 4. But as the animal body is certainly not itself the soul, yet has fellowship with the soul as long as God pleases; so the soul herself is not life, but partakes in that life bestowed upon her by God. Wherefore also the prophetic word declares of the first-formed man, “He became a living soul,” teaching us that by the participation of life the soul became alive; so that the soul, and the life which it possesses, must be understood as being separate existences. When God therefore bestows life and perpetual duration, it comes to pass that even souls which did not previously exist should henceforth endure [for ever], since God has both willed that they should exist, and should continue in existence. For the will of God ought to govern and rule in all things, while all other things give way to Him, are in subjection, and devoted to His service. Thus far, then, let me speak concerning the creation and the continued duration of the soul. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Chapter XXXIV, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Points 2, 3, 4)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
Please consider the explanations below:
“… But he who shall reject it, and prove himself ungrateful to his Maker, inasmuch as he has been created, and has not recognised Him who bestowed [the gift upon him], deprives himself of [the privilege of] continuance for ever and ever [literally, ‘to the ages of Ages’]. And, for this reason, the Lord declared to those who showed themselves ungrateful towards Him: “If ye have not been faithful in that which is little, who will give you that which is great? ” indicating that those who, in this brief temporal life, have shown themselves ungrateful to Him who bestowed it, shall justly not receive from Him length of days for ever and ever. [literally, ‘to the ages of Ages’] …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons
iii. The continuance in the ‘length of days to the ages of Ages’ denied to the Wicked means that the Wicked remain in a soul/spirit state as they are not made alive (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 23) yet by God’s Grace in the sense that they have not been Resurrected in a Perfect Body as Blessed St. Irenaeous’ quote above seem to imply:
“…4. But as the animal body is certainly not itself the soul, yet has fellowship with the soul as long as God pleases; so the soul herself is not life, but partakes in that life bestowed upon her by God. Wherefore also the prophetic word declares of the first-formed man, “He became a living soul,” teaching us that by the participation of life the soul became alive; …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons
Please notice carefully that the “soul becoming alive” has to do with it gaining a “body” as the “soul herself is not life” as Blessed St. Irenaeous clearly explains above using the past example of the “living soul” of the First Man formed likewise too in analogy.
“… Proclaimed through the prophets the dispensations of God, and the advents, and the birth from a virgin, and the passion, and the resurrection from the dead, and the ascension into heaven in the flesh of the beloved Christ Jesus, our Lord, and His [FUTURE] manifestation from heaven in the glory of the Father “to GATHER ALL THINGS in ONE,” and to RAISE UP ANEW ALL FLESH of the WHOLE HUMAN RACE, in order that to Christ Jesus, our Lord, and God, and Saviour, and King, according to the will of the invisible Father, “every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and THINGS UNDER the EARTH [Hell], and that every tongue should confess” to Him, …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Chapter X, ‘Against Heresies’, Book I, Point 1)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book1.html
“… He pitied him [MAN], [and did NOT desire] that he [MAN] should continue a sinner for ever [to the AGE, AEON], NOR that the SIN which surrounded him should be IMMORTAL, and EVIL INTERMINABLE and IRREMEDIABLE. … and thus causing sin to cease, putting an END to it by the DISSOLUTION of the FLESH, which should take place in the earth, so that MAN, CEASING at length to live to SIN, and dying to it, might begin to live to God… ADAM received NEW LIFE; and the LAST ENEMY, DEATH, is DESTROYED, which at the first had taken possession of MAN. Therefore, WHEN MAN has been LIBERATED, “… HIS SALVATION is DEATH’s DESTRUCTION. When therefore the Lord VIVIFIES MAN, that is, ADAM, DEATH is at the same time DESTROYED” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’ Book 3, Chapter XXIII, Point 6, Point 7)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
Yes, St. Irenaeous calls it “DISSOLUTION of the FLESH” in the above (Context Discussed later below too) = “Resurrection of Judgment for the Wicked” (John 5:28 – 29) = “JUDGED in the FLESH” (1 Peter 4:6) = “DESTRUCTION of the FLESH” (1 Corinthians 5:5) = St. Justin Martyr calls it “DISSOLUTION by God of things CORRUPTIBLE (all SIN and EVIL)”, Context linking these together.
Here’s another quote from Blessed St. Irenaeous pointing to “Man” (in General, i.e. all mankind) somehow being brought to “Maturity” in some “future time”:
“…The Lord has therefore endured all these things on our behalf, in order that we, having been instructed by means of them all, may be in all respects circumspect for the TIME TO COME and that, having been RATIONALLY taught to love God, we may continue in His perfect love: for God has displayed LONG-SUFFERING in the case of MAN’s APOSTASY; while man has been instructed by means of it, as also the prophet says, “THINE OWN APOSTASY shall HEAL THEE; ”
God thus DETERMINING ALL THINGS BEFOREHAND [Ephesians 1:11] for the BRINGING of MAN to PERFECTION [Ephesians 1:9 – 10], for his edification, and for the revelation of His DISPENSATIONS, that goodness may both be made apparent, and righteousness perfected, and that the CHURCH may be FASHIONED after the IMAGE of His Son, and that MAN may FINALLY be brought to MATURITY at SOME FUTURE TIME, becoming ripe through such privileges to see and comprehend God …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Book 4, Chapter XXXVII)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book4.html
Highlight, how does this FREE WILL part eventually leads to UNIVERSAL SALVATION for ALL MEN in St. Irenaeous’ own words above?
God has displayed LONG-SUFFERING in the case of MAN’s APOSTASY [This is how Irenaeous understands 2 Peter 3:15] —> “THINE OWN APOSTASY shall HEAL THEE” —-> God thus DETERMINING ALL THINGS BEFOREHAND [Ephesians 1:11] —> for the BRINGING of MAN to PERFECTION [Ephesians 1:9 – 10] —> for the revelation of His DISPENSATIONS [‘times’, Acts 3:21, 1 Timothy 2:6, Ephesians 1:9] —> MAN [All Men, Collectively Spoken] may FINALLY be brought to MATURITY [Saved, Restored to Perfection] at SOME FUTURE TIME [in the “Ages or AEONS to come” – Ephesians 2:7]. Please note the reason why God allowed Apostasy —> namely to HEAL ALL who are held in Apostasy first –> so, there is NO ETERNAL APOSTASY in an ETERNAL HELL or ANNIHILATION without RESTORATION of HEALING type of APOSTASY —> Can you REALLY SEE this ONLY BIBLICAL TRUTH? —> as St. Irenaeous’ Phrase ‘THINE OWN APOSTASY shall HEAL THEE’ means IRREFUTABLY. Isn’t God Alone Good? Yes, (Mark 10:18).
“…1. The Lord has taught with very great fulness, that souls not only continue to exist, not by passing from body to body, but that they preserve the same form [in their separate state] as the body had to which they were adapted, and that they remember the deeds which they did in this state of existence, and from which they have now ceased,-in that narrative which is recorded respecting the rich man and that Lazarus who found repose in the bosom of Abraham. In this account He states that Dives knew Lazarus after death, and Abraham in like manner, and that each one of these persons continued in his own proper position, and that [Dives] requested Lazarus to be sent to relieve him-[Lazarus], on whom he did not [formerly] bestow even the crumbs [which fell] from his table. [He tells us] also of the answer given by Abraham, who was acquainted not only with what respected himself, but Dives also, and who enjoined those who did not wish to come into that place of torment to believe Moses and the prophets, and to receive the preaching of Him who was to rise again from the dead. By these things, then, it is plainly declared that souls continue to exist that they do not pass from body to body, that they possess the form of a man, so that they may be recognised, and retain the memory of things in this world; moreover, that the gift of prophecy was possessed by Abraham, and that each class of souls] receives a habitation such as it has deserved, even before the judgment. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Chapter XXXIV, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Point 1)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
“… For Paul does not say, “the God of this world [AGE, AEON],” as if recognising any other beyond Him; but he confessed God as indeed God. And he [apostle Paul] says, “the UNBELIEVERS of this world [AGE, AEON],” because they [UNBELIEVERS] shall NOT INHERIT the FUTURE AGE [AEON] of incorruption [SINLESSNESS] …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Chapter XXXIV, ‘Against Heresies’, Book III, Chapter VII, Point 1)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
Indeed, in the above it is evident that (in St. Irenaeous’ OWN WORDS’ that:
the UNBELIEVERS of this world [AGE, AEON, AGE1] —-> because they [UNBELIEVERS] shall NOT INHERIT —–> the FUTURE AGE [AEON, AGE2] of incorruption [SINLESSNESS]. St. Irenaeous clearly makes a distinction and understands the CURRENT AGE (AEON, AGE1) vs the NEXT AGE (AEON, AGE2) vs the “ages to come” (e. g. Ephesians 2:7, AGE2, AGE3…) as explained in detail in earlier write ups too agreeing to all this.
“So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to ALL MEN, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to ALL MEN. For as through the one man’s disobedience THE MANY were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One THE MANY will be made righteous.” (Romans 5:18 – 19, NASB)
The Many sinners in Adam is the same Many which will be Made Righteous by Lord Jesus Christ (Proper Context for Romans 5:18 – 19). Under the Equation: ‘Adam + the Many’ = All Men = All Human Beings Ever Existed
Lord Jesus Christ is exempt from the equation above simply because He is God in Flesh and not a mere Man only & Alone is never affected by Adam’s sin in any way.
“… For as by the disobedience of the one man who was originally moulded from virgin soil, the many were made sinners, and forfeited life; so was it necessary that, by the obedience of one man, who was originally born from a virgin, [the] many should be justified and receive salvation. Thus, then, was the Word of God made man, as also Moses says: “God, true are His works.” But if, not having been made flesh, He did appear as if flesh, His work was not a true one. But what He did appear, that He also was: God recapitulated in Himself the ancient formation of man, that He might kill sin, deprive death of its power, and vivify man; and therefore His works are true.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Chapter XVIII, Book III)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
Please compare with the quotes below too:
“… For since from man it was that death prevailed over men, for this cause conversely, by the Word of God being made man has come about the DESTRUCTION of DEATH and the RESURRECTION of LIFE; as the man which bore Christ230 saith: “For231 since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as IN ADAM ALL DIE, so also IN CHRIST shall ALL be MADE ALIVE :” and so forth. For NO LONGER now do WE DIE as SUBJECT to CONDEMNATION; but as MEN who rise from the dead WE AWAIT the GENERAL RESURRECTION of ALL, “which232 42in its OWN TIMES He shall SHOW,” even God, Who has also wrought it, and bestowed it upon us… ” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Points 10.5 , ‘On the Incarnation’)
Source – Section 10: https://ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204/npnf204.vii.ii.x.html
“… The Divine grace variously distributed… Further also, when the word is sown, it does not yield a uniform produce of fruit in this human life, but one various and rich ; for it bringeth forth, some an hundred j^nd some Matt.] 3, 8. sixty, and some thirty 7 , as the Saviour teaches — that Sower of grace, and Bestower of the Spirit … Nor is the grace confined to the perfect alone; but it is sent down also among those who occupy the middle and the third ranks, so that He might RESCUE ALL MEN GENERALLY to SALVATION…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Festal Letter 70 – 71)
Source:
Comment: In the last quote above, St. Athanasius is revealing that the Grace of God Works in different Ways beginning with the Perfect (Hundredfold Seed) to the Second Rank (Sixty Fold Seed) to the Third Rank (Thirty Fold Seed) and lastly toward a ‘General Salvation which Rescues ALL MEN to be sinless again (implied)’. Right?
St. Athenagoras of Athens Proves that the ‘Common Lot’ of General Salvation applies even to the Wicked or failed ones after their Proportioned Final Judgment in the Lake of Fire
“… And we shall make no mistake in saying, that the final cause of an intelligent life and rational judgment, is to be occupied uninterruptedly with those objects to which the natural reason is chiefly and primarily adapted, and to delight unceasingly in the contemplation of Him who is, and of His decrees, notwithstanding that the majority of men, because they are affected too passionately and too violently by things below, pass through life without attaining this object. For the large number of those who fail of the end that belongs to them does not make void the common lot, since the examination relates to individuals, and the reward or punishment of lives ill or well spent is proportioned to the merit of each….” – Blessed St. Athenagoras of Athens, In his writings he styles himself as “Athenagoras, the Athenian, Philosopher, and Christian”, in the fragments of the Christian History of Philip of Side (c. 425). Philip of Side claims that Athenagoras headed the Catechetical School of Alexandria (which is probably incorrect and contradicted by Eusebius), Athenagoras is an Ante-Nicene Christian apologist who lived during the second half of the 2nd century (c. 133 AD – c. 190 AD, ‘On the Resurrection of the Dead’ )
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-resurrection.html
This Salvation from the Lake of Fire is echoed by these great saints too, to quote:
“… XIX. But these sins were not after Baptism, you will say. Where is your proof? Either prove it — or refrain from condemning; and if there be any doubt, let charity prevail. But Novatus, you say, would not receive those who lapsed in the persecution. What do you mean by this? If they were unrepentant he was right; I too would refuse to receive those who either would not stoop at all or not sufficiently, and who would refuse to make their amendment counterbalance their sin; and when I do receive them, I will assign them their proper place; but if he refused those who wore themselves away with weeping, I will not imitate him. And why should Novatus’s want of charity be a rule for me? He never punished covetousness, which is a second idolatry; but he condemned fornication as though he himself were not flesh and body. What say you? Are we convincing you by these words? Come and stand here on our side, that is, on the side of humanity. Let us magnify the Lord together. Let none of you, even though he has much confidence in himself, dare to say, Touch me not for I am pure, and who is so pure as I? Give us too a share in your brightness. But perhaps we are not convincing you? Then we will weep for you. Let these men then if they will, follow our way, which is Christ’s way; but if they will not, let them go their own. Perhaps in it they will be baptized with Fire, in that last Baptism which is more painful and longer, which devours wood like grass, 1 Corinthians 3:12-19 and consumes the stubble of every evil….” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source [ Oration 39, Chapter XIX, Oration on the Holy Lights. The Oration on the Holy Lights was preached on the Festival of the Epiphany 381, and was followed the next day by that on Baptism.]:
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310239.htm
which is not forever but till the last penny & purifies thereafter as his words ” … which is more painful and longer [NOT forever] …” in “… but if they will not, let them go their own. Perhaps in it they [Novatian Heretics] will be baptized with Fire, in that last Baptism which is more painful and longer, which devours wood like grass, 1 Corinthians 3:12-19 and consumes the stubble of every evil….”
and
“… Our Saviour has appointed two kinds of resurrection, in accordance with which John says, in the Apocalypse, “Blessed is he that hath part in the first resurrection”; for such come to grace without the judgment. As for those who do not come to the first, but are reserved until the second resurrection, these shall be burnt, until they fulfill their appointed times, between the first and the second resurrection; or, if they should not have fulfilled them then, they shall remain still longer in punishment … ‘ – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Great Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD) …”
Source: https://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Ambrose
vii. Will God Grant the same General Salvation Hope of Resurrection in a Sinless Vivified Body (healing it post-Judgment after the Destruction of Body + Soul in Gehenna first, Matthew 10:28) to ‘all who die in Adam, to be Made Alive in Christ likewise too’ (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 23)?
Blessed St. Irenaeous and Blessed St. Justin Martyr imply so toward those in ‘unbelief’, ‘the dead’, ‘even toward God’s Enemies’ or the ‘Wicked’ too to be ‘Vivified’ or ‘Renewed’ likewise eventually, to quote:
“… for we ourselves have heard [Him], and know that this man is truly the SAVIOUR of the WORLD.” And PAUL likewise declares, “And so ALL ISRAEL SHALL be SAVED; ” but he has also said, that the law was our pedagogue [to bring us] to Christ Jesus. Let them NOT therefore ascribe to the law the UNBELIEF of certain [among them]. For the law never hindered them from believing in the Son of God; nay, but it even exhorted them so to do, saying that MEN can be SAVED in no other way from the old wound of the serpent than by believing in Him who, in the likeness of sinful flesh, is LIFTED UP from the earth upon the tree of martyrdom, and DRAWS ALL THINGS to Himself, and VIVIFIES the DEAD.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book 4, Chapter II, Point 7)
Translation Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book4.html
“… Just as the physician is proved by his patients, so is God also revealed through MEN. And therefore Paul declares, “For God hath concluded ALL in UNBELIEF, that He [God] may have MERCY upon ALL; ” not saying this in reference to spiritual Aeons, but to MAN, who had been DISOBEDIENT to God, and being CAST OFF from IMMORTALITY, then OBTAINED MERCY, receiving through the Son of God that adoption which is [ACCOMPLISHED] by Himself… ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book III, Chapter XX, second part of Point 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
Please note carefully that St. Irenaeous speaks of MEN (who are sick generally being SINNERS, as the Context of the Great Physician is set forth first). Next, St. Irenaeous Speaks of the ‘Mercy to All’ —> not as an offer, nor as an availability or any part on the ‘will of men’ (agreeing to Romans 9:15 – 16) though popular theology errs otherwise greatly in this – Can you see it? —-> but as an ACCOMPLISHED Fact evidenced by the phrase ‘OBTAINED MERCY’ toward those ‘CAST OFF from IMMORTALITY’ due to His Work Alone. In other words, Irenaeous does NOT discuss any ‘availability or the will of man’ when quoting Romans 11:32 proving that these are irrelevant to the context of MERCY which depends on GOD’s WILL ALONE (Romans 9:15 – 16).
“… Yet is it not absurd, that that which has been produced with such circumstance, and which is beyond all else valuable, should be so neglected by its Maker, as to pass to NONENTITY? Then the sculptor and painter, if they wish the works they have made to endure, that they may win glory by them, RENEW THEM when they begin to DECAY; but God would so neglect His own possession and work, that it becomes ANNIHILATED, and NO longer EXISTS. Should we not call this labour in vain? As if a man who has built a house should forthwith DESTROY it, or should NEGLECT it, though he sees it falling into DECAY, and is ABLE to REPAIR it: we would blame him for labouring in vain; and should we not so blame God? But not such an one is the INCORRUPTIBLE,–NOT SENSELESS is the INTELLIGENCE of the universe. Let the unbelieving be silent, even though they themselves do not believe. … ” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER VIII.–DOES THE BODY CAUSE THE SOUL TO SIN? FRAGMENTS OF THE LOST WORK OF JUSTIN ON THE RESURRECTION)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-resurrection.html
“… If, then, neither of these is by itself man, but that which is made up of the two together is called man, and God has called man to life and resurrection, He has called not a part, but the whole, which is the soul and the body. For it had its salvation from itself; so that in saving the soul, God does no great thing. For to be saved is its natural destiny, because it is a part of Himself, being His inspiration. But no thanks are due to one who saves what is his own; for this is to save himself. For he who saves a part himself, saves himself by his own means, lest he become defective in that part; and this is not the act of a good man. For not even when a man does good to his children and offspring, does one call him a good man; for even the most savage of the wild beasts do so, and indeed willingly endure death, if need be, for the sake of their cubs. But if a man were to perform the same acts in behalf of his slaves, that man would justly be called good. Wherefore the Saviour also taught us to love our enemies, since, says He, what thank have ye? So that He has shown us that it is a good work not only to love those that are begotten of Him, but also those that are without. And what He enjoins upon us, He Himself first of all does.” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER VIII.–DOES THE BODY CAUSE THE SOUL TO SIN? FRAGMENTS OF THE LOST WORK OF JUSTIN ON THE RESURRECTION)
Translation Source:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-resurrection.html
Note: The General Salvation of Man seems to include even “those not begotten of Him” and “His Enemies” too in quote above as part of the “Renewal/Repair” process in quote above.
“… But when the passage speaks as from the lips of many, ‘We have preached before Him,’ and adds, ‘as if a child,’ it signifies that the wicked shall become subject to Him, and shall obey His command, and that all shall become as one child. Such a thing as you may witness in the body: although the members are enumerated as many, all are called one, and are a body. For, indeed, a commonwealth and a church, though many individuals in number, are in fact as one, called and addressed by one appellation. And in short, sirs,” said I, “by enumerating all the other appointments of Moses I can demonstrate that they were types, and symbols, and declarations of those things which would happen to Christ, of those who it was foreknown were to believe in Him, and of those things which would also be done by Christ Himself. But since what I have now enumerated appears to me to be sufficient, I revert again to the order of the discourse…” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100 AD – c. 160 AD, CHAPTER XLI & CHAPTER XLII, ‘Dialogue with Trypho’)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
Note: The Wicked are said to eventually obey Him and Blessed St. Justin offers an analogy to that in that such a subjection can be observed likewise first in the Church as his phrase “…Such a thing as you may witness in the body …” means in the quote above. As discussed at the start, Blessed St. Irenaeous and St. Justin’s “eternal punishment” quotes may be more accurately meaning “age-during” or “to the age” (Singular-Aeon) timeline as it literally means in the Bible.
viii. And What God’s Will is in the Ages (Aeons)?
“… Christ, who was called the Son of God before the ages [Aeons], was manifested in the fulness of time, in order that He might cleanse us through His blood, who were under the power of sin, presenting us as pure sons to His Father, if we yield ourselves obediently to the chastisement of the Spirit. And in the end of time He shall come to do away with all evil, and to reconcile all things [Colossians 1:16, 20], in order that there may be an end of all impurities. … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Fragment XXXIX, FRAGMENTS FROM THE LOST WRITINGS OF IRENAEUS)
Translation Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-fragments.html
2) ages of Ages – Idiom/Figure of Speech or Literally?
Yes, it’s not a figure of speech as some claim but a literal meaning whose definition extends into the future too as St. Irenaeous points above and is sealed as Truth by St. Ambrose below too from First Christianty, to quote:
Ages to Come in Ephesians 2:7 or Revelation 20:10 or in Matthew 12:31 – 32 or is the next Age (Olam/Aeon) eternal?
“… yet that I may satisfy thee on Scriptural grounds, learn that He made not only what is past, but also what is future, as it is written: “Who made things to come.” Elsewhere too Scripture says: “By whom also He made the ages, who is the brightness of His glory and the express Image of His Person.” Now the ages are past and present and future. How then were those made which are future, unless it is that His active power and knowledge contains within itself the number of all the ages? For just as He calls the things that are not as though they were, s so has He made things future as though they were. It cannot come to pass that they should not be. Those things which He has directed to be, necessarily will be. Therefore He who has made the things that are to be, knows them in the way in which they will be. If we are to believe this about the ages, much more must we believe it about the day of judgment, on the ground that the Son of God has knowledge of it, as being already made by Him. For it is written: “According to Thine ordinance the day will continue.” He did not merely say “the day continues,” but even “will continue,” so that the things which are to come might be governed by His ordinance. Does He not know what He ordered? “He who planted the ear, shall He not hear? He that formed the eye shall He not see?” …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, the first Great Latin Doctor of the Church, Converter, Baptizer &Teacher of St. Augustine (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD, Ambrose: Selected Works and Letters, Point 197 – 198 Chapter 4 Pages 730 – 731)
Source:
Four phrases from the above proving this Doctrine of the Ages (Aeons/Olams) to be True: “… By whom also He made the ages … Now the ages are past and present [Aeon1] and future [Aeon2, Aeon3, ….] … unless it is that His active power and knowledge contains within itself the number of all the ages … If we are to believe this about the ages…”
Note that the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit may not be forgiven in this present singular-age (AEON1) or until the future next-singular-age (AEON2) only and Ephesians 2:7 with St. Ambrose’s quote proves that there are “Ages [Plural] to Come” (AEON2, AEON3, … at least) where Forgiveness can be Attained in AEON3 as God Wills as per the Mystery of the Eighth Day (AEON3) which is after His Millennial Reign of the Coming Sabbath-Rest-of-the-Righteous-Seventh-Day (AEON2) as discussed in previous posts such as the one below (which agrees to St. Ambrose’s quote in Point 6 earlier emphasizing that this Blasphemy can be Forgiven eventually) :
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/lake-of-fire-hope-for-the-wicked-one-day/
3) Ages/Aeons Mystery
“… .10,7 In this people there dwells one infinite Godhead, one imperishable Godhead, one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; spirit, soul and flesh; faith, hope and charity; past, present and future; the AGES, the ETERNAL AGES, and the AGES of AGES; Sabbaths of Sabbaths; the circumcision of the flesh, the circumcision of the heart, and “the circumcision of Christ by the putting off of the body of the sins .’’ 202 (9) In a word, it PURIFIES ALL THINGS for itself, things visible and invisible, thrones, dominions, principalities authorities, powers. But IN ALL is the same holy voice crying, “Holy, Holy, Holy,” from glory to glory, < to glorify > the Father in the Son, and the Son in the Father with the Holy Spirit, to whom be glory and might unto the AGES of AGES. Amen. And he who so believes will say “So be it! So be it. ” …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points10.7 – 10.9, Pages 498 – 499)
Source:
Focus points from the Quote above:
Ages or Aeons Mystery
Neither St. Epiphanius of Salamis, St. Ambrose of Milan and even St. Irenaeous of Lyons understood the phrase “Aeon” as eternity but as ‘age (singular) vs ages (plural)’ only into the future as their own words prove as follows (strengthening the claim that they believed at most in a to the age/ages chastisement but not an eternal one):
There are at least three types of Ages [Aeons-plural] Time Periods
“… past, present and future; the ages, the eternal ages, and the ages of ages; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’
I think that the phrase “eternal ages” means that the “ages or Aeons” continue into eternity.
Note: Men’s Final Punishment in Gehenna or the Lake of Fire has never been mentioned to the Aeons-plural to come but only to the lesser maximum sentence which is to the next Aeon-singular to come (Matthew 25:46, Matthew 12:31 – 32) in the Bible giving a strong case that it’s not eternal but age-during to the next age only (though severe & a long time).
The word eternal in front of the word ages (Aeons) itself proves that the word “ages-plural” itself does not mean eternity by itself but is a limited succession of ages to come by God’s Will as St. Epiphanius says, “eternal ages” to imply an eternal sequence of ages to come, right?
4) Divided Christianity?
One does not need to agree with what the Church Fathers taught as even among them there is disagreement. However, speaking Truth is important so as not to misrepresent the saints. After reading both sides, one can decide to believe whichever one thinks is closer to the Truth of First Christianity.
Here’s an example:
“… They then that depreciate the Only-begotten Son of God blaspheme God, defaming His perfection and accusing Him of imperfection, and render themselves liable to the severest chastisement. For he that blasphemes any one of the Subsistences [Persons of the Trinity] shall have remission neither in this world [AGE/AEON] nor in that which is to come. But God is able to open the eyes of their heart to contemplate the Sun of Righteousness, in order that coming to know Him whom they formerly set at nought, they may with unswerving piety of mind together with us glorify Him, because to Him belongs the kingdom, even to the Father Son and Holy Spirit, now and forever. Amen…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, ‘On Luke 10:22 and Matthew 11:27’, Section 6)
Source: http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2805.htm
Focus Phrases:
“… But God is able to open the eyes of their heart to contemplate the Sun of Righteousness, in order that coming to know Him whom they formerly set at nought, …” toward those who did this first “… For he that blasphemes any one of the Subsistences [Persons of the Trinity] shall have remission neither in this world [AGE/AEON] nor in that which is to come …” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope
It’s thus okay to err in this (if they erred) as the Greatest Fathers of the Church as the quote above seems to point that even Blessed St. Athanasius the Great believed that the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is only unforgivable in the current and next age/Aeon (Matthew 12:31 – 32) and may be Forgiven thereafter in the ages (Aeons) to come (Ephesians 2:7). To quote:
“…“Eternity (Greek Aionios) signifies in Scripture sometimes the fact that we do not know the end, sometimes the fact that there is no end in the present world, but there will be one in the next. Sometimes eternity means a certain length of time, even that of a human life.” (Origen, Commentary on Romans, Book 6, section 5). …The Emperor Justinian in A.D. 540 tried to extinguish Origen’s teachings by defining Catholic doctrine at that time. “The Holy Church of Christ teaches an endless aionios (ATELEUTETOS aionios) life to the righteous, and endless (ateleutetos) punishment to the wicked.” Aionios was not enough in his judgment to denote endless duration, so he employed ateleutetos. The point is that “aionios” by itself did not mean “everlasting.” It needed to be strengthened with another word to in fact mean “endless,” like “ateleutetos.” Jews who were contemporaries with Christ, but who wrote in Greek, show that “aionios” was not used to mean “everlasting.” Josephus the historian used “aionios” to refer to temples which were already destroyed (and thus not “everlasting”), indeterminate prison sentences and time lapses between historical events. He never used the word to denote “everlasting,” but rather to mean an indeterminate period or season. The Jewish writer Philo always used the words athanaton, ateleuteton or aidion to denote endless and aionion for temporary duration. Augustine, who struggled mightily with Greek, claimed for years that the only meaning of “aionios” was “everlasting,” yet even he had to acknowledge his error when visited by the Spanish presbyter Orosius, who convinced Augustine of his error. Augustine relented, but only to the extent that “aionios” did not only mean “everlasting.” Augustine still believed it means “everlasting” with regard to Hell. To summarize then, Greek word “Aionios,” which is sometimes translated as “everlasting” in Scripture (as in “everlasting punishment”), does NOT in fact mean “unending or everlasting in quantity of time.” Rather, “Aionios” speaks to an “indeterminate age set by God alone.” The word refers to a certain quality (not quantity) of being – – whether it be “aionios life” or “aionios remedial-punishment.” Aionios is always qualified by what it is describing. …” – Mr. Richard Murray
Peace to you
Age-during Life or Eternal Life or Both?
1) Blessed St. Augustine claims that the “Age-during life” is not literal but an idiomatic expression to mean ‘Eternal Life’
“… 112 It is quite in vain, then, that some–indeed very many–yield to merely human feelings and deplore the notion of the eternal punishment of the damned and their interminable and perpetual misery. They do not believe that such things will be. Not that they would go counter to divine Scripture–but, yielding to their own human feelings, they soften what seems harsh and give a milder emphasis to statements they believe are meant more to terrify than to express the literal truth. “God will not forget,” they say, “to show mercy, nor in his anger will he shut up his mercy.” This is, in fact, the text of a holy psalm.237 But there is no doubt that it is to be interpreted to refer to those who are called “vessels of mercy,”238 those who are freed from misery not by their own merits but through God’s mercy. Even so, if they suppose that the text applies to all men, there is no ground for them further to suppose that there can be an end for those of whom it is said, “Thus these shall go into everlasting punishment.”239 Otherwise, it can as well be thought that there will also be an end to the happiness of those of whom the antithesis was said: “But the righteous into life eternal.” But let them suppose, if it pleases them, that, for certain intervals of time, the punishments of the damned are somewhat mitigated. Even so, the wrath of God must be understood as still resting on them. And this is damnation–for this anger, which is not a violent passion in the divine mind, is called “wrath” in God. Yet even in his wrath–his wrath resting on them–he does not “shut up his mercy.” This is not to put an end to their eternal afflictions, but rather to apply or interpose some little respite in their torments. For the psalm does not say, “To put an end to his wrath,” or, “After his wrath,” but, “In his wrath.” Now, if this wrath were all there is in man’s damnation, and even if it were present only in the slightest degree conceivable–still, to be lost out of the Kingdom of God, to be an exile from the City of God, to be estranged from the life of God, to suffer loss of the great abundance of God’s blessings which he has hidden for those who fear him and prepared for those who hope in him240 –this would be a punishment so great that, if it be eternal, no torments that we know could be compared to it, no matter how many ages they continued. 113. The eternal death of the damned–that is, their estrangement from the life of God–will therefore abide without end, and it will be common to them all, no matter what some people, moved by their human feelings, may wish to think about gradations of punishment, or the relief or intermission of their misery. In the same way, the eternal life of the saints will abide forever, and also be common to all of them no matter how different the grades of rank and honor in which they shine forth in their effulgent harmony. …” – Blessed St. Augustine of Hippo, Doctor of the Church, who influenced virtually all of subsequent Western philosophy and Catholic theology, as well as a significant amount of Protestant theology (c. 354 AD – c. 430 AD, Points 112 – 113, CHAPTER XXIX. “The Last Things”, Enchiridion).
Source: http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/augustine_enchiridion_02_trans.htm
2) The Well Learned Blessed Pope St. Dionysius the Great sees a distinction between the phrase “unto the age” which is followed by “unto the ages” where he quotes a Bible Verse to see that the current earth does not last forever (as many translations err, in Ecclesiastes 1:4) but only to the “age” (Hebrew: Olam/ Greek: Aeon) since a “New Earth” will eventually be made as Revelation 21:1 Prophesies
“… One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever” (unto the age, Ecclesiastes 1:4). Yes, unto the age, but not unto the ages…” – Blessed Pope St. Dionysius the Great of Alexandria (Papacy: c. 248 AD – c. 264 AD, ‘A Commentary on the Beginning of Ecclesiastes’)
Source:
https://www.ecatholic2000.com/fathers/untitled-229.shtml#_Toc390296607
Focus Phrase: “… Yes, unto the age, but not unto the ages …”
Please note carefully that the Well Learned Pope St. Dionysius the Great is clearly Revealing that the Hebrews Word “Olam” (in his quote of Ecclesiastes 1:4) does NOT mean ‘forever’ but is referring to ‘the Age/Aeon/Olam’ (Seventh Day) but not to a time which follows after that, namely the “Ages to Come” (e.g. Ephesians 2:7, implied).
So, he is clearly implying that the ‘Life in the Seventh Day/Age/Olam’ is on this same Renewed-Earth (Matthew 25:46, Daniel 12:2) but following-ly, his phrase “not unto the ages” means that the Current Earth does not last beyond that ‘having passed away’ being ‘Replaced by a New Earth’ (Revelation 21:1) thereafter into the “ages” to come [which Begins with the Messianic Eighth or the “times after the kingdom” in St. Irenaeous’ Writing, implied].
Yes, the same Hebrew Word “Olam” is used both in Ecclesiastes 1:4 and Daniel 12:2 of which Pope St. Dionysius the Great implies that its meaning refers to the particular “Age” (Seventh Day) and “not unto the ages” (Eighth Day toward Eternity) which comes after that proving this same intended meaning again.
So when Holy Scripture says ‘Olam God’, it’s not a limit but a highlight of His God-Ship to that Glorious Messianic Age just like the phrase ‘God of Abraham’ or ‘God of Israel’ does not limit Him to be God for those only. Can you see it?
That “Seventh Day” (Messianic Aeon/Olam) Life is not eternal.
Wait, what? Please hear me out first before accusing me of Blasphemy by partially quoting me.
This is because the Life & Punishment of the Seventh Age as it is Described in Daniel 12:2 to stand in contrast as the Reward of Faith vs Chastisement for Betterment (or “Kolasin in Greek” in in Matthew 25:46) of the Wicked.
Yes, that ‘Life for the Righteous Ends’ not in Death but a Glorification Toward a Higher Perfected Eternal Life from the ‘Eighth Day or Eighth Age/Aeon/Olam’ onward as this Church Father Reveals Majestically:
“… Such, according to David, “rest in the holy hill of God,” in the Church [Sheepfold1] far on high, in which are gathered the philosophers of God, “who are Israelites indeed, who are pure in heart, in whom there is no guile; ” who do not remain in the seventh seat, the place of rest, but are promoted, through the active beneficence of the divine likeness, to the heritage of beneficence which is the eighth grade; devoting themselves to the pure vision of insatiable contemplation…” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, CHAPTER XIV, Stromata Book 6)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book6.html
Focus Phrase: “… who do not remain in the seventh seat [i.e. Age-during life on the Seventh Day/Age/Aeon/Olam], the place of [Sabbath] rest, but are promoted, through the active beneficence of the divine likeness, to the heritage of beneficence which is the eighth grade [Age-during life on the Eighth Day/Age/Aeon/Olam toward eternity]…”
iii. The Stronger Phrase in Daniel 12:3 and Exodus 15:18 (example)
Verses:
“Those who have insight will shine brightly like the brightness of the expanse of heaven, and those who lead the many to righteousness, like the stars forever [Olam] and ever [wā-‘eḏ.].” – Prophet Daniel (Daniel 12:3, NASB)
“The LORD shall reign forever [Olam] and ever [wā-‘eḏ.].” (Exodus 15:18, NASB)
So these Verses are clearly implying that God’s Reign is to that Messianic Age (Seventh Day/Aeon/Olam) and ‘Continually, wā-‘eḏ’ or equivalently, ‘Beyond’. Hence Pope St. Dionysius the Great implies this intrinsically without quoting these Verses as ‘unto the ages [Aeons/Olams]’ (as found in the New Testament too, e.g. Ephesians 2:7).
This Agrees to what was Declared by the Blessed Messenger regarding Christ’s Reign in Verse below too:
“and He shall reign over the house of Jacob to the ages; and of His reign there shall be no end.'” – Blessed ArchAngel Gabriel (Luke 1:33, YLT)
That is,
” to the ages;” = Current Age, next Age (Seventh), the age after that (Eighth) and so on as St. Irenaeous himself remarked that ‘Immortality’ is to be Viewed as a “long Series of Ages (Aeons/Olams)” into the future as God Willed it that way (quote below) sealing this Understanding as ‘more accurate’ First Orthodox Christianity too:
” … But ALL THINGS which proceed from Him, WHATSOEVER have been MADE, and are made, do indeed receive their own beginning of generation, and on this account are INFERIOR to Him who formed them, inasmuch as they are not unbegotten. Nevertheless THEY ENDURE, and EXTEND their EXISTENCE into a LONG SERIES of AGES [Aeons, Aeon1, Aeon2, Aeon3, …] in accordance with the WILL of GOD their Creator; so that He GRANTS them that they should be thus formed at the beginning, and that they should so exist afterwards.” – St. Irenaeous of Lyons (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Chapter XXXIV, Point 2)
Translation Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
Conclusion – First Christianity – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons clearly sees eternity as a “long series of ages (Aeons)” one followed by another literally and even the distinction between “to the age” and the continuance of the “ages (subset) of Ages (Set)” thereafter in regards to the “Eternal Life” of the Righteous Context too
To quote:
“…2. … Nevertheless they endure, and extend their existence into a long series of ages in accordance with the will of God their Creator; so that He grants them that they should be thus formed at the beginning, and that they should so exist afterwards. 3. For as the heaven which is above us, the firmament, the sun, the moon, the rest of the stars, and all their grandeur, although they had no previous existence, were called into being, and continue throughout a long course of time according to the will of God, so also any one who thinks thus respecting souls and spirits, and, in fact, respecting all created things, will not by any means go far astray, inasmuch as all things that have been made had a beginning when they were formed, but endure as long as God wills that they should have an existence and continuance. The prophetic Spirit bears testimony to these opinions, when He declares, “For He spake, and they were made; He commanded, and they were created: He hath established them for ever, yea, forever and ever.” And again, He thus speaks respecting the salvation of man: “He asked life of Thee, and Thou gavest him length of days for ever and ever; ” indicating that it is the Father of all who imparts continuance for ever and ever on those who are saved. For life does not arise from us, nor from our own nature; but it is bestowed according to the grace of God. And therefore he who shall preserve the life bestowed upon him, and give thanks to Him who imparted it, shall receive also length of days for ever and ever. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, Chapter XXXIV, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Point 2)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
Please read the quote below from Blessed St. Irenaeous carefully to see his incredible accuracy in understanding Holy Scripture ‘as it is Written’(who is a Greater Authority than even Blessed St. Augutsine in Biblical Koine Greek & Doctrine in First Christianity):
“… when He declares, “For He spake, and they were made; He commanded, and they were created: He hath established them for ever, yea, forever and ever.” And again, He thus speaks respecting the salvation of man: “He asked life of Thee, and Thou gavest him length of days for ever and ever; ” indicating that it is the Father of all who imparts continuance for ever and ever on those who are saved. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation
Can you see it?
Please let me repeat with [Emphasis Mine] as Blessed St. Irenaeous who wrote Originally in Biblical Koine Greek would have written in quote above, again:
“… when He declares, “For He spake, and they were made; He commanded, and they were created: He hath established them for ever [to the Age, Age-during], yea, forever and ever [to the ages of Ages].” And again, He thus speaks respecting the salvation of man: “He asked life of Thee, and Thou gavest him length of days for ever and ever [to the ages of Ages]; ” indicating that it is the Father of all who imparts continuance for ever and ever [to the ages of Ages] on those who are saved. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation
It is clear that Blessed St. Irenaeous sees the ‘Salvation of Man’ in the Context of ‘those who are Saved’ with the following Theological Points of Biblical Accuracy:
iii) Blessed St. Irenaeous clearly sees that the stronger phrase “aeons of Aeons” literally as a continuance of life on the righteous henceforth into the ages to come
“…He hath established them for ever [to the Age, Age-during], yea, forever and ever [‘aeons of Aeons’ or to the ages of Ages] … Thou gavest him length of days for ever and ever [‘aeons of Aeons’ or to the ages of Ages]; ” indicating that it is the Father of all who imparts continuance for ever and ever [‘aeons of Aeons’ or to the ages of Ages] on those who are saved. …”” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons
It is interesting to note that nowhere in the Bible is his phrase “…for ever [to the Age, Age-during], yea, forever and ever [‘aeons of Aeons’ or to the ages of Ages] …” regarding the Life of the Righteous is found. In the Bible, the phrase is only “age-during life” (or Aeonian Life) indicating that Blessed St. Irenaeous is clearly explaining that the righteous’ life does not end after the age (Aeon) but continues thereafter into the ‘ages’ (Aeons to come, Ephesians 2:7) as he clearly explains in the above in the Context of ‘Continuance of this Life of the Righteous’.
This Biblical Concept that there are AGES to COME literally (Ephesians 2:7) is supported by St. Irenaeous himself (who was a direct Disciple of St. Polycarp who in turn was a Disciple of the Blessed St. John the apostle himself) apart from the Blessed ArchBishop St. Ambrose of Milan too Affirming it from Western Christianity, to quote:
“… we [True Christians] ourselves, when at the giving of thanks we pronounce the words, “To Aeons of Aeons” [Revelation 20:10, Revelation 14:11] do set forth these Aeons. And, in fine, wherever the words Aeon or Aeons occur, they at once refer them to these beings.” – St. Irenaeous of Lyons (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Chapter III, Book I)
Translation Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book1.html
Comment: St. Irenaeous clearly refers to time as the “Aeon” (singular) and “Aeons” (Plural) in his last quote above & dispels the Gnostic Myth that these refer to some creatures (beings).
Peace to you
Blessed St. Julian of Norwich & Virgin Mary & Universalism
But “… All manner of things shall be well… ” in another world and time. It is well documented that her Visions contained Christ Centered Universalism.
However, it is not so well known that despite her numerous visions, she never had seen “bodily presence of Virgin Mary” nor did she see “Virgin Mary as a co-intercessor nor as a co-redemptrix with Christ” proving that in her Divine Revelations itself the Roman Catholic & Eastern Orthodox Dogma of “praying to Virgin Mary etc. to be clearly false”.
In fact, it is well known that she only had three visions regarding Blessed Virgin Mary and it’s as follows (please note ‘Carefully’ that her Visions do NOT prove Virgin Mary as a co-intercessor nor as a co-Redemptrix nor as anyone a Christian should pray too as the Majority of the latter Church till today have erred greatly, may God have Mercy on whomever He Wills), to quote:
“… Also God shewed me in part the wisdom and truth of her soul, wherein I understood the reverent beholding in which she beheld her God, that is, her maker, marveling with great reverence that he would be born of her who was a simple creature of his making. For this was her marveling: that he who was her maker would be born of her who was made. And this wisdom and truth, knowing the greatness of her maker and the littleness of herself that is made, made her say so meekly to Gabriel: “Lo me here, God’s handmaiden.” …” – Blessed St. Julian of Norwich
“… For Christ and she were so oned [united] in love that the greatness of her love was the cause of the magnitude of her pain. . . . For as much as she loved him more than all others, her pain surpassed all others. For ever the higher, the mightier, the sweeter that the love is, the more sorrow it is to the lover to see that body in pain that he loved. …” – Blessed St. Julian of Norwich
iii) Eleventh Revelation
“… And for the marvelous, high, and special love that Christ had for this sweet maiden, his blessed mother, our lady Saint Mary, he shewed her highly rejoicing, which is the meaning of this sweet word, as if he had said: “Wilt thou see how much I love her, that thou might rejoice with me in the love that I have in her and she in me?” …” – Blessed St. Julian of Norwich
Source for each quote above [no copyright infringement as I’m not quoting the article owners’ additional words/comments but only Blessed St. Julian of Norwich’s own writing only which the author has quoted in link below of which no one owns the copyright as it’s not theirs]: https://www.juliansvoice.com/veronicas-blog/julians-revelations-about-mary
Conclusion
The Roman Catholics will say that her Visions prove that Christians ought to pray to Virgin Mary but the actual quotes as shown from her visions, only three as quoted above do NOT prove anything like that from her Divine Visions even if she herself erred in doing so by following the Majority Practice of her church at that time.
Interestingly, some Roman Catholic theologians claim that she didn’t teach Christ Centered Universalism but eternal hell but if you read her actual quotes it clearly proves otherwise, for example please consider:
“… She wrote, “For I saw no wrath except on man’s side, and He forgives that in us, for wrath is nothing else but a perversity and an opposition to peace and to love.”[81] She wrote that God sees us as perfect and waits for the day when human souls mature so that evil and sin will no longer hinder us.[82] “God is nearer to us than our own soul,” she wrote. This theme is repeated throughout her work: “Jesus answered with these words, saying: ‘All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of thing shall be well.’ … This was said so tenderly, without blame of any kind toward me or anybody else” …” – Blessed St. Julian of Norwich
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_of_Norwich
In other words, if she understood hell as eternal, her words below makes no sense as she herself claims that her Divine Revelations contradict that notion in her own words, to quote (as Blessed St. Julian of Norwich herself analyzes her own Visions):
“… And thus signifieth He when He saith: THOU SHALT SEE THYSELF if all manner of things shall be well. As if He said: Take now heed faithfully and trustingly, and at the last end thou shalt verily see it in fulness of joy. Thus in these same five words aforesaid: I may make all things well, etc., I understand a mighty comfort of all the works of our Lord God that are yet to come. There is a Deed the which the blessed Trinity shall do in the last Day, as to my sight, and when the Deed shall be, and how it shall be done, is unknown of all creatures that are beneath Christ, and shall be till when it is done. The cause why He willeth that we know, is for that He would have us the more eased in our soul and set at peace in love — leaving the beholding of all troublous things that might keep us back from true enjoying of Him. This is that Great Deed ordained of our Lord God from without beginning, treasured and hid in His blessed breast, only known to Himself: by which He shall make all things well.
For like as the blissful Trinity made all things of nought, right so the same blessed Trinity shall make well all that is not well. Our Faith is grounded in God’s word, and it belongeth to our Faith that we believe that God’s word shall be saved in all things; and one point of our Faith is that many creatures shall be condemned: as angels that fell out of Heaven for pride, which be now fiends; and man in earth that dieth out of the Faith of Holy Church: that is to say, they that be heathen men; and also man that hath received christendom and liveth unchristian life and so dieth out of charity: all these shall be condemned to hell without end, as Holy Church teacheth me to believe. And all this standing, methought it was impossible that all manner of things should be well, as our Lord shewed in the same time.
And as to this I had no other answer in Shewing of our Lord God but this: That which is impossible to thee is not impossible to me: I shall save my word in all things and I shall make all things well. Thus I was taught, by the grace of God, that I should steadfastly hold me in the Faith as I had aforehand understood, therewith that I should firmly believe that all things shall be well, as our Lord shewed in the same time. For this is the Great Deed that our Lord shall do, in which Deed He shall save His word and He shall make all well that is not well. How it shall be done there is no creature beneath Christ that knoweth it, nor shall know it till it is done; according to the understanding that I took of our Lord’s meaning in this time. …” – Blessed St. Julian of Norwich (Chapter 32, The Thirteenth Revelation, c. 1342 AD – c. 1416 AD)
Source: https://en.m.wikiquote.org/wiki/Julian_of_Norwich
You don’t need to agree with the Divine Visions showed to her but let us not add/remove from what she actually wrote and what het Visions actually contained to be honest Christians. We may believe whatever we want as neither did the Divine Visions believe/Reveal in what the Majority of Christians believe and hence it doesn’t matter at all as God can have Mercy on whomever He Wills (Romans 9:15).
Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh’s Visions also agree toward Christ Centered Universalism likewise. Interesting indeed.
Comment: Regarding Possible non-Elect Salvation Hope for at least non-Christian relatively good people, please consider these ancient First Christianity quotes as follows based on Matthew 25:24.
“Then he who had received the one talent came and said, ‘Lord, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you have not sown, and gathering where you have not scattered seed.” – Most Merciful One, Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 25:24, NKJV)
Note (Context): We know from the Parable of the Sower, the Christians are all Sowed by the Sower into the Good Soil producing either a thirty, sixty or hundredfold harvest (Matthew 13:1 – 23). Please note carefully that in Matthew 25:24 above, Christ Reaps ‘others’ whom He has “not sown” meaning that these cannot refer to Christians and the fact that He Reaps from them indicates the Hope that these must be ‘some relatively good non-Christians’ who may be Saved into a non-Elect Salvation accordingly as even the ‘Shepherd of Hermas’ Scripture has Revealed (implied) in First Christianity as we have discussed prior too.
“… This servant seems to me to have been one of those who believe, but do not act honestly, concealing their faith, and doing every thing that they may not be known to be Christians. They who are such seem to me to have a fear of God, and to regard Him as austere and implacable. We indeed understand how the Lord reaps where He sowed not, because the righteous man sows in the Spirit, whereof he shall reap life eternal. Also He reaps where He sowed not, and gathers where he scattered not, because He counts as bestowed upon Himself all that is sown among the poor. …” – Blessed Origen of Alexandria, the Great but surprisingly Modest Exegete of the Eastern Church, “Nicknamed: Admantius or Man of Steel”, Tortured and Martyred for Christ (c. 184 AD – c. 253 AD)
and
“34Then Peter opened his mouth and said: “In truth I perceive that God shows no partiality. 35But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him.” (Acts of the Apostles 10:34 – 35, NKJV)
Yes, especially the non-Christian righteous who do a lot of Charity Works in Love:
“30So Cornelius said, “Four days ago I was fasting until this hour; and at the ninth hour I prayed in my house, and behold, a man stood before me in bright clothing, 31and said, ‘Cornelius, your prayer has been heard, and your alms are remembered in the sight of God.” (Acts of the Apostles 10:30 – 31, NKJV)
Please note carefully that Blessed Apostle St. Peter clearly notes that Cornelius (a non-Christian good at that time) has already been ‘accepted by God’ as there is no partiality with God (Acts 10:34 – 35, hence this could imply the General Salvation or ‘non-Elect Salvation toward Good non-Christians’) as St. Peter made this Statement even before he has begun to have Preached to Cornelius himself and even before Cornelius has believed in Christ. Indeed, Blessed Apostle St. Peter then continues further to Preach the Gospel to Cornelius to believe in Christ to thereby Garner the Highest Elect-Salvation in Him (Acts 10:36 – 48).
“… Also, by this which this servant dared to say, “Thou reapest where thou sowedst not,” we understand that the Lord accepts the good life of the Gentiles and of the Philosophers …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Source for each quote above [ for Blessed Origen’s and Blessed St. Jerome’s, from the Official ‘Catena Aurea’ Roman Catholic Bible Commentary in link below ]:
As discussed in earlier essays, Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh has seen this to occur in the Spirit World itself proving both Blessed Origen’s and Blessed St. Jerome’s quotes above based on Matthew 25:24 to be True. Mysterious Indeed.
Please note that Lord Jesus Christ Affirmed that what the wicked Servant told about the Lord in that the Lord Reapest even where He has not sown to be “True” (in Matthew 25:24) and is not a false statement as this can clearly be seen in the Lord’s Reply as follows:
“26“But his lord answered and said to him, ‘You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown, and gather where I have not scattered seed.” – The Fairest and Most Merciful Judge of All, Most Honoured Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 25:26, NKJV)
Perhaps the Earliest Church Leaders knew all this and that’s why their quotes sometimes seem to point to such a Broader Biblical Hope, for example:
“… The prophet Joel also predicted this phenomenon so that one cannot doubt the fulfillment of a fact attested by several witnesses. “And the sun,” he says, “will be changed into darkness and the moon into blood before the great and terrible DAY of the LORD’s COMING.” (Joel 2:31) . As far as the literal meaning of these words indicates, they seem to be more fitting for the SECOND ADVENT, for then the Lord will manifest himself publicly to ALL MEN, to the testimony of Scripture: “Then every eye will see him, and all the tribes of the earth and those who have crucified him will strike their breast.” (Rev. 1:7) … So the prophet foretold that the Savior would take care of their infirmities, and this prophecy is fulfilled in his time, as we see in the Gospel: “He really has borne our torpor, of our sufferings.” (Isa. 1:4) All these predictions have received their consummation and fulfillment in the Savior’s passion, and thus the SALVATION of the HUMAN RACE has been done in a true way for those who were on EARTH or in HELL*, for the prophecy of Zachariah embraces both of them at once. On earth, men have been freed from the oppression of their enemies by the intervention of the mercy of God, and in HELL* THEY were DELIVERED from the SORROWS THEY ENDURED. Indeed, all those who hoped in Christ who had been Promised to them awaited the coming of Him Who was to triumph over DEATH and DELIVER THEM from HELL. This is why Zechariah says: “To fulfill His mercies toward our fathers.” (Luke 1:72) But if it is understood that THIS SALVATION must also come in the SECOND ADVENT, … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD, Reply to Question 105, Commentary on the Gospel of Luke)
*Hell = Hades or Gehenna (Lake of Fire), we can’t be sure unless we see the Original but it’s certainly not Christians but some ‘lost ones’ who endured ‘sorrows in Hell first’ till that time of His Second Coming/Advent who ‘hoped in Christ who had been Promised to them’ sounds like ‘good non-Christians’, right? He also affirms that such a Salvation is possible in the Second Advent as Matthew 25:24 or Matthew 25:26 Reveals where He Reaps to Salvation (Matthew 13:28 – 30) toward whom He has not sown the Seed, i.e. among non-Christians too right?
All Glory be to the Most Holy and Most Blessed Trinity both now, to the age and unto the ages of Ages without End. Amen. Maranatha, Even so Come Lord Jesus to whom All things are Possible. Amen and Amen.
Peace to you
Additional Quotes (Example):
Mystery of the Surprised Sheep – Possible Hope for the non-Christian Good on Judgment Day?
To quote:
“… Sigurd Grindheim, writing in the Catholic Biblical Quarterly suggests that this parable connects to the Sermon on the Mount because it shows the importance of right attitude leading to right action.[5] Several Christian scriptures are addressed in this parable. Evangelical scholars believe that “least of my brothers” refers only to Christian believers and not to all peoples. This interpretation would mean that any act of kindness done to Christ’s followers is essentially done for Christ.[6] This implies a ramification: some people who receive salvation will be surprised because they did not personally follow Jesus, but supported his believers and helped Christ in this way. Scriptural commentator John Bollan said in regard to this passage, “the quality of our lives and our discipleship are measurable by the standards of love and the extent to which we translate this sentiment into action”.[7] Using this as a basis for scriptural interpretation, the love shown toward Jesus’ followers or vulnerable people in general promotes his mission, and allows for even the pagans to be saved. There is a sense that judgment will come through God asking “what have you done for my people”. The key to this parable is that the sheep and the goats are not surprised at their placement in the final Judgement, but at the reasons for their placement. …” – Wikipedia (Matthew 25)
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_25
All Glory be to the Most Holy and Most Blessed Trinity both now,
to the age and unto the ages of Ages without End. Amen.
Maranatha, Even so Come Lord Jesus to whom All things are Possible.
Amen and Amen.
Peace to you
P/S 35: Christ Centered Universalism – Blessed Billy Graham affirmed Hope for good non-Christians too
Example Video: https://youtu.be/drt5VPfnnms
Indeed, late in life, the World Famous Evangelist Blessed Billy Graham himself affirmed that good non-Christians may be Saved (which we understand to be a ‘Non-Elect Salvation’ as we have discussed with First Christianity quotes from Blessed Origen, Blessed St. Jerome and even the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture to Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh & Blessed Emmanuel Swedenborg’s Visions too) as it was discussed in further in post below too:
So, isn’t Blessed Billy Graham one of the most profoundly Anointed Man of God in all of Modern Protestantism?
Is he going to be hearing ‘I never knew you’ or is he revealing Deep Truths from Holy Scripture as he understood it as well from the Bible for example regarding the Mysterious surprised sheep as Matthew 25:31 – 46 describes literally?
As usual, some protestants affirm that Blessed Billy Graham and all Roman Catholics & other denominations of Christianity are going to an eternal Hell too, example in link below:
Here’s an example quote from link above:
“… Billy Graham was undoubtedly an ecumenicalist as he praised the pope as his “brother” and treated Roman Catholicism as a valid expression of the Christian faith. Speaking of Pope John Paul II after his death, Graham stated, I think he’s with the Lord, because he believed. He believed in the Cross. That was his focus throughout his ministry, the Cross, no matter if you were talking to him from personal issue or an ethical problem, he felt that there was the answer to all of our problems, the cross and the resurrection. And he was a strong believer. …”
No Verse in the Bible condemns Christ Centered Universalism as Hoping and Praying for it is God’s Will (1 Timothy 2:1, 1 Timothy 2:4, 1 Timothy 2:6, 1 Timothy 4:10) and thus even if God Decides Eternal-Hell, we can Petition for it and God can Decide into the ages to come whether to let His Mercy to Triumph and End any Judgment Sentence (James 2:13, Romans 11:30 – 32) as that’s what a Christian ought to Try Always & it’s not a Heresy for His Sons to Ask into the ages to come too (Ephesians 2:7), to quote:
“… and yet to recognize that His kingdom is ETERNAL, that is to say, the kingdom of the Son, for in the Name of Jesus EVERY KNEE shakes in HEAVEN, on the EARTH, and IN HELL. (Philip. 2) The Apostle St. Peter confirms this truth when he says:” No other name under heaven was given to MEN by which we were to BE SAVED.” (Acts 4) And did not the Lord Himself say to His disciples, “Until now you have not asked anything in my name, ask and I will answer you?” (John. 16:24) The REIGN of the Son therefore consists in the fact that it is in HIS NAME that ALL MEN are SAVED, and that ALL the PRAYERS addressed to Him until the end of the world are ANSWERED. But when ALL CREATURES have confessed Jesus Christ WILLINGLY or by FORCE, and have been subjected to the power against which they have resisted, then the MYSTERY of ONE GOD will be REVEALED to ALL MEN, and all thanksgivings will go back to God the Father, the principle of all things, that ALL PREACHING CEASE, ONE GOD be recognized in the MYSTERY of the TRINITY. … ” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD) (Written c. 366 – c. 384, Reply to Question 26, Commentary on the Gospel of Luke)
Source:
Conclusion – What did Blessed Billy Graham believe as Christian Faith?
To quote:
Quote 1—Are Muslims and Buddhists Saved? (an Interview with Robert Schuller)
Schuller: Tell me, what do you think is the future of Christianity?
Graham: Well, Christianity and being a true believer, you know, I think there’s the body of Christ, which comes from all the Christian groups around the world, or outside the Christian groups. I think everybody that loves Christ, or knows Christ, whether they’re conscious of it or not, they’re members of the body of Christ. And I don’t think that we’re going to see a great sweeping revival that will turn the whole world to Christ at any time. I think James answered that, the apostle James in the first council in Jerusalem, when he said that God’s purpose for this age is to call out a people for His name. And that’s what God is doing today, He’s calling people out of the world for His name, whether they come from the Muslim world, or the Buddhist world, or the Christian world or the nonbelieving world, they are members of the body of Christ because they’ve been called by God. They may not even know the name of Jesus but they know in their hearts that they need something that they don’t have, and they turn to the only light that they have, and I think that they are saved, and that they’re going to be with us in heaven.
Schuller: What I hear you saying is that it’s possible for Jesus Christ to come into human hearts and soul and life even if they’ve been born in darkness and never had an exposure to the Bible. Is that a correct interpretation of what you are saying?
Graham: Yes, it is because I believe that. I’ve met people in various parts of the world in tribal situations, that they have never seen a Bible or heard about a Bible, and never heard of Jesus, but they’ve believed in their hearts that there was a God, and they’ve tried to live a life that was quite apart from the surrounding community in which they lived.
Schuller: That’s fantastic, I’m so thrilled to hear you say that, there’s a wideness in God’s mercy.
Graham: There is. There definitely is.
Quote 2—Salvation without Christ? (an Interview with McCall’s Magazine)
I used to play God, but I can’t do that anymore. I used to believe pagans in far-off countries were lost—were going to hell—if they did not have the Gospel of Jesus Christ preached to them. I no longer believe that. . . . I believe there are other ways of recognizing the existence of God—through nature, for instance—and plenty of other opportunities, therefore, of saying “yes” to God. (Graham later clarified what he meant here.).
Note: Blessed Billy Graham does not believe in other ways of Salvation but only through Christ but Christ can Save them where even He did not Scatter the Seed of the Gospel too as Matthew 25:24 and Matthew 25:26 Reveals (i. e. Possibly the ‘Non-Elect Salvation’ both Blessed Origen and Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate have affirmed too) as opposed to the Christian Seed Salvation (i. e. the ‘Elect Salvation’ as it is described in the Parable of the Sower, Matthew 13:1 -8, Matthew 13:18 – 30).
Quote 3—Should We Link America with the Kingdom of God?
Speaking as an American himself, Graham said: I came close to identifying the American way of life with the kingdom of God. Then I realized that God had called me to a higher kingdom than America. I have tried to be faithful to my calling as a minister of the gospel.4
The above is a short excerpt from ReGrace with the endnotes removed. The rest of the quotes by Graham — including clarifying remarks he made about some of them — are included in the book.
To order the book, go to ReGrace: What the Shocking Beliefs of the Great Christians Can Teach Us Today.
Here is the Back Cover Description:
The church is tired of seeing Christians act ungraciously toward one another when they disagree. Social media has added to the carnage. Christians routinely block each other on Facebook because of doctrinal disagreements. The world watches the blood-letting, and the Christian witness is tarnished.
But what if every Christian discovered that their favorite teacher in church history had blind spots and held to some false–and even shocking–views?
Bestselling author Frank Viola argues that this simple awareness will soften Christians when they interact with each other in the face of theological disagreements.
In ReGrace, he uncovers some of the shocking beliefs held by faith giants like C.S. Lewis, Luther, Calvin, Moody, Spurgeon, Wesley, Graham, and Augustine–not to downgrade or dismiss them, but to show that even “the greats” in church history didn’t get everything right.
Knowing that the heroes of our faith sometimes got it wrong will empower us to treat our fellow Christians with grace rather than disdain whenever we disagree over theology.
Source: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/frankviola/billygraham/
Peace to you
Marietta Davis – Nine Days in Heaven Vision in a Coma
Firstly, each quote is from the Book Titled ” from link below unless stated otherwise:
https://archive.org/stream/scenesbeyondgrav00davi/scenesbeyondgrav00davi_djvu.txt
1) Who was Marietta Davis? She Claims to have Visited the Spirit World and met Lord Jesus Christ for 9 days and even Predicted her own Death and it Happened exactly.
“… Dear Friend: — Since you have been publishing the trance of Marietta Davis, in the Mountain Cove Journal, some of the readers have written to us to ascertain its authenticity. Upon this account, and to relieve you from embarrassment, we submit the following for your disposal : Marietta Davis was a member of our family ; — she was born in this town, where she lived until called by death from us. She was not of open religious habits ; being disciplined to religious conversation. During the revival in the winter of 1847 – 1848, her mind, as you well know, was religiously exercised ; but she could not realize what others professed, so as to enable her to unite with her young friends in the ordinances of the Gospel. In August following she fell into a sleep, or trance, from which she could not be awakened. — In that state she remained nine days ; and when she awoke, she said she had been in Heaven ; that she had seen there many of her old friends and relations who were dead ; and Jesus the Redeemer. From that time her hope in heaven through Jesus, was strong ; and she rejoiced in the prospect of a final admission into the Paradise of Peace. During her short stay with us, after she came out of the trance, she related what she said she had seen, heard and learned during her sleep; but much of what she told us, she said she wished should not be mentioned then, for the world was not prepared to hear it. The trance, as you published it, as far as we can recollect, is correct ; only you have omitted much. Marietta fell asleep in August, 1848, and died the following March, and at the time and in the manner predicted by herself. …” – (Section: “Authentic Testimony” in link above)
Note: Occasionally I correct spelling errors as found in the Book Text in link above.
2) The Phrase “Shadow of Death” (e.g. Psalm 23:4, Psalm 107:10 – 15) refers to the ‘Afterlife Spirit World Regions’
“… “Here the redeemed are first conducted by their guardian protectors, as they leave the valley and shadow of death, and here they are taught the rudiments of immortal life. Here they receive instructive lessons relative to their heavenly abode, and learn the nature of pm-e love, unmarred by sin. …” – (Chapter I, Page 23, SCENES BEYOND THE GRAVE)
As discussed in previous posts, if the phrase “Shadow of Death” refers to the “Spirit World”, the Psalm 107:10 – 15 might refer to a Salvation Hope there (example in link below):
https://web.facebook.com/jonathan.ramachandran/posts/10159186867567784
3) She saw ‘False Prophets’ in Hell where these refer to those who ‘merchandise the Gospel’ (i.e. making money out of the Gospel Intentions), teach not the danger of sin and “Mammon” (‘Love of Money’ stuff)
“… “Thou fiend of darkness! thou child of hypocrisy ! deceiver, matchless deceiver ! thine is the hell of a heartless religious teacher. Adequate sufferings thou canst never endure. Thou ‘madest merchandise of religion and the souls of men. Yea, because of this, thou didst dwell in temples of human glory, receiving the adoration of men ; then thou didst wrap thyself in the garments of ease at the expense of souls ; thou didst not seek to reach the ruined heart with the soul-redeeming Truth of Heaven, but to please the ear and charm the fancy. Is now thou art tormented. Arise ! thou false teacher, arise ! and in thy silken gown display the order of thy false apostleship. Speak to us smooth things. Direct the movement of this broad gallery of mimic song. Hold thy blasphemy! vent not thy cursings, for lo ! thy Maker is just ; wish not to move him from his throne. His august majesty thou didst mock. Through thee, his glory should have shown, and by that light thousands should have been led to seek his face. … The Bible — oh ! that sacred Book, gift of God to guide the wanderer to bright mansions in heaven — was made, by the false interpretations of the pleasure-loving and heartless divine, the passport to this scene of woe, where sins ripen into living forms, where fashions, with their gaudy folds, enwrap the spirit as with innumerable sheets of unextinguishable fire, and where Mammon, like a spectral goddess, sits in the clouds of death, which encanopythe abyss. … “Fear not, Marietta, before thee has been portrayed a portion of the consequences of sin upon the spirit of man. Spiritual sufferings are beyond any power of expression ; nor may they be perfectly mirrored upon the understanding by figures of representations. He who first addressed thee, represents that spirit of antichrist which seeks to dazzle spiritual perception by bright pictures of false reasoning behind all of which lies the scene of discord, improper affections, impure desires, love of self, false hearts, cruelty, lust, rape, and murder ; the denial of God in his redeeming mercy, sacrilege and blasphemy. He strove to direct thy attention to an opposite scene, and thereby conceal the state of those whose hearts are not controlled by the love of God. …” – ( CHAPTER XVn or CHAPTER XVIII, Page 99 , 101, 103, THE PANDEMONIUM MOCK WORSHIP, SCENES BEYOND THE GRAVE)
Conclusion – Ransom for Many Mystery?
The Ransom for Many Mystery [Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28] seems to include Salvation in the Spirit World as this Verse is quoted later in her Vision next.
She saw “Justice” (possibly an angel/Symbolism) pursuing a ‘Dark Cloud [Fallen being, non-Christian] Soul?’ who runs toward a ‘fallen group [of souls or called as ‘fallen orb’ later in writing below]’ in the ‘Spirit World’ till “Mercy” intervened (possibly an angel/Symbolism too) … where God Sided with Mercy as She Chose to Intervene and Saved through Christ (James 2:13, 1 Peter 3:18 – 19, 1 Peter 4:5).
“… The former objects had passed away during the worship of the angels and the infants, and new ones appeared. A bright cloud rested but a little above the temple, and from that cloud descended a being who appeared omnipotent in strength. Justice, was written upon his majestic brow. His movement was like one supreme, at whose bidding worlds might flee away, and in whose hand universal law might pause, and her evolving energies slumber. This august personage advanced toward a gloomy glen, encircled by huge mountains whose lofty peaks ascended far into the blue vault above. His demeanor indicated purpose. As he drew very near what appeared the object of his pursuit, a dark cloud moved down the mountains attended by lightning in all the terror of wild display, as if the electric fountains were issuing from an ocean of igneous elements. Heavy thunderings shook the base of the massive hills. Fire, smoke, and tempest were emitted, while the elements seemed to madly embrace each other. The scene was frightfully terrific; but still Justice advanced, and the very lightnings seemed to wi’eath themselves into a diadem about his brow. •’ Destruction ” was now mirrored in super-flaming letters, in the very lightnings, upon the clouds, and repeated by the stunning peals of thunder. Beneath this awful display of angry elements, and the movement of Justice, the earth began to quake and give way. At this moment, when the excitement had apparently reached its climax, from beneath the cloud, and at the foot of the mountain, came a voice of lamentation, a voice of despair, saying, ^’ Spare us ; is there no hope.” ” No hope,” echoed the thunders, and Justice still advanced. ” IS To hope,” he repeated, as he raised his hand of might. ” No hope, no hope,” chimed the hoarse voice of contending elements. ” We perish without hope,” said the voice of wailing which grew still weaker and more suppressed. ” Alas ! alas ! we perish unpitied,” and in an instant was revealed the forlorn being and the afflicted group displayed in a former scene. Over the prostrate man bent the trembling female as if to screen him from the tempest ; but as she saw Justice raise his mighty hand, she fell back, exclaiming, ” All is lost ! No hope ! “We perish ! Receive us, thou abyss 1″ Dreadful was the suspense of that moment. Justice still advanced, as if to cut in pieces, to crush at once the forlorn man whose trembling hands were upraised in form of supplication, — by whose side, and around whom, were fallen his group of friends, alike helpless and suppliant. At this period a voice from the burning cloud
said: ” Law’s proceeding energies have been violated, and thence disturbed in thee, O man. And thinkest thou to trifle therewith, and not to suffer the consequences? Dost thou not understand that law, when opposed, worketh the destruction of the body- in which it is violated ? Moral law is the law of sense and goodness. Hast thou not violated ? Yea, thou hast. Now ensue the dread effects, and thou art the sufferer.” As this voice ceased, superior light flashed over the scene, and from above a cloud exceedingly bright descended, from which came, with the speed of thought, another being, the very image of meekness, whose demeanor was the very opposite of Justice ; and embracing Justice, who was still advancing toward the fallen group, said : ” Art thou inexorable, O thou who vindicatest the everlasting throne? Must the sinner perish? Is there no hope ?” ” No hope in the arm of flesh,” answered Justice in a voice that shook the firmament above. The very stars trembled, and the earth quaked and reeled as the words proceeded from his lips. ” No hope or cause of hope exists upon the fallen orb,” again repeated Justice, still advancing. And as the blow was about descending upon the sinner, the being who hung upon the neck of Justice bent over that bleeding form, and placing her left hand upon his heart, raised the right, and touching the arm of Justice, said, ” Thy Throne, O God, endureth for ever. Thy kingdom is from everlasting to everlasting. Thy Word endures. To thy years there is no end. Thou, O God, art holy. righteousness is the foundation of thy throne — the pavilion of thy dwelling-place — the glory of the everlasting hills — the defence and safety of the Heaven of heavens, where congregate the unnumbered myriads of glorified seraphim. Here, O God, is a fallen being. Sin is the violation of thy law. The sinner hath presumed upon thy government, and touched with impious hands the flaming sword ; hath dared vengeance ; trifled with thy will ; and contended with eternal and irrevocable justice. He hath fallen. He lieth bruised, mangled and expiring. Yet, O God, thou hast created him an immortal being ; intellectual, hence accountable ; spiritual, hence by sin he lieth upon the verge of a bottomless abyss, where, if he fall, he shall feel immortal pangs, and dwell in unremitting woe. The reed is bruised, but not entirely broken ; the flickering blaze of the smoking flax, though expiring, still exists [Isaiah 42:3, Matthew 12:20]. Mercy is my name. Mercy is an attribute of thy throne. To thee, O God, belong Justice and Mercy I Let thy love, O thou Eternal, descend I and thou, Justice, spare, O spare this fallen being I Spare him though he hath sinned, and bartered for a morsel his eternal good !” Here Mercy bowed her head, as if to wait the decision and a voice from the cloud said, “Mercy, thou hast plead for the sinner, and heaven giveth audience. Canst thou find a ransom? Justice pause in thy execution.” Then another voice said, ”God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son. He shall bear their iniquity. By my righteous servant I will justify many.” [Matthew 20:28, Matthew 26:28]. Then there was a pause, during which, from the right approached a female — even Mary whom I had seen with the beasts of the stall pressing to her bosom the babe of Bethlehem—and by the expiring form bowed, over which by the aid of Mercy she extended the babe, and with reverence looked up toward the cloud. And the voice continued, “This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, until he send forth judgement unto victory [Matthew 12:20]. And in his Name shall the Gentiles trust.” [Matthew 12:21] Then replied Justice, ” Hath he endured temptation, and suffered without the Gate? Hath he conquered death ! Can he stay the tempest of wanting elements? Can he change the malign nature of that perverted heart? Can he descend the maelstrom of death, and arrest the heavy tide whose broad current thence rolls to the bottomless abyss ?” Then said Mercy, ” The future shall answer thee, O, thou who boldest the balances of equity, the the scales of universal right.” When Mercy had answered, the scene changed, and upon the mount, called the Mount of Olives, I saw a being more lovely than the sons of men He lifted up his eyes to heaven and said, ” Lo ! 1 come, in the volume of the book it is written of me, to do thy Will, O God !” Then appeared a vast multitude of deformed beings exhibiting every type of human suffering and shameful depravity ; and addressing them He said ; “If any man thirst, let him come unto me and drink. I am the “Way, the Truth and the Life. No man cometh unto the Father but by me.” Whereupon another voice said, “This is the Son of David, the hope of Israel, the bright and Morning Star. Now ariseth the Sun of Righteousness. Now appeareth Truth in its redeeming glory from the Eternal Cause. Look unto him, ye who perish, for lo ! He cometh to redeem.” Again I saw the mangled form. These words had fallen upon his dull and heavy hearing, and although he scarcely understood them, he raised his eyes as if to see whence hope was proffered. And as he looked. He who stood upon the Mount descended and bowed over him saying, “What dost thou desire?” And the sufferer said, “Oh that I might find salvation!” Then answered the Personage bending over him, ” I came to seek and save the lost.” Then said Justice to Mercy, “Where is thy ransom?” And another voice said, “Behold the Lamb of God which taketh away the sin of the world.” And he who proffered redemption said, “For this cause came I into the world.” “Even angel, “by thy Stripes is the sinner healed.” “But,” replied Justice, “Hath he prevailed?” Then addressing Mercy he continued, “Know, thou who pleadest the sinner’s cause, that until he whoro thou proposeth as Redeemer shall approach the fallen, holding in his hand these contending elements, he shall not rescue. Seekest thou still the fallen being’s salvation, his restoration to harmony ” Yea,” answered Mercy ” for this I interpose.” …” – ( CHAPTER XXIV, JUSTICE AND MERCY, Page 135 – 141, SCENES BEYOND THE GRAVE)
Comment: This afterlife Spirit World Salvation Hope for ‘Many’ (Majority of Mankind) to be Saved there as the Vision prior seems to point that they believed in Him in the afterlife after seeing the Risen Christ there (John 6:40) into a non-Elect Salvation seems to be echoed by the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture, Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh and Blessed Ambrosiaster too, to quote:
Context = Definition of Saved
Saved = Part of the Tower of Repentance = Being His Church /Bride
Not Saved = not His Church = have not Salvation (referring to ‘not’ being part of the First Resurrection Revelation 20:4 – 6 when He Returns, Matthew 7:21 – 23)
These same rejected unsaved stones are said to be saved in another place more humble eventually, to quote:
“Hermas 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. Hermas 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. Hermas 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts.”
Source for Translation: https://carm.org/shepherd-of-hermas
“… At least, that is the case with the majority, but there are some few personalities, Satan for instance, in regard to whom I was told, ‘Don’t ask about them.’ And so I didn’t like to ask, but I hoped that for them also there was some hope. ‘ ‘ They also told me that the Saints help in the work of saving souls in Hell, because there can be no idleness in Heaven. Those in Hell will ultimately be brought to Heaven like the prodigal son, but with regard to the ultimate fate of a certain number you must not ask.” The Sadhu is inclined to think that perhaps these few will be annihilated. “Once I said, ‘So many people will be lost because they have not heard of Christ.’ They said, ‘The contrary will be the ease ; very few will be lost. ‘ There is a kind of heavenly joke, no, joke is not a good word for it. ‘Very few will be lost but many will be saved. It is so, but don’t tell,’ they said, as it were, in jest, ‘because it will make men careless, and we want them to enjoy the First Heaven — that is the Heaven on earth — as well.’ ” “If there were no hope for all the non-Christians in the world and all the Christians who die in sin, God would stop creating men. We must do our part here on earth to save sinners, but if they refuse we need not be without hope for them. ‘ ‘ The Sadhu’s “universalism” recalls the famous “Shewing” to Mother Juliana of Norwich*, “All manner of things shall be well,” and her comments thereon — except that her respect for the authority of the Church precludes her making any suggestion how this may be possible. 1 The Sadhu faithfully obeys the injunction, “Don’t tell.” In his popular teachings, as we shall see in the next chapter, he stresses the need of repentance, and the certainty of immediate judgment in the next life, but he never speaks of his hope of ultimate salvation even for the unrepentant. …” (Blessed Sadhu Sundar Singh’s Hope in Christ Centered Universalism and Afterlife Salvation Mystery)
Source [Page 101 – 102, ECSTASY AND VISION, via Reverend Streeter and Bishop Dr. AJ Appasamy]:
https://archive.org/stream/cu31924029356684/cu31924029356684_djvu.txt
iii. Blessed Ambrosiaster
“… QUESTION 54. THE APOSTLE TEACHES THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED FOR ALL MEN. “ALL ARE THEREFORE DEAD,” SAID HE, “AND HE DIED FOR ALL.” THE SAVIOR SAYS, ON THE CONTRARY: THE SON OF MAN HAS COME TO GIVE HIS LIFE FOR THE REDEMPTION OF MANY. (MATT 20:28) THERE IS HERE A CONTRADICTION. — The words are different, it is true, but the meaning is the same; at other times, on the other hand, words that seem the same have quite a different meaning, such as these: “All that is not done in good faith (ex fide) is a sin.” (Rom. 14:23) and these others: “The law does not come from faith,” (Gal. 3:12) although the law is not a sin. This great number of which the Savior speaks is all the men of whom St. Paul speaks: They are in great numbers, because the greater part of all peoples and all nations ought to believe in the Savior. It is this great number of those who must believe that the Apostle calls all men. “He is dead for all,” he says, “that is, for those who believe and must believe.” He died also for those who refused to believe, but by refusing the grace he offers them, they do not want Jesus Christ to be dead for them, and by the same he seems not to have died for those to that his death was much more harmful than useful. On the contrary, he truly died for those who won, and who understand the mystery of the redemption give thanks to God through our Lord Jesus Christ. …” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
Source:
Humanitarian Works and Judgment Day – Hippolytus and Origen
It is well known that Blessed Hippolytus of Rome and the Christian Universlist Preacher Blessed Origen of Alexandria were friends, to quote:
“… Hippolytus was distinguished for his learning and eloquence. It was at this time that Origen, then a young man, heard him preach …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippolytus_of_Rome
[as the Story is Discussed in Images Attached from a Book Titled “Hippolytus: The First Antipope by John Mench” which may be bought in link below]:
https://www.amazon.com/Hippolytus-First-Antipope-John-Mench/dp/1489721304
*Please note how then Old Blessed Hippolytus of Rome praises young Blessed Origen’s Christian Faith/Hope and does not call him a heretic. Blessed Origen of Alexandria is known to Preach Christ Centered Universalism openly but the heresies of ‘transmigration of souls & the rest’ comes in later in life when Blessed Origen speculated too much using Greek Philosophy and erred.
“… This servant seems to me to have been one of those who believe, but do not act honestly, concealing their faith, and doing every thing that they may not be known to be Christians. They who are such seem to me to have a fear of God, and to regard Him as austere and implacable. We indeed understand how the Lord reaps where He sowed not, because the righteous man sows in the Spirit, whereof he shall reap life eternal. Also He reaps where He sowed not, and gathers where he scattered not, because He counts as bestowed upon Himself all that is sown among the poor. …” – Blessed Origen of Alexandria, the Great but surprisingly Modest Exegete of the Eastern Church, “Nicknamed: Admantius or Man of Steel”, Tortured and Martyred for Christ (c. 184 AD – c. 253 AD)
“… Also, by this which this servant dared to say, “Thou reapest where thou sowedst not,” we understand that the Lord accepts the good life of the Gentiles and of the Philosophers …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Source for each quote above [ for Blessed Origen’s and Blessed St. Jerome’s, from the Official ‘Catena Aurea’ Roman Catholic Bible Commentary in link below ]:
Blessed St. Jerome’s commentary for the quote continues as follows:
“… To him who has faith, and a right will in the Lord, even if he come in aught short in deed as being man, shall be given by the merciful Judge; but he who has not faith, shall lose even the other virtues which he seems to have naturally. And He says carefully, “From him that hath not, shall be taken away even that which he seemeth to have,” for whatsoever is without faith in Christ ought not to be imputed to him who uses it amiss, but to Him who gives the goods of nature even to a wicked servant. …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Source: https://poncer.blogspot.com/2005/11/st_13.html
Please read carefully to realize that in the Bible Verses Christ only takes away the talent from that “wicked unprofitable Servant who hid the talent in the ground” and did not use it wisely but not from the ones who ‘produced fruit where He Sowed not’ (i.e. the possible non-Christian who did good works since Christ didn’t Sow in them faith first as Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26 implies). Verses:
“26“But his lord answered and said to him, ‘You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown, and gather where I have not scattered seed. 27So you ought to have deposited my money with the bankers, and at my coming I would have received back my own with interest. 28So take the talent from him, and give it to him who has ten talents. 29‘For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away. 30And cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’” – Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 25:26 – 30, NKJV)
In other words, please notice that the talent is taken away from the unprofitable [Christian] servant only and not from those profitable for a “reaping” (hence have the fruit of good works) though it is Written that Christ did not “sow” in them, i.e. non-Christian righteous because the “Sowing as per the Parable of the Sower” (Matthew 13:1 – 23) must refer to ‘sowing the Faith of Christ’, right?
So, the “fruit” (refers to good works, John 5:28 – 29, Revelation 20:11 – 15) where the “Seed” refers to “Faith of Christ” (Matthew 13:1 – 23) and hence Christ will Harvest the “fruit” of ‘good works’ unto Salvation, as whatever that is “reaped” is Saved parabolically (Matthew 13:30) even if the “fruit of the harvest” is “reaped” from those non-Christians who did not have the ‘Seed of the Faith of Christ’ (Matthew 25:26), right? Salvation is not by Works but by His Mercy Alone though through the “Works” especially of “Mercy” one does can plead before God to have “Mercy on them” (Matthew 5:7).
“… Also He reaps where He sowed not, and gathers where he scattered not, because He counts as bestowed upon Himself all that is sown among the poor. …” – Blessed Origen of Alexandria
Here: Blessed Origen of Alexandria echoes that any kindness done to the “poor” is considered as “doing it for Christ” (Matthew 25:40) and thus such ones may obtain Mercy on Judgment Day too as neither is Mercy limited by faith or unbelief (Romans 3:3 – 4, Romans 11:32-KJV) but on whomever God Wills too as it does not depend on human will either (Romans 9:15).
In An Appendix attached to the Treatise titled “Refutation of All Heresies” now attributed to St. Hippolytus of Rome (earlier sometimes to Origen), we find the following mysterious passage which describes the traits of those who will be Saved on Judgment Day in Great Detail where in the particular section of the quote (highlighted below), such ‘kind ones to the poor’ (based on Matthew 25:31 – 46) may obtain Mercy to be Saved too (Romans 9:15, Matthew 5:7) of which ‘they may be surprised as well’, to quote:
“… Come, ye friends of the poor and the stranger. Come, ye who kept my love, as I am love. Come, ye who possess peace, for I own that peace. Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you, ye who esteemed not riches, ye who had compassion on the poor, who aided the orphans, who helped the widows, who gave drink to the thirsty, who fed the hungry, who received strangers, who clothed the naked, who visited the sick, who comforted those in prison, who helped the blind, … Then shall the King of kings make answer again, and say to them, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Inasmuch as ye have received those of whom I have already spoken to you, and clothed them, and fed them, and gave them to drink, I mean the poor who are my members, ye have done it unto me. But come ye into the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; enjoy for ever and ever that which is given you by my Father in heaven, and the holy and quickening Spirit. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD)
Source [Appendix, XLII, XLIV]:
or Pages 125 – 128 in link below too:
https://archive.org/stream/therefutationofa00hippuoft/therefutationofa00hippuoft_djvu.txt
Comments:
” 25But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:26, NKJV)
“… Cleave to me, to whom every knee boweth, of things in heaven, and things on earth, and things under the earth. For all who have been negligent, and have not shown pity in well-doing there, have nothing else due them than the unquenchable fire. For I am the friend of man, but yet also a righteous Judge to all. For I shall award the recompense according to desert; I shall give the reward to all, according to each man’s labour; I shall make return to all, according to each man’s conflict. I wish to have pity, but I see no oil in your vessels. I desire to have mercy, but ye have passed through life entirely without mercy. I long to have compassion, but your lamps are dark by reason of your hardness of heart. Depart from me. For judgment is without mercy to him that hath showed no mercy. (Jam_2:13) …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD)
Source [Appendix, XLVII.]:
The phrase ” I wish to have pity, but I see no oil in your vessels. I desire to have mercy, but ye have passed through life entirely without mercy.” strengthens our Context Claim that those who may have Practiced Mercy among these ‘non-Christians’ can Hope for His Mercy as Christ Seeks these ‘Works of Mercy’ in them (John 5:28 – 29, Revelation 20:11 – 15) in order to show any Mercy as Blessed St. Hippolytus’ quote above rings.
iii. Blessed Hippolytus of Rome may have seen the Lake of Fire Punishment as lasting to one ‘Singular Age (Aeon) only, i.e. Age-duringly’ as the literal word in the Bible means
To quote [Please note the phrase “Future age” = “Future AEON-singular only” carefully below]:
“… I produce now the prophecy of Solomon, which speaketh of Christ, and announces clearly and perspicuously things concerning the Jews ; and those which not only are befalling them at the present time, but those, too, which shall befall them in the FUTURE AGE on account of the contumacy and audacity which they exhibited toward the Prince of Life …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, Point 9, TREATISE AGAINST THE JEWS, Page 44)
and
“… 10. And again David, in the Psalrns, says with respect to the FUTURE AGE, ” Then shall He ” (namely Christ) ” speak unto them in His wrath, and vex them in His sore displeasure.” 3 And again Solomon says concerning Christ and the Jews, that ” when the righteous shall stand in great boldness before the face of such as have afflicted Him, and made no
account of His words, when they see it they shall be troubled with terrible fear, and shall be amazed at the strangeness of His salvation ; and they, repenting and groaning for anguish
of spirit, shall say within themselves, This is He whom we had sometimes in derision and a proverb of reproach ; we fools accounted His life madness, and His end to be without
honour. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, Point 10, TREATISE AGAINST THE JEWS, Page 45)
Source for both quotes above [‘Refutation of All Heresies’]:
https://archive.org/stream/therefutationofa00hippuoft/therefutationofa00hippuoft_djvu.txt
“… For he who comes down in faith to the layer of regeneration, and renounces the devil, and joins himself to Christ ; who denies the enemy, and makes the confession that Christ is God; who puts off the bondage, and puts on the adoption, he comes up from the baptism brilliant as the sun, 5 flashing forth the beams of righteousness, and, which is indeed the chief thing, he returns
a son of God and joint-heir with Christ. To Him be the glory and the power, together with His most holy, and good, and quickening Spirit, NOW and EVER [to the age]* and to ALL the AGES of the AGES. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, Point 10, DISCOURSE ON THE HOLY THEOPHANY, Page 87)
*[Emphasis Mine]
and the word “endless” in front of the stronger Koine Greek Phrase “ages of Ages” (example of occurrences in the Bible: Revelation 14:11, Revelation 20:10) is not necessary if the phrase ‘aeons of the Aeons’ itself means ‘forever’, right?, to quote next:
“… everlasting [AGE-During, literally] fire, prepared for the devil and his angels, which my Father hath prepared.” And John says, ” Without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever inaketh and loveth a lie ; for your part is in the hell of fire.” … G7. These things, then, I have set shortly before thee, O Theophilus, drawing them (from Scripture itself), in order that, maintaining in faith what is written, and anticipating the things that are to be, thou mayest keep thyself void of offence both toward God and toward men, ” looking for that blessed hope and appearing of our God and Saviour,” l when, having raised the saints among us, lie will rejoice with them, glorifying the Father. To Him be the glory unto the ENDLESS AGES of the AGES. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, G7 or 65 & 67, TREATISE ON CHRIST AND ANTICHRIST, Page 40)
or
“… and again, ” Well done, good and faithful servant ; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things : enter thou into the joy of thy Lord.” 2 Which joy may it be ours to reach, by the grace and kindness of our Lord Jesus Christ, to whom pertain glory, honour, and adoration, with His Father, who is without beginning, and His holy, and good, and quickening Spirit, now and EVER [literally: AGE-duringly], and to the AGES [“aeons”] of the AGES [“Aeons”]. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, XLTX, APPENDIX TO PART II, Page 130)
or
“… we made speed to depart thence in all earnestness ; and we reported in Jerusalem all that we had seen. Behold, then the great things that we have told you regarding Christ; and we saw Christ our Saviour, who was made known as both God and man. To Him be the glory and the power unto the AGES [“aeons”] of the AGES [“Aeons”]. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, CHRONOGRAPHY OF JULIUS AFRICANUS, Page 202)
Source for each quote above [‘Refutation of All Heresies’]:
https://archive.org/stream/therefutationofa00hippuoft/therefutationofa00hippuoft_djvu.txt
Peace to you
Peace to you
I never Knew You Mystery – Christian Faith – Which Faith will be Missing when Christ Returns?
“I tell you that He will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless, when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?” – Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 18:8, NKJV)
0) A Common Interpretation – My denomination is Right and it is the only True Christian Church
Example quote below by a recent famous Eastern Orthodox saint:
“… Of course the world has always been making war on Christian faith, but today it has very nearly succeeded in winning the war. Do you remember the terrible words of Our Lord: “When the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth?” In the last days faith is to be almost entirely extinguished. And yet the appearance of faith will probably be maintained; Antichrist, we know, will attempt to imitate Christ. Probably the “world Church” that is being formed by the “ecumenical movement” today (whose center, of course, will be Rome) will keep intact most of the externals of Christian worship and dogma—but its heart, true faith, will be missing, and so it will be simply an imitation of Christianity. …” – Blessed Fr. Seraphim Rose (1961 – 1982)
Source:
https://thoughtsintrusive.wordpress.com/letters-of-fr-seraphim-rose-1961-1982/
Comment: I do not think that this is what the Verse means because this Ancient Patriarch of First Christianity from Eastern Orthodoxy himself clearly speaks of ‘something else’ when quoting Luke 18:8.
Here’s is why I don’t believe in the quote in image with quotes from the Greatest Fathers of the Church in Eastern Orthodoxy itself to support my claims, let’s begin:
1) Judge Nothing before its time type of Faith
“Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord comes, who will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness and reveal the counsels of the hearts. Then each one’s praise will come from God.” (1 Corinthians 4:5, NKJV)
The Bible Verse above in regards to ‘Judge nothing before its Time’ instructs us to ‘not fix any results of Judgment on anyone’ type of Faith and hence it doesn’t matter what you believe about the “Results” of Judgment except that you ‘believe in God’s Judgment’ (as He Alone makes the Choice, Romans 9:15).
Yes, Believing in Eternal Hell, Christ Centered Universalism or Annihilation, i.e. speculating on the Topic of “Judgment” will not save anyone nor will it condemn them (but may make a difference in “rewards” as Blessed St. Gregory the Theologian below has shown):
“… then here too I will provide thee with broad paths. Philosophize about the world or worlds; about matter; about soul; about natures endowed with reason, good or bad; about resurrection, about judgment, about reward, or the Sufferings of Christ. For in these subjects to hit the mark is not useless, and to miss it is not dangerous. But with God we shall have converse, in this life only in a small degree; but a little later, it may be, more perfectly, in the Same, our Lord Jesus Christ, to Whom be glory for ever. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
2) Legal Church Worship and Rituals Type of Faith?
Doing “Legal Worship” is ‘not faith’ but rather “True Worship” is doing ‘Charity Works toward our fellow men’
Indeed, among All Virtues a Christian may Practice, the ‘Highest Virtue’ is ‘Charity toward others’, to quote:
“… And the charge against them is, that they have done the very opposite of that for which the saints were praised. “For I was hungry, and you gave Me not to eat; and thirsty, and you gave Me not to drink: for inasmuch as you did it not, He says, to one of these little ones, you did it not to Me.” But to this perhaps some one will object, that there are many kinds of well living; for virtue is diversified, so to speak, and manifold: why therefore, having omitted those other kinds, does He make mention only of love to the poor? To this we reply, that the act is better than any other kind of |532 well doing: for it works in our souls a certain divine likeness which moulds us, so to speak, after God’s image. For Christ also has said, “Be you merciful, as your Father also in heaven is merciful,” He who is quick to show mercy, and compassionate and kind, is ranked with the true worshippers; for it is written, that “a pure and unpolluted sacrifice to God the Father is this, to visit orphans and widows in their poverty, and that a man keep himself unspotted from the world.” And the wise Paul also has somewhere written, “But alms and communication forget not: for with such sacrifices God is content.” For He loves not the incense of the legal worship, but requires rather the pleasantness of the sweet spiritual savour. But the sweet spiritual savour unto God is to show pity unto men, and to maintain love towards them. …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD, Commentary on Luke 16:19 – 31)
Source:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/cyril-on-luke-16
Focus quotes proving our claim:
3) Loving our Enemies type of Faith
Today’s Christian faiths have many who ‘hate their enemies’ and wage war on them ‘politically, economically …etc. … some even secretly praying for the Destruction of their enemies in the Name of God’. Such a Faith is NOT found in Holy New Testament Scripture but the Opposite is the Case (if you practice this, it’s considered imitating the Saints of God themselves in quote below):
“… Whenever therefore offences are committed by any against us personally, let us immediately even count it our glory to be forgiving towards them, and full of mutual love; and imitating the holy fathers, even though they smite and scorn us, yes, even though they inflict violence upon us of every kind, let us free them from all blame, and be superior both to wrath |554 and vexation. Such glorying becomes the saints, and is pleasing to God. …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD, Commentary on Luke 16:19 – 31)
Source [Commentary on Luke 18:1 -8]:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/cyril-on-luke-18
4) Prosperity Gospel Type of False Faith in Hoarding and Material Abundance
Prosperity Gospel Type of False Faith which Merchandises the Gospel as the Main Error of False Prophets whose ‘Love have Gone Cold’ though they may have converted many by doing the ‘casting out demons work’, ‘prophesying money/prosperity primarily’, ‘other miracles’ (Matthew 7:20 – 23) as Converting People by Promising them Money is a False Gospel as the True Gospel Requires all Disciples of Christ to Renounce their Possessions in some Way (Luke 14:33) as the Great Commission to make “Disciples” includes this Teaching too (Matthew 28:19) with no hoarding wealth/riches/money (Luke 12:21) by Selling and Giving to Charities (Luke 12:31 – 33) or in Sharing them in Some Way (Acts 2:44 – 45, Acts 4:32, 1 John 3:16 – 18).
“… But that men would make merchandize of the word of uprightness, and prevail on many to abandon a sound faith, involving them in the inventions of devilish error, and “belching forth, as Scripture says, things out of their own hearts, and not out of the mouth of the Lord,” He foretold, saying, “When the Son of man comes, shall He find faith upon the earth?” [Luke 18:8] It escaped not His knowledge: how could it, seeing that He is God Who knows all things? He tells us then, to use his own words, that “the love of many will grow cold,” and that “in the latter times some shall depart from a correct and blameless faith, going after seducing spirits, and giving heed to the false words of men who are seared in mind. …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD, Commentary on Luke 16:19 – 31)
Source [Commentary on Luke 18:8]:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquinasstudybible/home/luke-commentary/cyril-on-luke-18
The First Resurrection into the ‘Royal Residence of God’ (Revelation 20:4 – 6, 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18, Matthew 7:20 – 23, Matthew 25:1 – 13) involves ” a lot of oil” (where the “oil” denotes ‘Good Works’ – please see proof quotes later below) and ‘Prosperity Gospel’ may cause one to ‘fall away from this Path of Righteousness as such teach to desire earthly things as abundant life’ which is not true (Luke 12:15) as this Great Saint from First Christianity Warned a long time ago when Discussing the Context of the ‘Great Denial’ in Matthew 7:30 – 23, to quote:
“… Let us, then, not only call Him Lord, for that will not save us. For He saith, “Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall be saved, but he that worketh righteousness.” [Matthew 7:20 – 23] Wherefore, brethren, let us confess Him by our works, by loving one another, by not committing adultery, or speaking evil of one another, or cherishing envy; but by being continent, compassionate, and good. We ought also to sympathize with one another, and not be avaricious. By such works let us confess Him, and not by those that are of an opposite kind. And it is not fitting that we should fear men, but rather God. For this reason, if we should do such [wicked] things, the Lord hath said, “Even though ye were gathered together to me in my very bosom, yet if ye were not to keep my commandments, I would cast you off, and say unto you, Depart from me; I know you not whence ye are, ye workers of iniquity.” [Matthew 25:13] … By what course of conduct, then, shall we attain these things, but by leading a holy and righteous life, and by deeming these worldly things as not belonging to us, and not fixing our desires upon them? For if we desire to possess them, we fall away from the path of righteousness … For what will it profit if a man gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?” This world and the next are two enemies. The one urges to adultery and corruption, avarice and deceit; the other bids farewell to these things. We cannot, therefore, be the friends of both; and it behoves us, by renouncing the one [Luke 14:33], to make sure of the other. … For if we do the will of Christ, we shall find rest; otherwise, nothing shall deliver us from eternal punishment, if we disobey His commandments. For thus also saith the Scripture in Ezekiel, “If Noah, Job, and Daniel should rise up, they should not deliver their children in captivity.” Now, if men so eminently righteous are not able by their righteousness to deliver their children, how can we hope to enter into the royal residence of God unless we keep our baptism holy and undefiled? …” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter (c.35 AD – c. 99 AD, 2 Clement Chapter IV, V and VI)
Source [ CHAP. IV.–TRUE CONFESSION OF CHRIST, CHAP. V.–THIS WORLD SHOULD BE DESPISED and CHAP. VI.–THE PRESENT AND FUTURE WORLDS ARE ENEMIES TO EACH OTHER]:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/2clement-roberts.html
Danger of Prosperity Gospel which can cause one to fall out from this Hope is highlighted from the above:
“… By what course of conduct, then, shall we attain these things, but by leading a holy and righteous life, and by deeming these worldly things as not belonging to us, and not fixing our desires upon them? For if we desire to possess them, we fall away from the path of righteousness … ”
Hence when Christ Returns, He rarely finds “Faith” (Luke 18:8) because the faith that exists in Christianity is ‘not having sufficient oil of Good Works as the Parable of the Ten Virgins Reveal’ (Matthew 25:1 – 13). Yes, the First Resurrection to be part of His Bride in the Wedding Feast requires one to have both “Faith and Works”:
“You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.” (James 2:24, NKJV)
Where this “works” is primarily ‘feeding the hungry, thirsty …’ or ‘humanitarian type’:
“14What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead” (James 2:14 – 17, NKJV)
Salvation is not by Works by but His Mercy/Grace (Ephesians 2:8) but to be part of the First Resurrection one has to ‘Work out one’s Salvation’ (Philippians 2:12) in ‘good works as Doing the Will of the Father’ (Matthew 7:20 – 23) sufficiently as the ‘oil must be enough’ [God Counts in Percentages, Luke 21:1 – 4, toward ‘those Worthy’ as He Alone knows the Threshold, Luke 20:35 – 36] where the ‘foolish virgins did not have enough oil/good works’ though they were “Virgins” indicating that ‘they kept the Law to some extent and were believers’ (Matthew 25:1 – 13).
“… Or, The “oil” denotes charity, alms, and every aid rendered to the needy; the lamps denote the gifts of virginity; and He calls them “foolish,” because after having gone through the greater toil, they lost all for the sake of a less; for it is greater labour to overcome the desires of the flesh than of money….” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD)
Rejection from the First Resurrection is Described as Follows:
“… For “cast ye,” saith He, “the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” [2871] Seest thou how not only the spoiler, and the covetous, nor only the doer of evil things, but also he that doeth not good things [James 4:17], is punished with extreme punishment. … Knowing then these things, let us contribute alike wealth, and diligence, and protection, [2872] and all things for our neighbor’s advantage. For the talents here are each person’s ability, whether in the way of protection, or in money, or in teaching, or in what thing soever of the kind. Let no man say, I have but one talent, and can do nothing; for thou canst even by one approve thyself. For thou art not poorer than that widow [Luke 21:1 – 4]; thou art not more uninstructed than Peter and John, who were both “unlearned and ignorant men;” [2873] but nevertheless, since they showed forth a zeal, and did all things for the common good, they attained to Heaven [Matthew 19:27 – 30]. For nothing is so pleasing to God, as to live for the common advantage [Acts 2:44 – 45, Acts 4:32, 1 John 3:16 – 18]. …” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Doctor of the Church, Archbishop of Constantinople (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD)
Source (Homily on Matthew 25):
https://biblehub.com/commentaries/chrysostom/matthew/25.htm
Second Resurrection which Happens 1000 Years later (Revelation 20:5) where only “Works” are mentioned to be Judged (Revelation 20:11 – 15, Romans 2:5 – 16). Another badge of Righteous seems to be Resurrected during this time (as they are simultaneously raised, based on Works in John 5:28 – 29, Daniel 12:2, Matthew 25:31 – 46*) where the ‘First Resurrection’ of ‘Christians only’ (His Bride) has already occurred 1000 years earlier (Revelation 20:4 – 6).
*Timeline as I understand it:
iii) The Final Gehenna or Lake of Fire Judgment at the End of this 1000 Years (Revelation 20:11 – 15, Daniel 12:2, John 5:28 – 29, Romans 2:5 – 16, Matthew 25:31 – 46) where it is based on “Works” according to these quoted Verses where a second badge of righteous is raised simultaneously with the wicked (note: Christian righteous are already raised & glorified 1000 years earlier and hence this can’t refer to them, right? – discussed next)
Hence I may speculate (with First Christianity quote as proof as discussed in posts prior) that this Second Badge of Righteous are Saved by His Mercy according to their “Good Works only” which may primarily refer to ‘non Christian relatively good’ (as He reaps them to Salvation, Matthew 13:30 from among those whom He did not plant the Seed of the Gospel, Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26) which may also include some of the ‘rejected Christians prior if they did show some ‘oil’ or ‘good works’ toward their fellow men’, to quote (an example quote from a previous discussion):
“… Come, ye friends of the poor and the stranger. Come, ye who kept my love, as I am love. Come, ye who possess peace, for I own that peace. Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you, ye who esteemed not riches, ye who had compassion on the poor, who aided the orphans, who helped the widows, who gave drink to the thirsty, who fed the hungry, who received strangers, who clothed the naked, who visited the sick, who comforted those in prison, who helped the blind, … Then shall the King of kings make answer again, and say to them, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Inasmuch as ye have received those of whom I have already spoken to you, and clothed them, and fed them, and gave them to drink, I mean the poor who are my members, ye have done it unto me. But come ye into the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; enjoy for ever and ever that which is given you by my Father in heaven, and the holy and quickening Spirit. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD)
Source [Appendix, XLII, XLIV]:
Blessed Hippolytus of Rome further explains that Christ looks to have Mercy according to how one has shown Mercy in their lives first toward ‘all men’ or ‘each man’ (Matthew 5:7) in his quote continued from the above as seen toward the wicked next:
“… Cleave to me, to whom every knee boweth, of things in heaven, and things on earth, and things under the earth. For all who have been negligent, and have not shown pity in well-doing there, have nothing else due them than the unquenchable fire. For I am the friend of man, but yet also a righteous Judge to all. For I shall award the recompense according to desert; I shall give the reward to all, according to each man’s labour; I shall make return to all, according to each man’s conflict. I wish to have pity, but I see no oil in your vessels. I desire to have mercy, but ye have passed through life entirely without mercy. I long to have compassion, but your lamps are dark by reason of your hardness of heart. Depart from me. For judgment is without mercy to him that hath showed no mercy. (Jam_2:13) …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD)
Source [Appendix, XLVII.]:
The phrase ” I wish to have pity, but I see no oil in your vessels. I desire to have mercy, but ye have passed through life entirely without mercy.” strengthens our Context Claim that those who may have Practiced Mercy among these ‘non-Christians’ can Hope for His Mercy as Christ Seeks these ‘Works of Mercy’ in them (John 5:28 – 29, Revelation 20:11 – 15) in order to show any Mercy as Blessed St. Hippolytus’ quote above rings.
and,
“… Also, by this which this servant dared to say, “Thou reapest where thou sowedst not,” [Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26] we understand that the Lord accepts the good life of the Gentiles and of the Philosophers …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Source:
iii. The “Oil” in the Parable of the Wise and Foolish Virgins refers to ‘Charity / Good Works’ to our fellow men where the “Buying and Selling of Oil” is the “Selling Earthly Goods and Doing Charity to Obtain Heavenly Treasures”
Bible Verses:
“8And the foolish said to the wise, ‘Give us some of your oil, for our lamps are going out.’ 9But the wise answered, saying, ‘No, lest there should not be enough for us and you; but go rather to those who sell, and buy for yourselves.’ 10And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding; and the door was shut.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ, the Bridegroom (Matthew 25:8 – 10, NKJV)
Note: The “Oil” is clearly obtained by some earthly transaction toward our fellow men in Verses above, to quote:
“… They that believe rightly, and live righteously, are likened to the five wise ; they that profess the faith of Jesus, but prepare themselves not by good works to salvation, are likened to the five foolish. And because the virtues are so linked together, that he who has one has all, so all the senses so follow one another, that all must be wise, or all foolish. …” – Blessed Origen of Alexandria, the Great but surprisingly Modest Exegete of the Eastern Church, “Nicknamed: Admantius or Man of Steel”, Tortured and Martyred for Christ (c. 184 AD – c. 253 AD)
Yes,
” 31“But SEEK HIS KINGDOM, and THESE THINGS will be ADDED TO YOU. 32“Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has chosen gladly to give you the kingdom. 33“SELL YOUR POSSESSIONS and GIVE TO CHARITY; make yourselves money belts which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near nor moth destroys. 34“For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. 35“Be dressed in readiness, and KEEP YOUR LAMPS LIT 36“Be like men who are waiting for their master when he returns from the wedding feast, so that they may immediately open the door to him when he comes and knocks. 37“Blessed are those slaves whom the master will find on the alert when he comes; truly I say to you, that he will gird himself to serve, and have them recline at the table, and will come up and wait on them. 38“Whether he comes in the second watch, or even in the third, and finds them so, blessed are those slaves.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 12:31 – 38, NKJV)
Note: Prosperity Gospel Teachers often quote a half truth only (Luke 12:31 above) and ‘hoard their treasures enjoying & promoting luxurious living’ without quoting the next Verses in “full” (especially Luke 12:33) where “Christ Commands also” to SELL those ‘earthly riches/possessions you obtained’ to obtain ‘a greater permanent heavenly treasure’. Their LAMPS are only LIT as per the amount of CHARITY WORKS Done [implied in Consecutive Verses above], can you see it as It is Written?
First Christianity Quotes Proving this Claim Unanimously:
[ Indeed, let’s not be Like the 5 Foolish Virgins who did not store up ‘enough oil’ (Matthew 25:1 – 13) ]
“… Or, The “oil” denotes joy, according to that, “God hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness.” [Ps 45:7] He then whose joy springs not from this that he is inwardly pleasing to God, has no oil with him; for they have no gladness in their continent lives, [p. 846] save in the praises of men. “But the wise took oil with their lamps,” that is, the gladness of good works, “in their vessels,” that is, they stored it in their heart and conscience, as the Apostle speaks, “Let every man prove himself, and then shall he have rejoicing in himself, and not in another.” [Gal 6:4] …” – Blessed St. Augustine of Hippo, Doctor of the Church, who influenced virtually all of subsequent Western philosophy and Catholic theology, as well as a significant amount of Protestant theology (c. 354 AD – c. 430 AD)
Or
“… The “oil” is the fruit of good works, the “vessels” are the human bodies in whose inward parts the treasure of a good conscience is to be laid up. …” – Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD)
or
“… The virgins that have oil are they who, besides their faith, have the ornament of good works – they that have not oil, are they that seem to confess with like faith, but neglect the works of virtue. …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
or
“… Or, The “oil” is the word of teaching, with which the vessels of souls are filled ; for what gives so great content as moral discourse, which is called the oil of light. The “wise” took with them of this oil, as much as would suffice, though the Word should tarry long, and be slack to come to their consummation. The, “foolish” took lamps, alight indeed at the first, but not supplied with so much oil as should suffice even to the end, being careless respecting the provision of doctrine which comforts faith, and enlightens the lamp of good deeds…” – Blessed Origen of Alexandria, the Great but surprisingly Modest Exegete of the Eastern Church, “Nicknamed: Admantius or Man of Steel”, Tortured and Martyred for Christ (c. 184 AD – c. 253 AD)
Or
“… Or, the trimming their lamps is the return of their souls into their bodies, and their light is the consciousness of good works that shines forth, which is contained in the vessels of the body. They that sell are the poor, who, needing the alms of the faithful, made them that recompense which they desire, selling in return for the relief afforded to their wants, a consciousness of good works. This is the abundant fuel of an undying light which may be bought and stored up for the fruits of mercy. “The marriage” is the putting on of immortality, and the joining together corruption and incorruption in a new union. Yet though the season of repentance is now past, the foolish virgins come and beg that entrance may be granted to them. …” – Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD).
Source for each First Christianity Quote above [in this Section “iii”]:
Peace to you
Dark World of the Dead – Hades/Sheol
The Old Testament Holy Scripture doesn’t have a vivid description of souls going into Hades’ Regions of Comfort vs Regions of Torment.
However, in their non-Scripture but additional books, we find a hint of the Warning of such a place and how to avoid it as follows [ Probably the best parental advice of a lifestyle to pursue which a parent can give to their child ] :
“… 8 Give according to what you have. The more you have, the more you should give. Even if you have only a little, be sure to give something. 9 This is as good as money saved. You will have your reward in a time of trouble. 10-11 Taking care of the poor is the kind of offering that pleases God in heaven. Do this, and you will be kept safe from the dark world of the dead. …” – Blessed Tobit to his son Tobias (Good News Translation, Tobit 4:7 – 11)
Source: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Tobit+4&version=GNT
And this is what Blessed Archangel Raphael has to say:
“… 8. It is better to pray sincerely and to please God by helping the poor than to be rich and dishonest. It is better to give to the poor than to store up gold. 9 Such generosity will save you from death and will wash away all your sins. … 15 I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand in the glorious presence of the Lord, ready to serve Him. …” (Good News Translation, Tobit 12:7 – 9, 15)
Source: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Tobit+12&version=GNT
or in another translation:
“… 6 Then he said to them secretly: Bless ye the God of heaven, give glory to him in the sight of all that live, because he hath shewn his mercy to you. 7 For it is good to hide the secret of a king: but honourable to reveal and confess the works of God. 8 Prayer is good with fasting and alms more than to lay up treasures of gold: 9 For alms delivereth from death, and the same is that which purgeth away sins, and maketh to find mercy and life everlasting. … 15 For I am the angel Raphael, one of the seven who stand before the Lord. …” (Bible Scripture.Net Translation, Tobit 12:6 – 9, 15)
Source: https://biblescripture.net/Tobias.html
Note: The Book of Tobit has been part of the Bible as Scripture in all early Christianity till today except in modern Protestantism which started rejecting it around the 1500’s.
Interestingly, Christ Affirmed that the Spirit World is ordered such for like reasons in New Testament Holy Scripture as follows:
“22So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.24“Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ 25But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:22 – 25, NKJV)
Conclusion
Both Christ’s Own Most Blessed Words and the other quotes from Blessed Tobit and Blessed Archangel Raphael point to the same Truth that being kind to the poor and Almsgiving / Charity Works (Luke 12:31 – 33) keeps one away from this much dreaded Dark Places of Hades (‘Hell now’) as even this most reliable Saint in First Christianity quotes the Book of Tobit likewise toward the same meaning as follows:
“… When you can do good, defer it not, because “alms delivers from death.” …” – Blessed St. Polycarp, Bishop of Smryna, an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of the Blessed St. John the Apostle (c. 69 AD – c. 155 A, Chapter X, Epistle to the Philippians)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/polycarp-roberts.html
Note: This Practice is also found in the Bible Verse below (again, this book was only removed in the protestant bibles somewhere late 1500’s onward – is it wise to remove books from the Bible which has been endorsed by all First Christianity for a long time?)
“41All men therefore praising the Lord, the righteous Judge, who had opened the things that were hid, 42Betook themselves unto prayer, and besought him that the sin committed might wholly be put out of remembrance. Besides, that noble Judas [Maccabees] exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forsomuch as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for the sins of those that were slain. 43And when he had made a gathering throughout the company to the sum of two thousand drachms of silver, he sent it to Jerusalem to offer a sin offering, doing therein very well and honestly, in that he was mindful of the resurrection: 44For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should have risen again, it had been superfluous and vain to pray for the dead. 45And also in that he perceived that there was great favour laid up for those that died godly, it was an holy and good thought. Whereupon he made a reconciliation for the dead, that they might be delivered from sin.” (2 Maccabees 12:41 – 45, the Original King James Bible)
Source: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/2-Maccabees-Chapter-12/
First Christianity Believed in this that Almsgiving can be done for the benefit of other dead, though it may not always give full recovery (as that depends on how wicked / lukewarm the dead person’s life was first) as the rich man’s life in Luke 16:19 – 31 was too wicked to be delivered whilst the Shepherd of Hermas Scripture clearly revealed that some do get out of Hell now after ‘fulfilling the days of their sins likewise to be placed in other regions’.
Here’s such an explanation below of such a Hope in detail (at least please try since even Blessed Pope St. Gregory the Great’s Intercession did get the unbeliever Emperor Trajan out from Hell’s torments as discussed in previous posts too):
“… But not thou alone must lament him that is such; the whole city must do the same, and all that meet you on the way, as men bewail them that are led to be put to death. For this is a death indeed, an evil death, the death of sinners. … Worthy indeed of lamentations are they (when we consider), what time as they shall stand before the judgment seat of Christ, what words they shall then hear, what they shall suffer! To no purpose have these men lived: nay, not to no purpose, but to evil purpose! Of them too it may be fitly said, “It were good for them had they never been born.” (Mark xiv. 21.) For what profit is it, I ask, to have spent so much time to the hurt of his own person? Had it been spent only to no purpose, were not that, I ask you, punishment enough! If one who has been an hired servant twenty years were to find that he has had all his labor in vain, would he not weep and lament, and think himself the most miserable of men? Why, here is a man who has lost all the labor of a whole life: not one day has he lived for himself, but to luxury, to debauchery, to covetousness, to sin, to the devil. Then, say, shall we not bewail this man? shall we not try to snatch him from his perils? For it is, yes, it is possible, if we will, to mitigate his punishment, if we make continual prayers for him, if for him we give alms. However unworthy he may be, God will yield to our importunity. For if Paul showed mercy on one (who had no claims on his mercy), and for the sake of others spared one (whom he would not have spared), much more is it right for us to do this. By means of his substance, by means of thine own, by what means thou wilt, aid him: pour in oil, nay rather, water. Has he no alms-deeds of his own to exhibit? Let him have at least those of his kindred. Has he none done by himself? At least let him have those which are done for him, that his wife may with confidence beg him off in that day, having paid down the ransom for him. The more sins he has to answer for, the greater need has he of alms, not only for this reason, but because the alms has not the same virtue now, but far less: for it is not all one to have done it himself, and to have another do it for him; therefore, the virtue being less, let us by quantity make it the greatest. Let us not busy ourselves about monuments, not about memorials. This is the greatest memorial: set widows to stand around him. Tell them his name: bid them all make for him their prayers, their supplications: this will overcome God: though it have not been done by the man himself, yet because of him another is the author of the almsgiving. Even this pertains to the mercy of God: “widows standing around and weeping” know how to rescue, not indeed from the present death, but from that which is to come. Many have profited even by the alms done by others on their behalf: for even if they have not got perfect (deliverance), at least they have found some comfort thence. If it be not so, how are children saved? And yet there, the children themselves contribute nothing, but their parents do all: and often have women had their children given them, though the children themselves contributed nothing. Many are the ways God gives us to be saved, only let us not be negligent. …” – Blessed St. John Chrysostom, Archbishop of Constantinople, Doctor of the Church (c. 349 AD – c. 407 AD)
Source [Chrysostom: Homilies on the Acts of the Apostles and the Epistle to the Romans A Commentary on the Acts of the Apostles Homily XXI on Acts ix. 26, 27]:
http://www.catholiccrossreference.com/fathers/index.php/2Cor%201:11
Comment: Because Almsgiving can be done on behalf of others to collect the “oil” of Good Works & Charity needed for Mercy, that’s why the “foolish virgins” ask for ‘some oil’ so that they don’t get rejected from the First Resurrection (Matthew 25:1 – 13), to quote:
“8And the foolish said to the wise, ‘Give us some of your oil, for our lamps are going out.’ 9But the wise answered, saying, ‘No, lest there should not be enough for us and you; but go rather to those who sell, and buy for yourselves.’ 10And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding; and the door was shut. 11“Afterward the other virgins came also, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open to us!’ 12But he answered and said, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you.’.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ, the Bridegroom (Matthew 25:8 – 12, NKJV)
The Truth that the “oil denotes good works especially charity works” is discussed further with plenty of First Christianity quotes in “P/S 39 earlier”.
Peace to you
Blessed Apostle St. Paul and the Sibyline Oracles Mystery
Claim
Apostle Paul never Preached Hell
Blessed Apostle St. Paul Preached Hell not in his “written letters in the New Testament” but “Verbally/Word of Mouth” as the Christian Sibyline Oracles writings are full of Hell description as per Luke 16:19 – 31 too but Ends in Christ Centered Universalism*.
The next Authoritative Ancient Christian Saint below states that the Order to “read the Siblyl” (quoted earlier containing the Christ Saving from the Lake of Fire Prophecy) is by “the Blessed and Holy St. Paul the Apostle of Christ himself” by a tradition ‘verbally or by word of mouth’ (2 Thessalonians 2:15), to quote:
“…He distinguished the most excellent of the Greeks from the common herd, in addition to “Peter’s Preaching,” the APOSTLE PAUL will show, saying: “Take also the Hellenic books, READ THE SIBYL, how it is shown that God is one, and how the future is indicated. And taking Hystaspes, read, and you will find much more luminously and distinctly the Son of God described, and how many kings shall draw up their forces against Christ, hating Him and those that bear His name, and His faithful ones, and His patience, and His coming.” …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria, Head of the Cathecathical School At Alexandria, Teacher of Blessed Origen (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, Stromata, or Miscellanies, Book VI, CHAPTER V — THE GREEKS HAD SOME KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUE GOD)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book6.html
Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria having the traditions called the “Ancestral Apostolic Seeds” is written by Blessed Eusebius of Caesarea (the father of Church History himself) in his infamous book Ecclesiastial History as shown in image too regarding how First Christianity endorsed the Orthodoxy of this True Christian.
Note: Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria never had any Prayer to Virgin Mary as part of the tradition by word of mouth. Interesting indeed.
*Christ Centered Universalism from the “Lake of Fire / Gehenna” part of the Christian Sibyline Oracles, to quote:
“… for a long day will God make.
And to the pious will the almighty God
405 Imperishable grant another thing,
When they shall ask the imperishable God:
That he will suffer men from raging fire
And endless gnawing anguish to be saved;
And this will he do. For hereafter he
410 Will pluck them from the restless flame, elsewhere
Remove them, and for his own people’s sake
Send them to other and eternal life
With the immortals, in Elysian field,” (Sibyline Oracles, Book II, 297-322, p. 51)
Translation Source:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib04.htm
I repeat with Emphasis:
“… for a long day will God make.
And to the pious will the Almighty God
405 Imperishable grant another thing,
When they shall ask the imperishable God:
That He [God] will suffer [SAVE] men from RAGING FIRE
And ENDLESS GNAWING ANGUISH to be SAVED;
And THIS WILL HE [God] DO. For hereafter He [God]
410 Will PLUCK THEM [Wicked] from the RESTLESS FLAME, elsewhere REMOVE THEM [Wicked, the ‘thirsty’ from the ‘Lake of Fire’], and for His own people’s sake [His Bride, Revelation 22:17] Send them to OTHER [Outside Regions of the Kingdom of the Heavens, Matthew 5:19] and eternal [AGE -DURING, Fulfilling John 17:2 toward ALL MEN or ALL FLESH or ALL HUMANITY] life With the Immortals [Revelation 20:4 – 6], in Elysian field,” (Sibyline Oracles, Book II, 297-322, p. 51)
Is Book II of the Sibyline Oracles written by Christians? Yes, if not the Jews first but not unbelievers, to quote:
“… Books 1-2 may have been written by Christians, though again there may have been a Jewish original that was adapted to Christian purposes. … The Christian apologist Athenagoras of Athens, writing A Plea for the Christians to Marcus Aurelius in ca. AD 176, quoted the same section of the extant Oracles verbatim, in the midst of a lengthy series of classical and pagan references including Homer and Hesiod, and stated several times that all these works should already be familiar to the Roman Emperor. The sibyls themselves, and the so-called Sibylline oracles, were often referred to by other early Church fathers; Theophilus, Bishop of Antioch (ca. 180), Clement of Alexandria (ca. 200), Lactantius (ca. 305), and Augustine (ca. 400), all knew various versions of the pseudo-Sibylline collections, quoted them or referred to them in paraphrase, and were unreluctant to Christianize them … ”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Oracles
Conclusion – General Salvation of All Men but not at the Same Time/Order of Resurrection (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 23 as Holy and Blessed Apostle St. Paul taught)
The ‘Apocalypse of Peter Writing’ [which was ‘Scripture’ alongside the Book of Revelation in the First Bibles of Christianity , i.e. the Muratorian or Roman Canon in the West & the Codex Claromontanus Canon in the East – though ‘not included by later Christianity only’] has this ‘Salvation from the Lake of Fire Hope after the Prayer of the Christians’, to quote:
“… In the Ethiopic sources, there is a section following the main body of The Apocalypse of Peter that scholars like R.B. Bauckham consider to be a separate story written centuries later based on Chapter 14.[12] This separate story explains that in the end God will save all sinners from their plight in Hell: “My Father will give unto them all the life, the glory, and the kingdom that passeth not away, … It is because of them that have believed in me that I am come. It is also because of them that have believed in me, that, at their word, I shall have pity on men… ” Thus, in this additional story, sinners will finally be saved by the prayers of those in heaven. Peter then orders his son Clement not to speak of this revelation since God had told Peter to keep it secret: [and God said]”… thou must not tell that which thou hearest unto the sinners lest they transgress the more, and sin”…”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse_of_Peter
Logic: We have two choices – To follows those of the First Christianity who endorsed the Apocalypse of Peter as Scripture (as the first Bibles of Christianity agree as proved with quotes in posts prior) or to follow the ‘later Christians’ where some were uncomfortable with it? To quote:
In the quote below , St. Athanasius is revealing that the Grace of God Works in different Ways beginning with the Perfect (Hundredfold Seed) to the Second Rank (Sixty Fold Seed) to the Third Rank (Thirty Fold Seed) and lastly toward a ‘General Salvation which Rescues ALL MEN to be sinless again (implied)’. Right?
“… The Divine grace variously distributed… Further also, when the word is sown, it does not yield a uniform produce of fruit in this human life, but one various and rich ; for it bringeth forth, some an hundred j^nd some Matt.] 3, 8. sixty, and some thirty 7 , as the Saviour teaches — that Sower of grace, and Bestower of the Spirit … Nor is the grace confined to the perfect alone; but it is sent down also among those who occupy the middle and the third ranks, so that He might RESCUE ALL MEN GENERALLY to SALVATION…” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Festal Letter 70 – 71)
Source:
Please compare with the quotes below too:
“… For since from man it was that death prevailed over men, for this cause conversely, by the Word of God being made man has come about the DESTRUCTION of DEATH and the RESURRECTION of LIFE; as the man which bore Christ230 saith: “For231 since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as IN ADAM ALL DIE, so also IN CHRIST shall ALL be MADE ALIVE :” and so forth. For NO LONGER now do WE DIE as SUBJECT to CONDEMNATION; but as MEN who rise from the dead WE AWAIT the GENERAL RESURRECTION of ALL, “which232 42in its OWN TIMES He shall SHOW,” even God, Who has also wrought it, and bestowed it upon us… ” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Points 10.5 , ‘On the Incarnation’)
Source – Section 10: https://ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204/npnf204.vii.ii.x.html
St. Athenagoras of Athens Proves that the ‘Common Lot’ of General Salvation applies even to the Wicked or failed ones after their Proportioned Final Judgment in the Lake of Fire
“… And we shall make no mistake in saying, that the final cause of an intelligent life and rational judgment, is to be occupied uninterruptedly with those objects to which the natural reason is chiefly and primarily adapted, and to delight unceasingly in the contemplation of Him who is, and of His decrees, notwithstanding that the majority of men, because they are affected too passionately and too violently by things below, pass through life without attaining this object. For the large number of those who fail of the end that belongs to them does not make void the common lot, since the examination relates to individuals, and the reward or punishment of lives ill or well spent is proportioned to the merit of each….” – Blessed St. Athenagoras of Athens, In his writings he styles himself as “Athenagoras, the Athenian, Philosopher, and Christian”, in the fragments of the Christian History of Philip of Side (c. 425). Philip of Side claims that Athenagoras headed the Catechetical School of Alexandria (which is probably incorrect and contradicted by Eusebius), Athenagoras is an Ante-Nicene Christian apologist who lived during the second half of the 2nd century (c. 133 AD – c. 190 AD, ‘On the Resurrection of the Dead’ )
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-resurrection.html
“… after the witness of Gabriel, after her secret knowledge of the divine conception, after the great exhibition of miracles, she shall feel about her soul a mighty tempest. The Lord was bound to taste of death for every man — to become a propitiation for the world and to justify all men by His own blood. Even thou thyself, who hast been taught from on high the things concerning the Lord, shalt be reached by some doubt. This is the sword. “That the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.” …” – Blessed St. Basil the Great, was the bishop of Caesarea Mazaca in Cappadocia, Asia Minor (modern-day Turkey). He was an influential theologian who supported the Nicene Creed and opposed the heresies of the early Christian church, fighting against both Arianism and the followers of Apollinaris of Laodicea. In addition to his work as a theologian, Basil was known for his care of the poor and underprivileged. Basil established guidelines for monastic life which focus on community life, liturgical prayer, and manual labor. Together with Pachomius, he is remembered as a father of communal monasticism in Eastern Christianity, Titles: Great Hierarch, Doctor of the Church (c. 329 AD – c. 379 AD, Letter CCLLX, Point 671 – Point 672)
Source:
If you read the ancient Christianity quote which St. Basil the Great quotes above, it is clear that Lord Jesus Christ’s ‘Ransom for All’ (1 Timothy 2:5 – 6) applies to “All Men in its own Divine-Kairois Times’ (as it is Written in 1 Timothy 2:6) which must mean ‘all human being ever created eventually’ simply because these ancient phrases “… The Lord was bound to taste of death for every man …” and ” …. — to become a propitiation for the world …” and “… to justify all men by His own blood…” means exactly that, right?
In short, in Blessed St. Basil the Great’s quote above, it is clear that he refers to
“… to taste of death for every man — to become a propitiation for the world ” = “… to justify all men by His own blood. …”
Also, Where did Blessed St. Clement of Rome Prophesy or Reveal that God in Christ will “Justify All Men” eventually by “Faith*” (i. e. the ‘Faith of Jesus Christ’ or ‘Faith of God’ as apostle Paul mentioned in Romans 3:22)?
“And so we, having been called through His will in Christ Jesus, are not justified through ourselves* or through our own wisdom or understanding or piety or works which we wrought in holiness of heart, but through faith, whereby the Almighty God justified all men that have been from the beginning; to whom be the glory for ever and ever. Amen.” – Blessed St. Clement of Rome, an Apostolic Father being a direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. Peter (c. 35 AD – c. 99 AD, 1 Clement 32:4)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/1clement-lightfoot.html
Both Blessed St. Basil the Great and Blessed St. Clement of Rome are just reiterating what Blessed Apostle St. Paul has Declared Majestically in Bible Verse below:
“So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to ALL MEN, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to ALL MEN. For as through the one man’s disobedience THE MANY were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One THE MANY will be made righteous.” (Romans 5:18 – 19, NASB)
The Many sinners in Adam is the same Many which will be Made Righteous by Lord Jesus Christ (Proper Context for Romans 5:18 – 19). Under the Equation: ‘Adam + the Many’ = All Men = All Human Beings Ever Existed
Lord Jesus Christ is exempt from the equation above simply because He is God in Flesh and not a mere Man only & Alone is never affected by Adam’s sin in any way.
“… For as by the disobedience of the one man who was originally moulded from virgin soil, the many were made sinners, and forfeited life; so was it necessary that, by the obedience of one man, who was originally born from a virgin, [the] many should be justified and receive salvation. Thus, then, was the Word of God made man, as also Moses says: “God, true are His works.” But if, not having been made flesh, He did appear as if flesh, His work was not a true one. But what He did appear, that He also was: God recapitulated in Himself the ancient formation of man, that He might kill sin, deprive death of its power, and vivify man; and therefore His works are true.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Chapter XVIII, Book III)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
It is by the “Faith of God” (Romans 3:3 – 4) or the “Faith of Jesus Christ” Alone (Romans 3:22) which overcomes any unbelief of Men eventually (Romans 3:3 – 4) which causes His Mercy upon All in Unbelief/Disobedience eventually (Romans 11:30 – 32) which causes this Final “Justification of All Men” as these quoted Bible Verses and the First Christianity quotes even below agree Perfectly:
For example, by ‘whose faith’ unless it is the “Faith of Jesus Christ to All and all those believing” (Romans 3:22 – King James Version, KJV) does St. Cyril of Alexandria fully affirms that the Context of 1 Peter 3:19 – 20 refers to Christ Saving in Hell toward the Wicked too [hence these ‘formerly Wicked/Disobedient spirits in prison’ must refer to part of the “All Men” or “All” Justified by the Faith of Jesus Christ after they repent there & Judgment is Over for them, right? , to quote]:
“… What occasion will we still have for weeping? On the contrary, will not what has happened to us, thanks to the Savior, cause us boundless rejoicing? He it was Who showed the way of salvation not only to us, but also went as herald to the once disobedient spirits of the underworld, as Peter says (1 Pet. 3:19-20). For it would not have done for His loving-kindness to be shown only to some; the manifestation of the gift had to extended to all of nature. For He spoke opportunely through the Prophets, “One part shall be rained upon, and the part on which I shall not rain shall be dried up.” (Amos 4:7) But the word which befits the Savior is: “Come to me, all you who labor and are weary, and I will give you rest.” (Mt. 11:28) Having proclaimed His message, then, to the spirits in the underworld and having said to those in fetters, “Come forth!” and to those in darkness, “Show yourselves!” (cf. Isa. 49:9) He raised up the temple of Himself in three days, (cf. Jn. 2:19) and renewed for nature even the ascent into heaven, presenting Himelf to the Father as a kind of first-fruits of humanity, having endowed those on earth with a share of the Spirit as a pledge of grace. (cf. 2 Cor. 5:5) (Festal Letter 2.8) …” …” – Blessed St. Cyril, Patriarch of Alexandria, Titles: The Pillar of Faith; Seal of all the Fathers; Bishop, Confessor, and Doctor of the Church (c. 376 AD – c. 444 AD)
Source: https://classicalchristianity.com/category/holyfathers/post-mortem/
Yes, In the Bible (e.g. KJV translation), it seems more accurate to refer it to the “Faith of Jesus Christ” (and not our faith in Christ as Romans 3:22, Galatians 2:16 and Blessed St. Clement of Rome’s quote prior seems to agree making this Possible). In fact, this rarely known accuracy seemed to have been uttered by this great early Church father too, to quote:
“… , one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.3, Pages 498 – 499)
Source:
Where
The phrase “For its own glory and faith” implies that “its own Faith” = GodHead’s Own Faith = “Christ’s Faith” = the “Faith of Jesus Christ” in Romans 3:22-KJV (not by our faith we are justified but by His Faith where we become the first recipients of It when we believe first reaping Imperishable Rewards, Romans 3:26).
So, St. Epiphanius writes that by “His Faith” Christ makes even the “things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth (Hell)” as one, yes as He “makes these three one” and “For its [His] own glory and faith”. So, each of the “Justification of faith for all men (all mankind)” eventually must thus refer to “His Faith” which is the Free Gift of God to all (Romans 3:22 – 24) and ‘not our faith as popularly assumed’, i. e. not of anything of ourselves including not our faith too for Salvation by His Mercy (Ephesians 2:8).
Please take note that St. Basil the Great may be reiterating a Well known orthodox phraseology in his writing above which proves that Lord Jesus Christ’s Ransom applies to All Men and not Just believers (as it is implied in 1 Timothy 4:10 too) but though he didn’t believe it, it is well known that his sister (St. Macrina the Blessed-Wonder Worker*) and his brother St. Gregory of Nyssa who must have known this phraseology too certainly understood this same phraseology as Christ Centered Universalism as they are known to have believed that as shown a little in the previous essays.
Peace to you
Mystery of Faith – We are Saved by Christ’s Faith not ours
Explanation, please consider:
Romans 3:22, “Faith of Jesus Christ”.
Romans 3:3 – 4, “Faith of God”.
Galatians 2:16, our faith in Christ = “believing in the Faith of Jesus Christ”
All KJV, King James Translation below as follows:
“Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the FAITH OF JESUS CHRIST, even WE have BELIEVED IN JESUS CHRIST, that we might be justified by the FAITH OF CHRIST, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.” (Galatians 2:16, KJV)
“3For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the FAITH OF GOD without effect? 4God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.” (Romans 3:3 – 4, KJV)
“Even the righteousness of God which is by FAITH OF JESUS CHRIST unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:” (Romans 3:22, KJV)
Based on Verses above:
FAITH OF JESUS CHRIST = FAITH OF GOD = FAITH OF CHRIST
A First Christianity Quote agreeing to this Mystery:
“… , one incomprehensible Godhead, unfathomable, inexpressible, invisible. It alone knows itself; it reveals itself to whom it will It raises up its witnesses, calls, predestines and glorifies them, lifts them up from hades, hallows them. (8) For its own glory and faith it makes these three one: things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth; …” – Blessed St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Salamis and the ‘Hammer of Heretics’, (c. 310 AD – c. 403 AD, ‘PNEUMATOMACHI’, “Panarion or Medicine-Chest”, Points 7.1 – 7.3, Pages 498 – 499)
Where the phrase “For its own glory and faith” implies that “its own Faith” = GodHead’s Own Faith = “Christ’s Faith” = the “Faith of Jesus Christ” in Romans 3:22-KJV (not by our faith we are justified but by His Faith where we become the first recipients of It when we believe first reaping Imperishable Rewards, Romans 3:26).
So, St. Epiphanius writes that by “His Faith” Christ makes even the “things in heaven, on earth, and under the earth (Hell)” as one, yes as He “makes these three one” and “For its [His] own glory and faith”. So, each of the “Justification of faith for all men (all mankind)” eventually must thus refer to “His Faith” which is the Free Gift of God to all (Romans 3:22 – 24) and ‘not our faith as popularly assumed’, i. e. not of anything of ourselves including not our faith too for Salvation by His Mercy (Ephesians 2:8).
Comment: Our “Works” only determine Order of Salvation (1 Corinthians 15:23) be it the First or Second Resurrection (Revelation 20:4 – 6) becoming True/Testified/Coming to pass in different Divinely-appointed-Kairois-Plural Times (1 Timothy 2:6, 1 Timothy 2:4, 1 Timothy 4:10) where we ought to Pray for it on behalf of others or “All men” including ourselves as believers (1 Timothy 2:1) where for some there is difference of Rewards/Punishment first before Salvation (John 5:24, Luke 12:47 – 48) till the last penny or age-during (Luke 12:59, Matthew 25:46) or Gradation of Salvation (Matthew 5:19).
“Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.” (James 2:24, KJV)
“Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 5:19, KJV)
Peace to you
Lake of Fire Hope and the Resurrections Mystery
1) Some (if not all) may be Saved from the Lake of Fire Judgment eventually as per the Exegesis of these Two Ancient Important Authorities of Doctrine in the Christian Faith
‘…Our Saviour has appointed two kinds of resurrection, in accordance with which John says, in the Apocalypse, “Blessed is he that hath part in the first resurrection”; for such come to grace without the judgment. As for those who do not come to the first, but are reserved until the second resurrection, these shall be burnt, until they fulfill their appointed times, between the first and the second resurrection; or, if they should not have fulfilled them then, they shall remain still longer in punishment … ‘ – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD) …”
Source: https://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Ambrose
This Hope was uttered toward the ‘Novatian Heretics’ as follows:
“… XIX. But these sins were not after Baptism, you will say. Where is your proof? Either prove it — or refrain from condemning; and if there be any doubt, let charity prevail. But Novatus, you say, would not receive those who lapsed in the persecution. What do you mean by this? If they were unrepentant he was right; I too would refuse to receive those who either would not stoop at all or not sufficiently, and who would refuse to make their amendment counterbalance their sin; and when I do receive them, I will assign them their proper place; but if he refused those who wore themselves away with weeping, I will not imitate him. And why should Novatus’s want of charity be a rule for me? He never punished covetousness, which is a second idolatry; but he condemned fornication as though he himself were not flesh and body. What say you? Are we convincing you by these words? Come and stand here on our side, that is, on the side of humanity. Let us magnify the Lord together. Let none of you, even though he has much confidence in himself, dare to say, Touch me not for I am pure, and who is so pure as I? Give us too a share in your brightness. But perhaps we are not convincing you? Then we will weep for you. Let these men then if they will, follow our way, which is Christ’s way; but if they will not, let them go their own. Perhaps in it they will be baptized with Fire, in that last Baptism which is more painful and longer, which devours wood like grass, 1 Corinthians 3:12-19 and consumes the stubble of every evil….” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source [ Oration 39, Chapter XIX, Oration on the Holy Lights. The Oration on the Holy Lights was preached on the Festival of the Epiphany 381, and was followed the next day by that on Baptism.]: http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310239.htm
2) Two Resurrections Mystery
“…2 At this same first resurrection will also appear the City and the splendid things expressed through this Scripture. Of this first resurrection Paul also spoke to the Macedonian church, thus: For as we have thus said to you, he says, by the Word of God, that at the trumpet of God, the Lord Himself will descend from heaven for raising up; and the dead in Christ will stand first, then we who are living, as we will be taken up with Him in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we will always be with the Lord. a We have heard the trumpet spoken of; it is observed that in another place the Apostle names another trumpet. Therefore he says to the Corinthians: At the last trumpet, the dead will rise, will become immortal, and we will be changed. b He says the dead will be raised immortal for bearing punishments, but it is shown that we are to be changed and to be covered in glory. [1 Corinthians 15:52] Therefore where we hear “the last trumpet,” we must understand also a first, for these are two resurrections. Therefore, however many were not previously to rise in the first resurrection and to reign with Christ over the world [Revelation 20:4 – 6], over all nations, will rise at the last trumpet, after the thousand years, that is, in the last resurrection, among the impious and sinners and perpetrators of various kinds [Revelation 20:11 – 15]. He rightly adds, saying: Blessed and holy is he who has a part in the first anastasis: toward this one the second death has no power. For the second death is being thrown into hell. …” – Blessed St. Victorinus, Bishop of Pettau, the First and Oldest Christian Commentary on the Apocalypse of John or Book of Revelation, Martyr for Christ (c. 303 AD)
Source [‘Commentary on the Apocalypse’, circa 2nd half of the third century]:
http://www.bombaxo.com/patristic-stuff/victorinus-in-apocalypsin/
*[Emphasis Mine/Others throughout]
3) Who will be part of the First Resurrection?
Bible Verses: Christians or His Bride/Church only [Revelation 20:4 – 6, 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18, Luke 20:35 – 36] as the rest including ‘imperfect Christians though Virgins (having “faith or holiness”) but not having enough “oil” (or ‘good works’, Matthew 25:1 – 13, James 2:24) are ‘rejected’ as the ‘many’ on that Day too (Matthew 7:20 – 23).
Blessed St. Jerome seems to have interpolated in his Version of translating the Work of St. Victorinus with the following additional comment, to quote:
“…4, 5. “And I saw thrones, and them that sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them; and I saw the souls of them that were slain on account of the testimony of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast nor his image, nor have received his writing on their forehead or in their hand; and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years: the rest of them lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.”] There are two resurrections. But the FIRST RESURRECTION is now of the souls that are by the FAITH, which does not permit men to pass over to the second death. Of this resurrection the apostle says: “If ye have risen with Christ, seek those things which are above.”2312 6. “Blessed and holy is he who has part in this resurrection: on them the second death shall have no power, but they shall be priests of God and Christ, and they shall reign with Him a thousand years.”] I do not think the reign of a thousand years is eternal; or if it is thus to be thought of, they cease to reign when the thousand years are finished. But I will put forward what my capacity enables me to judge. The tenfold number signifies the decalogue, and the HUNDREDFOLD sets forth the crown of virginity: for he who shall have kept the undertaking of virginity completely, and shall have faithfully fulfilled the precepts of the decalogue, and shall have destroyed the untrained nature or impure thoughts within the retirement of the heart, that they may not rule over him, this is the true priest of Christ, and accomplishing the millenary number thoroughly, is thought to reign with Christ; …” – Blessed St. Victorinus/Blessed St. Jerome’s Replacement [Revelation Chapter 20:4, 5, 6]
Source: https://ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf07/anf07.vi.ii.xviii.html
or in another translation
“…1 For I have not considered the kingdom of the thousand years to be earthly: for, if it is being perceived thus, at the completion of the thousand years they cease to reign. But I will offer as my capacity for understanding has perceived. The number ten signifies the Decalogue, and ONE HUNDRED shows the crown of virginity. For he who has preserved entire his resolution for virginity, and faithfully fulfilled the precepts of the Decalogue, and has overcome impure actions and impure thoughts among the chambers of the heart so that they do not rule him, this is truly a priest of Christ and entirely completes the millenary number, believed to rule with Christ, and rightly with Him the devil is bound. He who has been ensnared in the errors and dogmas of the heretics, in him the devil is released. But because he says he will be released at the completion of the thousand years, at the completion of the number of the perfect saints, in the bodies and hearts of whom virginity reigns, with the arrival of the coming of the hating one, many will be overthrown by him, seduced by earthly loves, and will likewise enter the lake with him. …” – Blessed St. Victorinus/Blessed St. Jerome’s Replacement [Revelation Chapter 20]
Source: http://www.bombaxo.com/patristic-stuff/victorinus-in-apocalypsin/
In both the translations/Versions above, it is clear that these point to only those with the “HUNDREDFOLD fruit” (Matthew 13:8, Matthew 13:23) are said to attain this First Resurrection. Please remember that Blessed St. Victorinus was a ‘Chilliast’ (in that he believed in the Literal Millennial Reign of the Messiah Doctrine while Blessed St. Jerome did not). Since the Commentary is originally St. Victorinus’ work, it may thus be implied that if only the “hundredfold fruit” Christians attain to the ‘First Resurrection’, then the ‘sixty and thirty fold fruit’ Christians (Matthew 13:8, Matthew 13:23) are among the ‘many who are rejected’ on that Day (Matthew 7:20 – 23) but may have their Resurrection to life (Revelation 20:11 – 15) later during the Judgment Day at the end of this 1000 years (Revelation 20:7 – 10). If this interpretation is to be trusted, it also implies that the ‘rejected Christians’ on that Day (Matthew 7:20 – 23) or the ‘foolish virgins’ (Matthew 25:1 – 13) are also among those ‘Resurrected to life on Judgment Day’ rising together with the ‘ungodly & sinners’ simultaneously (Daniel 12:2, John 5:28 – 29) as even Blessed St. Andrew may have thus understood it in that way, to quote:
“… Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the book oflife. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to their deeds. He says dead, (meaning) either ail people as enduring the death of the body, or those which became dead by means of transgressions, great and small, either those being such by âge or those who did more or fewer deeds of deadness and accordingly will be punished for the deeds, or great being the righteous and small being [230] the worthless sinners,1037 inferior by means of the soûl. The books having been opened dénote the deeds of each and the consciousness of each (person). The one book is (the book) of life, in which are inscribed the names of the saints. …” – Blessed St. Andreas/Andrew, Bishop of Caesarea, Earliest* Greek Patristic commentary on the Apocalypse (c. 563 AD – c. 637 AD)
Source [ Page 213, Chapter 64, Section 22 ] :
https://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/2008_constantinou_andrew-translation.pdf
Comments:
“…or those who did more or fewer deeds of deadness and accordingly will be punished for the deeds, or great being the righteous and small being [230] the worthless sinners*,1037 inferior by means of the soûl. …” – Blessed St. Andreas/Andrew
*1037 This is the opinion of Oikoumenios as well (11.8.2).
Source [ Page 213, Chapter 63, Text 222, Commentary 206 ] :
https://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/2008_constantinou_andrew-translation.pdf
iii. An Important Overlooked Point – The Second Resurrection believers among the Orthodox Christians in the Time of Blessed St. Andrew even
Please read the last quote by Blessed St. Andrew in “ii” above and note these following lines:
a. “… the first résurrection of the dead is granted only to the saints … [referring to Revelation 20:4 – 6, 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18, Matthew 25:1 – 13, Matthew 7:20 – 23, Luke 20:35 – 36]” = Are all believers Saints or only those of the Hundredfold as Blessed St. Jerome/Victorinus has claimed? We shall discuss this next.
So, who is right and who are these ‘other Christians’ who believed in Chilliasm or the Millennial Reign Doctrine?
Prepare to be shocked as these ones who believed that are ‘All the Kings of Theology in First Christianity’ except for Blessed Origen, Blessed Eusebius, Blessed St. Jerome, Blessed St. Augustine and the later ones.
For example:
“… Millennialism was taught by various earlier writers such as Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Commodian, Lactantius, Methodius, and Apollinaris of Laodicea in a form now called premillennialism.[9] According to religious scholar Rev. Dr. Francis Nigel Lee,[10] “Justin’s ‘Occasional Chiliasm’ sui generis which was strongly anti-pretribulationistic was followed possibly by Pothinus in A.D. 175 and more probably (around 185) by Irenaeus”. … Melito of Sardis is frequently listed as a second century proponent of premillennialism.[12] The support usually given for the supposition is that “Jerome [Comm. on Ezek. 36] and Gennadius [De Dogm. Eccl., Ch. 52] both affirm that he was a decided millenarian.”[13] In the early third century, Hippolytus of Rome … Around 220, there were some similar influences on Tertullian, although only with very important and extremely optimistic (if not perhaps even postmillennial) modifications and implications. On the other hand, “Christian Chiliastic” ideas were indeed advocated in 240 by Commodian; in 250 by the Egyptian Bishop Nepos in his Refutation of Allegorists; in 260 by the almost unknown Coracion; and in 310 by Lactantius. Into the late fourth century, Bishop Ambrose of Milan had millennial leanings (Ambrose of Milan. Book II. On the Belief in the Resurrection, verse 108). Lactantius is the last great literary defender of chiliasm in the early Christian church. …”
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennialism
My bet is on the “Millennialism” or “Chiliasm” Doctrine being True and I don’t condemn Christians who don’t believe in it because even Blessed St. Justin Martyr himself called those Christians teaching this ‘later false position’ as per Blessed Origen/Eusebius/ or even St. Andrew/ St.Augustine/ St.Jerome all who came in later are still “pure and pious faith” though they may have erred in this area:
“… I admitted to you formerly, that I and many others are of this opinion, and [believe] that such will take place, as you assuredly are aware; but, on the other hand, I signified to you that many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians, think otherwise. …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr (c. 100AD – c. 160 AD, Dialogue with Trypho the Jew, Chapter 110) Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennialism
4) First Christianity’s Second Resurrection – General Resurrection Mystery
i) Blessed St. Justin Martyr affirms that this is not his opinion but is held by “right-minded Christians on all points” and that ‘All those who believe in Christ are in the First Resurrection’, to quote:
“… But I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead, and a thousand years in Jerusalem, which will then be built, adorned, and enlarged, the prophets Ezekiel and Isaiah and others declare. For Isaiah spake thus concerning this space of a thousand years: ‘For there shall be the new heaven and the new earth, and the former shall not be remembered, or come into their heart; but they shall find joy and gladness in it, which things I create’…For as Adam was told that in the day he ate of the tree he would die, we know that he did not complete a thousand years. We have perceived, moreover, that the expression, ‘The day of the Lord is as a thousand years,’ is connected with this subject [2 Peter 3:8, Psalm 90:4]. And further, there was a certain man with us, whose name was John, one of the apostles of Christ, who prophesied, by a revelation that was made to him, THAT THOSE WHO BELIEVED IN OUR CHRIST would dwell a THOUSAND YEARS in Jerusalem [Revelation 20:4 – 10]; and that thereafter the general, and, in short, the eternal resurrection and judgment of all men would likewise take place [Revelation 20:11 – 15]. Just as our Lord also said, ‘They shall neither marry nor be given in marriage, but shall be equal to the angels, the children of the God of the resurrection. [Luke 20:35 – 36] …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100AD – c. 160 AD, Dialogue with Trypho the Jew, CHAPTER LXXXI)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons calls the “First Resurrection followed by the Millennial Reign of 1000 years” as the “Times of the Kingdom” referring also to these Verses in Luke 12:35 – 48 too in quote below:
“… This is what the Lord declared: “Happy are those servants whom the Lord when He cometh shall find watching. Verily I say unto you, that He shall gird Himself, and make them to sit down [to meat], and will come forth and serve them. And if He shall come in the evening watch, and find them so, blessed are they, because He shall make them sit down, and minister to them; or if this be in the second, or it be in the third, blessed are they.” [Luke 12:35 – 48]. Again John also says the very same in the Apocalypse: “Blessed and holy is he who has part in the FIRST RESURRECTION.” [Revelation 20:4 – 6] Then, too, Isaiah has declared the TIME when THESE EVENTS shall OCCUR; he says: “And I said, Lord, how long? Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant, and the houses be without men, and the earth be left a desert. And after these things the Lord shall remove us men far away (longe nos faciet Deus homines), and those who shall remain shall multiply upon the earth.” [Isaiah 6:11 – 13]. Then Daniel also says this very thing: “And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of those under the heaven, is given to the saints of the Most High God, whose kingdom is everlasting [age-during till the end of this age during the LAST DAY for 1000 years, Daniel 7:27], and all dominions shall serve and obey Him.” And lest the promise named should be understood as referring to this time, it was declared to the prophet: “And come thou, and stand in thy lot at the consummation of the days [Daniel 12] …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter XXXIV, Point 2)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
The phrase “you yourselves be like men who wait for their master, when he will return from the wedding,” (in Luke 12:36, NKJV) “And if he should come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants.” (Luke 12:38, NKJV) clearly implies that these Verses linked clearly to ‘servants’ mentioned in Matthew 25:14 – 30’s “For the kingdom of heaven is like a man traveling to a far country,” (Matthew 25:14, NKJV) points to the ‘Millennial Reign Time Period of 1000 years’ as the phrase “when he will return from the wedding” in Luke 12:36 (implies that these are the ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ who are NOT part of His Wedding with His Bride/Church) who are already Saved first (Revelation 20:4 – 6, Matthew 25:1 – 13) but the rest rejected (Matthew 7:20 – 23) and the Lord may Visit the Earth at least ‘three times or in three watches’ as the phrase “And if he should come in the second watch, or come in the third watch” in Luke 12:38 means as the result of them being rewarded for ‘good works’ at the End of this 1000 years in the Second Resurrection as the ‘Second Badge of Righteous too’ (Matthew 25:20 – 23, Revelation 20:11 – 15).
iii) Who are the ‘First Badge of the Righteous’?
“… And as the presbyters say, Then those who are deemed worthy of an abode in heaven shall go there, others shall enjoy the delights of paradise, and others shall possess the splendour of the city; for everywhere the Saviour shall be seen according as they who see Him shall be worthy. [They say, moreover], that there is this distinction between the habitation of those who produce an hundred-fold, and that of those who produce sixty-fold, and that of those who produce thirty-fold [Matthew 13:1 – 8, Matthew 13:18 – 23]: for the first will be taken up into the heavens, the second will dwell in paradise, the last will inhabit the city; and that was on this account the Lord declared, “In My Father’s house are many mansions.” For all things belong to God, who supplies all with a suitable dwelling-place; even as His Word says, that a share is allotted to all by the Father, according as each person is or shall be worthy. And this is the couch on which the guests shall recline, having been invited to the wedding. The presbyters, the disciples of the apostles, affirm that this is the gradation and arrangement of those who are saved, and that they advance through steps of this nature; also that they ascend through the Spirit to the Son, and through the Son to the Father, and that in due time the Son will yield up His work to the Father, even as it is said by the apostle, “For He must reign till He hath put all enemies under His feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.” For in the TIMES of the KINGDOM, the righteous man who is upon the earth shall then forget to die. “But when He saith, All things shall be subdued unto Him, it is manifest that He is excepted who did put all things under Him. And when all things shall be subdued unto Him, then shall the Son also Himself be subject unto Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all . John, therefore, did distinctly foresee the FIRST “RESURRETION of the JUST,” [Revelation 20:4 – 6, 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18, Luke 14:14] and the inheritance in the kingdom of the earth; and what the prophets have prophesied concerning it harmonize [with his vision, e.g. Isaiah 65:20 – 23, Isaiah 11, Revelation 20:7 – 10]. For the Lord also taught these things, when He promised that He would have the mixed cup new with His disciples in the kingdom. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter Chapter XXXVI, Points 1 – 2, 3-partial)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
Can the ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ as both Blessed St. Andrew’s quote earlier implied the other Orthodox Christians believed and as Mysteriously hinted in Blessed St. Irenaeous last quote prior refer to Christian only or non-Christians too?
I believe that it can refer to both the ‘rejected Christians from the First Resurrection, the Many’ (Matthew 7:20 – 23) as well as the ‘non-Christian righteous’ because it is clear that the ‘Elect are not part of it at all as all three good fruits [of both “faith and works”, James 2:24]: namely of the thirty, sixty and hundredfold type as mentioned in the Parable of the Sower in Matthew 13:8, Matthew 13:23’ are all part of the “First Resurrection” in the “times of the Kingdom” as Blessed St. Irenaeous himself Stated in quote above.
Indeed, these may be the Mysterious ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ where Christ Reaped (as whatever He Reaps is unto Salvation, Matthew 13:30) even where He Sowed not [the Gospel Seed, Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26] whose Judgment is based on ‘Good Works’ only (John 5:28 – 29, Matthew 25:31 – 40, Revelation 20:11 – 15) as His Mercy may be Extended to them (Romans 9:15) which occurs during this ‘Second Resurrection’ after the 1000 years have ended (Revelation 20:5) as Blessed St. Irenaeous’ calls this time period as the “after the times of the kingdom”, to quote:
“And in the Apocalypse John saw this new [Jerusalem] descending upon the new earth. For AFTER the TIMES of the KINGDOM, he says, “I saw a Great White Throne, and Him who sat upon it, from whose face the earth fled away, and the heavens; and there was no more place for them.” [Revelation 20:11] And he sets forth, too, the things connected with the GENERAL RESURRECTION and the judgment, mentioning “the dead, great and small.” “The sea,” he says, “gave up the dead which it had in it, and death and hell [Hades] delivered up the dead that they contained; and the books were opened. Moreover,” he says, “the book of life was opened, and the dead were judged out of those things that were written in the books, ACCORDING to THEIR WORKS; and Death and hell [Hades] were sent into the LAKE of FIRE, the SECOND DEATH.” [Revelation 20:11 – 15] Now this is what is called GEHENNA [Matthew 10:28], which the Lord styled eternal [AGE-DURING] fire [Matthew 25:31 – 46]. “And if any one,” it is said, “was not found written in the book of life, he was sent into the LAKE of FIRE. [Revelation 20:15, Revelation 21:8] … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 140 – c. 202 AD, Against Heresies, Book 5, Chapter 35:2)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
Here is another quote of Blessed St. Irenaeous which agrees to this ‘Second Badge of Righteous by Works only’ toward ‘all the remaining dead in the tombs’ as Christ Spoke in John 5:28 – 29 in the ‘hour to come’ on the Last Day (i.e. ‘whoever’ that is not resurrected in body yet in the First Resurrection, Revelation 20:5):
“… Again, He called Lazarus “with a loud voice, saying, Lazarus, come forth; and HE that WAS DEAD came forth bound with bandages, feet and hands.” This was SYMBOLICAL of that MAN who had been BOUND in SINS. And therefore the Lord said, “Loose him, and let him depart.” As, therefore, THOSE who were HEALED were MADE WHOLE in THOSE MEMBERS which had in TIMES PAST been AFFLICTED; and the DEAD ROSE in the IDENTICAL BODIES, their limbs and bodies receiving health, and that life which was granted by the Lord, who prefigures eternal [age-during] things by temporal, and shows that it is He who is Himself able to extend BOTH HEALING and LIFE to HIS HANDIWORK, that His words concerning its [future] RESURRECTION may also be believed; so also at the END, when the Lord utters His voice “by the LAST TRUMPET,” [1 Corinthians 15:52] the dead shall be raised, as He Himself declares: “The HOUR SHALL COME, in which ALL THE DEAD which are in the TOMBS shall hear the voice of the Son of man, and shall come forth; those that have DONE GOOD to the RESURRECTION of LIFE, and those that have DONE EVIL to the RESURRECTION of JUDGMENT.” [John 5:28 – 29] – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter XIII, Point 1)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
An Important Comment: As demonstrated, this ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ being raised to life [i.e. Soul given a Body, Bodily Resurrection] during these “after the times of the kingdom” on Judgment Day at the end of the 1000 years Millennial Reign is not referring to any Christian at all as Blessed St. Irenaeous’ earlier own quote clearly proved that he understood that all the Christians [i.e. of thirty, sixty or hundredfold fruit] are reaped in the First Resurrection itself. So, the ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ must refer to the Rejected Christians and non-Christian righteous, i.e. toward anyone who did “good works” among ‘all those who remain in the tomb’ [i.e. souls whose body still has not been raised] as Christ Remarked too in John 5:28 – 29.
However, their bodies (absent from soul) may burn with unquenchable fire during this Millennial Reign timeline (Isaiah 66:24) where even men as righteous as Blessed Noah, Blessed Daniel and Blessed Job cannot ask on behalf of their children to be part of the First Resurrection at all, to quote:
“… but some injunctions and acts were likewise mentioned in REFERENCE to the MYSTERY of CHRIST, on account of the hardness of your people’s hearts. And that this is so, God makes known in Ezekiel, [when] He said concerning it: ‘If Noah and Jacob and Daniel should beg either sons or daughters, the request would not be granted them.’ [Ezekiel 14:14] And in Isaiah, of the VERY SAME MATTER He spake thus: ‘The Lord God said, they shall both go forth and look on the MEMBERS [of the BODIES] of the MEN that have TRANSGRESSED. For their WORM shall NOT die, and their FIRE shall NOT be QUENCHED, and they shall be a gazing-stock to ALL FLESH.’ [Isaiah 66:24, Mark 9:44 – 48] So that it becomes you to ERADICATE this HOPE from YOUR SOULS, and hasten to know in what way forgiveness of sins, and a HOPE of INHERITING the PROMISED GOOD THINGS, shall be yours. But there is no other [way] than this,–to become acquainted with this Christ, to be washed in the fountain spoken of by Isaiah for the remission of sins; and for the rest, to live sinless lives.”… ” …” – Blessed St. Justin Martyr, a Great Early Christian Apologist who is a Foremost Exponent of the Divine Word, who Influenced Virtually all of subsequent Christian philosophy and Catholic theology, Martyr for Christ (c. 100AD – c. 160 AD, DIALOGUE WITH TRYPHO, CHAPTER XLIV)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-dialoguetrypho.html
and
“… And then the doctrine concerning the resurrection of bodies which we believe, will emerge true and certain [from their system]; since, [as we hold, ] God, when He resuscitates our mortal bodies which preserved righteousness, will render them incorruptible and immortal. For God is superior to nature, and has in Himself the disposition [to show kindness], because He is good; and the ability to do so, because He is mighty; and the faculty of fully carrying out His purpose, because He is rich and perfect. … 3. But these men are in all points inconsistent with themselves, when they decide that all souls do not enter into the intermediate place, but those of the righteous only. For they maintain that, according to nature and substance, three sorts [of being] were produced by the Mother: the first, which proceeded from perplexity, and weariness, and fear-that is material substance; the second from impetuosity -that is animal substance; but that which she brought forth after the vision of those angels who wait upon Christ, is spiritual substance. If, then, that substance which she brought forth will by all means enter into the Pleroma because it is spiritual, while that which is material will remain below because it is material, and shall be totally consumed by the fire which bums within it, why should not the whole animal substance go into the intermediate place, into which also they send the Demiurge? But what is it which shall enter within their Pleroma? For they maintain that souls shall continue in the intermediate place, while bodies, because they possess material substance, when they have been resolved into matter, shall be consumed by that fire which exists in it; but their body being thus destroyed, and their soul remaining in the intermediate place, no part of man will any longer be left to enter in within the Pleroma. For the intellect of man-his mind, thought, mental intention, and such like-is nothing else than his soul; but the emotions and operations of the soul itself have no substance apart from the soul. What part of them, then, will still remain to enter into the Pleroma? For they themselves, in as far as they are souls, remain in the intermediate place; while, in as far as they are body, they will be consumed with the rest of matter.…” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book II, Chapter XXIX, Points 2-partial, 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book2.html
It is clear that both Blessed St. Justin Martyr and Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyon’s quotes above refer to the “times of the kingdom” 1000 years Millennial Reign timeline and/or the “Lake of Fire Judgment in unquenchable fire” where interestingly the “…ERADICATE this HOPE from YOUR SOULS, … and look on the MEMBERS [of the BODIES] of the MEN that have TRANSGRESSED …” in Blessed St. Justin Martyr’s quote refers to Isaiah 66:24’s word of “corpses/dead bodies/carcass” (meaning that these do not have ‘souls in them’) preventing them from being Raised in the ‘First Resurrection’ and where Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons’s quote “…in as far as they are body, they will be consumed with the rest of matter.…” agrees perfectly where during this time they can only be placed in some ‘spirit world/intermediate abode for souls’ as the phrase “… For they themselves, in as far as they are souls, remain in the intermediate place; …” means in Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons’s quote above toward ‘some heretics’ as these may only be part of the ‘Second Resurrection’ which occurs at the end of that Millennial Reign. Can you see it?
Regarding the Hope that these may be forgiven and given continuity ‘after some ages to come’ meaning that ‘their souls’ may be given a ‘body’ was discussed in detail based on Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyon’s own quotes extensively in essay: “P/S 32: Age-during Life or Eternal Life or Both?” earlier.
Conclusion
Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome (a student/hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons himself) reflects this First Christianity understanding as we claimed earlier, to quote:
“Moreover, concerning the resurrection and the kingdom of the saints, Daniel says, “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall arise, some to everlasting [age-during] life, (and some to shame and everlasting [age-during] contempt, Daniel 12:2).” Esaias says, “The dead men shall arise, and they that are in their tombs shall awake; for the dew from thee is healing to them.” The Lord says, “Many in that day shall hear the voice of the Son of God, and they that hear shall live.” And the prophet says, “Awake, thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.” And John says, “Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the FIRST RESURRECTION: on such the second death hath no power.” [Revelation 20:6] For the second death is the lake of fire that burneth. And again the Lord says, “Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun shineth in his glory.” And to the saints He will say, “Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.” But what saith He to the wicked? “Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting [age-during] fire, prepared for the devil and his angels, which my Father hath prepared.” [Matthew 25:41] And John says, “Without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever maketh and loveth a lie; for your part is in the hell of fire.” [Revelation 21:8] And in like manner also Esaias: “And they shall go forth and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me. And their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be for a spectacle to all flesh.” [Isaiah 66:24] – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, TREATISE ON CHRIST AND ANTICHRIST, Point 65)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-christ.html
Please note carefully how Hippolytus distinguishes between those from the ‘General Resurrection’ vs those from the ‘First Resurrection’ whilst discussing the Great White Throne of Judgment in the quote above:
How do I know that Hippolytus referred to the ‘General Resurrection’ when he quotes Daniel 12:2 as it is not so clear especially since he seems to quote both Verses which refer to the First & Second Resurrection in the same paragraph above? To quote:
Hippolytus was one of the Church of Rome’s greatest early theologians according to The Catholic Encyclopedia. Notice what he wrote in the early third century:
“… For concerning the GENERAL RESURRECTION and the kingdom of the saints, Daniel says: “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting [age-during] life, and some to shame and everlasting [age-during] contempt.” And Isaiah says: “The dead shall rise, and those in the tombs shall awake, and those in the earth shall rejoice.” And our Lord says: “Many in that [Last] Day shall hear the voice of the Son of God, and they that hear shall live … ” (Hippolytus. On the End of the World, Chapter XXXVI. Excerpted from Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume 5. Edited by Alexander Roberts & James Donaldson. American Edition, 1886. Online Edition Copyright © 2005 by K. Knight).
Yes, Hippolytus himself referred to the hope which is NOT possible for others but the Christian dead ONLY (in 1 Thessalonians 4:13) to refer to the ‘First Resurrection’ or the ‘Resurrection of the Just only’ (tying up 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 17 to Revelation 20:4 – 6 & Luke 14:14) agreeing perfectly to our exegesis in obedience to 2 Peter 1:20 as well, as NO Prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, to quote:
“… Concerning the RESURRECTION of the RIGHTEOUS, Paul also speaks thus in writing to the Thessalonians: “We would not have you to be ignorant concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not even as others which have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive (and) remain unto the coming of the Lord, shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice and trump of God, and the dead in Christ shall rise first. Then we which are alive (and) remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and so shall we ever be with the Lord. [1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18] …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD, TREATISE ON CHRIST AND ANTICHRIST, Point 66)
Hence I may speculate (with First Christianity quote as proof as discussed in posts prior) that this Second Badge of Righteous are Saved by His Mercy according to their “Good Works only” which may primarily refer to ‘non Christian relatively good’ (as He reaps them to Salvation, Matthew 13:30 from among those whom He did not plant the Seed of the Gospel, Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26) which may also include some of the ‘rejected Christians prior if they did show some ‘oil’ or ‘good works’ toward their fellow men’, to quote (an example quote from a previous discussion):
“… Come, ye friends of the poor and the stranger. Come, ye who kept my love, as I am love. Come, ye who possess peace, for I own that peace. Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you, ye who esteemed not riches, ye who had compassion on the poor, who aided the orphans, who helped the widows, who gave drink to the thirsty, who fed the hungry, who received strangers, who clothed the naked, who visited the sick, who comforted those in prison, who helped the blind, … Then shall the King of kings make answer again, and say to them, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Inasmuch as ye have received those of whom I have already spoken to you, and clothed them, and fed them, and gave them to drink, I mean the poor who are my members, ye have done it unto me. But come ye into the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; enjoy for ever and ever that which is given you by my Father in heaven, and the holy and quickening Spirit. …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD)
Source [Appendix, XLII, XLIV]:
Blessed Hippolytus of Rome further explains that Christ looks to have Mercy according to how one has shown Mercy in their lives first toward ‘all men’ or ‘each man’ (Matthew 5:7) in his quote continued from the above as seen toward the wicked next:
“… Cleave to me, to whom every knee boweth, of things in heaven, and things on earth, and things under the earth. For all who have been negligent, and have not shown pity in well-doing there, have nothing else due them than the unquenchable fire. For I am the friend of man, but yet also a righteous Judge to all. For I shall award the recompense according to desert; I shall give the reward to all, according to each man’s labour; I shall make return to all, according to each man’s conflict. I wish to have pity, but I see no oil in your vessels. I desire to have mercy, but ye have passed through life entirely without mercy. I long to have compassion, but your lamps are dark by reason of your hardness of heart. Depart from me. For judgment is without mercy to him that hath showed no mercy. (Jam_2:13) …” – Blessed St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr for Christ, Hearer of Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons (170 AD – 235 AD)
Source [Appendix, XLVII.]:
The phrase ” I wish to have pity, but I see no oil in your vessels. I desire to have mercy, but ye have passed through life entirely without mercy.” strengthens our Context Claim that those who may have Practiced Mercy among these ‘non-Christians’ can Hope for His Mercy as Christ Seeks these ‘Works of Mercy’ in them (John 5:28 – 29, Revelation 20:11 – 15) in order to show any Mercy as Blessed St. Hippolytus’ quote above rings.
“… Also, by this which this servant dared to say, “Thou reapest where thou sowedst not,” [Matthew 25:24, Matthew 25:26] we understand that the Lord accepts the good life of the Gentiles and of the Philosophers …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
Source:
Peace to you
The Mysterious Phrase – Saviour of All
“… And then, [speaking of His] baptism, Matthew says, “The heavens were opened, and He saw the Spirit of God, as a dove, coming upon Him: and lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” For Christ did not at that time descend upon Jesus, neither was Christ one and Jesus another: but the Word of God-who is the SAVIOUR of ALL, and the ruler of heaven and earth, who is Jesus, as I have already pointed out, who did also take upon Him flesh, and was anointed by the Spirit from the Father-was made Jesus Christ, as Esaias also says, “There shall come forth a rod from the root of Jesse, and a flower shall rise from his root; and the Spirit of God shall rest upon Him: the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and piety, and the spirit of the fear of God, shall fill Him. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book III, Chapter IX, Point 3)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
Bible Verse with that Similar Phrase:
“Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.” (1 Timothy 2:6, KJV)
“I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;” (1 Timothy 2:1, KJV)
“For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.” (1 Timothy 4:10, KJV)
“Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.” (1 Timothy 2:4, KJV)
Note: I believe that the “All Men” in each Verse above is the same because it’s by the ‘Same Inspired Author (Blessed Apostle St. Paul), Same Letter, Same Koine Greek Word, Same Context (as there is no Chapter/Verse Divisions in the Original Koine Greek Bible)’ and the ‘believers’ are a subset of this ‘All Men’ which is especially seen in 1 Timothy 4:10.
Also we are to Pray for the Salvation of “All Men” (which includes us and every human being) which may come to pass in its “own times” as 1 Timothy 2:6 reveals where the Biblical Koine Greek Word is “Kairois” (Divine Time) which is “plural” indicating that there are Different Times/Orders or Salvation (1 Corinthians 15:20 – 23) in the “ages (aeons) to come” (Ephesians 2:7) till God becomes “All in All” (1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28) including the “First and Second Resurrections & its Judgment toward that end” (Revelation 20:4 – 15).
Probably this is the Context of Most Blessed Christ Who ‘Saves All Men’ which ought to be Declared by the Church in Faith which Blessed St. Irenaeous Speaks of in his quotes below (which makes best sense when seen under the equation ‘All Men = Adam + The Many (Rest of Mankind)’, based on Romans 5:18 – 19 too):
“… And undoubtedly the preaching of the Church is true and stedfast, in which one and the same way of salvation is shown throughout the whole world. For to her is entrusted the light of God; and therefore the “wisdom” of God, by means of which she SAVES ALL MEN, “is declared in [its] going forth; it uttereth [its voice] faithfully in the streets, is preached on the tops of the walls, and speaks continually in the gates of the city.” For the Church preaches the truth everywhere, and she is the seven-branched candlestick which bears the light of Christ…” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book V)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
“… For as by the disobedience of the one man who was originally moulded from virgin soil, the many were made sinners, and forfeited life; so was it necessary that, by the obedience of one man, who was originally born from a virgin, [the] many should be justified and receive salvation. Thus, then, was the Word of God made man, as also Moses says: “God, true are His works.” But if, not having been made flesh, He did appear as if flesh, His work was not a true one. But what He did appear, that He also was: God recapitulated in Himself the ancient formation of man, that He might kill sin, deprive death of its power, and vivify man; and therefore His works are true.” – Blessed St. Irenaeous, Bishop of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Chapter XVIII, Book III)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book3.html
Please compare with the quotes below too:
“… For since from man it was that death prevailed over men, for this cause conversely, by the Word of God being made man has come about the DESTRUCTION of DEATH and the RESURRECTION of LIFE; as the man which bore Christ230 saith: “For231 since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as IN ADAM ALL DIE, so also IN CHRIST shall ALL be MADE ALIVE :” and so forth. For NO LONGER now do WE DIE as SUBJECT to CONDEMNATION; but as MEN who rise from the dead WE AWAIT the GENERAL RESURRECTION of ALL, “which232 42in its OWN TIMES He shall SHOW,” even God, Who has also wrought it, and bestowed it upon us… ” – Blessed St. Athanasius the Great, the Father of Orthodoxy, Patriarch of Alexandria and Champion of Trinity, Doctor of the Church and Confessor, Coptic Pope (c. 296 AD – c. 373 AD, Points 10.5 , ‘On the Incarnation’)
Source – Section 10:
https://ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204/npnf204.vii.ii.x.html
Is God Making All things including His Enemies to be Subject to Him is for their Restoration and Healing? (1 Corinthians 15:24 – 28)
Yes, to quote:
“… As the apostle when he said all shall be subjected to the Son did not mean union of essence, but obedience flowing from free-will, together with the honor and glory which all give him as the Saviour, and King of all, in the same way his subjection to the Father means nothing else than the glory, and honor, and veneration, and exaltation, and voluntary subjection, which he is to give to God the Father, when he has made all worthy of his paternal Godhead. For, so long as they are not worthy of this, he, anticipating the future as a common SAVIOUR of ALL, administers a kingdom restorative of the imperfect and curative of those who need healing… Christ is to subject all things to himself. We ought to conceive of this as such a salutary subjection as that by which the Son will be subjected to him, who subjects all to him. We ought to believe that he will effect a subjection ineffable, indescribable, and befitting him alone, when he shall present to God, even the Father, those subjected to himself, collecting them like a heavenly choir ascribing to him glory and honor and salvation and majesty, who is the source and cause of all good things…” – Blessed Eusebius, Bishop of Caesarea, ‘Father of Church History’ (260 AD — 340 AD)
(Beecher 1878, citing Eusebius’ work, On Ecclesiastical Theology, Migne vi., p. 1030-1031)
Source:
https://www.tentmaker.org/books/Retribution/retribution29.htm
“… there lives still the SAVIOUR of ALL MEN, even of the half-dead and the despoiled, the Protector and Physician for all, the Word, that sleepless Keeper of all …” – Blessed St. Gregory Thaumaturgus, The Miracle-Worker (213 AD – 270 AD, Oration and Panegyric Addressed to Origen , Argument 17)
Source: www.newadvent.org/fathers/0604.htm
Christ Draws (Drags as in Catching Fish in a Net as it means in Koine Greek) ‘All Men’ as St. Ignatius applies the General Word ‘Draw All’ or ‘Draw All things’ in John 12:32 to the Subset of ‘All Men’ as follows:
“… and once more, “If I be lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men unto Me [John 12:32].” The Word therefore did dwell in flesh, for “Wisdom built herself an house.” The Word raised up again His own temple on the third day, when it had been destroyed by the Jews fighting against Christ. The Word, when His flesh was lifted up, after the manner of the brazen serpent in the wilderness [John 3:14], drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation [John 12:32]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Smyrnaeans, Chapter II)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-smyrnaeans-longer.html
Please notice carefully that St. Ignatius mentions that this ‘Drawing of All [Men]’ by Christ in John 12:32 results in the Final Salvation of ‘All Men’, in his words, “… drew all men to Himself for their eternal salvation…” as Stated in a past tense Prophetically as a Done Reality to Him.
Perfection of God Means God Saves ‘All Men’ eventually as Basic or General Salvation is likened to the ‘Rain falling both on the Just & Unjust’ and so ‘enmity on account of faith is with Love’
“… ” You ought therefore to “hate those that hate God, and to waste away [with grief] on account of His enemies.” I do not mean that you should beat them or persecute them, as do the Gentiles “that know not the Lord and God; ” but that you should regard them as your enemies, and separate yourselves from them, while yet you admonish them, and exhort them to repentance, if it may be they will hear, if it may be they will submit themselves. For our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth.” [1 Timothy 2:4] Wherefore “He makes His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; ” of whose kindness the Lord, wishing us also to be imitators, says, “Be ye perfect, even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect.” [Matthew 5:44 – 48]…” – Blessed St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch, nicknamed ‘God-Bearing’, An Apostolic Father being the direct Disciple of the Blessed Apostle St. John, Martyr for Christ (c. 35 AD – c. 108 AD, Epistle to the Philadelphians, Chapter III)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-philadelphians-longer.html
Context: The phrase “… our God is a lover of mankind, and “will have all men to be saved … His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust; …even as also your Father that is in heaven is perfect…” clearly Proves that St. Ignatius Believes that ‘All Men’ (in the Context of ‘God being a Lover of Mankind’, hence it means all human beings ever created) will be Saved eventually.
Salvation Post-Afterlife Judgment?
These same rejected unsaved stones are said to be saved in another place [‘not the thirty, sixty, hundredfold First Resurrection Salvation of Christian believers in the Tower of Repentance/Church/His Bride’] but in a more humble eventually [due to ‘not having faith & works’ at the required level, James 2:24] by His Mercy which Triumphs Over Judgment Eventually to All in Unbelief/Disobedience (Romans 11:32, James 2:13, Romans 3:3 – 4), to quote:
“… Hermas 7[15]:4 So she finished the explanation of the tower. Hermas 7[15]:5 Still importunate, I asked her further, whether for all these stones that were rejected and would not fit into the building of the tower that was repentance, and they had a place in this tower. “They can repent,” she said, “but they cannot be fitted into this tower. Hermas 7[15]:6 Yet they shall be fitted into another place much more humble, but not until they have undergone torments, and have fulfilled the days of their sins. And they shall be changed for this reason, because they participated in the Righteous Word; and then shall it befall them to be relieved from their torments, if the evil deeds, that they have done, come into their heart; but if these come not into their heart, they are not saved by reason of the hardness of their hearts. …” – Shepherd of Hermas Scripture (in First Christianity)
Source for Translation: https://carm.org/shepherd-of-hermas
Now, who is the “All Men”? Is His Mercy for Anyone?
“… QUESTION 102. AGAINST NOVATIAN … God does NOT want ANYONE to PERISH. “The Lord,” said Solomon, “pities those who repent.” (Eccl. 12:3) And in another place: “You have MERCY on ALL MEN, because you can do anything, and you hide their sins because of repentance.” (Wis. 11:24) ..” – Blessed Ambrosiaster (literally in Latin: “would-be Ambrose”), Roman Clergy active at Rome during the reign of Pope Damasus (c.366 AD – c. 384 AD)
The phrase God “pities those who repent” applies to those whose are saved without Judgment (John 5:24) as the phrase ” and you hide their sins because of repentance” means in the above distinctly from the Hope of Mercy to All Men, i.e. “… “You have MERCY on ALL MEN, because you can do anything, …” (Wis. 11:24). Can God’s Mercy be applied to the “Unsaved” to Save them Eventually or only to the ‘Vessels of Mercy’?
Here is Scripture below Stating that with “God’s Mercy” nothing is Impossible hence it is a heresy to Limit God’s Mercy to anyone except that we have to let God Alone Decide whether He Wills to have Mercy on All (Possible according to Romans 11:32 including the Disobedient too**), to quote:
“23 But thou hast mercy upon all [Compare:Romans 11:32]; for thou canst do all things, and winkest at the sins of men, because they should amend. 24 For thou lovest all the things that are, and abhorrest nothing which thou hast made: for never wouldest thou have made any thing, if thou hadst hated it. 25 And how could any thing have endured, if it had not been thy will? or been preserved, if not called by thee? 26 But thou sparest all: for they are thine, O Lord, thou lover of souls.” (Wisdom of Solomon 11:23 – 26, King James Bible Version, KJV)
Source: https://m.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Wisdom-of-Solomon-Chapter-11/
“… But the glory of those who believe is “the Lord’s portion.” For either the Lord does not care for all men; and this is the case either because He is unable (which is not to be thought, for it would be a proof of weakness), or because He is unwilling, which is not the attribute of a good being. And He who for our sakes assumed flesh capable of suffering, is far from being luxuriously indolent. Or He does care for all, which is befitting for Him who has become Lord of all. For He is Saviour; not [the Saviour] of some, and of others not. But in proportion to the adaptation possessed by each, He has dispensed His beneficence both to Greeks and Barbarians, even to those of them that were predestinated, and in due time called, the faithful and elect. Nor can He who called all equally, and assigned special honours to those who have believed in a specially excellent way, ever envy any. Nor can He who is the Lord of all, and serves above all the will of the good and almighty Father, ever be hindered by another. But neither does envy touch the Lord, who without beginning was impassible; nor are the things of men such as to be envied by the Lord. But it is another, he whom passion hath touched, who envies. And it cannot be said that it is from ignorance that the Lord is not willing to save humanity, because He knows not how each one is to be cared for. For ignorance applies not to the God who, before the foundation of the world, was the counsellor of the Father. For He was the Wisdom “in which” the Sovereign God “delighted.” For the Son is the power of God, as being the Father’s most ancient Word before the production of all things, and His Wisdom. He is then properly called the Teacher of the beings formed by Him. Nor does He ever abandon care for men, by being drawn aside from pleasure, who, having assumed flesh, which by nature is susceptible of suffering, trained it to the condition of impossibility. And how is He Saviour and Lord, if not the SAVIOUR and LORD of ALL? But He is the Saviour of those who have believed, because of their l wishing to know; and the Lord of those who have not believed, till, being enabled to confess him, they obtain the peculiar and appropriate boon which comes by Him. …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria, Head of the Cathecathical School At Alexandria , Teacher of Blessed Origen (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, Stromata Book 7, CHAPTER II — THE SON THE RULER AND SAVIOUR OF ALL)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-stromata-book7.html
and
“… Ver. 2. “And not only for our sins,”–that is for those of the faithful,–is the Lord the propitiator, does he say, “but also for the whole world.” He, indeed, saves all; but some [He saves], converting them by punishments; others, however, who follow voluntarily [He saves] with dignity of honour; so “that every knee should bow to Him, of things in heaven, and things on earth, and things under the earth;” that is, angels, men, and souls that before His advent have departed from this temporal life. …” – Blessed St. Clement of Alexandria, Head of the Cathecathical School At Alexandria , Teacher of Blessed Origen (c. 150 AD – c. 215 AD, FRAGMENTS OF CLEMENS ALEXANDRINUS, Commentary on ‘1 John 2:2’)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/clement-fragments.html
“And He is the propitiation* for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.” (1 John 2:2, KJV)
*Propitiation = Also includes the Context of Turning Away or Ending of Wrath in Judgment making this Hope of Mercy Cancelling a Judgment Sentence later by Triumphing over it as Prophesied by the First Christianity Scripture of ‘Apocalypse of Peter’ as a Valid Biblical Hope.
God’s Enemies will be Saved from All Evil Post-Final Judgment and after they Confess to Him (Philippians 2:9 – 11, Isaiah 45:23) Who is Saviour of All eventually (1 Timothy 4:10) as He is the ‘Saviour of All’ Context including ‘His Enemies’ is Echoed in “Bible Scripture” below [yes ‘Wisdom of Solomon Book’ is Scripture in All of Christianity except to some protestants from 1500s onward):
“For he that turned himself toward it was not saved by the thing that he saw, but by Thee, that art the SAVIOUR OF ALL. And in this thou madest Thine enemies confess, that it is thou who deliverest from all evil:” (Wisdom of Solomon 16:7 – 8, KJV Compare with ‘Saviour of All Men especially believers in 1 Timothy 4:10)
Source: https://m.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Wisdom-of-Solomon-Chapter-16/
“… Do you wish to know who are the others which fell near the waters, but could not be rolled into them? These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord; but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires.” She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/shepherd.html
These ‘rejected stones’ possibly refer to ‘the sinners’ in quote above, please consider:
“…These are they who have heard the word, and wish to be baptized in the name of the Lord …” = Non-Christians who Heard the Gospel but never got Baptized though they may have wished to because,
“…but when the chastity demanded by the truth comes into their recollection, they draw back, and again walk after their own wicked desires. …” = They did not want to Believe and Practice Christianity because the Demands of Its Purity is too High and that they don’t want to abandon their past ways, i.e. they died unrepentant on earth. Can you see that the Hope of the Spirit World Salvation also includes them as part of “all these rejected stones”?
The Hope Part:
“… She finished her exposition of the tower. But I, shameless as I yet was, asked her, “Is repentance possible for all those stones which have been cast away and did not fit into the building of the tower, and will they yet have a place in this tower?” “Repentance,” said she, “is yet possible, but in this tower they cannot find a suitable place. But in another and much inferior place they will be laid, and that, too, only when they have been tortured and completed the days of their sins. And on this account will they be transferred, because they have partaken of the righteous Word. And then only will they be removed from their punishments when the thought of repenting of the evil deeds which they have done has come into their hearts. But if it does not come into their hearts, they will not be saved, on account of the hardness of their heart.” …” – Shepherd of Hermas (Chapter VII, Third Vision, Translated by another Well Known Scholar Mr. Roberts-Donaldson)
Comment: The righteous are scarcely saved means ‘few are saved unto the First Resurrection’ while ‘the sinner’ mentioned distinctly from ‘the ungodly’ may refer to some of the sinners being showed Mercy on Judgment Day during the Second Resurrection as the Book of Enoch or even now in the Spirit World as the Shepherd of Hermas (Scripture in First Christianity) quote earlier regarding the ‘rejected stones’ (which includes the ‘unbaptized’, i.e. ‘those who wish to be baptized’ too) to be part of a different place than the ‘Tower of Repentance/Church’ meaning these are not the ‘thirty, sixty, hundredfold reaping’ but ‘the others’ where Christ Reaps where He Sowed not (Matthew 24:26) as discussed in “P/S 43” too.
Peace to you
First Christianity Mysteries – Where does the Evidence Point Most as First Christianity?
“… In the first 600 years of Christian history, researchers have identified six main theological schools concerning apokatastasis. Four of them were Universalists, one taught “conditional immortality” and the last taught Eternal hell.[14] Many early church fathers have been quoted as either embracing or hoping for the ultimate reconciliation of God with His creation. Those that did not embrace the teaching, such as Augustine, acknowledged that it was a common enough belief among Christians of the day.[15][16] The concept of a final restoration of all souls particularly had large appeal in the East during the fourth and fifth centuries.[2] … Origen and a form of apocatastasis were condemned in 544 by the Patriarch Mennas of Constantinople and the condemnation was allegedly ratified in 553 by the Fifth Ecumenical Council. … Many heteroclite views became associated with Origen, and the 15 anathemas against him attributed to the council condemn a form of apocatastasis, along with the pre-existence of the soul, animism, a heterodox Christology, and a denial of real and lasting resurrection of the body. Some authorities believe these anathemas belong to an earlier local synod.[19][20][21]
The New Advent Catholic Encyclopedia claims that the Fifth Ecumenical Council was contested as being an official and authorized Ecumenical Council, since it was established not by the Pope, but rather by the Emperor, because of the Pope’s resistance to it. The Fifth Ecumenical Council addressed what was called “The Three Chapters”[22] and was against a form of Origenism which had nothing to do with Origen and Origenist views. Popes Vigilius, Pelagius I (556–61), Pelagius II (579–90), and Gregory the Great (590–604) were only aware that the Fifth Council specifically dealt with the Three Chapters and they made no mention of Origenism or Universalism, nor spoke as if they knew of its condemnation, even though Gregory the Great was opposed to the belief of universalism.[2][23] Scholar Richard Bauckham has stated that while universalism appeared “discredited” due to scholarly resistance to Origen’s view, it “seems in doubt” if the Fifth Ecumenical Council specifically endorsed any negative view of it.[2] … Gregory of Nyssa was declared “the father of fathers” by the seventh ecumenical council and some traditional and modern Greek orthodox scholars dispute Pierre Batiffol and George T. Knight’s claim that Saint Gregory of Nyssa and Saint Macrina the Younger, who were brother and sister, believed or taught universal salvation. However, Gregory of Nyssa, in his book Sermo Catecheticus Magnus, described: “The annihilation of evil, the restitution of all things, and the final restoration of evil men and evil spirits to the blessedness of union with God, so that He may be ‘all in all,’ embracing all things endowed with sense and reason.” He further stated, “when death approaches to life, and darkness to light, and the corruptible to the incorruptible, the inferior is done away with and reduced to non-existence, and the thing purged is benefited, just as the dross is purged from gold by fire. In the same way in the long circuits of time, when the evil of nature which is now mingled and implanted in them has been taken away, whensoever the restoration to their old condition of the things that now lie in wickedness takes place, there will be a unanimous thanksgiving from the whole creation, both of those who have been punished in the purification and of those who have not at all needed purification.”[35] …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_reconciliation
1) First Christianity’s Disagreement
Just a Friendly Disagreement Existed – Not a Heretic either Way
“… Contrary to Bauckham, it is unknown which view (of endless hell, annihilation, or correctional hell) was most prevalent in the early Church, and at the time did not seem indispensable to universal Christian belief as, e.g., the Trinity and Incarnation. This is shown by the early 5th century statements of St. Augustine of Hippo, a most formidable advocate of the endless hell view, admitting that a “great many” [12] Christians saw hell as correctional and temporary, and who considered the matter a mere “friendly controversy.” [13] …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_reconciliation
2) Modern Protestantism Disagreement
No Condemnation in Hoping for Universal Reconciliation
To quote:
“… While not being a universalist per se, influential Christian philosopher Karl Barth, often regarded as the greatest Protestant theologian of the twentieth century,[10] spoke for a great deal of broadly traditional Christians when he wrote that salvation is centrally Christological. He asserted that in Jesus Christ the reconciliation of all of mankind to God has essentially already taken place and that through Christ man is already elect and justified; thus, eternal salvation for everyone, even those that reject God, is a possibility that isn’t just an open question but should be hoped for by Christians as a matter of grace.[2] …”
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_reconciliation
More Early Christian Quotes on Christ Centered Universalism may be found in link below (with sources quoted and discussed in detail):
https://www.anonymouschristian.org/blog/christ-centered-universalism-mystery-in-first-christianity/
Conclusion – Doctrinal Grid of First Christianity
Where is the Christian Limit to Speculating about Topics about which if he crosses the line it may be considered as Heresy? The Infamous quote from this Great Early First Christianity Authority in Doctrine & Church clearly Reveals that ‘Philosophizing about whether Hell is eternal or not’ (i.e “Judgment”) is not considered a Heresy even if we were to miss it either way where to attain the ‘right doctrine’ about it would not be futile either but may garner appropriate rewards as his quote below means, to quote:
“… then here too I will provide thee with broad paths. Philosophize about the world or worlds; about matter; about soul; about natures endowed with reason, good or bad; about resurrection, about judgment, about reward, or the Sufferings of Christ. For in these subjects to hit the mark is not useless, and to miss it is not dangerous. But with God we shall have converse, in this life only in a small degree; but a little later, it may be, more perfectly, in the Same, our Lord Jesus Christ, to Whom be glory for ever. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Here is the Roman Catholic Source and his quote in full where he also Reveals which part of Theology should not be speculated with as that may be Dangerous, please consider:
“… Attack the silence of Pythagoras,(a) and the Orphic beans, and the novel brag about “The Master said.” Attack the ideas of Plato,(b) and the transmigrations and courses of our souls, and the reminiscences, and the unlovely loves of the soul for lovely bodies. Attack the atheism of Epicurus,(g) and his atoms, and his unphilosophic pleasure; or Aristotle’s petty Providence, and his artificial system, and his discourses about the mortality of the soul, and the humanitarianism of his doctrine. Attack the superciliousness of the Stoa,(d) or the greed and vulgarity of the Cynic.(e) Attack the “Void and Full” (what nonsense), and all the details about the gods and the sacrifices and the idols and demons, whether beneficent or malignant, and all the tricks that people play with divination, evoking of gods, or of souls, and the power of the stars. And if these things seem to thee unworthy of discussion as petty and already often confuted, and thou wilt keep to thy line, and seek the satisfaction of thy ambition in it; then here too I will provide thee with broad paths. Philosophize about the world or worlds; about matter; about soul; about natures endowed with reason, good or bad; about resurrection, about judgment, about reward, or the Sufferings of Christ. For in these subjects to hit the mark is not useless, and to miss it is not dangerous. But with God we shall have converse, in this life only in a small degree; but a little later, it may be, more perfectly, in the Same, our Lord Jesus Christ, to Whom be glory for ever. Amen. …” – Blessed St. Gregory Nazianzus, also known as Gregory the Theologian or Gregory Nazianzen, Archbishop of Constantinople, Theologian, Doctor of the Church, Great Hierarch, Cappadocian Father, Ecumenical Teacher (c. 329 AD – c. 390 AD)
Source: [Oration XXVII. THE FIRST THEOLOGICAL ORATION. A PRELIMINARY DISCOURSE AGAINST THE EUNOMIANS, Point IX]
https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/five-theological-orations-11646
Note: the Words “World or Worlds” may actually be “Aeon or Aeons” in Koine Greek.
Peace to you
P/S 47: Understanding Evil – Why is there Evil – Sickness/Diseases/ Curses in this World?
We are the Authors of Our Own Destruction in Many Ways.
This is the ‘Real Evil’ in the World, a.k.a. “the Love of Money (1 Timothy 6:9 – 11) which causes the “Curses/Diseases in the World” as this is what Opens the ‘Door’ spiritually if we really understand it as the Verse Says, that ‘the Love of Money’ is the ‘Root (unseen) of All (not some) Evil’:
“For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.” (1 Timothy 6:10, KJV)
This ‘Way of Death’ is clearly seen in the First Christianity Writing called the “Didache” which is believed to be the Lord’s Teaching via the Twelve Apostles, to quote:
“… And the way of death is this: First of all it is evil and accursed: murders, adultery, lust, fornication, thefts, idolatries, magic arts, witchcrafts, rape, false witness, hypocrisy, double-heartedness, deceit, haughtiness, depravity, self-will, greediness, filthy talking, jealousy, over-confidence, loftiness, boastfulness; persecutors of the good, hating truth, loving a lie, not knowing a reward for righteousness, not cleaving to good nor to righteous judgment, watching not for that which is good, but for that which is evil; from whom meekness and endurance are far, loving vanities, pursuing revenge, not pitying a poor man, not laboring for the afflicted, not knowing Him Who made them, murderers of children, destroyers of the handiwork of God, turning away from him who is in want, afflicting him who is distressed, advocates of the rich, lawless judges of the poor, utter sinners. Be delivered, children, from all these. …” – The Didache (Chapter 5)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/didache-roberts.html
Focus phrases/words for this Context from the quote above:
“… greediness … loving vanities … not pitying a poor man, not laboring for the afflicted, … turning away from him who is in want, afflicting him who is distressed, advocates of the rich, lawless judges of the poor, … Be delivered, children, from all these. …” – The Didache
Conclusion – It’s okay to repeat this Biblical Truth “again” as Christ Repeated It too Himself:
“[Then Jesus said to His disciples], “Assuredly, I say to you that it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 19:23, NKJV)
“And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 19:24, NKJV)
Note: Christ Said the above toward a ‘Rich Man who has kept the Torah Well from his youth and not toward a known sinful rich man’ (The Biblical Context is more serious than we think it is especially since Christ Repeated this as the word “again” means calling us to be Alert to this Truth where the opposite is a Way of Perdition or Loss, Implied).
Comment: If it’s “hard” for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God, the opposite must be true also, right? In that, it must be easy for a “poor” to enter the kingdom of God, right? (Lazarus’ Example in the Bible Clearly Proves this in Luke 16:19 – 31).
Hence, let us be Wise Biblically.
“6But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. 9But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.” (1 Timothy 6:6 – 10, KJV)
Doesn’t God “Create Evil”?
“But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.” (Genesis 2:17, KJV)
Yes, as a “Choice” as Evil itself was ‘Created as a Choice/Knowledge state only in the Tree of Good and Evil’ and God also Warned them not to eat of it in the Beginning, Verse:
“6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. 7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.” (Isaiah 45:6 – 7, KJV)
Exactly, that’s how He Creates the Provision for Evil as Choice and Judgment but He doesn’t do any Evil itself, Verse:
“Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone.” (James 1:13, NKJV)
The New Testament Verses explain the Details of the Big Picture or Definition Given in the Old Testament Verse more clearly.
“For Thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with Thee.” (Psalm 5:3, KJV)
Hence, whenever we choose to sin we cause ourselves, our city and humanity to suffer and conversely when we obey His Law, we play a role in healing, restoration and blessing upon mankind generally as the Verse below clearly means [Note: Judgment is executed by righteous angels – Hebrews 2:2 or Devils too – Ephesians 6:12, though ‘God Claims General Responsibility Over this Law as He Allows it but in the End it’s our choice collectively as human beings which lead to either direction each time]:
“15See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil; 16In that I command thee this day to love the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the LORD thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it. 17But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them; 18I denounce unto you this day, that ye shall surely perish, and that ye shall not prolong your days upon the land, whither thou passest over Jordan to go to possess it. 19I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:” (Deuteronomy 30:15 – 19, KJV)
God does not change and His Principle of Judgment is clearly seen in the following Verses where even if there be ‘ten righteous persons’ left in a City, He will not destroy it with ‘Divine Judgment’ as Blessed Patriarch Abraham Pleads with the Most Blessed LORD:
“25Far be it from You to do such a thing as this, to slay the righteous with the wicked, so that the righteous should be as the wicked; far be it from You! Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?” 26So the Lord said, “If I find in Sodom fifty righteous within the city, then I will spare all the place for their sakes.” 27Then Abraham answered and said, “Indeed now, I ho am but dust and ashes have taken it upon myself to speak to the Lord: 28Suppose there were five less than the fifty righteous; would You destroy all of the city for lack of five?” So He said, “If I find there forty-five, I will not destroy it.” 29And he spoke to Him yet again and said, “Suppose there should be forty found there?” So He said, “I will not do it for the sake of forty.” 30Then he said, “Let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak: Suppose thirty should be found there?” So He said, “I will not do it if I find thirty there.” 31And he said, “Indeed now, I have taken it upon myself to speak to the Lord: Suppose twenty should be found there?” So He said, “I will not destroy it for the sake of twenty.” 32Then he said, “Let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak but once more: Suppose ten should be found there?” And He said, “I will not destroy it for the sake of ten.” (Deuteronomy 18:25 – 32, NKJV)
So if a person really ‘Loves his neighbour as himself’, he will teach others to forsake sin as well as try to be righteous as much as possible so as to make the world better as God has put some level of choice in our hands as human beings collectively to decide this as it is demonstrated in Verses prior.
“Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 5:19, NKJV)
Peace to you
First Resurrection – Few Saved and Special Mercy to the Poor Mystery
0) As we have seen in post below, First Christianity did have Pre-Dominant Two Resurrection Teaching based on “Chiliasm” which was the Majority Doctrine of the Church in the Earliest Centuries [in “P/S 47: earlier too]:
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10159252192652784&id=651792783
Based on this, we understand that Verses such as Matthew 7:14 or Matthew 7:20 – 23 regarding the “few” who are Saved may thus be referring to only those who are part of Marriage of the Most Blessed Lamb (Revelation 19:7) being part of the First Resurrection (Revelation 20:4 – 6). So let’s try to understand these “few” among Christians more closely with Bible Verses.
1) Both Good and Bad are invited to the Wedding
“8Then he said to his servants, ‘The wedding is ready, but those who were invited were not worthy. 9Therefore go into the highways, and as many as you find, invite to the wedding.’ 10So those servants went out into the highways and gathered together all whom they found, both bad and good. And the wedding hall was filled with guests.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 22:8 – 10, NKJV)
2) The “Few” Chosen for His Marriage are only the ones with the “Wedding Garment”
“11“But when the king came in to see the guests, he saw a man there who did not have on a wedding garment. 12So he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you come in here without a wedding garment?’ And he was speechless. 13Then the king said to the servants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 14“For many are called, but few are chosen.”.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 22:11 – 14, NKJV)
3) The “Wedding Garment” refers to “righteous works of the Saints”
“6And I heard, as it were, the voice of a great multitude, as the sound of many waters and as the sound of mighty thunderings, saying, “Alleluia! For the Lord God Omnipotent reigns! 7Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints. 9Then he said to me, “Write: ‘Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!’ ” And he said to me, “These are the true sayings of God.”.” (Revelation 19:6 – 9, NKJV)
A main Righteous Work of the Saints is “feeding the hungry” to be repaid at the First ‘Resurrection of the Just’ by faith only, Verses:
“12Then He also said to him who invited Him, “When you give a dinner or a supper, do not ask your friends, your brothers, your relatives, nor rich neighbors, lest they also invite you back, and you be repaid. 13But when you give a feast, invite the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind. 14And you will be blessed, because they cannot repay you; for you shall be repaid at the resurrection of the just.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 14:12 – 14, NKJV)
“For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 5:20, NKJV)
Yes, a major work of faith is “Charity Works” toward mankind (Luke 12:30 – 33) as to whom more is given, more works is required (Luke 12:48) counted in Love of God (1 Corinthians 13:3, 1 John 3:16 – 18) and percentage (Luke 21:1 – 4), example Verses:
“14What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead … 24You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.” (James 2:14 – 17, 24, NKJV)
4) None of those who were too busy with worldly pursuits will be part of His Bride
“16Then He said to him, “A certain man gave a great supper and invited many, 17and sent his servant at supper time to say to those who were invited, ‘Come, for all things are now ready.’ 18But they all with one accord began to make excuses. The first said to him, ‘I have bought a piece of ground, and I must go and see it. I ask you to have me excused.’ 19And another said, ‘I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I am going to test them. I ask you to have me excused.’ 20Still another said, ‘I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.’ … 24For I say to you that none of those men who were invited shall taste my supper.’ ”- Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 14:16 – 20, 24, NKJV)
5) Mysterious Mercy toward the “poor”, “blind”, “maimed”, “crippled” to be Saved remains
“12Then He also said to him who invited Him, “When you give a dinner or a supper, do not ask your friends, your brothers, your relatives, nor rich neighbors, lest they also invite you back, and you be repaid. 13But when you give a feast, invite the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind. 14And you will be blessed, because they cannot repay you; for you shall be repaid at the resurrection of the just.” 15Now when one of those who sat at the table with Him heard these things, he said to Him, “Blessed is he who shall eat bread in the kingdom of God!”. 16Then He [Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ] said to him, “A certain man gave a great supper and invited many, 17and sent his servant at supper time to say to those who were invited, ‘Come, for all things are now ready.’ 18But they all with one accord began to make excuses. … 21So that servant came and reported these things to his master. Then the master of the house, being angry, said to his servant, ‘Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in here the poor and the maimed and the lame and the blind.’ 22And the servant said, ‘Master, it is done as you commanded, and still there is room.’ 23Then the master said to the servant, ‘Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled. 24For I say to you that none of those men who were invited shall taste my supper.’ ”.” (Luke 14:12 – 18, 21 – 24, NKJV)
Comment: Please notice ‘carefully’ that the same Biblical Koine Greek words describing the “… 13But when you give a feast, invite the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind. …” (Luke 14:13) is also the ‘same disadvantaged ones’ (i. e. literally referring to those who are poor in poverty on earth with least money as well as those with physical disabilities to whom the righteous do charity works) who are also said to be saved to join in the “Wedding Feast” of the Most Blessed Lamb as Christ’s Parable referring to that Special Mercy toward them may be clearly seen in the phrase “… Then the master of the house, being angry, said to his servant, ‘Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in here the poor and the maimed and the lame and the blind.’ 22And the servant said, ‘Master, it is done as you commanded, and still there is room.’ …” (Luke 14:21 – 22) in Consecutive Verses above.
Please take note also that the above are all Bible Verses “as it is Written” with no interpretation nor any interpolation of any kind.
“19“There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. 20But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24“Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ 25But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 16:19 -25, NKJV)
“23Then Jesus said to His disciples, “Assuredly, I say to you that it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 19:23 – 24, NKJV)
Conclusion – A First Christianity Quote agreeing to this Mystery
“… He invites the poor, the weak, and the blind, to show that weakness of body shuts out no one from the kingdom of heaven, and that he is guilty of fewer sins who lacks the incitement to sin; or that the infirmities of sin are forgiven through the mercy of God. Therefore he sends to the streets, that from the broader ways they may come to the narrow way. Because then the proud refuse to come, the poor are chosen, since they are called weak and poor who are weak in their own judgment of themselves, for there are poor, and yet as it were strong, who though lying in poverty are proud, the blind are they who have no brightness of understanding; the lame are they who have walked not uprightly in their works. But since the faults of these are expressed in the weakness of their members, as those were sinners who when bidden refused to come, so also are these who are invited and come; but the proud sinners are rejected, the humble are chosen. God then chooses those whom the world despises, because for the most part the very act of contempt recalls a man to himself. And men so much the sooner hear the voice of God, as they have nothing in this world to take pleasure in. When then the Lord calls certain from the streets and lanes to supper, He denotes that people who had learnt to observe in the city the constant practice of the law. But the multitude who believed of the people of Israel did not fill the places of the upper feast room. Hence it follows, And the servant said, Lord, it is done as you have commanded, and yet there is room. For already had great numbers of the Jews entered, but yet there was room in the kingdom for the abundance of the Gentiles to be received. Therefore it is added, And the Lord said to the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled. When He commanded His guests to be collected from the wayside and the hedges, He sought for a rural people, that is, the Gentiles; Or, He sends to the highways and about the hedges, because they are fit for the kingdom of God, who, not absorbed in the desire for present goods, are hastening on to the future, set in a certain fixed path of good will. And who like a hedge which separates the cultivated ground from the uncultivated, and keeps off the incursion of the cattle, know how to distinguish good and evil, and to hold up the shield of faith against the temptations of spiritual wickedness. …” – Blessed Archbishop St. Ambrose of Milan, First Latin Doctor of the Church (c. 340 AD – c. 397 AD)
Source (Commentary on Luke 14:15 -24):
“Then He lifted up His eyes toward His disciples, and said: “Blessed are you poor, For yours is the kingdom of God.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 6:20, NKJV)
While discussing all these Verses in Luke 14 regarding this Marriage of the Lamb that Christ also Said,
“So then, none of you can be My disciple who does not give up all his own possessions.” – Most Blessed Lord Jesus Christ (Luke 14:33, NASB)
Very. Interesting. Indeed.
P/S: “Wedding Garment” as “Works of Mercy” and more
“… The marriage-feast of Christ and the Church is filled, when they who were found by the Apostles, being restored to God, sat down to the feast. But since it behoved that both bad and good should be called, not that the bad should continue bad, but that they should put off the garments unmeet for the wedding, and should put on the marriage garments, to wit, bowels of mercy and kindness, for this cause the King goes out, that He may see them set down before the supper is set before them, that they may be detained who have the wedding garment in which He is delighted, and that he may condemn the opposite. …” – Blessed Origen of Alexandria, the Great but surprisingly Modest Exegete of the Eastern Church, “Nicknamed: Admantius or Man of Steel”, Tortured and Martyred for Christ (c. 184 AD – c. 253 AD)
“… What ought we to understand by the wedding garment, but charity? For this the Lord had upon Him, when He came to espouse the Church to Himself. He then enters in to the wedding feast, but without the wedding garment, who has faith in the Church, but not charity. …” – Blessed Roman Catholic Pope St. Gregory the Great, Saint Gregory the Dialogist in Eastern Christianity, the Father of Christian Worship, and John Calvin declared in his Institutes that Gregory was the last good Pope. (540 AD – 604 AD)
“… Or; The marriage garment is the commandments of the Lord, and the works which are done under the Law and the Gospel, and form the clothing of the new man. Whoso among the Christian body shall be found in the day of judgment not to have these, is straightway condemned. “He saith unto him, Friend, How camest thou in hither, not having a wedding garment?” He calls him “friend,” because he was invited to the shredding as being a friend by faith; but He charges him with want of manners in polluting by his filthy dress the elegance of the wedding entertainment. …” – Blessed St. Jerome of the Vulgate, Doctor of the Church who did the First Official Translation of the Bible out of Its Original Languages into Latin, Priest, Confessor, Secretary to Pope Damasus I (c. 347 AD – c. 420 AD)
“… Or otherwise; Whenever God will try His Church, He enters into it that He may see the guests; and if He finds any one not having on the wedding garment, He enquires of him, How then were you made a Christian, if you neglect these works? Such a one Christ gives over to His ministers, that is, to seducing leaders, who bind his hands, that is, his works, and his feet, that is, the motions of his mind, and cast him into darkness, that is, into the errors of the Gentiles or the Jews, or into heresy. The nigher darkness is that of the Gentiles, for they have never heard the truth which they despise; the outer darkness is that of the Jews, who have heard but do not believe; the outermost is that of the heretics, who have heard and have learned. …” – Pseudo Chrysostom
“… Or; The wedding garment is the grace of the Holy Spirit, and the purity of that heavenly temper, which taken up on the confession of a good enquiry is to be preserved pure and unspotted for the company of the Kingdom of heaven. …” – Blessed St. Hilary of Poictiers, the “Athanasius of the West”, Doctor of the Church, The Champion of Trinity in the West (c. 310 AD – c. 368 AD)
Source for each quote above:
Peace to you
P/S 54: Lost Orthodoxy – First Christianity – Two Badges of Righteous via Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons
1) First Resurrection – the “times of the Kingdom”
Marriage of the Most Blessed Lamb – toward “True Christians” with both “Faith” (Virginity) and “Sufficient Works” (“Oil”), e. g. in Matthew 25:1 – 13, James 2:24 bearing either the “thirty, sixty or hundredfold fruit” (Matthew 13:8, all the “dead in Christ” too during the ‘early trumpet’, 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18) followed by the “times of the Kingdom” for 1000 years (Revelation 20:4 – 6, Matthew 25:14 – 30).
To quote from Blessed St. Irenaeous to learn this first:
“… And as the presbyters say, Then those who are deemed worthy of an abode in heaven shall go there, others shall enjoy the delights of paradise, and others shall possess the splendour of the city; for everywhere the Saviour shall be seen according as they who see Him shall be worthy. [They say, moreover], that there is this distinction between the habitation of those who produce an hundred-fold, and that of those who produce sixty-fold, and that of those who produce thirty-fold [Matthew 13:1 – 8, Matthew 13:18 – 23]: for the first will be taken up into the heavens, the second will dwell in paradise, the last will inhabit the city; and that was on this account the Lord declared, “In My Father’s house are many mansions.” For all things belong to God, who supplies all with a suitable dwelling-place; even as His Word says, that a share is allotted to all by the Father, according as each person is or shall be worthy. And this is the couch on which the guests shall recline, having been invited to the wedding. The presbyters, the disciples of the apostles, affirm that this is the gradation and arrangement of those who are saved, and that they advance through steps of this nature; also that they ascend through the Spirit to the Son, and through the Son to the Father, and that in due time the Son will yield up His work to the Father, even as it is said by the apostle, “For He must reign till He hath put all enemies under His feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.” For in the TIMES of the KINGDOM, the righteous man who is upon the earth shall then forget to die. “But when He saith, All things shall be subdued unto Him, it is manifest that He is excepted who did put all things under Him. And when all things shall be subdued unto Him, then shall the Son also Himself be subject unto Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all . John, therefore, did distinctly foresee the FIRST “RESURRECTION of the JUST,” [Revelation 20:4 – 6, 1 Thessalonians 4:13 – 18, Luke 14:14] and the inheritance in the kingdom of the earth; and what the prophets have prophesied concerning it harmonize [with his vision, e.g. Isaiah 65:20 – 23, Isaiah 11, Revelation 20:7 – 10]. For the Lord also taught these things, when He promised that He would have the mixed cup new with His disciples in the kingdom. …” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 130 AD – c. 202 AD, ‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter Chapter XXXVI, Points 1 – 2, 3-partial)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
2) Second Resurrection – “after the times of the Kingdom”
1000 years later, Judgment Day arrives (Revelation 20:5) where we see another badge of those made righteous based on “works” (Daniel 12:2, John 5:28 – 29, Revelation 20:11 – 15) where possibly referring to Christ Reaping the Good Life of Gentiles or Philosophers (as Blessed St. Jerome remarked on Matthew 25:24) toward Salvation (Matthew 13:30) where “He Sowed not” the Seed of the Gospel (Matthew 25:26).
To quote from Blessed St. Irenaeous to learn this too:
“… And in the Apocalypse John saw this new [Jerusalem] descending upon the new earth. For AFTER the TIMES of the KINGDOM, he says, “I saw a Great White Throne, and Him who sat upon it, from whose face the earth fled away, and the heavens; and there was no more place for them.” [Revelation 20:11] And he sets forth, too, the things connected with the GENERAL RESURRECTION and the judgment, mentioning “the dead, great and small.” “The sea,” he says, “gave up the dead which it had in it, and death and hell [Hades] delivered up the dead that they contained; and the books were opened. Moreover,” he says, “the book of life was opened, and the dead were judged out of those things that were written in the books, ACCORDING to THEIR WORKS; and Death and hell [Hades] were sent into the LAKE of FIRE, the SECOND DEATH.” [Revelation 20:11 – 15] Now this is what is called GEHENNA [Matthew 10:28], which the Lord styled eternal [AGE-DURING] fire [Matthew 25:31 – 46]. “And if any one,” it is said, “was not found written in the book of life, he was sent into the LAKE of FIRE. [Revelation 20:15, Revelation 21:8] … ” – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (c. 140 – c. 202 AD, Against Heresies, Book 5, Chapter 35:2)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
Here is another quote of Blessed St. Irenaeous which agrees to this ‘Second Badge of Righteous by Works only’ toward ‘all the remaining dead in the tombs’ as Christ Spoke in John 5:28 – 29 in the ‘hour to come’ on the Last Day during the “Last Trumpet” (i.e. ‘whoever’ that is not resurrected in body yet in the First Resurrection, Revelation 20:5):
“… Again, He called Lazarus “with a loud voice, saying, Lazarus, come forth; and HE that WAS DEAD came forth bound with bandages, feet and hands.” This was SYMBOLICAL of that MAN who had been BOUND in SINS. And therefore the Lord said, “Loose him, and let him depart.” As, therefore, THOSE who were HEALED were MADE WHOLE in THOSE MEMBERS which had in TIMES PAST been AFFLICTED; and the DEAD ROSE in the IDENTICAL BODIES, their limbs and bodies receiving health, and that life which was granted by the Lord, who prefigures eternal [age-during] things by temporal, and shows that it is He who is Himself able to extend BOTH HEALING and LIFE to HIS HANDIWORK, that His words concerning its [future] RESURRECTION may also be believed; so also at the END, when the Lord utters His voice “by the LAST TRUMPET,” [1 Corinthians 15:52] the dead shall be raised, as He Himself declares: “The HOUR SHALL COME, in which ALL THE DEAD which are in the TOMBS shall hear the voice of the Son of man, and shall come forth; those that have DONE GOOD to the RESURRECTION of LIFE, and those that have DONE EVIL to the RESURRECTION of JUDGMENT . …” [John 5:28 – 29] – Blessed St. Irenaeous of Lyons, a Hearer of Blessed St. Polycarp who is an Apostolic Father being the Disciple of Blessed St. John who wrote the Book of Revelation (‘Against Heresies’, Book 5, Chapter XIII, Point 1)
Source: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/irenaeus-book5.html
An Important Comment: As demonstrated, this ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ being raised to life [i.e. Soul given a Body, Bodily Resurrection] during these “after the times of the kingdom” on Judgment Day at the end of the 1000 years Millennial Reign is not referring to any Christian at all as Blessed St. Irenaeous’ earlier own quote clearly proved that he understood that all the Christians [i.e. of thirty, sixty or hundredfold fruit] are reaped in the First Resurrection itself. So, the ‘Second Badge of Righteous’ must refer to the Rejected Christians and non-Christian righteous, i.e. toward anyone who did “good works” among ‘all those who remain in the tomb’ [i.e. souls whose body still has not been raised] as Christ Remarked too in John 5:28 – 29.
Source Post:
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10159252192652784&id=651792783
Peace to you
Here’s the Latest Book Link for the “Lake of Fire -Hope for the Wicked One Day” Book dated 15 April 2020
Click the button above to Download as PDF
Thank you
More Reading:
1) Parables of Lord Jesus Christ in First Christianity Exegesis
Parables of Lord Jesus Christ in First Christianity Exegesis [Last Updated 24 Mar 2020]
2) Lake of Fire – Hope for the Wicked One Day?
Lake of Fire – Hope for the Wicked One Day? [Updated 19 Dec 2019]
3) Book Release (New , Year 2020)
Thirty Sixty and Hundredfold Mystery Book – Free PDF Download
Here’s our Latest Book for further Edification regarding the rarely known Thirtyfold, Sixtyfold and Hundredfold Mystery as it was taught in First Christianity (Book Released Online – 7 Jan 2020).
This Book is not for sale and only an online PDF version is available (no hardcopy due to no budget). Free download in links may be found in pages below:
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Thank you Mr. Gavin Vincent for these IT works.
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